Strange, confusing feelings (or Cardinal sins)
I’m just curious if any Cubs fans are experiencing a similar sensation. As the playoff picture began to take shape at the end of the season and the Cardinals clawed their way into the postseason, it dawned on me that a Cards/Brewers NLCS was a possibility. While I didn’t necessarily think the Cards would get past the Phillies, I began to think about who I would cheer for. At first I thought I would likely watch dispassionately, simply enjoying the beauty of baseball being played between two skilled, albeit hated teams, much like I did during the 2005 World Series between the White Sox and Astros. Then as I began to watch today’s game a curious thing happened; I find myself actually rooting for the Cardinals. But not just rooting; audibly cheering…this has created understandably disquieting feelings within. As I realized I was standing up and shouting when David Freese hit his home run, I began to question what my life had become. I realize the Cardinals represent the Cubs greatest rivals, and geographic considerations don’t really enter into the equation for me as I live nowhere near the Midwest.
But I can’t stand the Brewers. I think I actually hate them. I dislike the Cardinals because they are the Cardinals and that’s what I’m supposed to do, but I respect many of their players. I genuinely hate Milwaukee and their preening, showboating, Tonyplushing, arrogance. Here’s hoping this St. Louis support is a passing occurrence, and once the World Series begins I’ll be able to root loudly for either the Tigers or Rangers. But the greater issue is whether I’ll regain my self-respect after cheering for the Cardinals. Is anyone else experiencing this phenomenon, actively rooting for the Cardinals (or I suppose the Brewers) and sinking further into the miasma of self-loathing that typically accompanies a Cubs’ offseason?
Oh, I’m also troubled by what will become of me if I’m forced to cheer for Prince Fielder next year. But I realize that’s putting the cart before the free agency horse. (For everyone other than Fielder himself, apparently.)
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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i hope all of the NLCS games go to 20 innings
so the pitching staff is burned out for the world series
I'm a happy panda.
Because Nolan Ryan (my baseball hero)
owns the Rangers, I’m rooting for them, even though I always root for the senior circuit. As far as the Cardinals/Brewers are concerned, the Cubs/Cardinals rivalry is now almost non-existent and my disdain for the Brewers runs deep. Go Cardinals!!
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
My rooting instinct in the NLCS
After giving it much thought, I decided to support a team which might be losing its slugging first baseman to free-agency.
Pujols could be the player in MLB who preens the most. I don’t think any team could be more arrogant than the Cards, except maybe the Yankees.
I don’t think those are the real reasons.
"Prince Fielder is too fat even for the Oakland A’s" - Billy Beane
I have to disagree
Pujols is the rare superstar, by all accounts one of the good guys.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
I don't know what is the matter with you people
The Cardinals are EVIL!. The Brewers are American League team that got forced into our division. If I were a Brewers fan I would be annoyed by the tens of thousands of Cub fans taking over their park for many years. One persons “preening” is another’s celebrating and playing with heart. TLR is probably the biggest A-hole in baseball. I have NO problem at all rooting for the Brewers though to be fair I prefer either AL team to them, but if the AL team were say the Yankees I would have no trouble rooting for the Brewers to win the WS.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either
by Doggie Stalker on Oct 9, 2011 10:24 PM CDT reply actions 3 recs
Exactly.
No problems cheering for the Brew Crew.
I’d cheer for the Yankees over the Cards.
"Keep pushin' til' it's understood. And these badlands start treating us good."
Amen
As one who has lived near Card fans for almost 50 yrs. There are no worse fans towards Cub followers. If I even wear so much as a Cub cap anywhere, and I mean anywhere, I’m ridiculed all day by total strangers.
"It's a funny old world. Man's lucky if he gets out of it alive." W.C. Fields
Yep.
I went to a Brewer game at Miller Park once when the Cards were the visiting team. I wore my Cubs cap. Not one Brewer fan gave me any grief, but the Cardinal fans were truly obnoxious about it.
Dear Great Pumpkin, I am looking forward to your arrival on Halloween Night. I hope you will bring me lots of presents.
The rivalry is over, it was over the day the Cubs organization no longer could fight back.
You can sometimes escape a bear attack by playing dead, well that’s what kind of happened and the Cardinals moved on. In fact, I would say that definite rivalries have been formed between the Reds, Brewers and Cards this year. It’s up to the Cubs now to figure out how to get back into the fray.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
by troutfishin on Oct 9, 2011 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
So true...
…the Cubs are like the very last kid picked to play.
St. Louis or Milwaukee would be crazy to let either of their st basemen walk away. With (a healthy?) Wainright coming back for the Cardinals and the lineup the Brewers have now, they both have separated themselves from all other teams in the Central for a good 2 or 3 years.
"When I came up to bat with three men on and two outs in the ninth, I looked in the other team's dugout and they were already in street clothes." - Bob Uecker
** 1st basemen
"When I came up to bat with three men on and two outs in the ninth, I looked in the other team's dugout and they were already in street clothes." - Bob Uecker
Crew can't afford Prince
There is no runaway contender in the NL Central in the near future.
Not so sure
The Reds still have a lot of talent. This could change if they trade Votto, but if Walt Jocketty wises up and fires Dusty at some point in the near future, I could see the Reds taking a big step forward.
This is just silly
So in the years when the Bears are terrible you don’t care if the Packers win ( GO BACK FYI)
If the Yankees finish 5th their fans don’t care if the Red Sox win? This is our historic and never ending enemy. I have changed my views a about some teams over the years. As a kid I hated the Reds, but gradually I stopped caring. I still hate the Mets a lot but not as much as I used to, but I will always hate the Cardinals and I will always went them to lose and I don’t care if Greg Maddux came out of retirement to pitch for them and Fuld batted lead off. Truth be told the worse the Cubs are relative the Cubs , the MORE I hate them.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either
by Doggie Stalker on Oct 10, 2011 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I won't watch an NLCS game.
An ALCS game? Sure.
"When I came up to bat with three men on and two outs in the ninth, I looked in the other team's dugout and they were already in street clothes." - Bob Uecker
Brewers > Cardinals
but I’d rather cheer for gonorrhea than the Brewers.
At least gonorrhea can be cured with a pill, I don't think you can say the same for a...
…Brewers fan.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
yeah, I was gonna say AIDS
but that’s a little insensitive
by FloridaCubsFan on Oct 10, 2011 12:32 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm thankful midwest baseball is ascendant this year.
I’ve never bought into the hate-the-Cards hysteria anyway. Three historic, working class, solid, heartland USA cities get to be in the October spotlight. What’s wrong with that? And I’m still cheering that the Yankees, Red Sox, and Phils are out!
I’ll pull for the Brewers in the World Series (assuming they get there) — especially if they have to go against the Texas Rangers.
We have to demand more!
by copingwiththecubs on Oct 10, 2011 6:52 AM CDT reply actions
He can't hit the breaking
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Oct 16, 2011 8:07 AM CDT up reply actions
I can't root for the Cardinals, ever.
But Brewers players doing that stupid “Beast” thing makes me truly dislike them. And their fans are awful.
So I’m hoping for good, interesting baseball games, and then the Tigers or Rangers to crush the winner.
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Why is their “Beast Mode” stupid? If it gets them fired up and they do it for each other and at each other. Why is it dumb. I think many of us don’t like either b/c we are haters or very jealous that we are watching a team that can’t afford to keep their superstars play like we only wish our beloved cubbies would have played.
by cgregory1982 on Oct 10, 2011 7:20 AM CDT up reply actions
Every time they get on base?
It’s way over the top.
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NLCS vs Golfing…I understand your POV but whatever gets you fired up and on a roll. Mr Yellon would you feel the same if it was the Cubs smashing on other teams.
by cgregory1982 on Oct 10, 2011 7:32 AM CDT up reply actions
You have a point.
In fact, I wouldn’t want Cubs teams to do that. Why rub it in? Enjoy your win, sure. But some of the Brewers celebrations are way over the top.
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I hate that argument, you can't find annoying what another team does....
…simply because “if the Cubs were doing it, you wouldn’t it find it so annoying would you”?
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
I was a Bulls fan
when the Bulls had Rodman. Rodman was a punk then, before, and after. I wish they didn’t need Rodman to be that good. Alas, they did.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
I hated Dennis Rodman
until the day I heard the Bulls got him. He was a strange bird, but he helped me watch my team win 3 more rings. You always had that “Zambrano” feeling with him, but Jordan was able to keep him somewhat under control.
People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring. ~Rogers Hornsby
Over the top celebrations have gone too far.
I imagine you watched the end of Game 5 of the Brewers win over Arizona. When Nyjer Morgan was interviewed on the field, all he could say while pointing to the fans was: “F-(bomb) yeah! F-(bomb) yeah!” It was all on national television. Then Nyjer came back and said he can’t put his feeling into words… you just did Nyjer, you just did. Now clean your mouth out when you are speaking to a national audience. Better yet, clean up your showboating act while you’re at it.
Jack Brickhouse: "Hey! Hey!" Harry Caray: "Holy Cow!"
Vince Lloyd: "The Chicago Cubs are on the Air!" Len Kasper: "Oh Baby!!!!"
Ron Santo: "YES!" "All Right! Let's do it!" "Ohhh Nooooo!" "Gee Whiz! Come on!" AND... "This Is The Year!"
by #1 iowan cubs fan on Oct 10, 2011 8:37 PM CDT up reply actions
That cracked me up.
It’s clear he’s screaming ‘Eff yeah’ to the crowd and he’s gonna continue to do so. So what does the dopey reporter do? Sticks a microphone right up to his craw where we can now hear his profanities crystal clear. I was on the edge of my seat the whole time, and laughed my ass off when it happened.
Seeya Jimbo! Good job, Tommy Boy!
Nyjer Morgan is a piece of work.
Jack Brickhouse: "Hey! Hey!" Harry Caray: "Holy Cow!"
Vince Lloyd: "The Chicago Cubs are on the Air!" Len Kasper: "Oh Baby!!!!"
Ron Santo: "YES!" "All Right! Let's do it!" "Ohhh Nooooo!" "Gee Whiz! Come on!" AND... "This Is The Year!"
by #1 iowan cubs fan on Oct 10, 2011 9:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Did Santo's clicking also bother others?
by Madison Cub Fan on Oct 10, 2011 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions
It did, at the time.
But you have to remember that in 1969, NO ONE did that.
I suspect someone should have told Durocher and Santo that wasn’t a good idea.
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At the time?
I don’t know that I had a strong opinion on it or not. I was 12.
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@ 12 I had strong opinions on sports already
When he you did start having strong opinions on baseball did you have a problem with it?
by Madison Cub Fan on Oct 10, 2011 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Well.
Personally, I didn’t have a problem with it. It doesn’t seem real “in your face” like some of the modern “celebrations” do.
However, in the context of the times I can see how people would have been upset with it.
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Out of even hard core baseball fans
what percent even knows about the beast right now? Much less will remember it in 30 years?
The clicking will always be remembered and possibly not fondly by many team and fans May he RIP
One of the reasons to ‘HATE’ I think is stetching it unless one is looking for reasons to hate a team.
SB is different he’s felt that way since he was a kid. In 1990 I’m guessing a majority of Cubs fan didn’t care one way or another about them.
by Madison Cub Fan on Oct 10, 2011 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions
I think "the beast" is getting known because...
… the Brewers are in the playoffs and it’s getting national attention. Other than Brewers fans, I can’t imagine anyone likes it.
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If they make the WS people will know
but whose even watching LCS on tbs
TBS’ St. Louis-Milwaukee game Sunday afternoon drew a 2.4 overnight, down a whopping 62% from its coverage of the Yankees-Rangers ALCS game 1 last year
by Madison Cub Fan on Oct 10, 2011 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree i wish the Cubs had a little fire in them
People have said how they get annoyed by Garza hanging over the railing but the Cubs need more players like that.
Uh-oh.
That’s the idea that got us Milton Bradley.
The Cubs need good players. “Fire” has nothing to do with it.
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by Al Yellon on Oct 11, 2011 7:43 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Ok let me rephrase
Good players that want to win and have passion for the game I.e. Matt Garza.
Players with Byrd’s attitude and Ramirez’s skill.
Also The Rangers have some stupid antics too. That’s just what teams do when they have fun while playing the game. Most other fan bases won’t like another teams antics.
I did happily in 1964
when they beat the stinkin Yankees
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Oct 10, 2011 10:02 AM CDT up reply actions
now....that's a hard one Yankees vs Cards, I think I'd have to go Cards
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on Oct 10, 2011 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions
It was an easy call for me
I grew up hating the Yankees. I became a Bob Gibson fan that year. Still my favorite of all the pitchers I have seen. Loved his toughness.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Oct 10, 2011 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions
Yep...what I'm waiting for is...
when Fielder and Braun go through their “boxing” routine…Braun bobs, when he shoulda weaved, and Fielder knocks him out. That would be classic.
"When I came up to bat with three men on and two outs in the ninth, I looked in the other team's dugout and they were already in street clothes." - Bob Uecker
I really don’t think they are rubbing iit in or doing it to show up the other team. When I played in college we did something similar when we went on a late season 12 of 13 win streak. As a team it really did fire us up. However I really think it’s how you look at it.
Remember to hit "reply" if you are answering another comment.
Helps the threading. Thanks.
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Marmol gave the Cards life with a sickening lack of control, and in most years ...
…I would be pulling for any team to do what he could not: drive the stake and finish-off St. Louis.
However, the Brewers seem to be as obnoxious a bunch as the ‘86 Mets, with fans to match, which I’m sure will be more than enough to make me a Cardinals fan for this series.
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
Living in Atlanta
I have to respectfully disagree. We could of helped put them in the ground, yes, but the Braves completely fell apart. That is the real reason they are there. Either way, it still sickens me.
People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring. ~Rogers Hornsby
If we win the Marmol game
The Cards might tie Atlanta, but they would have beaten them. Atlanta had nothing. This isn’t on us.
"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk
There was another Marmol blown save vs. the Cardinals in June.
Both of those games, within one strike of a Cubs victory. Win those and the Cardinals are watching the playoffs on TV.
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And...
… how bad do you think the Phillies feel? By beating the Braves, they allowed the Cardinals to get in, which eventually sent themselves home for the winter.
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exactly
and they (phillies) played the starters all the way through the last game. Alot of people thought they were gonna rest them, which would have given Atlanta an advantage. Not the case.
People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring. ~Rogers Hornsby
What the Phillies did to Atlanta and didn't do against St. Louis is what REALLY aggrevates me.
As always, the Cardinals got the best possible result in the best possible scenario. And to boot, a former Chicago Cubs shortstop is making his “Finally, it feels like I’m on the right side of the rivalry” quote from this past offseason feel that much worse to see the Cardinals in the NLCS.
Go ALCS winner… hopefully Texas, but Detroit is okay too.
Jack Brickhouse: "Hey! Hey!" Harry Caray: "Holy Cow!"
Vince Lloyd: "The Chicago Cubs are on the Air!" Len Kasper: "Oh Baby!!!!"
Ron Santo: "YES!" "All Right! Let's do it!" "Ohhh Nooooo!" "Gee Whiz! Come on!" AND... "This Is The Year!"
by #1 iowan cubs fan on Oct 10, 2011 8:46 PM CDT up reply actions
I Was At That June Game
Ryan Freakin’ Theriot! Ugh!
Good things come to those who wait... and wait....and wait.
I will root for the Crew
to beat the Cards, and whoever wins, I will root against in the WS. I dont want another team in the division to win the series before we do again, but if it was Milwaukee, it wouldnt bother me like the Cards. I respect their players and even TLR, but I dont like them. Its no different than the Yankees. You can say you dont like them, but to say they dont have great players you would be crazy.
People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring. ~Rogers Hornsby
never
….I could never root for the Cards
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on Oct 10, 2011 9:56 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
I got a question about Brewers and Cards
The people who hate the Brewers did you hate them as an AL team? If you are under 35 I can see why one would b/c they’ve basically never known them as an AL team. I was in college when they switched and am rather blah when it comes to them. Had I been a kid I would, much like I do with the Bears and Vikings.
The Cards on the other hand they’ve always played against. I’ve never liked. I’ve always taken pleasure in them losing.
by Madison Cub Fan on Oct 10, 2011 10:11 AM CDT reply actions
I was OK with the Brewers when they were an AL team.
Not the Cubs divisional rival, for one thing.
Also, the attitude of the organization and fans seemed different then.
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yes it was different but they were horrible team
The Pirates start getting better they might also be a little different attitude
by Madison Cub Fan on Oct 10, 2011 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes, I did
Because their fan base has always been militant to fans of other teams. Growing up in SE WI as a Cub fan, even with them in the AL, the fans were obnoxious. Now that it’s the same division, they are toxic.
Step Two: Develop an organizational plan
by Shanghai Badger on Oct 10, 2011 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
As a Wisconsinite I kind of have a soft spot for the Crew
I grew up with the Brewers as my AL team and until they switched over when I was 18 I was a fan. And being from the sticks in south central WI I also didn’t have any real experience with the Brewers fans that are present in SE part of the state. I’ve always hated the Cardinals – that was taught to me at a young age by my grandmother.
by wallrock on Oct 10, 2011 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yes, I'm over 35, but I never did like the Brewers, especially after the Selig-engineered start of interleague play...
…and the Bud Bonanza of moving his team into the NL, where he knew that legions of Cubs fans would indirectly make the Brewers solvent while pumping enormous pre-sale value into his franchise.
More than that, I especially resent baseball championships won in Milwaukee, in the same way pennants won in Phoenix or Los Angeles annoy me. These are all cities where the Cubs played, and continue to play, a major role in building and maintaining interest in baseball. Why should these former satellites and long-time minor league towns get their share of pennants while we seem forever saddled with Cubness and Wrigleyism?
Sure, I know it’s only envy of the periodic but routine success enjoyed by almost all franchises other than the Cubs. As far as Milwaukee goes, I must say that I’m still thankful for the Braves, and the championship-by-proxy I enjoyed as a kid in 1957, along with most fans in Chicagoland. If you lived north of Chicago in the years from ‘55-’60, you likely made the Braves your team, as the Cubs stumbled through the darkest years of P.K.’s Terrible Twenty.
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
Watching highlights, I found myself doing something peculiar
Every time either team gave up the lead, I found myself laughing at them. Not necessarily cheering for either team (in fact, definitely not cheering for either team), but enjoying watching each team suffer alternately.
Go Tigers/Rangers.
"We push bunt, we squeeze bunt, we hit and run, we steal home!" - Larry Cox (I think...) on the 1989 NL East Champion Chicago Cubs
Definitely Rooting for Milwaukee
Where I live, it’s 75% Cardinals, 15% Braves, 5% Cubs, and 5% for other MLB teams, when it comes to rooting interests. The Cardinals are more popular than the Tennessee Titans down my way. Of course, that’s comparing baseball and football. I definitely want the Brew Crew to win.
Good things come to those who wait... and wait....and wait.
Something that I think might also play a part
When people find out I’ve been a hard core life long Packers fan but also feel the same way about the Cubs. Normally look @ me a bit odd.
If the Twins ended up in the NL central for some reason, could a little of my massive Viking hate spill over? possibly. So could that be part of it? The intense Bears/Packers contempt.
by Madison Cub Fan on Oct 10, 2011 11:06 AM CDT reply actions
I will never root for the Cards
But I think I’m in the same boat as most everyone else in that I am not really rooting for the Crew, either. Nyjer Morgan needs to go away. I’m still shocked the Phils blew it against the Cards.
I used to root for the Cards in the Series when I was little - '67, '68
but now, after decades of being exposed to their obnoxious, soelf-importants, self-reverential, self-loving fans, I hate them. I can’t stand them. I want to see them go down. Their getting to the Series would just be another example to the jerks that they somehow deserve to be there more than any of the lesser organizations that make up the rest of the National League.
I would root for the Tigers against St. Louis or Milwaukee in the Series but with both Young and Maggs gone, I’m afraid it will be Texas. I root for no team from Texas. So if it’s the Brewers and Texas, I’m for the Brewers. Cards and Texas? I root for no one and probably watch as little of the Series as I have in years.
Its Cards for me all the way
I think everybody knows how much I hate the Brewers and ole googly eyes Ryan Braun. The 3 teams I hate most in baseball Brewers, and both Sox teams. As for cheering for Fielder if he is a Cub well in my opinion I would rather have him than Pujols. Younger, cheaper (maybe). I will be cheering for the Cards the whole time until 1 little weasel at 2nd base.
"Women...you can't live without them, and they can't pee standing up." Rube Baker
I honestly don't care
Maybe its my current level of frustration with the Cubs, but I’m not going to devote any more emotions to hoping that a rival doesn’t win it all. Its not going to be the Cubs, so who cares. I just want to see some good baseball and be sufficiently entertained.
I truly dislike Tony Larussa
and I was truly happy when the Brewers won last night. I think Larussa and Jeter would make great “life partners”.
"I lof to hit de home ron!"
Whoa see that over there thats left field
Where did Jeter come from? Jeter is one of the good guys in baseball. I got nothin but respect for Jeter how he plays the game, keeps to himself, doesnt show up other teams
"Women...you can't live without them, and they can't pee standing up." Rube Baker
This.
I don’t quite understand the Jeter hatred in some quarters.
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I'm Not A Jeter Hater, But...
the perceived leader of the Yankees is always going to get some hatred. It’s guilt by association.
Good things come to those who wait... and wait....and wait.
I suppose.
I have a lot of respect for him.
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Plus, Jeter is known to give back to the community. And I have respect for players that do that.
Jack Brickhouse: "Hey! Hey!" Harry Caray: "Holy Cow!"
Vince Lloyd: "The Chicago Cubs are on the Air!" Len Kasper: "Oh Baby!!!!"
Ron Santo: "YES!" "All Right! Let's do it!" "Ohhh Nooooo!" "Gee Whiz! Come on!" AND... "This Is The Year!"
by #1 iowan cubs fan on Oct 10, 2011 8:48 PM CDT up reply actions
It has LOT more to do with his supporters and fans than it does with him
Stuff like him winning Gold Gloves despite being a pretty bad SS doesn’t help.
Yeah, that's a valid point.
You can’t really blame him for that, though.
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Jeter is just all right
oh yeah!
"We push bunt, we squeeze bunt, we hit and run, we steal home!" - Larry Cox (I think...) on the 1989 NL East Champion Chicago Cubs
An intriguing comment probably best left unexplored.
Baseball is pitching, offensive production, baserunning and defense.
I know how you feel.
I am having the same strange, confused feelings although I’m rooting for the Brewers because I’ve disliked the Cardinals longer. I’m an NL person so this disturbing condition will continue as I root for the Brewers or the Cards in the WS.
Dear Great Pumpkin, I am looking forward to your arrival on Halloween Night. I hope you will bring me lots of presents.
No true Cub fan would ever root for the Cardinals
EVER, these two teams have been rivals for over 120 years, the Brewers have never been a rival. As mentioned, they were an AL team that was thrown into the NL. Amazing that anybody would root for the Cardinals over the Brewers despite what you think of any player or gesture they may make.
Oh c'mon.
You are just saying this tongue-in-cheek, right? Cuz I don’t think most of us have been around for that whole 120 years.
While your sentiment about rooting for the Brewers over the Cardinals holds true for me, I wouldn’t say that someone wasn’t a true Cub fan for rooting for the Cardinals. I think the rivalries are bigger depending where you live and what kind of fans you have to deal with on a daily basis.
Dear Great Pumpkin, I am looking forward to your arrival on Halloween Night. I hope you will bring me lots of presents.
The Cubs Cardinals rivalry...
…. really dates only back to about the late 1920s. In the first decade of this century when the Cubs were winning pennants, the Cardinals were a really bad team. They didn’t win their first NL pennant until 1926, and then the two teams fought for pennants most of the next couple of decades (between 1928 and 1945, the Cubs or Cardinals won 11 of the 18 NL pennants).
The rivalry as we know it in the current sense really started in 1967, when the Cubs awoke from the 20-year slumber and were in first place in July, but the Cardinals then ran off with the pennant.
So it’s about 45 years old, not 120.
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the two teams have been playing each other that long though
that’s my point…..it has the Bears/Packers longevity history.
Longevity doesn't necessarily equal rivalry.
You imply that when you say “the Brewers have never been a rival”.
By your definition, yes, they have, for 14 years.
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and the Mets were are rival for more than twice that
In my mind I still dislike them far more than the Brewers and no In have no memory of 69
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either
by Doggie Stalker on Oct 10, 2011 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions
I think the rivalry as we know it is even more recent than that. It dates to when the hated Mets
were sent out of the Cubs’ division. From 1969 until then, I hated the Mets far and away more than the Cardinals. Might have been different if you grew up downstate, but beating the Mets was always more thrilling to me than beating the Cardinals.
As late as Jack Clark’s homer in the NLCS against the Dodgers, I was still rooting for the Cards in the postseason. I remember really enjoying that homer because I hated the Dodgers and Lasorda far more than the Cards.
Never hated the Cards until the Brock trade sent them on a spectacular pennant run.
Yet I was glad to watch them beat the Yanks in the ‘64 Series. Pulled for Boston in ’67 and Detroit in ’68, the latter with its famous Tigers’ comeback after Detroit lost three of the first four. That turnaround was made all the better as the key Game 5 play occurred when Brock failed to slide for what would have been an insurance run and was tagged out at home, giving Detroit new life and instant momentum.
Still, given the right circumstances, I easily can root for the Cards. That Clark home run you mention might be the best example – nothing better than watching Slim Fast Tommy take a hit. Even in New York, Lasorda had his detractors. Along with maybe a hundred other fans who had walked in off the street. I watched the Clark HR in an appliance store on Sixth Avenue in Manhattan, and just by the roar of that small crowd as Clark connected, you could imagine the New York money riding on the Cards that day.
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
I think ernaga has hit on something.
The Brock trade and its aftermath — the three Cardinals pennants in the 60s — probably solidified the Cardinals as a hated rival.
Before that, I don’t think it was as intense. Also, it’s hard to imagine from the standpoint of 2011, but before the mid to late 1970s, road trips to games even that close were not common. Though thousands of Cubs fans now go to St. Louis and Cardinals fans come to Chicago, I’d bet if you looked at any such crowd in the 1950s, you’d have seen very few fans of the other team.
Road tripping to baseball games is a fairly recent phenomenon.
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RE: the Mets.
Now you’re talkin’ real hate. They were trouble from the beginning, and speaking of Lasorda, the Cards, and the Clark home run reminds me of three fatal shots absorbed by the Mets, one of which helped put Tommy in the Hall of Fame.
Of course, I’m speaking of Scioscia’s HR off Gooden in ‘88, as well as Molina’s against Aaron Heilman in the 2006 playoffs, and Terry Pendleton’s HR for the Cards off Roger McDowell in the last week of the ’87 regular season, a triple-helping of sunshine for Met haters everywhere.
The first two of those hits killed the Mets “dynasty” before it really could solidify, while Molina’s shot sent New York into its current tailspin.
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
Since the Mets were taken out of the same division with the Cubs...
… the rivalry has diminished.
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Some of us have VERY long memories.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either
by Doggie Stalker on Oct 11, 2011 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions
I love it when people define others' fandom
Get over yourself.
Step Two: Develop an organizational plan
by Shanghai Badger on Oct 10, 2011 10:32 PM CDT up reply actions
As for Brewer fans
I only know a couple. Say what you will about their fanbase. But none of them really dislike any of their players.
I wish I could say the same.
by Madison Cub Fan on Oct 10, 2011 5:43 PM CDT reply actions
I understand completely
I feel the exact same way.
I like to think I’m just rooting against the arrogant Brewers (namely Nyjer Morgan).
I find the Brewers annoying during the season but I don't hate them...
Since they are now contending for the NL pennant and the chance to play in the World Series, I’m able to root for them. I have a soft spot for them since I have been to Miller Park, love the Racing Sausages and the fact you can get the very nontraditional ballpark fare, cinnamon roasted nuts, at the park. Plus, I had a grandmother who rooted for Milwaukee baseball (she was a Braves fan back in the day).
I want to see a Brewers/Tigers World Series. It’s time for the MIdwest to represent!
"Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?"--The Brain
There are three reasons and three reasons only to root for the Cards
1) Rooting for the Cards is one of the demands made by people who have kidnapped your children.
2) the Cards are playing a prison team made up entirely of child molesters and the Cards have to win or the molesters get paroled.
3) every other team in every other organized baseball league in every other country on every inhabited planet has spontaneously combusted. And frankly, you should become a lacrosse fan if that happens.
That is it. That is the list.
"It's all in the game, yo"
List
That just about covers it. One of my most satisfying moments in the Cub/Card rivalry was in 1974 when the Cubs played the Pirates & could force a one game playoff w/the Cards if they beat the Bucs. They led up until the final out, when Rueschel fanned the fianl hitter, but alas, Swisher dropped the 3rd strike, the runner reached & the Pirates went on to win. Every Card fan I knew was sure the Cubs dropped the game on purpose, but they forget this was a last place Cub team. It was the norm that year.
"It's a funny old world. Man's lucky if he gets out of it alive." W.C. Fields
I think the WS will be Rangers vs Brewers and Rangers will win it all.
I would love for them to win it at Milwaukee and the camera pans on 40,000 Brewers fans looking like they just got a shot of Novocaine.
If the Brewers win it all this year,
That would give Wisconsin a championship in professional football and baseball in one year. Shucks. How come us Iowans never get anything? (laughs)
Jack Brickhouse: "Hey! Hey!" Harry Caray: "Holy Cow!"
Vince Lloyd: "The Chicago Cubs are on the Air!" Len Kasper: "Oh Baby!!!!"
Ron Santo: "YES!" "All Right! Let's do it!" "Ohhh Nooooo!" "Gee Whiz! Come on!" AND... "This Is The Year!"
by #1 iowan cubs fan on Oct 10, 2011 9:57 PM CDT up reply actions
If the Cardinals do win it all...
Do you guys think next season they’ll hand out the world series rings against the Brewers or the Cubs? You know they’ll do it when the Cubs are in town just to further inflate their ego. The Cardinals and Cardinals fans really need their ego’s inflated more because… Cardinals nation never gets what they want. They never get spoiled rotten.
Jack Brickhouse: "Hey! Hey!" Harry Caray: "Holy Cow!"
Vince Lloyd: "The Chicago Cubs are on the Air!" Len Kasper: "Oh Baby!!!!"
Ron Santo: "YES!" "All Right! Let's do it!" "Ohhh Nooooo!" "Gee Whiz! Come on!" AND... "This Is The Year!"
by #1 iowan cubs fan on Oct 10, 2011 10:14 PM CDT reply actions
BTW... I was being sarcastic.
Jack Brickhouse: "Hey! Hey!" Harry Caray: "Holy Cow!"
Vince Lloyd: "The Chicago Cubs are on the Air!" Len Kasper: "Oh Baby!!!!"
Ron Santo: "YES!" "All Right! Let's do it!" "Ohhh Nooooo!" "Gee Whiz! Come on!" AND... "This Is The Year!"
by #1 iowan cubs fan on Oct 10, 2011 10:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Brew Crew over Cards
I loved watching the Brewers in the early 80s when they were in the AL and bummed they were moved to the NL. No way can I root for LaRussa and the Cards because of 1982 Series and Cubs fan in me…
This is not as difficult as watching the Astros play the White Sux in the Series a few years back…that was pure evil…
That series almost ended up being the White Sox and Cardinals.
That’s the worst matchup I can ever think of for Cubs fans to watch. Of course, now that I’ve said it, we’re gonna see it happen sometime soon. If it does happen, who do you root for being a Cubs fan? I guess it would be appropriate to root for Chicago because any championship won by a Chicago team is good for the city… but it would still be a tough pill to swallow.
Jack Brickhouse: "Hey! Hey!" Harry Caray: "Holy Cow!"
Vince Lloyd: "The Chicago Cubs are on the Air!" Len Kasper: "Oh Baby!!!!"
Ron Santo: "YES!" "All Right! Let's do it!" "Ohhh Nooooo!" "Gee Whiz! Come on!" AND... "This Is The Year!"
by #1 iowan cubs fan on Oct 11, 2011 12:01 AM CDT up reply actions
When that happens...
…all you can hope for is the “Roller Derby Channel” is up and running 24/7.
"When I came up to bat with three men on and two outs in the ninth, I looked in the other team's dugout and they were already in street clothes." - Bob Uecker
Don't have the RedBird hate so many others do ...
therefore I root for StL once the Cubs are out. I don’t consider Milw anything special except for being Chicago’s biggest suburb.
Outside the division and still in the NL, I go with Phi (yes, against StL because I like the Phils rotation) and over to the AL, well it’s BeanTown. But since they tanked, I’m going with the Rangers this year. TB is also intriguing with how they compete with such a low payroll and being in the ALE.
Just win the next game...!
I've been supporting the Brewers from the get-go...
…if only because I picked them to win the division, so every time they advance into or in the playoffs it makes me look like I know what the hell I’m talking about when it comes to baseball.
That said, I really don’t have any discernible emotional investment either way in either team. I’m not standing up and cheering for anyone in this series. In fact, as confusing as this might sound, I think I’m hoping the Brewers win the NLCS and then lose to the Rangers in World Series. And that’s because the Rangers have rebuilt their organization recently in a manner that I’d very much like to see the Cubs follow.
Baseball is pitching, offensive production, baserunning and defense.
Brewers for 2 reasons
1) Matt Holliday’s late and dirty slide with spikes high into Starlin Castro.
2) I prefer Miller to Budweiser.
by toppsmike on Oct 11, 2011 8:35 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
American League all the way at this point.
Either way, it seems silly for anyone to say “Cubs fans should root for this team cause…” Cubs fans can cheer for/against whoever the hell they want. That’s more life experience than anything. Being a Cubs fan and the dislike that accompanies it is a personal endeavor. A Cubs fan living in St. Louis is going to have a different perspective than a Cubs fan living in Milwaukee. And that’s okay. At the end of the day, we’re Cubs fans.
Seeya Jimbo! Good job, Tommy Boy!
by shoemile on Oct 12, 2011 4:03 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
dont feel bad
the cardinals are total pros and some of the brewer players have acted like real jerks.this aint wrestling boys you keep it in the clubhouse.i dont really care who wins but i will always have a soft spot for larussa for an act of kindness many years ago.
I'm late to the party, but here is what I would like to see...
The Brewers lose the NLCS to the Cardinals in seven games, preferably on a heartbreaking error.
The Cardinals lose the WS to Rangers in four games.
This would be the worst possible scenario for both teams – the Brewers fail in their shot to even reach the WS. So close, yet so far. The Cardinals, who have already been to the WS many times, just get embarrassed by the Rangers. In both cases, it gives neither organization any bragging rights, and any claims of success can be shot down with a simple “Yabbut you lost.”
I think I speak for everyone here when I say, "Wait, what the hell are you talking about?"
by Ross on Oct 15, 2011 11:58 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I see one rooting angle here
If the Cards win the NLCS, it creates the opportunity for Ryan “the right side of the rivalry” Theriot to boot a ball and gain lasting goat status.
Cardinals fan chiming in
I know you guys probably don’t care much about my opinion but I thought I’d share. I don’t really harbor a grudge against any Cub fan who roots against the Cardinals against any opponent. We’re rivals after all. This is understandable. I thought I’d let you know though that, while I feel compelled to “hate” the Cubs organization because of my upbringing, I don’t really dislike any of their players (well except Zambrano, but I don’t think many of you guys like him either). It’s completely different for the Brewers and Reds. There are several players on each team who I truly loathe. What’s worse is the way that their fans seem to embrace their player’s petulant actions. When Yadier Molina got suspended for screaming at an umpire the attitude in St. Louis and over at VEB was that he had gone completely overboard. We forgave him and still supported him but nobody supported that particular action. When Nyjer Morgan Tweeted a completely unprovoked attack at Pujols, Brewers fans (at least the ones over at other-BCB) rushed to his support and if anything it further cemented him as one of their favorite players. When Brandon Phillips made an (again, completely unprovoked) attack calling the Cardinals players “whiny little bitches” Reds fans couldn’t have been happier, and it launched a meme over at RR that survives to this day (and, while Brandon Phillips started the whole thing, and Johnny Cueto ended Jason Larue’s career with repeated kicks to the face, RR remains convinced that that series is perfect evidence of why the Cardinals are the most evil team in professional sports).
I guess what I’m saying is that I understand Cubs fans hating on the Cardinals. In some areas I can definitely see how the Cardinals are annoying (believe me that Larussa’s occasional holier-than-thou quote is as grating to me as it is to any of you). I just hope you guys don’t loathe us purely for being the Cardinals, because I don’t really feel the same way toward you guys.
Also this-BCB is infinitely better than RR and other-BCB (at least when St. Louis is involved. The mere mention of the Cardinals is enough to turn 90% of otherwise-rational fans on those two boards into rabid lunatics).
When Nyjer Morgan Tweeted a completely unprovoked attack at Pujols, Brewers fans (at least the ones over at other-BCB) rushed to his support and if anything it further cemented him as one of their favorite players.
it’s tony plush, man
THEOOOOOOOOO
by jesus christos on Oct 16, 2011 3:29 PM CDT up reply actions
To be honest I wasn't that upset over those tweets
though it wouldn’t be something I’d support out of a player I root for. The reason I hate Morgan has nothing to do with Tony Plush (which is at least somewhat entertaining), but because he injured that one Philly fan (threw a baseball at his head trying to hit another fan who was heckling him) and then a few days later he body checked the Cardinals’ backup catcher coming home to score (Cards catcher didn’t have the ball and was giving him home. He had stepped so far away from the plate that when Morgan ran into him he didn’t even manage to touch home and was called out when celebrating with his teammates for touching another player while still being a live runner)
I actually have a lot of respect for the Cardinals and their players.
I just can’t root for them to win. But I can’t root for the Brewers, either — for many of the reasons you state.
It’s a really rough NLCS for some of us.
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There are some Brewer players I like
Fielder (would like him better in blue pinstripes), Weeks, Hart. McGehee (what happened to him?).
Braun I respect as a player.
Yeah, Morgan not so much.
Step Two: Develop an organizational plan
by Shanghai Badger on Oct 16, 2011 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions
McGehee stopped hitting.
But given what happened in the NLCS, they’d probably have been better off with him at 3B than Hairston.
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I know he stopped hitting
but I don’t know why
Step Two: Develop an organizational plan
by Shanghai Badger on Oct 17, 2011 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Well thank God that's over
Life can go back to normal now. Go Rangers!
by Random Simon on Oct 16, 2011 10:50 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs























