From Australia, A Possible Solution To The Shattered Bat Problem
by Al Yellon on Sep 20, 2010 8:13 AM CDT
in Chicago Cubs News
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PrintYesterday, after the scary incident in which Tyler Colvin was injured by his teammate Welington Castillo's shattered bat, I wrote this post for SB Nation Chicago (if you haven't read it yet, please do) on the issue of bats shattering and seriously injuring people; over the last three years a major league coach, a fan, and now a player have been hurt by flying pieces of maple bats.
This is nothing new, although the proliferation of the more easily-breakable maple bats has brought the issue to the forefront; check out this description of a similar injury to the Dodgers' Steve Yeager -- 34 years ago:
In 1976, Yeager was injured when a piece of Bill Russell's bat shattered and hit him in the neck as he was waiting on deck, piercing his esophagus. He had nine pieces of wood taken out of his neck in 98 minutes of surgery. Yeager later invented the catcher's throat protector flap that hangs from the catcher's mask, which he began wearing after the life-threatening incident.
In the comments last night, BCB'er Clutch16 posted this link from former major leaguer Morgan Ensberg's blog in which he posted the cost of baseball bats during his career, which ended after 2008:
Baseball bats that I used while I played cost $720/dozen. That means that the piece of wood in my hands cost at least $60 a bat. I think maple bats are closer to $80/bat.
In this case, cost shouldn't matter. If it's a little more expensive to come up with a solution that will prevent shattered bats from seriously injuring or killing someone, MLB must do it. They really don't have any choice unless they want to explain why someone was killed on a baseball field.
I received an email overnight from Mick Lee, an Australian who -- just coincidentally -- a day before the injury to Colvin, posted on the SB Nation Tampa Bay Rays site a possible answer to this problem. Follow me past the jump for the answer.
Mick Lee (SB Nation user name AUSSIExRULES) is a former professional cricket player in Australia. Here is his post from DRays Bay, in which he talks about a protective coating that is used to prevent cricket bats from shattering:
One such product is called Extratec. It has been approved by the International Cricket Council (ICC) and is now preferred by nearly all professional cricketers today.
Cricket as a sport has a long and rich history similar in a lot of ways to baseball. Extratec is a clear adhesive which is applied to the face and edges of a cricket bat, like a sticker or decal, giving it a protective coating to stop the bats from splintering or breaking. The great thing about Extratec is that it does not add or take away any of the characteristics of the bat itself. By this I mean that it won't enhance performance or stop the bats from doing its natural thing. You don't want to lose that "natural" sound of the ball hitting the bat, but also you don't want to see any rebound qualities that Extratec does not have to give batters an advantage.
Extratec in its original state was developed in the United States to protect the blades of helicopters. it is both extremely tough and lightweight. The thickness of the adhesive is 0.35mm and weighs less than an ounce. Tests and trials were carried out by the ICC on the ping and performance of a range of cricket bats with Extratec as opposed to a normal bat and there was absolutely no reduction or enhancement on the bats performances. If a bat splinters or breaks it would normally be held together by the adhesive or drop to the ground close to the batsman.
Obviously, cricket bats aren't quite the same as baseball bats, and the ball isn't the same, either, but I don't see why baseball couldn't approve this at least for trials, say, during spring training. If it works, players could keep the maple bats that they like for their lightness and bat speed, and everyone could be assured that they wouldn't shatter as they do now.
Let's give it a shot. Please, before someone gets killed.
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This sounds like a wonderful solution.
They’ve got to try something.
♪♫ Take me out WITH the crowd.
Buy me some peanuts and cracker jack,
I don't care if I NEVER get back ♪♫ Jack Norworth and Albert Von Tilzer
Are they looking at any kind of solution at all?
Or just ignoring the problem until something tragic happens. MLB waits too long on everything … steroids, gambling etc.
One of Lee Elia's 15%
by waiting4cubs on Sep 20, 2010 8:57 AM CDT up reply actions
It may be time for MLB to look more seriously at aluminum bats
They can probably be designed so the moment of inertia is similar to a wood bat (the ball that golf dropped with metal-headed drivers). Yeah, the sound won’t be as nice, but since when is great sound worth getting someone seriously injured or killed? Does MLB really have to wait until the head of a broken bat flies into the stands and hits a kid who was eating a Frosty Malt?
Why go to Aluminum
Which has its own set of risks, when something like this Extratec could be easily applied to wooden bats? Even high schools and colleges are moving away from Aluminum. the comparison to Golf is interesting since use of aluminum and related alloys has allowed further distance and ball speed. Exactly the kind of characteristics baseball does not need. That is of course unless if one would like to see a position player take a come-backer that literally will knock his head off. No another solution is in order and this kind of techonolgy shared by the OP sounds like a great alternative.
"Ask Dad. He'll know. And on the off chance he doesn't, he'll make something up"
Right.
Aluminum would be a huge mistake. In addition to making things MORE dangerous for pitchers and fielders because of the speed with which the ball goes off an aluminum bat, you could kiss all the home run and scoring records goodbye. Games would be decided 21-20 and someone would hit 100 home runs in a season.
No thanks.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Did you read the post, Al?
ClarkFan isn’t talking about moving the current aluminum bats into MLB. He’s talking about developing an aluminum bat that mirrors the performance of its wooden counterpart.
Yeah, I saw that, but still...
… I think this Australian solution is a better one.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I agree with you, Al. The Australian solution could be implemented
immediately while the aluminum bat solution could be years away. The Extratec product should at least be investigated and tried on a trial basis to see if it is a viable solution.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Sep 20, 2010 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions
As long as it doesn't turn the game into cricket!
"I think I'm going to a casino in Indiana and play snake eyes. I don't know what else to say, I'll be honest with you."
They could do that...
…and mirror wood bat performance, but I still like just keeping it to wood because of the sound off the bat.
Today’s aluminum bats are outrageous (similar to how golf clubs have evolved). When I played in the early 80’s the aluminum we used really didn’t perform any better than wood and they were torture to get jammed in cold weather.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Today's Aluminum Bats
They aren’t as thick as the ones used in about 1997, so they are not as lively. It could very well be that the aluminum you used in the glory days of Mississippi State baseball wasn’t that lively in the early 1980’s. However, today’s aluminum bats are still more dangerous than wooden bats. I fear for pitchers in college baseball because they are so close to the hitter and are so prone to getting hit by line drives. There needs to be more work to deaden the aluminum bats further.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
I used a wood bat...
…for part of my high school career (graduated in 79) and frankly should have stayed with it because the aluminum bat I used (still have it) was like swing lead. It was a gold H&B and was a 35 inch 33 ounce lunk of crap.
At MSU, I used an Easton 34 1/2 32 ounce bat with a thin barrel that hurt like hell when you got jammed in cold weather (much worse than wood bats). We also had some of those bats break in half (at the handle) from fatigue and this happened 2-3 times when I was in college.
The aluminum bats have improved dramatically since that time and today’s bats would be lethal in the big leagues.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Aluminum in the 1990's
Those aluminum bats in the 1990’s never should have used because of how thick they were. The offense really got out of hand. Of course, college baseball pitching staffs tend to be short on the number of good arms, but that 21-14 USC – Arizona St. national championship game was an embarrassment to college baseball. I believe that had more to do with the bats than the quality of pitching. IMHO, the progress that has been made to deaden the bats in the last decade or so has not been sufficient.
Also, I wonder how many errors third basemen at the big league level would be charged with, if they had to field balls struck by aluminum bats. That ball can get on you in a hurry, when aluminum bats are involved.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
I agree...
…and this is similar to what has happened in golf with metal drivers (I think it has ruined the game) because very rarely do you see a guy needing to hit a 3 or 4 iron into a par 4.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Clark and Palmeiro
I’m sure they could have hit home runs just fine with wooden bats back in the day at State, and that’s with Palmeiro not on the juice.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
Palmeiro...
…had the best hands and balance I have ever seen, the dude could have hit with a broom handle.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
That's my point, the material is not magic
What happened in golf clubs was not that metal heads had some special juju that produced higher ball speed. But working in different materials allowed larger clubheads with a higher moments of inertia (balls hit off center go straighter and further, so players can use longer shafts and swing harder) and other special effects (spring faces). Driving distances went through the roof because the USGA and the R&A didn’t clamp down soon enough and lost control of the process.
MLB could start with the advantage of using testing and developing a set of specs that keep new-generation metal bats from being higher performance than wood. Why cut down trees to make bats, especially given that ash trees are being threatened?
The problem with Aluminum is
How does MLB know if a batter is used a MLB specified aluminum bat, or an illegal/non-specified bat which could make the ball travel farther?
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on Sep 20, 2010 11:13 AM CDT up reply actions
How do they know if a batter used a MLB specified wooden bat, or an illegal/non-specified bat which could make the ball travel farther?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 20, 2010 11:14 AM CDT up reply actions
Well they don't
Which is why I beleieve the whole steroid issue was just a conspiracy to cover up illegal wooden bats from former nazi’s in Paraguay…
For a wooden bat, you don’t know until the bat breaks, per Sammy Sosa. For an aluminum bat, that never happens.
You can’t stop every cheater, but I wouldn’t want to help them either.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on Sep 20, 2010 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions
Produce them in controlled, inspected facilities with an identifying stamp
A player gets caught using a non-stamped bat, he gets a 10-day vacation without pay for the first offense.
It is interesting
I really can’t thing of too many other pieces of equipment so core to a sport that are essentially unregulated.
Imagine if a shot putter could provide his/her own shot put? Or why not have each pitcher bring his own supply of baseballs?
Eamus Ursuli!
Safety glass was created to reduce injury from breakage.
It’s used in many applications including automobiles and construction. It’s an industry standard now.
There is NO good reason why MLB continues to ignore a demonstrated, serious health threat to player, coaches, umpires and fans. This isn’t new this season. This problem has existed for many seasons.
You would think the threat of a negligence lawsuit(s) from an injured party(s) against clubs and MLB would be enough for the MLB legal counsel to push to address the issue in a significant manner.
I think the coating mentioned above should be one of several researched options to reduce the potential for injury.
There are 108 beads in a Catholic rosary and there are 108 stitches in a baseball. Who says baseball isn't a religion?
by Zeke on Sep 20, 2010 9:02 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Read the back of a ticket stub when you get a chance
and you’ll understand why the cold-hearted legal eagles at MLB aren’t too worried about the current situation, at least from the fans’ perspective. Here’s what the back of a Cubs ticket says
WARNING: Holder assumes all risk incidental to the game of baseball whether occurring prior to, during or after the game, including (but not exclusively) the danger of being injured by or in connection with any thrown bat or thrown or batted ball. Holder agrees Major League Baseball, the National League, the teams, their agents and players are not liable for any resulting injuries.
From what I’ve read, it sounds like several cases have already been brought against MLB over the years and haven’t really gotten very far in the legal system.
The only way to effect change on this particular issue is through continued publicity, shame, exposure and embarrassment. Not that that has ever worked on Bud in the past, but it might work on enough owners and other power brokers in the game to force Bud’s feeble hand.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
I am not a lawyer, but...
… I don’t think that’s an enforceable contract.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Agree...
…they can write whatever they want on the ticket, but if the court finds that they were negligent in making the environment as safe as possible (by ignoring these types of circumstances) they can be liable in the end.
It’s no different than the consent you sign when you have surgery. There is all kinds of legal mumbo jumbo in those, but if the doc screws up, his ass is still on the line.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Sort of like having a chunk of concrete fall on you from the upper deck while attending a game...
There are 108 beads in a Catholic rosary and there are 108 stitches in a baseball. Who says baseball isn't a religion?
Court precedent is with the teams
Here’s a case where the Massachusetts courts threw out a lawsuit against the team by a woman injured by a foul ball. And a two part blog entry (part 1 and part two) on Connecticut decisions where a lawsuit on a foul ball was thrown out because of the warnings. The second decision allowed a suit to go forward on a patron who was hit in the picnic area at a minor league game.
But the precedent is clear. You can’t sue if you’re hit by a foul ball if you should have been watching the field. If you’re in a picnic area or a concession stand, then you probably can. But if you’re in your seat and supposed to be watching the field, you assume the risk of getting hit by foul ball.
by Josh Timmers on Sep 20, 2010 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions
They don't have to sell it to the public
they have to sell it to a judge who is going to look at the law.
by Josh Timmers on Sep 20, 2010 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Excellent point
And negligence, in this case, could be fairly easy to prove.
There is a difference though...
A foul ball into the stands is a fundamental part of the game. For baseball to avoid this risk they would need to institute a system (netting?) that would detract from the product they are providing.
With these broken bats though there seems to be a negligence issue where they are ignoring a potential fix that is cheap and would have little to no impact on the game.
Eamus Ursuli!
The article about the Dodger fan getting struck in the head by a broken bat made reference to...
…several lawsuits having been filed over the years and not getting anywhere. Also implied teams go out of their way to NOT offer any kind help with medical bills or any other type of financial restitution, for fear of setting precedent and/or the appearance of accepting even the slightest bit of responsibility.
If it’s not enforceable, then why hasn’t there been a successful lawsuit yet? I’m not a lawyer either, but it seems that the wholesome americana of a baseball fan and the deep pockets of MLB would be a very attractive combination for a high reward case.
To paraphrase Jackie Chiles… “Wait a second. Did you say Major League Baseball? Hmm… I’ve been wanting a piece of them for years.”
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
How much plexiglass should we order?
I have seen foul balls travel out to the right field corner at Wrigley, section 240. I’ve seen them in a game and during BP. Once during BP, I was addmittedly not paying attention and yapping with my friends. I heard a “thump” right behind me and then I saw guys racing towards me. I looked back and found a BP ball in the row behind me.
Granted, where I sit the foul balls are rare. The right field corner and above the walk way. But the trajectory of those balls would not be stopped by any plexiglass.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on Sep 20, 2010 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions
Lol. I wasn't suggesting that we plexiglass the ballpark.
I was using safety glass as an example of how a product was made better and less dangerous to humans utilizing technology and a DESIRE to make the product safer.
There are 108 beads in a Catholic rosary and there are 108 stitches in a baseball. Who says baseball isn't a religion?
If I recall
Corey Hart has been using a different type of bat and has had no problems with them this year.
"It's a funny old world. Man's lucky if he gets out of it alive." W.C. Fields
Not sure
I seem to remember an article featuring a new company in Louisville that is introducing their bats & Hart was their most “known” customer. I was hoping someone else would be able to find the article.
"It's a funny old world. Man's lucky if he gets out of it alive." W.C. Fields
I found it.
Sounds interesting. More players should try this. The company is apparently HQ’d in Wisconsin.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Here's the article
http://www.jsonline.com/business/97244294.html
It doesn’t appear to be anything more than finding acceptable wood and turning it properly, though – not any sort of new technology
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
In truth...
I think it absolutely WILL take someone to get killed before major league baseball/players union changes anything.
Both sides are reluctant to change and any cooperation on the issue is probably a pie-in-the-sky idea.
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
If this situation...
…does not call for Selig to utilize his “best interests of the game clause”, I don’t know what would.
If someone wants to legally challenge his authority so be it, but to do nothing is asking for a catasrophe waiting to happen.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
I can see players being stubborn about switching
from what works for them, but wouldn’t this incident make them more hesitant to use maple? Is this something that they will have to phase out in stages like the spitball?
♪♫ Take me out WITH the crowd.
Buy me some peanuts and cracker jack,
I don't care if I NEVER get back ♪♫ Jack Norworth and Albert Von Tilzer
Jeff Baker already said he doesn't use maple for that very reason.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I read that.
His comments are what got me thinking along those lines.
♪♫ Take me out WITH the crowd.
Buy me some peanuts and cracker jack,
I don't care if I NEVER get back ♪♫ Jack Norworth and Albert Von Tilzer
maybe a composite?
Perhaps a wood/plastic combo that was optimized to have all the same material properties as maple except for a higher flexural strength. I agree with Al re: the other Al is not an option.
Of course, this would require MLB to be proactive in its development. Not gonna happen.
I like the coating idea. It’s a start.
maybe this is something the fans should demand
can baseball fans across the country send thousands of emails to ol’ Bud and drive him crazy? or mail thousands of letters to his statue at Miller Park?
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
Good idea.
What’s his address?
♪♫ Take me out WITH the crowd.
Buy me some peanuts and cracker jack,
I don't care if I NEVER get back ♪♫ Jack Norworth and Albert Von Tilzer
They say if you write down his address...
you’ll be cursed.
"A dream you dream alone is only a dream. A dream you dream together is reality." John Lennon
What does one more curse here or there mean to a Cub fan?
One of Lee Elia's 15%
by waiting4cubs on Sep 20, 2010 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions
I did find this, I'm going to keep looking for an email address...heehee :)
The Office of the Commissioner of Baseball
Allan H. (Bud) Selig, Commissioner
Address: 245 Park Avenue, 31st Floor
City: New York, State: NY Zip Code: 10167
Phone: 212) 931-7800
Fax: 212-485-3546
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on Sep 20, 2010 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions
If you get him to say his name backwards...
RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).
Free BLou
Something has to happen, this is worth exploring for sure.
This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).
Is there a reason
that OSHA doesn’t get involved? I know that in other sports safety issues remain the realm of the league. The fine print on tickets establishes a hold harmless agreement between the club and fan, but what about employees such as coaches, ushers, vendors, security personnel who are also at risk—risks that don’t exist in other sports? It seems to me that these folks should be covered by OSHA guidelines and if an incident/mishap of appropriate severtiy involves an emloyee they are bound by federal law to report it. As such, MLB would be compelled to take action to avoid OSHA penalties. What say ye legal eagles of BCB?
And so it goes.
OSHA
usually doesn’t get involved in union businesses, unless one side is suspected of violating the contract. Generally if there is a union and they’ve negotiated safety conditions, OSHA would assume that the union has negotiated what the acceptable risks of the profession are.
Besides, I really think they should be monitoring coal mines a lot more than baseball diamonds.
Now if you could argue that the beer vendors are in danger of broken bats, that’s another thing. But despite a few broken bats going into the stands, I think you’d have a hard time arguing that the beer vendors are in serious danger requiring government action.
by Josh Timmers on Sep 20, 2010 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Statement from Tyler Colvin, via Cubs Media
"I want to thank Cubs fans for their support all season, especially right now, and let everyone know that I’m doing OK," said Colvin. "I also want to thank everyone who has helped take care of me here in Miami – the Cubs and Marlins training and medical staffs, the EMTs at the ballpark and everyone here at the hospital.
"You never want to have a season end early, and I’m disappointed that I’m not going to be able to make it through the finish line with the rest of my teammates. That being said, I couldn’t be more thankful for the Cubs organization, my teammates and the opportunity to play for Cubs fans my rookie season. Thank you from the bottom of my heart."
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Aw-Best wishes, Tyler!
♪♫ Take me out WITH the crowd.
Buy me some peanuts and cracker jack,
I don't care if I NEVER get back ♪♫ Jack Norworth and Albert Von Tilzer
by katie casey on Sep 20, 2010 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions
My picture of what Colvin is going threw....fax this to Bud
"A dream you dream alone is only a dream. A dream you dream together is reality." John Lennon
going through not threw
"A dream you dream alone is only a dream. A dream you dream together is reality." John Lennon
WOW, Classy Guy!
Best wishes to Tyler on a quick recovery and kudos for a tremendous rookie season!
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on Sep 20, 2010 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions
Get well Tyler.
I’ll miss seeing you play and will see you next season.
A lovely story:
One day, long, long ago, there lived a woman who didn't whine, nag or bitch. That would be me....
But that was a long time ago and it was just that one day.
The end
If it doesn't happen in New York or Boston, it doesn't happen.
Maybe if a star got injured,that would be something, but does anyone think that Selig or the union are really going to do anything because some decent but not great rookie got injured? Or some coach?
I doubt it. I hope I have to eat those words because it’s a serious problem, but I just don’t see MLB moving on this.
by jerry morales rules on Sep 20, 2010 10:30 AM CDT reply actions
I don't see how Bud Selig is going to do anything about this.
He’s oblivious about so many of baseball’s problems I can’t imagine this is any different.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
If they thought for one second that this issue was worth paying attention to...
they already would have done something about it. Bats have been shattering with dozens of near misses and glancing blows to players for years.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 20, 2010 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions
Personally I think there's bigger problems in baseball than bats hitting a player once-in-a-blue-moon.
Such as:
All-star game
Cheating / PEDs
Playoffs that are in no way representative of the regular season
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
There's a risk of death here.
That’s a bit more important than the All-Star Game.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Wrong Al...the All-Star Game COUNTS.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 20, 2010 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions
This seems like the right spot to voice my disagreement
What about fastballs traveling 100 miles per hour hitting a batter in the head? What about a batters follow through hitting a catcher?
I would presuppose that these two incidents are more common than being punctured by a broken bat.
So, if my above statements are true, should baseball use tennis balls? Should there not be a catcher and instead use those bouncy-backstops we all used to throw into?
Yes, there is a “chance” of death, but it is minuscule.
What happened to Mr. Colvin is unfortunate, but this thing is a freak accident. Let’s avoid the hyperbole.
by wennington4 on Sep 20, 2010 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm not trying to sound insensitive, Al.
But there’s a chance of injury/paralysis/death when you’re throwing 9 ounce balls 100+ MPH that hit speeds of 120+ coming off the bat. It’s the name of the game. If MLB really thought this injury/paralysis/death thing was a bigger issue they would require better batting helmets (perhaps ones that cover the jaw or face?), make running into the catcher illegal, or taking out the 2B/SS illegal.
And for the record, I don’t think this should be that big of an issue; MLB announces bat type XYZ is illegal, and it’s done with. But Selig is an idiot and he wouldn’t make a decision that makes sense.
Dan
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Keep in mind Dan...
that as big an idiot as Bud Selig is….he’s only really doing what the owners want him to do or not do.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 20, 2010 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Ever seen that 'NSync video where they are puppets controlled by a super hot girl?
Selig’s the puppet, the super hot girl, I haven’t figured that part out yet.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Regarding thrown balls...
… MLB has mandated batting helmets for decades. They now also mandate helmets for base coaches.
And yet, they can’t mandate a change in bats that would make them safer?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Yes, you're right
They’re is risk in injury and death in everything you do in life. Just driving down the street in your car you risk death.
But its not like we’re changing the game of baseball here. All that is being suggested is a simple clear plastic coating of sorts to make the bats break less. From what I can tell it will make no difference in the bats and could potentially save lives, I don’t see why MLB shouldn’t do it.
by cubsfaninatl on Sep 21, 2010 10:07 AM CDT up reply actions
When it comes to MLB making changes...
…unless the making of money is involved, its going to take something VERY bad to happen before they seriously opt to change.
Colvin’s situation was bad… but I doubt they view it as bad enough to make any changes.
That's probably
the frightening truth. They were “quick to adopt base coaches in helmets tho”… I forget, what’d that take to initiate the change… ???
on the sands of hesitation, lie the bones of countless millions, who, at the brink of the best, sat down to rest, and resting...they died. Author Unknown
Death Of Mike Coolbaugh in North Little Rock
Mike Coolbaugh was the first base coach for the Tulsa Driller, the AA farm team of the Rockies. He got killed by a line drive in the first base coaching box in 2007 at Dickey-Stephens Park in North Little Rock, when Tulsa was playing the Arkansas Travelers. Yes, somebody had to be killed for base coaches to be required to wear helmets.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
World Series Share by Rockies
The Rockies voted Mike Coolbaugh a full World Series share in 2007.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
Sorry Memphis
I was being sarcastic. I recall the incident. I just wanted to remind everyone it took a death to change the policy. Sad.
on the sands of hesitation, lie the bones of countless millions, who, at the brink of the best, sat down to rest, and resting...they died. Author Unknown
Helmets for Pitchers?
Is it such a crazy idea for pitchers to wear helmets? They are the ones most prone to getting hit by line drives.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
Great idea
Sadly, again, no fatalities…yet. Have a fantastic day.
on the sands of hesitation, lie the bones of countless millions, who, at the brink of the best, sat down to rest, and resting...they died. Author Unknown
Hello everyone
Sorry I’ve been absent lately (missed 6 gm W streak), but I lost my mother last week. Please forgive me, cuz thats a good excuse!. I feel sad that it might take a potentially life-threatening injury to get MLBs attention. But that’s the way it seems… if even this is enough!
on the sands of hesitation, lie the bones of countless millions, who, at the brink of the best, sat down to rest, and resting...they died. Author Unknown
oh jeff, I'm so sorry :(
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on Sep 20, 2010 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions
Thanks cooliogirl
at least she didn’t suffer, quick & unexpected. However, our Cubbies haven’t lost since last Monday, the last game she watched!. As is customary in my family, she was buried with a cubs hat in the coffin. :)
on the sands of hesitation, lie the bones of countless millions, who, at the brink of the best, sat down to rest, and resting...they died. Author Unknown
maybe she was watching over Tyler Colvin, that could have very easily been a tragedy
there must be just as many Cubs fans in the next life as there is in this one. I wonder if I’ll come back a Cubs fan? It’s so strong in all of us I can’t see myself as any other kind of fan.
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on Sep 20, 2010 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions
Doubtless
on all counts! Talk asap. Peace
on the sands of hesitation, lie the bones of countless millions, who, at the brink of the best, sat down to rest, and resting...they died. Author Unknown
Sorry to hear about your loss jeff.
A lovely story:
One day, long, long ago, there lived a woman who didn't whine, nag or bitch. That would be me....
But that was a long time ago and it was just that one day.
The end
Very glad to see Tyler is okay
the sad thing really is that no changes will be made to bats league-wide. It sadly will take someone to be seriously injured (visible blood; a clip that can be played ad nauseum on the news and sports networks) or killed for something to actually change. I think Tyler’s injury wasn’t shocking enough to whip the arse of the people who have the power to make the change…including the players. The people responsible for making changes will cite “it’s an extremely rare occurrence” and spew some excuse about how “we’re working on it”. Just like it took serious injuries to bring helmets into the game, it will take serious injuries to make this change…and unfortunately (for changes sake, not Tyler’s, of course) this occurrence wasn’t severe enough. Which is a shame.
"What the hell, let's review it." - Dale Tallon
"They are!" - Pat Foley
"What a farce." - Dale Tallon
gotta run all
so much stuff to do “after the fact”. Hope cubs enjoy the off day… lets go out with a bang, and not a whimper in 2010! Go Cubs! Not to mean to sound “morbid”, but for those of you whom still have parent(s) alive: cherish the moments.
on the sands of hesitation, lie the bones of countless millions, who, at the brink of the best, sat down to rest, and resting...they died. Author Unknown
I know you didn't write it Al, but a small quibble with the Yeager and his catcher's mask flap invention
Was that really related to his on-deck bat-shards-in-the-throat incident? What I remember is him taking a ball in the throat on a nasty hop while behind the plate. Probably happened to him many times, but this particular one really really hurt and got him thinking…
…and voila! catchers mask flap was born.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
That's kinda how I remember it, too
Yeager came up with the mask flap because he got a ball in the throat, not from the shattered-bat incident.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Sep 20, 2010 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions
I believe you are correct
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Fair enough.
That’s what I found on the link.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I think shattered bats area product of thicker barrels and thinner handles on the bats
I think if MLB required a thicker handle on the bat the number of broken bats would drop significantly
We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. I just can't figure out where else to play!
-- Pat Williams
by Fat Punk Kicker on Sep 20, 2010 12:09 PM CDT reply actions
Not sure about that...
…there have always been players who have used thin handled bats, so that isn’t new.
I believe it is from 3 main factors; the use of the new maple bats, pitchers throw harder and bigger stronger hitters create more bat speed – something is going to give.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
I completely agree with the coating of the bats.
A Cricket ball is a little bit smaller, but a great deal harder than a baseball, and yet they took forever to start using any form of glove.
However, the same principle holds true, as the game is slightly similar.
I don’t see anything really changing with the bats as far as bat speed or even the way the ball comes off the bat.
Having watched Cricket for may years, and having played it in my youth, I find it simply the reluctance to change that keeps MLB from exploring the option.
Sadly, what happened to Colvin was avoidable had the players union AND MLB taken the time to try and make the game a little safer.
There were a few in Cricket who complained about the coating, but they were few and far between. I can see the same in MLB, but it has to change before someone is killed and people stop going to games due to MLB’s lack of concern for the fans.
This is true
And the glove I refer to is nothing more than the equivalent of a batting glove, nothing compared to what is used in baseball. (I’ve only seen them used in the last few years.)
And while there have been deaths in Cricket, the correlation can still be made.
No sport can be made truly safe, but I feel that coating the bats would be a much better idea than to keep tempting fate, and waiting for a disaster before something is done.
To prevent injuries a lot should be done in baseball and taking care of the bats is just a start.
If the intent is to prevent injury then all these stupid rules/traditions need to be done with once and for all -
1. Sliding into 2nd base to breakup double plays is dangerous and is just stupid in the 21st century. This can result in a severe injury to the player covering 2nd.
2. Ramming into the catcher like a mad bull at home plate is just plain stupid and ridiculous. This dangerous play should be off the rule book.
3. Brick walls in a field of play? In what kind of a sport do you see this? Ivy and all is good for poetry and pictures but having brick walls is really dangerous. The Cubs should at the very least pad them before someone like Sam Fuld or a Reed Johnson ends up with a career ending injury.
I can go on and on.
Cricket at the least is a gentleman’s game and all the antics that go on a baseball field are not tolerated in Cricket.
This has already been done....
it’s called rec-league softball.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 20, 2010 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions
huh? So I guess we are ok with status quo then.
People who don’t like shattered bats, broken legs, head injuries that have no direct correlation with a given play or the generic spirit of the game can go play Soft Ball.
Wow!
The three things you've listed above all have "a direct correlation with a given play or the generic spirit of the game".
1. Why should I even have to explain this one to you?
2. The object of the game is to score runs.
3. The brick wall isn’t a secret….every player that plays a game in Wrigley knows it’s there. Just like the hill and flagpole in Houston and the bullpen mounds in numerous other ballparks.
Professional Baseball is a hard game played by grown men.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 20, 2010 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions
1. Why should I even have to explain this one to you?
I stopped reading after that.
BTW us, are you Bud Selig?
Actually I got suckered into reading the rest of that stupid post
So having a giant hole right in the middle of the street is OK with you, if everyone knows about it huh?
The hill and flagpole in minute maid park is just as idiotic as the brick wall in Wrigley.
The outfield wall doesn't = middle of the street, but nice try.
If you hate the way professional baseball is played…switch to watching bowling or golf. Those are much safer sports.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 20, 2010 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions
huh? I don't _hate_ the way prof. baseball is played
I can choose to NOT care and feel all manly about it like you because at the end of the day I am not the one playing over there facing 90 MPH fast balls.
But we have enough evidence to show that certain elements unnecessarily hurt players and it is NO fun.
Do you really watch baseball or any sport to see players hurt or die?
if yes, you can go watch bull fighting or that fake wrestling.
Teehee ^-^
You want baseball to be a baby game!
"A dream you dream alone is only a dream. A dream you dream together is reality." John Lennon
and also like any other sport it is just that - a 'sport'
You don’t have to get sweaty and feel worked up over it. I guess wild animals are more manly than the human beings then.
I am just saying that with all the technology around we don’t have to keep doing the same stupid things because probably getting hit by broken bats is somehow manly for certain emotionally insecure personalities.
Sorry, I'm choking on all these words you keep putting in my mouth...
So now it’s “the broken bats” you want to discuss? If you’re going to change the subject….Ok…but what I was talking about were your 3 silly examples of things you want outlawed or changed. Maple bats can and have hurt players. I think it makes sense to implement a solution like the protective tape or film over them to reduce the chance of injury. Bats flying around the field of play are dangerous because they’re basically foreign objects. Other players and THE ACTUAL BALLPARK aren’t.
::hyperventilates and collapses in pool of sweat::
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 20, 2010 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions
How many players...
…have you seen get hurt on the outfield wall at Wrigley? You don’t because they know it is there and they play accordingly.
Ramming into the catcher and breaking up a double play are part of the game and should never be removed.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Soriano's been back there for years
and he’s never hurt himself on the wall
"There are no curses here...Games are won and lost on the baseball field" - Lou Piniella
The batting gloves in cricket are quite thick with padding on top
http://westindianshop.com/sportinggoods/BSG01043.jpg
"I think I'm going to a casino in Indiana and play snake eyes. I don't know what else to say, I'll be honest with you."
So true
I just wasn’t going to start a diatribe about how different they are compared to the ones used in baseball. (I could see a little of that coming)
But, I do wish we had those when I was playing cricket :)
No probs, I think i might have misread
what you were saying first time round.
Where did you play cricket? In the US or overseas?
"I think I'm going to a casino in Indiana and play snake eyes. I don't know what else to say, I'll be honest with you."
I played overseas
In Wellington, and later in Brisbane and Sydney. All of it was school related, but it was a blast.
It would be a great sport to get the US into.
Of course, I’m still preaching Rugby to those who know me as well!! World Cup!!!
I can’t wait :)
And in additon
Bloody He!!, They are MUCH more padded than I remember, and than they look on the Sat.
Breaking bats
I have written letters to Selig about this issue twice over the last 7 years. This is a tragedy waiting to happen (and getting more likely every day). Aluminum bats are illegal in MLB. What is so hard (and takes years of committee meetings to discuss) about issuing a statement that “Effective with the opening of Spring training 2011, maple bats are now illegal for use in ALL levels of MLB.”?
This afternoon...
… I wrote a new post for SB Nation Chicago on this issue. Discuss on this front page FanShot.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
No, only maybe two or three.
But there is new information in my new post. Posted it at SBN Chicago because, well, I had already posted about it quite a bit here.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Someone will eventually get killed, or more seriously injured.
I watched it live, but we’ve all seen it. Colvin could have been much more seriously injured. And, I am not minimizing his injury, just saying it could have been worse. Baseball will drag this out. There is unlikely a legal leg to stand on. The issues with the bats are becoming well known. And, there is a difference between a ball, which most fans are alert to, and mutliple daggers coming at you.
I like the idea of a coating. I was taking to a buddy about it today. There has to be something that can be done.
Great article
If MLB was adamant about coaches wearing helmets then they should do the same for solving this bat problem.
Hey Al
Thanks for posting and thanks for allowing me on your site. Seems the guys at Bat Glove are on the right track. Thanks for that as i had never heard of them until today.
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