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Cubs 3, Giants 2: Attaboy, Welington -- The Beef Comes Through

MESA, Arizona -- Here's how well Welington Castillo ("Beef", as he's been affectionately termed here) has hit this spring. He went 1-for-2 and drove in the winning run in the Cubs' 3-2, 10 inning win over the Giants, and his average went down by 27 points.

From .733 to .706.

I'll talk more about Castillo -- and Max Ramirez, too -- in a bit. But first, let me say how outstanding Randy Wells was today. Emmanuel Burriss, the game's leadoff hitter, singled and stole second. The next hitter, our old buddy Mike Fontenot, singled up the middle. Marlon Byrd overthrew the cutoff man and the run scored and Fontenot went to second (though, to be fair to Byrd, even if he holds the runner at third, the next hitter, Pablo Sandoval, hit a fly ball that would have scored the run anyway).

And then -- nothing. Wells retired all 18 hitters he faced after that, including seven strikeouts. He's got a 1.35 ERA this spring and has been the team's most consistent starter. Wells had said he was going to bear down and improve on last year's performance -- so far, so good. Let's hope he can carry this through to the regular season.

John Grabow threw a decent inning, giving up a single and getting a couple of ground ball outs, but Sean Marshall -- who has not had a good spring, with a 6.75 ERA -- blew the lead and the game went into extra innings after Carlos Marmol had a 1-2-3 ninth and Jae-Hoon Ha, pinch-running with two out in the bottom of that inning, got picked off.

Star-divide

Marcos Mateo -- who, I believe, still is not a major league pitcher -- pitched himself into a jam with a walk after Starlin Castro booted a ground ball, but got out of it when Castillo made a nice play on an attempted sac and turned it into a force at third, then struck out two Giants minor leaguers wearing numbers in the 80s and 90s.

Which set up the heroics in the bottom of the 10th from Max Ramirez, who worked a walk after a single and a fly out, and Beef's RBI game-winner.

Koyie Hill, meanwhile, went 0-for-3, lowering his spring average to .037, and failed to throw out two runners attempting to steal.

How hard is this decision, really? It should be getting close to time for more roster cuts; the last round was last Tuesday, and there appears to be a pretty good chance that tomorrow's game at Tempe against the Angels will be rained out (80% chance of rain). So the brass may have an unexpected day off to make some roster decisions. Please make the right one -- thank Koyie for his service, offer him a coaching job, and put Beef or Max-Ram on the roster. Incidentally, Max-Ram played 1B today -- maybe a nod to try to get him to be more versatile.

Meanwhile, no one else did much offensively today, except Byrd, who went 2-for-2 with a walk and is now hitting .488 for the spring.

Today's crowd of 13,465 set a HoHoKam Park attendance record (by three people) -- although, there appeared to be some empty seats and the berm, though fairly crowded, didn't seem overwhelmingly so as opposed to other large crowds. Among those on the berm today was Tom Ricketts, who stopped by to say hello and, like last year, got mobbed for autographs and photos, which he gave in good spirits. (No, it wasn't the time for a Q&A session. I hope to talk to him when I get back to Chicago.)

That brings the spring season attendance to 104,370, an average of 8,698 per date. There are five dates remaining in the spring season; not all of them will sell out, but the Cubs could draw 150,000 for the 17 dates. That would be about the same as last year's total (152,493), but in three more dates. The Giants drew another sellout in Scottsdale today, 11,616, and the Rockies drew 12,209 at Talking Stick.

It remains to be seen whether all of Cactus League attendance will be what it was a year ago. It's clear that the new complex is going to set all kinds of records, and the Giants are doing well. Other teams are flat or down.

Tomorrow, weather permitting, Andrew Cashner will start against the Angels in Tempe. Jered Weaver will go for the Angels; other Angels scheduled to pitch tomorrow are Kevin Jepsen, (the other) Francisco Rodriguez and Jason Bulger. The game will be televised on MLB Network.

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First.

Wow. .037. How is it not obvious at this point?

by elgato on Mar 20, 2011 7:14 PM CDT reply actions  

1-for-27.

I’m beginning to think there’s no end to how much they will give Koyie while completely ignoring what Max-Ram and Beef do.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 7:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

We just need to wait and see,

if they don’t do the obvious there are problems. Hill’s salary is in reality nothing. It was his job when he got it, and now he has not only played himself out of it, but two others have beat him out. That is what spring is for. I stand by what I said last night. Send Beef to Iowa so he can play everyday, keep Max as backup, and release Hill. And I would in all seriousness like to see them offer him a coaching position in the organization.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 7:20 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

Another thing

If we cant release a back up catcher who is making 800,000 , then there is no way they will release Silva and his big salary.

by Mitchener on Mar 20, 2011 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Agree.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

That needs to happen also.

Although they both may be among the last cuts. As long as they don’t cut Max it stays possible that what should happen will.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 7:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's assuming the reason why Hill...

…is a Cub is a financial one. We’ve seen Hendry time after time fail to make tough decisions when it comes releasing under performing players for loyalty reasons. I think Hendry over the years has gotten a little to close to the players, yes those bonds of friendship can be a good thing at times (woods hometown discount) but it can act as a curse when someone doesn’t know how to mix business with pleasure.

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 8:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

Someone said here the other day that loyalty is both Hendry’s best and worst quality. That’s 100% correct.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

With that in mind,

I said the same thing in this thread. I really wish I could attribute that quote.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

I could go for that.

I think Beef is the better player, but maybe he would be served better playing every day at Iowa. If Max-Ram fails, then you bring Beef up as backup.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

I have to agree...

Beef is a solid prospect, and it serves a better value to his development and to our organization to keep him in Iowa right now, as opposed to serving a backup role in the bigs.

His everyday line could make him a very valuable trade chip as well, or even make Soto a trading option one day, if things evolve in that manner by 2012.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)

by SackMan on Mar 20, 2011 8:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree with you again.

This is a perfect idea, which covers all the variables. Why is it so hard to make what is obviously the right choice?

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 7:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sigh ... yep.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 8:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hendry is Amazing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.

by shoemile on Mar 21, 2011 2:10 AM CDT up reply actions  

Seriously.

It’s beyond ridiculous. At some point they have to acknowledge that Hill simply cannot play major league baseball any more.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 7:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Is Hill testing Hendry's loyalty

I mean 1 for 27 makes it seem like hes not even trying. Wheres Ashton Kutcher? Am i getting PUNKED?

The guy did make the team last year with only 5 hits in ST. Looks like Hill is going top that this year.

by Mitchener on Mar 20, 2011 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Here's hoping ...

that Quade knows what we can see — despite no comments that would indicate that he does.

by elgato on Mar 20, 2011 7:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Right!!

At what point does it effect Castillo’s mind set? What more does he need to do to make the opening day roster over a guy hitting .037?

Looking outside the box, if Soto is going to be the catcher of the future, do the Cubs look to trade Wellington for bullpen help? Is he ready to be an everyday catcher?

"The standard is the standard" Mike Tomlin

by LuvMLB on Mar 20, 2011 8:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

maybe

Maybe its reassuring to him to know that ML teams are so desperate for catchers that they will let guys like Hill stick around forever lol…he could be thinking of the great potential of long term job security lol

by jeff_pico on Mar 20, 2011 8:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

He's going to outhit his "competition" by 700 points. And lose.

This may be a first for every position battle in the history of organized baseball.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 10:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

I would have liked to have seen Ricketts on the lawn.

He was wearing a nice shirt too. Being sold by Roger the Beer Man (I have one); all proceeds to benefit cancer. Nice touch Tom, makes you seem like one of us, except you own the cubs.

We'll miss you Big Boy. #10 for Hall of Fame.

by mrcubsfan on Mar 20, 2011 7:23 PM CDT via mobile reply actions  

I did! Got your tweet. Nice job as usual.

We'll miss you Big Boy. #10 for Hall of Fame.

by mrcubsfan on Mar 20, 2011 7:29 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Should Marshall's bad spring be a big concern?

I sure hope not.

"Hey Hey, Holy mackerel, no doubt about it,!"

by scottsdalecubs on Mar 20, 2011 7:24 PM CDT reply actions  

Yeah, I'm a bit worried about Marshall.

He should have 3-4 more outings.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 7:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Semi concern

he is no longer fighting for a job, so he can work on other areas. I hope that is the reason.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 7:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

One other thing.

Marshall’s best pitch is a sweeping curveball. Often, those don’t break in the dry desert air the way they do in Chicago.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 7:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sigh!!

We need Marshall. I hope it’s just the dry desert air and not an injury.

"The standard is the standard" Mike Tomlin

by LuvMLB on Mar 20, 2011 8:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agree, the curveball is a ....

…fickle pitch in Arizona. He’s young enough and his track record shows he’ll turn it around. Garza hasn’t had the greatest spring either but he said the other day that he’s throwing mainly 2-seam fastball’s because the curve is useless in Arizona.

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 8:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

I was looking to see how Marshall did last spring.

I know there are previous years’ spring stats around somewhere, but I can’t seem to locate them right now.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Thank you.

As you can see, this is his first spring exclusively in relief. Not sure whether that makes a difference or not.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's a good point,

Marshall’s used to getting starter’s innings in ST.

Baseball is back!!

by cowsarecool220 on Mar 20, 2011 9:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

What to do with Scales??

Now hitting .391 and Barney .371. Would we dare be better off with two guys trying to make a MLB opening day roster for the first time? Dump Baker and Dewitt? If I were them, I would be worried. Quade, I hope, doesn’t make the same old tired decisions but actually holds players accountable. The last two weeks will be interesting.

We'll miss you Big Boy. #10 for Hall of Fame.

by mrcubsfan on Mar 20, 2011 7:37 PM CDT via mobile reply actions  

Does DeWitt hava any options?

I still see DeWitt, Baker, and Barney. Scales back to AAA as a player/coach. He is another that the Cubs should take care of when his playing days are over. He is also a valuable insurance policy.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 7:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

What if Scales ends up at .450?

And the others drop? It could happen and I hate to see the cubs pass just because he “wasn’t supposed to”. Isn’t this how storybook endings happen?

We'll miss you Big Boy. #10 for Hall of Fame.

by mrcubsfan on Mar 20, 2011 7:47 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Scales isn't a major league player.

If he were 23, I’d say maybe. But he is 33. He’s six months younger than Ryan Dempster.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 7:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

At some point though, wouldn't production trump age?

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Mar 20, 2011 8:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

No.

Because Scales has proven that he’s not really a major league player.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sad but true

Scales has, again & again, shown “promise” but not the ability to stick at the MLB level… it’s almost become a seasonal “Rite”… Scales up…Scales down.

I didn't understand the "white-collar Cub fans", "blue-collar Sox fans" until much later in life. Harry Smith~ "For Cubs Fans Only".

by jeffstorm2 on Mar 20, 2011 9:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sure, to some extent.

And at that point, aren’t you looking at Scott Moore WAY before Bobby Scales? Yes, you are.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 10:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed

on Scales. He has been here before and was very average in real games. Good fill in for injuries later in the season.

by If we only had Hubbs on Mar 20, 2011 9:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Where does Moore fit into this picture?

He’s literally better than DeWitt at everything. And he’s only 20 months or so older.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 10:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think Moore goes to AAA

to see if he can sustain the spring. If any of the three headed monster gets hurt or plays poorly enough he gets his shot.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 10:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

Where did DeWitt earn his shot?

He’s never been as good as Moore at any level.

If he’d come from Pittsburgh, he’d be released already.

This is just the Cubs thinking that the Yankees/Dodgers/Cardinals/“Teams who beat us in the playoffs” are magic, and anything that they’ve touched has a bit of golden glow.

We’re talking about a poor fielding 2B (who can play 3B), who has no power whatsoever, who has posted a sub-.800 OPS through the minors, and who only got an MLB gig because the three people in front of him for the 3B gig were severely injured. (Granted, one of them was Nomar.) Then, in MLB, he proceeded to hit like Aaron Miles. And field 2B like crap.

There is literally nothing in Blake DeWitt’s spring, or his MLB past, or his MiLB past, that makes you think that he can be a MLB starter. At least Scott Moore has consistently posted mid-.800’s OPS throughout his career. And he’s outhitting DeWitt by 300 points this spring.

He had another RBI extra base hit today. It would have made me happy if I wasn’t completely convinced that he’s going to be in another organization in 6 months like Casey McGehee.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 10:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

I posted back when the Cubs acquired DeWitt

that you were getting nothing special, and that he really wasn’t an upgrade from Theriot, but I was shouted down.

by azjazzman on Mar 20, 2011 11:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I was involved in those threads at the time.

I’m still pissed we gave up the opportunity to gain an extra 1st rounder when Lilly signed a multi-year deal (and make no mistake, he was NOT going to accept arb for a 1-year deal.)

We traded Lilly away. For very, very little.

And now, the team is like a beginning poker player who feels “pot committed” and feels they have no option other than to keep calling and see how things turn out.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 11:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree with you on the Lilly thing

We are hoping Garza will have a bounce back year and look and look @ what we gave up for him. Compared to look @ what we got for Lilly trade.

AJ I had agreed with you, but was frustrated enough w/ the Cubs @ that point that I wasn’t spending much time on BCB.

''"I always thought I was the most competitive person out there. I never thought I'd find anybody more competitive until I met him.'' Ryan Dempster talking about Ted Lilly

by Madison Cub Fan on Mar 21, 2011 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think the Garza/Lilly comparsions mean much.

The Cubs got three years of a cost-controlled pitcher in his late 20s. The Dodgers got two months of an expensive pitcher in his mid 30s.

Now, the Cubs should have hung on to Lilly and offered him arbitration — I was holding out hope on DeWitt, but he looks to be pretty whatever — because the return in that trade just wasn’t enough.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

I knew I should've never bought that Cesar Izturis jersey...

GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.

by shoemile on Mar 21, 2011 2:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

Scales

Scales has had 158 ML at bats and has hit .248 he’s not going to make or break the team. He’s no prospect but he will probably be called up if there are middle infield injuries. I do hope Barney makes the team over Ojeda.

by jeff_pico on Mar 20, 2011 7:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

What about keeping Barney, Scales, DeWitt and Baker?

Scales CLEARLY can play in the outfield as well as first, second and third and he could take the spot Johnson would take. Honestly though, while Johnson is a great guy, I just do not see the need for a fifth outfielder. He would rarely get at bats with a four man rotating outfield as it will hopefully be. In an emergency, if they need an extra outfielder, Baker can play in one of the corners and Fukudome, or Colvin could play center. The same problem occured with Joey Gathright—he NEVER played and was clearly not needed.

by mdcubsfan on Mar 20, 2011 7:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

Scales should not make the team over Moore.

He’s six years older than Moore, and he does nothing better.

If Scales AND DeWitt make the team over Moore, I’d question Hendry’s competence. I mean, more than I already do.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 10:30 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

We learned the answer in 2006. It's seven.

Neifi, Womack, Walker, Cedeno, Hairston, Theriot, and Bynum.

That was the dumbest roster composition ever. If Jose Macias had made that team, his status as the “emergency catcher” would have allowed us to play an entire lineup consisting only of second basemen.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 9:11 AM CDT up reply actions  

Theriot played in 53 games, with 30 starts at 2B

That was 3rd most on the team, behind Neifi and Walker. Cedeno was mostly a shortstop, but got 15 or so 2B starts. All 7 of those guys started at least 12 games there.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

Seriously?

Wow. My mistake. I honestly thought Dusty played him in about 20 games.

Cedeno only became the shortstop because the Cubs acquired Izturis.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 11:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

Man. Looking at these 2005-2006 rosters is heartbreaking.

Remember how Neifi Perez managed to start 135 games and play in 154, racking up 609 PA with 89 starts in leadoff or #2, while posting a line of .274/.298/.383?

And Corey Patterson spent plenty of time leading off, putting up 451 PA worth of (holy god) .215/.254/.348?!

Also, Jose Macias managed to lead off 8 games, bat second in another 2 (and play in 112 overall) with his .254/.274/.316 line. He never played again.

That was all 2005 – just 6 seasons ago. It sounds like something that the manager would have done in the 1910’s before math was invented. Or if he and the GM were addicted to laudanum or something old-timey and couldn’t watch the games.

And Jim Hendry was still the GM, just blithely watching all that happen.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'd guess ...

that Patterson mostly led off before his numbers fell off the table — he was actually sent to AAA in 2005 before injuries prompted his recall. I know, I know — that’s a very small caveat.

No excuse for the rest of it, though. Amazingly, the 2005 Cubs weren’t that bad. They actually won 79 games.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

After Patterson was recalled from Iowa...

…. in early August, he led off games only three times, mostly batting seventh or eighth. One of those leadoff appearances was the last game of the season.

Patterson’s 2005 season was the worst offensive season by anyone with that many plate appearances in 37 years.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's what I thought.

You have to wonder whether Patterson would have had a more successful career if he hadn’t been in Dusty’s clutches for three seasons.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why not?

Dusty was the manager in those years — and Dusty was infamous for encouraging free-swinging. If Dusty wasn’t the moron that he is — if he had been a manager who advocated a more patient approach — don’t you think it would have affected Corey?

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Could be, but I think that by the time guys get to the majors they are what they are

Dusty wasn’t going to fix Patterson, but he was broken in the minor league system.

by ClarkFan on Mar 21, 2011 4:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

i dont know what the question is to the 2b predicament

but scales is far from the answer

He's my Hossa
HO-HO-HO-HO-HOSSA

by jesus christos on Mar 20, 2011 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Scales is 33 years old.

In the time he’s played in the major leagues, he’s proven he cannot play major league defense. We have enough defensive problems as it is.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 7:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Baker, DeWitt, and Barney

will make for one serviceable 2nd baseman and one utility infielder. Between the three of them.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 7:56 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Baker and Barney may make for

one serviceable 2b and one utility infielder without Dewitt. Moore adds diversity, and DeWitt fills out the Iowa roster.

If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.

by tharr on Mar 21, 2011 4:36 AM CDT up reply actions  

Why should baker be worried?

He’s hitting .395 and has actually had some major league success.

by Dcr18 on Mar 20, 2011 8:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

plus it seems

that the Cubs see Baker as a super-sub…1b, 2b, 3b, of…the 2011 version of DeRosa

by hansman1982 on Mar 20, 2011 10:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Seriously, the more apt question is: "Has Baker won the Everyday 2B job?"

I am not sure where DeWitt figures into this argument, but I have a feeling it’s “the heir apparent to David Kelton’s Iowa 3B gig”.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 10:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

Keep MaxRam and Barney.

Castillo needs at bats, so start him at Iowa. Scales can be called up if Barney flops, but I think by the end of the season he will be the regular second baseman. Higher ceiling than DeWitt or Baker.

Offer Koyie a minor league instructor position.

Oh, and dump Silva.

by Clark Addison on Mar 20, 2011 7:56 PM CDT reply actions  

Why do people keep saying that Hill..

…needs to be offered a coaching position? What has he done as a Cub that would give anyone the idea that he would make a good coach? Just release the guy, he’ll do just fine.

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 8:33 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Because of some intangible

that makes the pitchers, coaching staff, and management like him. There is something there that he can impart to the rest of the organization. It is also a way to be loyal, which helps any organization. It is just time to hang up the game spikes, not to cast him off.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 8:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

Soooo....why not make Bobby Scales...

…or Braden Looper or anyone that isn’t going to make this roster a coach. Again, what makes you or anyone else think that he would make a good coach?

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 8:40 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

I think they will make Scales a coach someday,

I think that is one reason they keep a 33 year old minor leaguer around to help with the kids. I don’t nor do I think anyone else presume that Hill will be a good coach, but if he knows how to handle pitchers well enough that they support him despite him hurting them on offense wouldn’t that skill make him a good bullpen coach? Looper we owe nothing to so cast him away if he does not make the team, we did him a favor giving him a chance.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 8:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

You're assuming that the reason...

…they keep Hill despite his anemic hitting is because of the way he handles the pitchers. The organization including Hendry may say this, but I think it’s because Hendry has a hard time letting go.

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 8:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hendry's best quality is that he's very loyal.

However, his worst quality is also that he’s very loyal too.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 8:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, I am

it’s not like they have not gotten rid of players, they let DLee go and he was an icon. I will bet you a beer (if Al says it is ok) that Hill will not be on the opening day roster. And no, that offer is not open to everyone.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 8:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes they let dlee go...but if you...

…recall like a lot of other trades Hendry has made, instead of looking for the best trade, he tries to placate the player by putting him in a good situation. I might take you up on that offer, I don’t drink but I would take a $5.00 wrigley soda all the same.

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 10:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think that is a fair offer,

I just don’t see how they can keep Hill. I am no Hendry fan but if Hill is on the team outside of injuries I will be amazed. Silva I could see as mop up with his salary, as a starter NOOOOOOOOO!

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 10:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

If it gets to a point that there is no way...

…to deal Silva, then the only alternative in my mind is to eat the money and outright release him, remember the mariners are picking up the tab on some of Silva’s salary this year so the hit may not be as bad as you think. I think it would be around 6 or 7 million.

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 10:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

I do believe there is a possibility with Silva

''"I always thought I was the most competitive person out there. I never thought I'd find anybody more competitive until I met him.'' Ryan Dempster talking about Ted Lilly

by Madison Cub Fan on Mar 21, 2011 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

I have no where at all that Hill is in danger of not making the team

''"I always thought I was the most competitive person out there. I never thought I'd find anybody more competitive until I met him.'' Ryan Dempster talking about Ted Lilly

by Madison Cub Fan on Mar 21, 2011 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

The front office needs to be as brave as the new Mets front office

They swallowed hard and decided the team was better served by waiving Castillo and Perez, despite the money they were owed. I hope Cubs management gets the same grip on the idea of “sunk costs.”

by ClarkFan on Mar 21, 2011 9:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

It’s time to make the tough decisions.

Check out Chicago sports coverage at SB Nation Chicago

by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

Have the Cubs ever been good @ that?

''"I always thought I was the most competitive person out there. I never thought I'd find anybody more competitive until I met him.'' Ryan Dempster talking about Ted Lilly

by Madison Cub Fan on Mar 21, 2011 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

Great point.

There’s no worries about saving face when you’re purging the last guy’s bad contracts.

When its your bad contracts, you might be tempted to hold on for one more year and see if this guy gets it together after all.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

"Koyie handle pitching staff well"

…kills me every time.

Seriously, how many times he will do the catching behind Soto, twice a week? Maximum. I understand, that Castillo hasn’t really pinch hit or played a lot in the majors. However who do you want to pich hit when the game is on the line:
a. a rookie, who maybe has enough experience to handle the pressure,
b. Hill who simply cannot (carrier .215 hitter in the ML and fading)?
Maybe it’t better for Castillo to catch every day at his age, then Max Ramirez should be the backup.

Hill is a great guy, a sweet story. Maybe can handle pitchers, on the other hand, aren’t able to help the pitcher to be more accurate nor to throw harder. Since he is not a great catcher againt the running games (dropped his CS rating from 40 to an awful 18-with not much help from the pitching staff to be fair) his gamecalling ability is a little over-emphasized.

by Gio on Mar 20, 2011 8:06 PM CDT reply actions  

We obviously have an issue at 2B

But, we’re not the only team that is weak at a certain position. It’s pretty common throughout MLB rosters, that a certain position on the field gets platooned over the course of the year, due to weakness of talent.

So… let’s make the most of it, and give Barney as much playing time as we can… maybe he plays his way into being a quality everyday player. If not, then you have next off-season to try and re-address the situation.

Unfortunate that Dewitt seems to not be the answer. He’s only 25 years old… former 1st round pick, and has been playing at the major league level since he was 23 in 2008. It’s a make or break year for him at this level.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)

by SackMan on Mar 20, 2011 8:14 PM CDT reply actions  

Agreed that it's a make-or-break year for DeWitt.

I’d be a whole lot more confident if he’d ever really hit in the minors. He got his MLB gig due to injury. He has never really hit at any level.

Scott Moore is roughly the same age, is more pedigreed (former top-10 pick), is hitting the crap out of the ball, and plays more positions than DeWitt. And yet he has NO chance of making this roster, because the Cubs traded for DeWitt more recently and are trying to save face.

If this team had any competence whatsoever, DeWitt would already be in minor league camp. Then again, he’s gotten himself sent to the minors in each of the last 3 years due to his crap perfomance, so I suppose he may be out of options.

Man, this team frustrates me. What does DeWitt offer that Moore or Baker or Barney doesn’t? It’s like having a buddy who pines over a girl who is horrible for him. DUMP DEWITT ALREADY.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 10:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

Very disappointed in Quade's decision making in this regard.

Only wish Hendry would reign him in.

GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.

by shoemile on Mar 21, 2011 2:18 AM CDT up reply actions  

Note, please, that I am NOT defending DeWitt in this post.

Moore is roughly the same age as DeWitt, except that he’s two years older.

He also has almost no professional experience at 2B. Besides this spring: 17 games in the minors, 23 games with the Orioles in 2008 and 2010.

Yes, it’s clear Moore is a better hitter. But I’d rather see him start every day at Iowa at 2B, with the idea that if DeWitt fails, either Barney wins the job, or Moore could be recalled after he gets some real experience at 2B. I fear that you’d be wanting DeWitt’s mediocre defense after seeing a completely inexperienced guy play there.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 8:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

He's not quite 2 years older.

Moore will be 27 all season (born in November). DeWitt will turn 26 during this season.

And absolutely no one should be using 2B defense, of all things, as a plus for DeWitt over anyone. He’s terrible at it by any measure. Quade said that it was a serious concern just a few days ago.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 8:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

What makes you think a guy with 40 games of professional 2B experience...

… can handle it as the primary part of a platoon? (Moore would be the primary part since he’s lefthanded.)

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 8:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

How many MLB games did DeWitt have at 2B before last year?

more to the point, why would you insist upon the player who has tried to play 2B for a season and failed rather comprehensively? Neither you nor I know how Moore would do at 2B in a full season. We do, unfortunately, have a bunch of evidence that DeWitt cant hack it.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 8:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

You have a good point.

Moore played 22 games at 2B last year for Baltimore.

DeWitt started playing 2B primarily last year… with 126 games. Prior to that, he had 29 games at 2B under his belt between 2008-09. So, it’s basically the same move.

Both guys are former 1st round picks who haven’t made an impact yet.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)

by SackMan on Mar 21, 2011 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

Again, not defending DeWitt.

But he has 160 minor league games at 2B.

Thus, nearly 300 professional games at 2B. Moore has 40. That’s a significant difference.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 9:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

OK, send Moore to Iowa as a 2B

And give DeWitt a bus ticket to Des Moines with a May date on it…..

by ClarkFan on Mar 21, 2011 9:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

No it is obvious .

So obvious some appear to have blinders on . Maybe once they break camp things will change . It would not count on it .

by cubs north on Mar 20, 2011 8:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

The raise is irrelevant now.

First of all, they don’t have to pay him the whole amount if they release him by a certain date.

Second, they need to acknowledge this and do it — release him.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can ask, yes.

I may not get an answer.

I have already called for Hill to be let go. If he’s not, I’ll be happy to post that it was the wrong decision, because if that’s the decision, it will be wrong.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

If I ask Tom Ricketts...

… he’d defer me to the baseball people.

So I’d have to ask them.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

you got to admit he and Hendry spin quite a bit.....

He says that like he has no care of whats going on in the baseball side…Isnt he a fan of his own team?

by TJ11 on Mar 20, 2011 9:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sure.

But to make public baseball pronouncements would undercut his GM.

Until/unless he’s ready to replace him, he won’t do that. And probably not even then, not in public, anyway.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

The $850K was agreed

to avoid arbitration. I’m not aware of an option to reduce that for any reason. Can you give any validation?

If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.

by tharr on Mar 21, 2011 4:45 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, arbitraition player contracts

are almost never guaranteed. If a player is released by different dates, the team only has to pay to pay termination pay. The percentage of the termination pay is determined by the date the player is released

If the player is cut within 16 days before the season begins, he is entitled only to 30 days’ termination pay. If the player is cut during spring training but after the 16th day before the season begins, he is entitled only to 45 days’ termination pay.

Baseball is back!!

by cowsarecool220 on Mar 21, 2011 9:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

So if the Cubs release Hill...

… now, they’d only owe him 30 days’ pay, right?

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 10:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

45 days termination pay

Unless my math is incorrect, there are only 11 days until the season begins.

by RynoRooter on Mar 21, 2011 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

45 days, at this point.

From Cots:

If the player is cut before the 16th day before the season begins, he is entitled only to 30 days’ termination pay. If the player is cut during spring training but after the 16th day before the season begins, he is entitled only to 45 days’ termination pay.

(This assumes that the contract isnt’ guaranteed for some other random reason. We can’t assume too much.)

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

Noted.

I had it backwards.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think the original quote box has a mistake

It says “cut within 16 days before the season begins”, which is (1.) kind of odd phrasing, and (2.) is also incorrect. So your reading of that quote (and following question) was correct. If any of this makes any sense.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe that's why I got confused.

In any case, it appears that if Hill is cut before the season starts, they don’t owe him the full salary.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's certainly what I thought about Hill

Then again, a few days (weeks?) ago in one of these threads, someone said I was mistaken, and that Hill’s contract is guaranteed regardless, for some reason. I have no information either way.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oh my gosh a thousand times rec'd.

I’ve been saying this for years. This team literally does not care to put the best product on the field. They prefer to let front office personnel waste years and untold millions in order to cover their own @sses.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 10:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sue FTW

GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.

by shoemile on Mar 21, 2011 2:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

Green'ed.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 21, 2011 6:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think it should be pointed out who made that comment

Sue in the few years I’ve been on bcb, she is one of the most positive Cub fans I’ve seen.

''"I always thought I was the most competitive person out there. I never thought I'd find anybody more competitive until I met him.'' Ryan Dempster talking about Ted Lilly

by Madison Cub Fan on Mar 21, 2011 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

Cactus League attendance update

2011 Thru 03/20 (179 games): 1,173,913
2010 Thru 03/27 (179 games): 1,173,284

by azjazzman on Mar 20, 2011 8:25 PM CDT reply actions  

I thought there were more games earlier this year

shouldn’t that be the other way around? They should have reached 179 earlier, yes? It is good to see attendance picking up.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 8:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

They did reach 179 earlier

Read my post again: The games thru today equals 179. Last year, it wasn’t until March 27th that 179 games were played,

by azjazzman on Mar 20, 2011 8:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ooops my bad,

I read it as the 17th, my apologies, that’s what you get for watching the NCAA and this at the same time.

by jpeters407 on Mar 20, 2011 8:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

All those posts from Al about declining attendance

before Spring Break even started were a waste of bandwidth. Al has been coming to AZ for Spring Training for 25+ years. He should understand Cactus League attendance patterns by now.

At this point, about the only thing one can say with any certainty is that the final head count will be very much the same as it was last year, and that the new ballpark has been wildly successful. Successful to the point where it clearly has taken fans away from some of the other venues, but strangely enough, not the one that you would’ve thought it would hurt the most…the other one in Scottsdale.

by azjazzman on Mar 20, 2011 9:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree

but its his blog and if he found it interesting at the time lol….attendance to games in general isn’t interesting to me but seems to be to alot of people on the site.

by jeff_pico on Mar 20, 2011 9:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

The point is...

… that the equivalent attendance this year is primarily BECAUSE of the new park. Whether that sustains itself next year remains to be seen.

To me, it’s pretty obvious why the other park in Scottsdale hasn’t been affected. The home team is the defending World Champion, fans that have always traveled well. There were a ton of Giants fans in Mesa today.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Your second paragraph

is unarguably true. There clearly are a lot of Giants fans in town, their away games have drawn very well this year. While the Giants home attendance is about the same as last year, their road attendance is up.

The first paragraph, not so much. I think it is very likely that if the Rockies and D’Backs were still playing in Tucson, the other parks would not have seen as much of a decline. The math is clear…the decline at parks in Phoenix, Glendale and Peoria is exactly equal to the increase for the Rockies and D’Backs.

And that isn’t the point in any event. For weeks now you have been telling us about the precipitous decline in Cactus League attendance and I have been saying you are premature.

The numbers now that we have gone thru Spring Break speak for themselves.

by azjazzman on Mar 20, 2011 9:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think there's any way to prove either of our points.

I think there’s a lot of curiosity factor for the new stadium. A lot of Cubs fans I’ve talked to say they wanted to check it out — even when the Cubs weren’t playing there. That won’t be repeated next year.

It seems also that there are a lot of locals going to those games who might not have otherwise gone to games. It’s not as clear to me that those are locals who went to other parks in other years. Those declines may have other factors (economy, primarily) — and we may not know until next year whether your scenario or mine is true.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Checking out the new ballpark

no doubt was a factor the first couple of weeks, but it is unlikely that it is much of a factor now that 26 games have been played there.

The other thing is that both the Rockies and D’Backs have seen significant increases this year at their AWAY games.

But, it matters not what the reasons are or aren’t, try as you might to change the topic, the fact is you were wrong about declining attendance in the Cactus League.

by azjazzman on Mar 20, 2011 10:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

This needs to be green.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 10:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

I dont get

AZjazzman’s affinity for spring training attendance…is he on the Arizona tourism board?

"There had to be a place where the game could be fun again….that place is called Wrigley Field"---Andre Dawson

by epsilon on Mar 21, 2011 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions  

Some teams are declining.

Of that, there is no doubt.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 10:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Wow

there actually is someone on here that can see the overall picture.

by azjazzman on Mar 20, 2011 11:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't get that stoked up about attendance stuff ...

but it’s hard to jump on your bandwagon with stuff like this because you can get so combative, jazzman. I’m not going to say you’re wrong on this — seems like you might have a point — but I’m not going to rush to your defense.

Sorry, dude.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 7:59 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

This coming week

the week after Spring Break in AZ is historically just as strong as Spring Break week for ST attendance. That is especially true for the CA teams, because this week is Spring Break in CA.

If all the games tomorrow are rained out, it will hurt some, especially if it is cloudy/rainy throughout the week. But, even with that, it figures that this year will wind up on par with last year.

There will be some teams down, some teams up and some teams about the same. That happens every year.

by azjazzman on Mar 20, 2011 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Al's obsession with attendance

seems to be the same as my dad’s new obsession with the weather channel. It’s just something to focus on. Has it gotten too much ink here? Maybe, but it’s spring training, and thankfully (outside of the Silva/ARam dust-up) it has been a drama-free camp.

Only real question marks are 2nd base (Moore over DeWitt please!) and whether or not Garza will be better once the season starts. Again…please!

Scott Bora$ is satan.

by Canadian Cubs Fan on Mar 21, 2011 6:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

I find it humorous that we all have our...

…jocks twisted(including myself) over the Hill / Castillo backup catcher situation, when there are way bigger issues and holes on this roster than who is going to fill in for Soto once or twice a week.

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 8:37 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

totally agree

But thats the debate this time of year, last year there were thousands of words wasted on Joey Gathright’s lack of ability, while there were much bigger questions to answer. The 25th man seems to be something that people like to debate.

by jeff_pico on Mar 20, 2011 8:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

or that was 09?

Time flies when you’re having fun lol

by jeff_pico on Mar 20, 2011 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Gathwrong was in 2009.

Along with Heilman, MB, Gregg, Aaron Miles, etc…

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 8:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

How about we debate exactly how far the...

…General Manager has his head up his ass. I’m going to guess 5 inches.

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

OK, let's stop this.

Talk about his moves or not. This is juvenile.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes it's juvenile, but you have to wonder..

…where Hendry’s head is at these last couple of years. I was just taking a shot in the dark on that one.

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 10:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

I do wonder about some of his decisions.

But let’s keep the conversation at a higher level.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 10:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

It shows issues in the Cubs decision making ability....

If you cant decide between an aging .037 hitter and a young .706 hitter…You have problems and shoud not be in the position you are in….

by TJ11 on Mar 20, 2011 8:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's funny though, shouldn't the heated debate...

…regarding who is going to be the backup catcher be reserved for teams that are destined for the postseason?

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 8:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

That is true...though we are going to win 122 games...!!!! It may not be enough.

I thought only teams like the Pirates had to use guys like Byrd to bat 3rd?

He is a good player and i like the man’s hustle, but on a good team he is batting 6th at best…maybe 2nd if the situation is right…

by TJ11 on Mar 20, 2011 8:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Cubs regulars have talent

We have 7 former All Stars out of 8 players, the ‘names’ are there, however the talent doesn’t mesh together to be a successful team. We have 4 all stars on the pitching staff, this team is not devoid of talent…it ‘seems’ fine on the outside but something is rotten in Denmark.

by jeff_pico on Mar 20, 2011 8:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Emperor has no defense.

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Mar 20, 2011 8:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think

“Had” talent works better than “have” talent….aramis is old and has a questionable work ethic, alfonso is old and slow, marlon byrd hustles but hustle doesnt equate talent (though I love him), and fukudome is almost worthless (imho).

"There had to be a place where the game could be fun again….that place is called Wrigley Field"---Andre Dawson

by epsilon on Mar 21, 2011 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

What about the starting second baseman?

If Blake DeWitt had EXACTLY the same career marks at every level, but had previously been a Pittsburgh Pirate, he would be released by now.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 10:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Good teams make good decisions

If you have an obvious decision, and refuse to make it, to the detriment of your team, you probably aren’t very good.

by timh815 on Mar 20, 2011 8:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

And as long as Crane Kenney and Jim Hendry...

…are associated with this organization, they will be stuck south of mediocrity.

by troutfishin on Mar 20, 2011 8:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

at this point

I know I could do better…I understand that between Silva, Hill and Shark you have about $10 million is contracts that didnt pan out – ok so you took a couple chances and they didnt work…PUT THEM ON WAIVERS! If you dont want to eat the money at least make them earn it in Des Moines and get some young fellers on the big league roster. You have made your show that you are contending this year and ticket sales are still off…at this point Silva, Shark and Hill are not going to filp you from 3rd to 1st in the NLC

by hansman1982 on Mar 20, 2011 10:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hendry can't put Shark on waivers. He put that in Shark's contract.

So… basically…. he’s on the 25-man, or he’s making three and a half million to sit at home eatin Funyuns.

How in the hell did Shark’s agent get Hendry to give him these sorts of contract provisions?

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Mar 20, 2011 10:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

Cuz it was Hendry

and he was in awe of Shark………LOL

by Swoosie on Mar 20, 2011 11:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

There was a very interesting article

about that recently. The Cubs didn’t have picks 2-4 that year and figured they could get Colvin cheap so the budget was spent on Shark. It was a flier and he was a ND guy. Hendry bent over and the rest was history.

If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.

by tharr on Mar 21, 2011 4:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

Did they take Hendry to dinner like Bradley?

That seems to get big contracts out of Hendry!!!

by TJ11 on Mar 21, 2011 8:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

No

but they did put a mint on his pillow.

If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.

by tharr on Mar 21, 2011 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

You make the call...

your backup catcher just finished the final season of his contract and ends up with the following stats..

BA .214 OBP .254 SLG .298

Do you…

A) enter into arbitration with him?

B) refuse arbitration and simply let him become a FA?

C) Avoid arbitration and give him a 20% raise?

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Mar 20, 2011 8:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

If I'm GM, I choose option B.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 9:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

I know.

To be honest, that’s not even a hard choice to make.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 9:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sigh ... yep.

To the detriment of the whole team, too.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 9:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

I have been and always shall be your friend. Live long and prosper!

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Awesome movie......KAHNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I believe the death seen between Kirk and Spock was Shatners best acting job ever…

by TJ11 on Mar 20, 2011 9:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hello TJ11

I missed you being ’round for the game…for a couple seconds today, I thought I sensed actual optimism!!!!

I didn't understand the "white-collar Cub fans", "blue-collar Sox fans" until much later in life. Harry Smith~ "For Cubs Fans Only".

by jeffstorm2 on Mar 20, 2011 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hello

It was good to see Wells pitch good and Beef continue to show Hill, Hendry, and Quade up….

by TJ11 on Mar 20, 2011 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, it was (in some ways) encouraging

sadly, these roster “non-moves” are taking up a lot of time and discussion… when only obvious decisions remain. G’nite

I didn't understand the "white-collar Cub fans", "blue-collar Sox fans" until much later in life. Harry Smith~ "For Cubs Fans Only".

by jeffstorm2 on Mar 20, 2011 9:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

I really wish I'd seen that movie in theaters.

From the comments I’ve seen on musical clips from the expanded soundtrack which depict that scene, quite a few people who watched that part were in tears.

In the booklet for the expanded soundtrack for ST III, they said right away they wanted to bring Spock back to life, and they devised that element of the story using the Genesis matrix (life from lifelessness) as the catalyst.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 20, 2011 9:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

....

Look, we get it. You don’t like this move. If they had given him $3 million, then you could bitch about the money. Since he is making 2x the minimum salary, it’s hardly a huge money hit.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think his salary is the point here...

whether he makes $800,000 a year or $80,000 a year or $1.95 a year…he sucks…he sucked last year and there was absolutely NO frickin’ reason to offer this guy ANY money at all. NONE! If they can’t see that this guy is “rock-bottom” as far as backups, then we’re all kidding ourselves in thinking this organization will someday figure “it” out.

"I think part of a best friend's job should be to immediately clear your computer history if you die." - Anonymous

by Easy Ed on Mar 20, 2011 11:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

We all assumed Tom Ricketts would clean house upon arrival

You did? Then you assumed incorrectly. I never thought he’d do that.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 8:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

I agreed with you about when he first got there...But after a couple of bad years, do you think he would stay with the same people???

I don’t think so….

This is why Hendry nor Ricketts will ever do a live Q&A on here…..Scared of questions and actual follow ups…

by TJ11 on Mar 21, 2011 9:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's been only one full year...

… and any owner would have had the same large contracts and debt service.

IIRC, Cuban’s offer had even MORE debt service in it than the Ricketts deal did.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

I know you think highly of Ricketts, but when does he start cutting some losses, and try to move forward?

It is maddening to watch this team continue to just tread water.

I thought he was a big Cub fan?

I do not think this. I think he is one of the stereotypical rich fans that sit in the good seats but dont really know what is going on.

If a real fan with a passion for winning was now owning the Cubs, I believe different moves would have been made.

by TJ11 on Mar 21, 2011 8:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

I would love to know if his knowledge as a fan in the bleachers

was that of holding a beer over his head and saying “Sandberg and Dawson rule!” or if he really followed the tortured fortunes of the team and organization from opening day until the call-ups in September and through to the inevitable disappointing final game.

by the nth on Mar 21, 2011 9:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

I am thinking first part of what you said was true...

If he was really a fan, things would be changing…

by TJ11 on Mar 21, 2011 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

What facts do you have that Cuban..

…wouldn’t have cleaned house. Again there are no facts, it’s pure supposition on our part.

As I pointed to earlier, Ricketts calls himself a fan of this team, if he was a fan, and seeing the internals(something we aren’t privy to) he should have never continued to let this team be lead by Hendry and Kenney, NEVER.

How can you argue with that?

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions  

Why and how did Mark Cuban come into this discussion Al?

We are talking about what Ricketts should have done, not what Cuban would have done.

What do you think Ricketts should have done? Let me guess, the status quo?

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think it's a big mistake...

… if new management/new ownership comes into any organization and immediately fires everyone, regardless of what business it is.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's called supposition Al.

Why do you go out of your way to defend this organization? It’s unbecoming

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

You were making assumptions with no basis.

Why do you go out of your way to blast this organization? It’s unbecoming.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

Really?

You’re a fan, supposedly rooting for this team, and you feel your “responsibility” is to blast it?

Doesn’t sound like much fun to me.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

You've been a fan for how many years?

You can’t see the difference between rooting for the players on the field and PEOPLE that manage the organization?

These people aren’t your friends Al, your refusal to acknowledge the mismanagement in the organization may net you a few more interviews but little else.

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

The attitude around here from some...

… appears to be “everything the Cubs do is wrong”.

I do not say, nor have I ever said everything they do is right. However, the reverse is not true, either.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

Very true, Al

Frankly, part of me wants to see the Cubs keep Hill just so I can watch TJ’s head explode (as well as many others around here).

Some people are accused of being Cubs defenders here, but I think that’s only because the accusers dislike EVERYTHING the Cubs do. So by comparison, I guess that makes anybody who says they do something right a “defender.”

by Not Bruce Froemming on Mar 21, 2011 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Exactly my point.

I’ve criticized many things here, but because I don’t reflexively bitch about everything, people call me a “defender”.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

Let's be clear, though---

You certainly can take a critical stance before the Cubs take action. Like this spring, re: Koyie and Silva.

But in the event that the Cubs ultimately do precisely the opposite of everything you’ve prescribed this spring, won’t we see a BCB headline story urging everyone to “give it a chance” in the immediate aftermath?

And next offseason, can we look forward to our 3rd annual “Hendry deserves another year to fix the mess he created” story?

You were definitely critical of the Bradley signing. And its not uncommon for you to be critical of moves after hindsight has shown them to be failures. But it’s unusual to see a BCB article disagreeing with a Hendry move at the time it is made.

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by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

You agree with this Al

“but I think that’s only because the accusers dislike EVERYTHING the Cubs do.”

I would be careful because the people that complain about SOME of the things this organization does is about half of the people that contribute to this website.

I find it interesting that you are more willing to criticize the viewers of your website and you don’t seem to have the same ability for your beloved organization.

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

As noted above

I do criticize when I find things that I think are done wrong. Another note to the post above yours, yes, I may write “give it a chance” — because if it doesn’t go the way I (we) want it to, what is the alternative? Post here with torches and pitchforks? Be angry? Not enjoy baseball? That’s not an option for me.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 5:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

You're still confusing...

…the issue. There is a difference between the TEAM we root for and the PEOPLE that run this organization. Yes, I’ve called into question a lot of the moves that Hendry has made, and I’ve been right about almost all of them, but that does not lessen my enjoyment for the game of baseball one iota.

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 6:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

BTW, so your alternative..

..to an angry post is to give faint praise to a management group that doesn’t deserve any.

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 6:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Now that's just inaccurate.

Bruce, I’m very critical of some parts of the Cubs and could be viewed as generous on other points. For instance, I don’t fault Hendry for the Z extension, because that one DID make sense at the time.

The folks who trend toward optimism often paint those of us who are more pessimistic with too broad a brush. I’m very critical of Hendry, but I certainly don’t think every move he’s made has been bad. And there are a lot of people like me on BCB.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed, eg

Never said you were part of that group. I think you’ve been fair with your criticisms and your praise.

Some others, however, most definitely have not.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Mar 21, 2011 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think

the definition was pretty narrow. Read it again.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Mar 21, 2011 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

We're getting into semantics, which might not end well.
the accusers dislike EVERYTHING the Cubs do.

I guess it depends on who you define as the accusers. I took it to mean anyone who thinks that overall Hendry has done a bad job, i.e. me.

It depends on what the definition of ‘accusers’ is. But whatever.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Good point

Maybe it would be better to call out those people by name, or maybe not.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Mar 21, 2011 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Eh, whatever.

It’s just a blog, right? :)

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Please do...

…you’re painting with a broad brush after all.

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 4:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

"...the accusers dislike EVERYTHING the Cubs do."

Baloney. That’s a strawman argument, and it’s hyperbolic.

People dislike the stupid things the Cubs do.

And they’re proven to be correct in almost every single instance. Has there been any initial outcry about a Hendry move that worked in the last 3 years?

No one was upset about Hendry re-signing Wood this offseason, for instance. Or giving Marmol his extension.

But when they go through a series of transactions engineered to land Aaron Heilman, or give Aaron Miles a multi-year deal worth more than he’d ever earned in his career to date, or throw $850K at one of the worst catchers in MLB, or trade away an arb-eligible pitcher in Lilly, going into a fantastically stocked draft, in order to acquire Blake DeWitt…

…well, if you are paying attention, you start to wonder about the decision-making process in the front office.

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by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Please, Wood's signing fell into...

…Hendry’s lap. What he’s done in the last 3+ years has been pure crap.

You’re absolutely right about Bruce, I get sick of people painting with a broad brush because they can’t understand the difference between rooting for a team and criticizing the organization.

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nah, I disagree.

If you go back three and a half years, we’re talking end of 2007, right?

The Harden trade, the Edmonds pickup, the Johnson (2008) pickup, the Wood signing, the Byrd signing (not great, but not pure crap), the Dempster extension, getting an 11-game winner and cash for MB (I know that he signed Milton in the first place), getting anything for a month-plus of D-Lee …

Hendry had a terrible 2008-09 offseason, one that probably would have gotten him fired if not for the ownership change happening at that time. He’s also made a lot of bad moves and he’s on borrowed time, as far as I’m concerned.

But he has made some good moves in the timeframe you stated.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

All that you mentioned....

…is meh. Wood fell into his lap, Byrd is nothing spectacular, the best out of all of these is Dempster, and I certainly wouldn’t call it a great achievement that he was able to give a player a contract extension.

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Harden trade?

That was a very good move. None of the guys (as far as I know) whom the Cubs sent to Oakland have amounted to squat, and Harden was pretty good in 2008 in Chicago. He would have won a playoff start if the Cubs’ offense hadn’t both blown and sucked in LA.

Anyway, even if the moves I mentioned were ‘meh,’ they’re not ‘pure crap.’

You’re actually doing EXACTLY what NBF and Al were complaining about — reflexively bashing Hendry. I’m no fan of the guy, but he has made some good moves, or at least some OK moves, in the past 3.5 years.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

I really have to agree...

That expression makes me literally bristle, as it’s really the worst sort of fallacy. It is EXTREMELY rare to find people of this site at least who take on this attitude. And it’s sad really that folks who take a more optimistic view of these moves feel that those who disagree (and often with strong analytical evidence to support them) are reduced to this negative “group” as their defense.

The fact is, many of the moves that the Cubs have made over the last few seasons have often been at best bad and counter-productive, and at worst comical (I’m talking to you, Crane Kenney). That’s not negativity, that’s reality.

by Damen Jackson on Mar 21, 2011 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'll make my last point on this.

I think that the pessimistic folks outnumber the optimists. That’s happened since the LA playoff loss and the terrible 2008-09 offseason.

As a result, the crowd here has become generally more pessimistic. That might be what NBF and others are noticing — not a reflexive if-Hendry-does-it-it-must-be-bad mentality but more people questioning his moves.

I know I fall into this camp. When Soriano signed, I was happy because I was willing to give Hendry a benefit of a doubt. I remember thinking that $136 million is a LOT of money, but salaries are always increasing and Hendry knows what he’s doing.

If the same contract were handed out now, I’d be more worried. I question more moves by Hendry now than I once did — though I won’t reflexively think they’re stupid.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

I've said this to you offline, Al:

When the Cubs make a debatable decision — the Garza trade, for instance – you get behind it out of optimism. The move is made, so you figure you (and probably all of us) should stop are bitching and hope for the best.

Meanwhile, when something has gone past your point of tolerance — Koyie Hill, for instance — you become incredibly insistent and fall in line with the TJs and the SWLs in terms of message and tone.

I don’t think you support everything the Cubs do. But I’ve rarely seen you criticize a move immediately after it’s been made. IIRC, you even had a post after the Bradley signing trying to make the best of that situation, though you had shot down the idea of the Cubs getting Bradley days before.

That can appear inconsistent, but I really think it’s just optimism. Once the Cubs make a deal, you’re hopeful and all in and try to explain why you’re hopeful. Once you’ve decided a player or coach must go, your rhetoric changes sharply.

Just my thoughts. Not meant as criticism.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

I seriously hadn't read this post when I wrote that reply above.

We seem to be on the same wavelength today. I’m just 2 minutes slower.

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by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think it's a mark against Al.

It’s who he is. Rather than bitch and moan about a bad move from Jump Street, he becomes optimistic that it will work out.

That’s not how I’m wired. But I don’t have a problem with someone who acts that way.

Cheers, Al.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sure, of course not.

But that doesn’t mean that he should agree with the likes of NBF when he says things like “I want the Cubs to keep Hill to tick off the accusers who dislike EVERYTHING the Cubs do,” and chime in that people “reflexively bitch” about everything Hendry does.

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by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

I happen to like NBF.

I disagree with him most of the time, but he makes this place more interesting. So I’m not going to go with “the likes of NBF.”

But I agree with the rest of what you’ve said. There are a lot of consistent critics of Jimbo — I’d say you and I qualify — who will give him credit where we think credit is due.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

He spends a lot of time calling me a psychopath, among other things.

So I’ll differ with you on some of your sentiments. But I think we essentially have expressed the same positions throughout this discussion.

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by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed...

…like I said earlier it seems as though Al is more comfortable criticizing people on this site than he is criticizing the organization.

by troutfishin on Mar 21, 2011 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Actually, this is pretty accurate.

That’s just the way I view things. I tend to be an optimist by nature, so yes, maybe I’m less critical than others.

We’d all have liked to have seen the last two plus years go differently. There are some tough decisions I would like to see management make now. If they don’t make them, then maybe my tone will be more critical.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 21, 2011 5:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think ...

that when a move is made that you previously argued against, you figure that maybe YOU were wrong. Or that you hope that you were.

Again, I don’t see anything wrong with that.

But the knee-jerk mentality that you and NBF say is so pervasive is actually something that very few posters actually share. Nervousness? Sure. A century of (mostly) losing will do that.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 5:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

The money is only part of the problem

It seems that the commitment of $850K means that the organization cannot cut him and face the embarrassment of acknowledging their foolishness.

If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.

by tharr on Mar 21, 2011 4:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

Dare I ask/suggest...

…maybe it’s more of a scouting/coaching thing? I mean, there’s no denying that DeWitt’s career numbers thus far aren’t particularly impressive and he’s having an awful spring at the plate. But … maybe the scouts and coaches who are, y’know, actually in Arizona watching every play of every game see something in the 25-year-old DeWitt that they don’t see in the 27-year-old Moore? Given how relatively little data we (as fans) have on both players, do we really know who is the better choice in this case? Don’t get me wrong — I think you’ve made (and remade) an interesting point in comparing the two. But it’s just seems like there’s an awfully lot of very strong opinions being thrown around here based on spring training results that may not really mean a whole lot.

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by daver on Mar 21, 2011 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

I am not overly concerned with DeWitt's horrible spring.

I am moderately concerned with his rather pedestrian career to date, both in the majors and the minors. Obviously, the Dodgers were similarly concerned, as they traded him at age 25 for a couple months of a rent-a-pitcher.

And, I will admit, I am concerned about his apparent inability to play 2B at the level the Cubs expect. If he is a minus fielder, he offers almost nothing.

Finally, I am concerned- I believe, with good reason- that the Cubs front office is not particularly adept at identifying talent, seems all to willing to give multiple chances to players and plans that other orgs would write off as “bad investment, lesson learned”, and (frustratingly), they put undue weight on the “an acquaintance of Jim Hendry vouched for the guy” school of roster composition.

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by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

I understand your concerns about Cubs management...

…and share them to a certain extent. But I just need a little more time to see what becomes of DeWitt. I’m not prepared to call any of the options you list above as “better” at this point — they’re just other options, all of which the team can pursue if DeWitt doesn’t work out. (Er, well, depending on where Moore ends up after spring training.) Personally, I’d love to see Darwin Barney win the job outright eventually — or even share the position with Baker.

And I’m not sure I’d call Lilly a rent-a-pitcher for the Dodgers — they did re-sign him and may have had a pretty good idea that they’d be able to when that deal was made.

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by daver on Mar 21, 2011 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

If they viewed him as more than a rent-a-pitcher ...

then the Cubs should have been able to get more from LA, right?

I agree with the rest of what you’ve said, though.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe, maybe not.

They gave us a 25-year-old, first-round draft pick and two pitchers. It seemed like a reasonable return for Lilly and Theriot at the time.

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by daver on Mar 21, 2011 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hmm. I seem to remember being ready to storm the barricades.

Consider the opportunity cost. Lilly was worth a 2011 1st round pick if we did absolutely nothing.

And that 1st round pick would have the advantage of not (yet) being a total bust whose team was giving up on him.

I worry that a sizeable reason for the Lilly-for-DeWitt deal was salary relief – both in the “we don’t have to pay Lilly for two months of 2010” sense, and in the “DeWitt will be a cheap, if ineffective, 2B option for 2011” sense, and (most upsettingly) in the “we won’t have to pay to sign an extra 2011 first rounder” sense.

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by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

The draft pick would've been nice.

But isn’t there also a chance Lilly could’ve accepted arbitration, hurting the team’s payroll flexibility? There’s also the possibility that they were thinking, “DeWitt could be a cheap — and reasonably effective (even in a platoon role) — 2B option for 2011.”

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by daver on Mar 21, 2011 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

If he accepted arbitration....

Well, first, there’s absolutely no way that a player in Lilly’s situation is ever going to accept arbitration. This was his last chance for a multi-year payday, and he took it. He wasn’t going to start going year-to-year at age 35.

That said, IF he’d taken arb…. is that so bad? You’ve got Ted Lilly, on a 1-year deal, at something like the $10-12M or so he’s made for the last several years and will continue to make for the next several years.

Isn’t he then worth at least as much in trade as he (apparently) was in July of 2010? Perhaps more, as he pitched very effectively down the stretch in 2010 and more conclusively demonstrated that he was past his injuries.

I still fail to see the downside in keeping Lilly. Unless the team is THAT strapped for cash, that the remote possibility of having to pay $12M for an awesome lefthander and team leader (until he’s traded) is backbreaking.

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by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Lilly wouldn't have accepted arbitration.

And if he had, you could argue that the Cubs could have kept him and avoided trading some top prospects for Garza. I’m not saying the Garza trade was bad (the jury is definitely out) but Lilly could have been a Cub for another year until the Cubs had money to go sign a big-time pitcher after 2011.

And that would have been the worst case scenario.

by elgato on Mar 21, 2011 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think the Garza trade is different from keeping Lilly

Even with his stunning awesomeness, Lilly was still going to be a short timer due to his age. A deal with the Cubs would have been for 1 year, and the deal he signed with the Dodgers was the maximum viable term.

I believe that picking up Garza was targeted at having at least one experienced starter who is young enough to make it through to the other side of the pitching staff turnover that will happen over the next 2-3 seasons. I don’t know if Garza was the right guy for that, but if that was the goal it does make some sense.

by ClarkFan on Mar 21, 2011 4:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't disagree with anything you're saying.

I’m definitely jumping the gun here – the Cubs haven’t even officially made the end-of-ST moves we’re anticipating yet.

I just feel like I’ve heard this song before, and I know where the music stops.

Maybe Hendry will prove me wrong this time. I hope so.

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by D98 on Mar 21, 2011 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

We have 7 former All Stars out of 8 players, the ‘names’ are there, however the talent doesn’t mesh together to be a successful team.

That’s the same thing I heard back in ‘09 and then ’10. Let’s face it, they don’t have a ton of talent or upside. The key word there is former. We’re one of the older teams in the league and older players don’t magically increase their production. We’re just not a very good team.

by Bad Midget on Mar 20, 2011 8:56 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

beautiful in its simplicity...

I didn't understand the "white-collar Cub fans", "blue-collar Sox fans" until much later in life. Harry Smith~ "For Cubs Fans Only".

by jeffstorm2 on Mar 20, 2011 9:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not trying to be rude, I am just wondering

what the relevance is on the attendance issue. I know that it has been slacking, but I didn’t know why your going into averages and statistics on the attendance issue? Just wondering if something was up with that?

by alabamacubbie on Mar 20, 2011 9:52 PM CDT reply actions  

Because I'm interested in it.

If you’re not, pass it on by.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 9:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

I usually pass it by

Just a question but don’t get upset about it. You keep your attendance statistical data and I’ll keep watching the game.

by alabamacubbie on Mar 20, 2011 10:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Al

how many games where there last year for all of ST…if there are more this year year overall then that will depress attendance #’s by itself as there is less urgency to see a game. It did appear last year that you were reporting on consistent record breaking attendance figures

by hansman1982 on Mar 20, 2011 10:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

There were 219 last year

and there were 246 scheduled this year. But, it looks like 10 game will be wiped out tomorrow and maybe some on Tuesday as well.

That is why I use the same number of games to do a comparison.

The best comparison is the per game average.

Thru 179 games the per game average:

2010 = 6555
2011 = 6558
2009 = 6518

The Final Avg for 2010 was 6718 and this year projects to be slightly higher, but essentially the same.

by azjazzman on Mar 20, 2011 11:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

thanks for doing the math

i think you’re right in that the 219 game comparison will match up too

by doofus cubs guy on Mar 21, 2011 2:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

Grabow

Only briefly mentioned. but, doesn’t he need to start the season on the DL? He is not effective. And, can of worms aside about his contract, I can’t see the reason in bringing him North when he could go on the 15 day DL and maybe work out his issues.

by Nibbles on Mar 20, 2011 10:07 PM CDT reply actions  

Grabow

Grabow has only pitched 3 innings 5 hits and 2 ER and 2K’s not sure how you can summize that he is completely dead to the team yet.

by jeff_pico on Mar 20, 2011 10:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Grabow did better today.

We’ll see how he does with a few more appearances.

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by Al Yellon on Mar 20, 2011 10:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why does Coleman not pitch much?

Did he call a pitch that was hit for a HR by Pat Burrell or something?

by TJ11 on Mar 20, 2011 11:03 PM CDT reply actions  

Based upon what data

If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.

by tharr on Mar 21, 2011 4:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

Hendry doesn't like him.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

State high point count: 3/50

If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Mar 21, 2011 6:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Pardon, but that was the assessment

many gave about Randy Wells he proved to be quite a useful MLB pitcher.

Baseball is back!!

by cowsarecool220 on Mar 21, 2011 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

OT: Hawks beat the Yotes!

in regulation! Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

OK back to the topic at hand.

by Swoosie on Mar 20, 2011 11:47 PM CDT reply actions  

I'm wishing we had eyes on the minor league camp.

I’m less interested in questions we already know the answer to (Is DeWitt a legit leadoff man? Is Silva done? Is Koyie Hill’s bat warming up yet?) than ones we don’t (Is Hayden Simpson pitching yet? What’s Szczur looking like? Is Cabeza(s) going to be able to provide another reasonable catching option?).

Probably hafta wait a few weeks. The Pirates had a great similar post about Jameson Taillon.

by timh815 on Mar 21, 2011 7:48 AM CDT reply actions   1 recs

Tell me about it

I’m debating on whether or not to buy MiLB TV this year to watch more of our farm teams. Has anybody bought this before? Is it worth it?

by RynoRooter on Mar 21, 2011 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions  

And where is LeMahieu the past few days and how is he doing?

He may not be part of the many-playered 2B scenarios in 2011, but it would be good to have him get a little more power to compete for 2012.

by ClarkFan on Mar 21, 2011 4:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

time

to ressurect the old wendy line. wheres the beef. in iowa. koyie hill you are one lucky man.

by NOMAR on Mar 23, 2011 6:06 AM CDT reply actions  

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