Derrek Lee: Chicago can be a tough place to play
by Not Bruce Froemming on Apr 30, 2011 11:06 AM CDT
Email
PrintSounds like the Cubs' former first baseman liked his time in Chicago overall, but not completely. At least it's good to see he didn't receive any hate mail while he was here, although that wouldn't have surprised me, either.
He was one of my favorite modern-era Cubs, both for his play and his demeanor, and truly had an MVP-quality year in 2005. Although he isn't exactly lighting 'em up in Baltimore.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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i hope this
convinces people here that there is a race issue with cubs fans & black players. I remember more than a few commenters last year dismissing the stories of J. Jones or Hawkins because they were malcontents or whatever. But D Lee was a class act and if he says he saw that kind of bs then we should believe it.
I think you're overstating the problem.
I don’t deny that some black players may have heard racist taunts. However, I believe those people are in the extreme minority of Cubs fans.
Don’t tar all of us with that brush.
Check out Chicago sports coverage at SB Nation Chicago
by Al Yellon on Apr 30, 2011 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
well dont dismiss it either Al
obviously not all Cub fans are racist but it has been a reoccurring problem for like 5-6 years now. Black players who struggle get racist hate mail. Period. I don’t read about this as often in other cities. It’s a problem and I don’t pretend to have any form of solution because you can’t stop stupid people from being stupid but again, I hope D Lee speaking on it will silence those at BCB who were suggesting Milton Bradley or Hawkins were making it all up.
by CalCalender on Apr 30, 2011 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions
Really?
D-Lee had his struggles at times, but said he never got any such mail.
I don’t deny that some idiot fans made remarks like this, nor that Bradley or Hawkins “made it up”. I’m sure that was real. You’re making it out to be a much larger problem than it really is.
Check out Chicago sports coverage at SB Nation Chicago
Dusty Baker
Jacque Jones, Latroy Hawkins & Milton Bradley all reported it. Tori Hunter who is one of the classiest guys in baseball said he knew it was a problem here.
Thats not exactly a great track record Al
by CalCalender on Apr 30, 2011 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions
Milton Bradley....LOL
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Apr 30, 2011 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Again...
… I do not deny these things happened. You’re making it out like every Cubs fan is a racist. That is certainly false.
Check out Chicago sports coverage at SB Nation Chicago
no im not
you are trying to discredit a valid argument by misrepresenting what im saying.
i said it above- obviously not all cubs fans are racist
i cant be more clear than that
by CalCalender on Apr 30, 2011 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Fair enough.
However, the problem seems to have gone away — for the moment, at least. Let’s hope it stays gone away.
Check out Chicago sports coverage at SB Nation Chicago
I don't deny things like that happened either but...
…Dusty had a gift of being able to deflect issues, when the team was playing awful he’d pull out the race card. When things didn’t go his way in the playoffs or the world series he’d use his kid as a prop to deflect any criticism that might head his way.
As I said earlier, prejudices to some degree exist in all of us so therefore the problem of race issues aren’t going anywhere. Do they exist as a blight on society like they once did? No. But for us to think that this is some sort of epidemic in Chicago is pure silliness.
by troutfishin on Apr 30, 2011 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Agreed about Dusty
Couldn’t stand that aspect of his personality.
That said, Chicago is one of the most bigoted cities in the US, sad to say.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Apr 30, 2011 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions
All major cities are bigoted to a certain extent.
What desegregation in the south proved was that you can’t legislate away prejudice but what I find ironic about forced desegregation in the south is that he have voluntary segregation in just about every major city in the country.
BTW, that bigotry you point out is a two way street.
Oh, very true
Chicago isn’t as segragated as, say, Milwaukee is. But it is much more segregated than most other major American cities.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Apr 30, 2011 4:04 PM CDT up reply actions
it is also one of the most segregated
which doesn’t help
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Chicago is a bigoted city?
I’m seriously asking…not being a jerk.
Just thought the city that gave Obama and Oprah a springboard to jump off of wouldn’t be considered too bigoted
They both (stats & bikinis) show a lot, but not everything. - Infielder Toby Harrah Poster formerly known as Wrigster.
by bilbosbuttons on Apr 30, 2011 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions
It's very segregated...
…which can create a mob mentality in certain situations. Areas like Bridgeport can be very dangerous for a certain segment of the populace as other areas of the west and south side can be dangerous for another segment of the populace.
Another thing
I was a traveling trainer for 5 years for a company that had 35 call centers in the US.
IN the so called non bigoted north the teams would always form along racial lines. I rarely if ever saw people of different races sitting together for lunch.
But in the so called racist south I saw a lot more interaction and friendly relations between people of different races. And I never ate at the hotel while training in the south I was invited to people’s homes for dinner all the time. Rarely was in the north.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on Apr 30, 2011 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions
That is preposterous
Unless you have some statistical evidence, you’re simply pandering to a personal bias. Spend some time down south and you’ll recognize that the people of Chicago stand tall on racial issues.
If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.
I have spent time in the South
and I stand by what I said.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 1, 2011 6:00 AM CDT up reply actions
You always stand by what you said
but that doesn’t make you right. Tell us what you meant by
I have spent time in the South
. Just how much time di you live in the South and where.
If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.
How much time have you spent in the South?
I’ve lived here all my life. Racism is not nearly as large a problem down here as a lot of people make it out to be.
That isn’t to say that we don’t have any racists, but racism has been a problem since the beginning of human history and it isn’t just black and white. But for some reason it’s always a little more convenient to play it up with a southern accent.
by Pre on May 3, 2011 2:27 AM CDT up reply actions
for me
24 years north, 11 years south and i agree, i have seen less segregation and less racism in the south
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Chicago is an example of what demogrophers call "hypersegregation"
Most recently Adam Green from the U of Chicago detailed the current state of affairs and if you need more clinical research and statistical evidence just google “hypersegregation Chicago”. You’ll find myriad academic treatises on the topic.
Chicago hardly stands tall on racial issues.
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
by Gibbon Jockey on May 2, 2011 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions
Perhaps you can agree
that there are numerous studies which claim that hypersegregation research is based upon invalid assumptions. Salt Lake City with a black population of 1.3% was claimed as a model of integration, for instance,
If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.
Oh, no doubt about that
And subsequently, Chicago ranks behind black majority metropolitan areas such as Detroit, DC or New Orleans…
The point I was simply making is that the general detente is one color on the southside and another color on the northside. That’s the way it’s been, the way it is, and the way it will be and the data backs that up. I don’t find that situation as being particularly progressive.
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
by Gibbon Jockey on May 3, 2011 4:02 PM CDT up reply actions
By the way, NO will always be
one of my favorite cities. I just wish we committed as much effort to rebuilding there as we have to Baghdad.
But to the point, I would like to distinguish between racism and segregation. IMHO, segregation nowadays is more of an economic reality as opposed to the forced segregation from earlier days. And we can agree that numerous steps could be taken by government to address that situation.
But racism is in the hearts of people. In that respect, I heartily disagree that Chicago is near the top of the list. I have lived in Houston many years and there is a loud minority who are serious bigots. Most younger people are indifferent to race. However, the old guard still contains too many racists who believe our President is a dumb foreigner.
If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.
Give me a break.
Nobody said every Cubs fan is racist. But, I agree. There does seem to be a problem. And I’ve noticed it in the stands as well. Black and latin players have far more and much more intense vitriol directed in their direction when they fail. It’s disgusting. And rather than pretending it doesn’t exist, Cubs fans should be doing their best to expose and excoriate those that take this tact.
You live in the city long enough and you'll have a couple of
…racial epithets thrown your way over the course of your like and it doesn’t matter what color you are, but to suggest that this is epidemic for it to become the distraction for players as Lee suggests is I think kind of ridiculous.
I think people need to consult with Moises Alou and ask him how they can get thicker more calloused skin.
Huh?
You live in the city long enough and you’ll have a couple of
…racial epithets thrown your way over the course of your like [sic] and it doesn’t matter what color you are
I’m not familiar with any white Chicago Cubs that have had racial epithets thrown their direction. Don’t develop some sort of equivalency between how white and black players are treated in Chicago because a white person can get called a “cracker” or a “honky” in certain parts of the city is laughable.
Finally, to suggest that black ballplayers should have to deal with racist fans and just need to develop “thicker” skin is absurd. That stuff needs to stop.
The white players get called homophobic slurs instead.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
while i don't think that blacks, and/or hispanics need to develop and change
because of silly racism, i think hat racism needs to stop.
but, i do think that people that are having bigotry thrown at them should realize there are idiots everywhere.
no matter what race, age, sex, or religion, ANYTHING, there is someone pout there that will offend you, or try to offend you…
They both (stats & bikinis) show a lot, but not everything. - Infielder Toby Harrah
Poster formerly known as Wrigster.
by bilbosbuttons on Apr 30, 2011 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not talking about players in my example...
…I was talking about people that live in the city in general. I’ve been called a cracker and a honky and I’ve lived here my entire life. It happens, I’m sorry if I offended you because I agree it shouldn’t happen at all but there might be a correlation between the demographic in attendance at Wrigley and who the epithets are being aimed at.
The only thing I pointing out is that race problems in this country is not a one way street, you live in Chicago long enough and you begin to realize that.
you see it on TV, hear it on the radio
read about it in the paper, it does go both ways, but one of those ways has become socially acceptable, and the other makes you a racist, go figure
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
by Cubbie-Tim on Apr 30, 2011 4:40 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
On the flip side
3 of the most popular Cubs of all time including Mr. Cub are african american.
There’s racism in every sports fandom. I bet it’s actually less with the Cubs than other teams but if a Pirates player was a victim it wouldn’t get the publicity because they’re the Pirates.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on Apr 30, 2011 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions
"Tori Hunter who is one of the classiest guys in baseball,"
Ummmm, a lot of Hispanic ballplayers would disagree with that statement.
I am a traveler of both time and space to be where I have been. Robert Plant 1975
Derrek Lee is the tipping point for me
If he heard and saw it, i believe it.
"It's all in the game, yo"
I second...
…Al. The problems are simply magnified here (X4 here versus, say, Cincinnati).- TL
"Sir,--It has been wittily remarked that there are three kinds of falsehood: the first is a 'fib,' the second is a downright lie, and the third and most aggravated is statistics." *The National Observer* (June 13, 1891): p. 93-94.
the media is probably more of a problem than the actual comments made to players
everything is so under scrutiny and over analyzed by the media these days ESP in chi-town, ESP on the north side.
They both (stats & bikinis) show a lot, but not everything. - Infielder Toby Harrah
Poster formerly known as Wrigster.
by bilbosbuttons on Apr 30, 2011 4:36 PM CDT up reply actions
I call BS on your racist cubs fans claim...
CUBS fans don’t have racial issues…SOCIETY had racial issues, some of them might just happen to be cubs fans.
I bet there a racist braves fans, marlins fans, Yankees fans, red sox fans…you think Chicago is the only place in the US that has racist people…riiiiight
They both (stats & bikinis) show a lot, but not everything. - Infielder Toby Harrah Poster formerly known as Wrigster.
by bilbosbuttons on Apr 30, 2011 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
I would say Individuals have race issues
Those individuals, in a shrinking minority, are going to pop up on occasion in all aspects of society.
Exactly...
I doubt we will ever be rid of it forever…sad but true.
They both (stats & bikinis) show a lot, but not everything. - Infielder Toby Harrah Poster formerly known as Wrigster.
by bilbosbuttons on Apr 30, 2011 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions
No doubt that prejudices exist, they exist in all of us...
…so therefore the problem of “race issues” will never completely go away.
by troutfishin on Apr 30, 2011 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions
especially as long as there are different rules for each race
in society. we promote racism even if we dont think we are and dont mean to
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Good point.
I know several Cub fans who are brain surgeons. if a few Cub fans being racists makes Cub fans racist these brain surgeons mean we’re all brain surgeons too!
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on Apr 30, 2011 8:13 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't miss him
I’ll still never forget 2003.
“Let’s make him famous.”
That and his great seasons didn’t seem to come when the Cubs had great seasons.
RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010) and Ron Santo (February 25, 1940-December 2, 2010).
If you disagree with me in any way, you are wrong.
I don't get
The first two sentences of your post (not trying to bait you, I seriously don’t get it).
by Not Bruce Froemming on Apr 30, 2011 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions
I get it.
That’s what Lee reportedly said to his Marlins teammates during Game 6 after the… well, you know.
Check out Chicago sports coverage at SB Nation Chicago
i have no problem with him saying that, and i am sure we would have said similar
if the roles were reversed for us
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
I don't have to like it
Or him.
RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010) and Ron Santo (February 25, 1940-December 2, 2010).
If you disagree with me in any way, you are wrong.
some dont mind, some will, its ok either way
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
I think Lee's statement about Bartman...
…was prescient in a sense because who would know at that moment just how much of an impact one play would make.
Who is the "let's" and who is the "him" in that statement?
They both (stats & bikinis) show a lot, but not everything. - Infielder Toby Harrah Poster formerly known as Wrigster.
by bilbosbuttons on Apr 30, 2011 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions
lets = marlins
him = Bartman
it was a comment about making him famous for the foul ball, while he was with Florida.
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Well, it's stupid to hold that against him
I would have said the same thing were I in his position.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Apr 30, 2011 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions
According to Mike Lowell and others, it was Mark Redman cheerleading, jumping up and down...
…saying “Let’s make that kid famous.”
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
whoever it was, i dont blame them nor think they were wrong for it
it makes sense, you want to win and know that the incident will be highlighted if you do
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
That is one of the stupidest statements I've ever read on this blog
If Jim Freaking Edmonds can play here and be cheered, then Derrek Lee, who played for a team that has no history with the Cubs other than that series, can play here.
My eyes are bleeding from the stupidity of that statement.
"It's all in the game, yo"
I always wanted more from D.Lee
and have been a harsh critic of his play for years. 2005 was one of the finest seasons I’ve seen from a Cub, I expected him to play close to that level for a few more years, assuming he was peaking. He seemed to never quite recover from his arm injury, unless you count 2009. He had a decent season in 2007 and was the only position player to show up in the playoffs. It appeared that he led the team in warning track fly-outs the past few seasons. Despite how much his play frustrated me at times, he made me eat my words on numerous occasions.
"You've got to get your damn shirts rolled up and go out and kick somebody's ass. That's what you've got to do. Period." -- Lou Piniella
Don't be fooled by D. Lee's Cub playoff performance.
In 2007, he hit .333 thanks to 4 singles.
Game 1: 1 for 4 (single), 0-2 with men on base.
1st AB – man on first, 1 out: strikeout.
2nd AB – man on 2nd, 2 out: strikeout.
3rd AB – leadoff single, scores after wild pitch, 2 walks, and another single.
4th AB – bases empty, 2 outs: strikeout.
Game 2: 1 for 4 (single), 0-3 with men on base.
1st AB: man on first, 1 out: fielder’s choice, beats double play.
2nd AB: bases empty, 1 out: walk
3rd AB: (losing 2-6): man on first, 1 out: popout to SS
4th AB: (losing 8-4): bases empty, 1 out: single.
5th AB: (9th inning, losing 8-4): runners on 1st and 2nd: strikeout.
Game 3: 2 for 4 (both singles) 0-2, 1 GIDP with runners on base
1st AB: Bases empty, 2 out: single
2nd AB: Bases empty, 1 out: single
3rd AB: Runner on 2nd, no outs: 6-3.
4th AB: (7th inning, down 4-1) Runner on 1st, 1 out: GIDP.
In 2008 – his overall stats were pretty great. But again, he failed in every big spot and produced when literally nothing was at stake:
Game 1: 1-3 (single) 0-1, 1 GIDP with men on base.
1st AB: Bases empty, 2 out: Walk
2nd AB: Bases empty, 1 out: Single
3rd AB: (losing 4-2, 5th inn) Runner on 1st, 1 out: GIDP.
4th AB: (losing 6-2, 8th) Bases empty, 4-3.
Game 2: 2-4 (single, meaningless double, brutal error in 5-run Dodger 2nd inning.) 0-1 with men on base
1st AB: Man on 2nd, 1 out: Strikeout.
2nd AB: (Trailing 0-5) Bases empty, single
3rd AB: (Trailing 0-7) Bases empty, Flyout to RF
4th AB: (9th inning, Trailing 1-10) Bases empty: Double
Game 3: 3-4 (1-1 with men on base)
1st AB: Bases empty, 2 out: Double
2nd AB: 2 out, runner on first: Single, runner advances to 2nd.
3rd AB: 2 out, bases empty: Strikeout
4th AB: (8th inn, Trailing 0-3) Bases empty, no out: Double.
His 2008 Game 3 was good.
But when you look at D. Lee’s playoff performances for the Cubs, you see zero RBI, due entirely to the fact that he batted 1-10 with 2 GIDP with men on base during those 6 games, or his one hit was a weak single with a man on 1st as the Cubs were losing their 6th straight playoff game.
A couple of bases empty doubles, one in the 9th inning of a game the Cubs were losing by 9 runs, doesn’t mean that Lee “showed up” for those playoff series.
Granted, he was better than Soriano, but he managed to shrink from every big (and even medium-sized) moment in both playoff series, and he directly allowed more runs with his glove than he knocked in with his bat.
Sadly, the biggest hit of Lee’s career was against the Cubs, in the 2003 NLCS.
And he flat-out sucked in that series, too.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Chicago can be a tough place to play....
Especially if you are not a good baseball player and you blame racism for your problems……
by TJ11 on Apr 30, 2011 2:15 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
I don't think they're blaming racism for their problems, TJ
The fan reaction to their problems is what’s key.
I think they have a point. Not a huge point, but one nonetheless.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Apr 30, 2011 4:01 PM CDT up reply actions
I am sick of hearing it.
I don’t think of the players that way. Dunston and Dawson along with Grace and Sandberg were my favorites and I think Dunston and Dawson busted their ass more than any players that i have ever seen. I am just sick of being painted with every other person who is not black as a racist everytime some sick bastard does something stupid to a player of color.
Some guys like Lee only mention it if asked or way after the fact. That is fine. Others like Bradley and Baker used it as a crutch and it just pisses people off. They are just as big of a racist as the fools who say something to them.
I agree
I don’t think of players that way, either.
I don’t think everybody thinks the same way you and I do, however.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Apr 30, 2011 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions
a smal amount of people think that way
and the majority get tagged based on it.
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
The proof might be
if stuff like this happens in other cities and whether it rises to the same level as it does in Chicago, specificially at Wrigley Field.
If it’s common in other places, that doesn’t make it right, of course, but it also shows Wrigley isn’t necessarily an outlier.
If it’s much worse at Wrigley than at other places, then there’s a problem.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Apr 30, 2011 5:02 PM CDT up reply actions
many times i have heard people talk about their team and the need to be less white
since they can win with more hispanics and less whites.
I wont say that the people saying this were racist, but it would be easy to think the they are based on the statement alone, and that translates often to how people react, they take one statement and run with it without knowing or understanding anything else about the person
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
this is also a problem towards the average joe at times
a white person cannot make half the comments a non white person can, without being called racist. it is socially acceptable (yet it should not be) for a non white comedian (for example) to call white people “cracker ass cracker” but God forbid a white person makes a similar statement about a black or hispanic person. So much of the racism is true, and a lot of it is perception on one side of and “not allowed” on the other.
to set the record straight I am all for equality, but that means if its ok for one, is needs to be ok for the other, and that will never happen.
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
I think you might be going off into the weeds here...
…because I’ve never looked at the discrepancies in race relations in regards to what we are allowed to say about each other. You’re right in a sense but what I think what has drivin most of the problems that we see is the push towards social engineering.
The way we see each other and the way we interact can’t be taught or legislated by the government, it begins in the home. To rid the world of racism would mean the end of ignorance, as long as we humans exist so will ignorance.
+1 well said
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
The one thing
The one thing that is scary is people have talked on an off about making hate speech a crime.
Yes it’s wrong but it’s also something often left up to interpretation. You cannot punish people for saying words.
I was accused of being a racist once for commenting how elegant Michelle Obama looked and how tough it can be sometimes.
The person didn’t even find out what the conversation was about. They happened to walk in and heard me say that.
I was talking to someone who like Michelle is about 6 feet tall. We were talking about how hard it was sometimes for women to find elegant clothing at that height. I am not 6 feet tall but 2 of my sisters in law are and they had to get their wedding dresses specially ordered
The friend I was initially talking to had just gotten engaged and we had talked about my sisters in law getting their dresses and she was asking me where they had gotten theirs.
She had mentioned how Michelle has become a fashion idol for women who are very tall and that’s when I said what I said and the other person walked in.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
And
And by the way my friend got her dress at the same place my sisters in law did and looked gorgeous.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions
While this may be true
I just don’t give a damn.
I don’t feel the urge to say racist things. The fact that someone else “gets to” doesn’t give me the urge to do so.
"It's all in the game, yo"
i am not saying i want to say them
but that the way it is acceptable or not based on skin tone only continues to make it worse and keep it alive
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
I also don't take offense at the word "cracker"
I actually don’t have the first clue what it means and how it became a slur. Am I a Wheat Thin or a Triscuit?
"It's all in the game, yo"
Term comes from rural southern whites using whips when herding cattle...
The whip crack is referenced. Now you know.
Generally a reference to rural white southerners.
It's 106 miles to Chicago...
You sound really insensitive when you say that
The differences between the historical origin and use of racial slurs about blacks and the historical treatment of blacks in American make using those words infinitely more insensitive than “cracker” or any other slur towards whites.
my point if you have been reading my posts
is that its bullshi*t that a non white can make racial statements about whites and it is socially acceptable, but a white person cannot do the same without being labeled a racist
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
I don't think it's bull----
I think that it is a reflection of how much more offensive the racial slurs directed at non-whites are.
And you didn’t say “racial statements”. You said racist comments.
Realistically, Lee 's career started on a downhill trend
those last 3 years. His hand injury didn’t help. Did we really get enough out of him? Not sure. Had the team gotten to a WS, I think we’d say yes. His race is meaningless.
Sadly, Lee’s only ring was earned at the Cubs expense.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Apr 30, 2011 3:16 PM CDT reply actions
Country mice scurrying into Wrigley, bringing their racism with them.
"They sell every ticket to every game, win or lose!" - Tom Ricketts
Lol...
This reeks of irony, and hypocrisy
They both (stats & bikinis) show a lot, but not everything. - Infielder Toby Harrah Poster formerly known as Wrigster.
by bilbosbuttons on Apr 30, 2011 3:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Well if it's not irony, as a life long..
…Chicagoan I’ll be the first to extol the virtues of country folk. Most of my extended family live in the south and in the areas that they live in it’s almost like a social utopia for people of all races compared to what you see in major cities. Neighbors actually talk to each other, people help each other, it’s kind of a nice change of pace when I go and visit.
When I first moved out to the country
I couldn’t believe it. I’d drive down the block and people would wave at us. My husband and I had a picnic lunch in the park and some people came up by us. We were sort of expecting to be harassed, but they just came over to say “hi”. So I know what you mean about “neighbors actually talk to each other.” It was quite refreshing.
Fasten those seat belts...
I will never forget seeing a Mayor of a small town get out of his truck
to help a lady pick up her papers she dropped. and seeing others flock to help as well. this happened less than 40 miles from where i live now, and it was such a great relief and change of pace from my 24 years in Chicago. Its nice to walk around and see people saying hi, using sir and ma’am, and all races having fun together here. we are not segregated for the most part in Austin as well, its a mix most everywhere.
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Tulsa, OK is pretty mixed as well...
everyone does fine…
They both (stats & bikinis) show a lot, but not everything. - Infielder Toby Harrah Poster formerly known as Wrigster.
by bilbosbuttons on Apr 30, 2011 4:13 PM CDT up reply actions
My experience
Spending 5 years traveling all over the country as I mentioned above as a traveling trainer, the people in the south are in general more friendly.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on Apr 30, 2011 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Nevermind.
Cubs/Titans/Thunder fan. Just a typical idiot I guess.
"They sell every ticket to every game, win or lose!" - Tom Ricketts
OK.
The namecalling is going to stop here.
If this kind of commentary keeps up, I’m going to close comments on this post.
Be nice.
Check out Chicago sports coverage at SB Nation Chicago
no offense Al..
but magicballs was the only one who resorted to name calling.
unless saying something along the lines of “this reeks of hypocrisy and irony” is not accepted. if its not acceptable, sorry.
if is is acceptable, then the only problem was him.
They both (stats & bikinis) show a lot, but not everything. - Infielder Toby Harrah
Poster formerly known as Wrigster.
by bilbosbuttons on Apr 30, 2011 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions
What's your problem
you’re being called to the carpet for an overgeneralized stereotypical view of country folk and you resort to name calling. What your doing is no different than what a few fans at Wrigley are doing to black and hispanic players.
The fact that you can't differentiate between the two
along with the fact that you don’t know the difference between YOU’RE and YOUR is fitting.
"They sell every ticket to every game, win or lose!" - Tom Ricketts
If you would like to get into a battle of wits, I'm game...
but because you can’t recognize that calling someone a racist because of where they reside geographically as bigotry then it would be a waste of my time.
Actually
he used your and you’re right.
What’s your problem is right and he is saying You are being called which you’re is the correct contraction for.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on Apr 30, 2011 8:16 PM CDT up reply actions
But then he also said
" What YOUR doing is no different than a few fans at Wrigley…" In that case it should have been YOU’RE. What YOU ARE doing is no different than a few fans at Wrigley….I’m a 4th grade teacher it stuck out right away. lol
#10 You will be missed.
by Bricks and Ivy on Apr 30, 2011 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Missed the other one
Sorry missed that one.
My personal favorite is how often I’ve been called a LOOSER because I’m a Cubs fan.
What is a looser?
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions
It means you're not as tight as everyone else i guess
#10 You will be missed.
by Bricks and Ivy on May 1, 2011 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions
im from the country..
and you generalized country people as a bunch of hillbilly racists. i just thought that your generalization of us, was hypocritical. in the fact that you were talking about us generalizing.people.
we can stay civil about this…
They both (stats & bikinis) show a lot, but not everything. - Infielder Toby Harrah Poster formerly known as Wrigster.
by bilbosbuttons on Apr 30, 2011 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions
here is a spin on this
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
No wait,
D Lee was a classy Cub. I was glad to have him for several years. No regrets.
"We're young and dumb and ready to go throw strikes." James Russell
Another thing
The worst treated athletes in this city in recent memory were Rex Grossman and Jay Cutler. Yes it’s a different sport but they got their jerseys burnt, death threats and things thrown at them from the stands.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
Absolutely right
what happened to Rex in the local and national media prevented him, I believe from having a promising career. His he had a few bad games during that super bowl season but his overall numbers were really impressive.
What happened to Cutler following the game against Green Bay was reprehensible. It’s one thing to have a couple of fans hurling slurs it’s quite another to have a national media line up against you. Grossman’s career has never been the same and we won’t know what becomes of Cutler until this season begins.
not just the national media, but players from other teams tweeting about you
that was even more of a jab IMHO
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
The treatment of Cutler
was an absolute disgrace.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Apr 30, 2011 10:02 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
agreed
from the public, media and other players as well. was nice to see the bears players come to his defense, especially urlacher
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
I have never been more embarrassed to be a Chicago sports fan
than I was in the week following the NFC title game.
Sadder still that much of the media were complicit, with some exceptions (Boers and Bernstein being among them).
by Not Bruce Froemming on Apr 30, 2011 10:16 PM CDT up reply actions
That's surprising (and refreshing) to hear about B'n'B
Their day-in day-out homophobia and calling people (pejorative for Downs Syndrome people) is guaranteed to lower your IQ at least 25 points.
Urlacher
If anyone knows about the way players are treated badly in this city by the media its Urlacher.
On a related note to this topic ESPN had a whole thing saying Urlacher is only popular in Chicago because he’s white.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions
there were those who speculated that Dustin Byfuglien
was traded by the Blackhawks since he was black as well, but no ojne said that about Kirk Heinrich being traded by the Bulls if that helps to show the common sense used in such statements
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Who the hell speculated THAT?
How could ANYBODY even offer that an an opinion?
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on May 1, 2011 9:01 PM CDT up reply actions
that was what many fans said on numerous sites and blogs
it was such a stupid thing, yet was said
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
i am not saying they were right, and i know they were wrong
it is just another example of how some react looking at skin tone alone
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Understood
Some people should have their Intenets License revoked.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on May 3, 2011 4:45 PM CDT up reply actions
I have literally never heard that "speculation".
Was that speculated by someone in the media? If so, show your work.
When Buff was traded, the primary response was OH GOD DAMN IT STUPID SALARY CAP WHYYYYYY (this is somehow Huet’s fault.)
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
it was comments made by fans
i remember reading the comments on multiple articles about the trade, and shaking my head, I know exactly why he as moved, it was move him or move Sharp, and that was a no brainer.
and here is one of those such comments that you are basically saying I have made up
west side rob | June 24, 2010 9:31 AM | Reply
im 50 years old african american i was so proud to see that and african american was part of winning a stanley cup. what a slap in the african comunity face that u got ride of buff when you had other options its odvous the black hawks organization dont care about its african american fan base. right now im hurt!
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
oh, who cares about that.
We may as well start citing Youtube commenters.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on May 4, 2011 9:23 PM CDT up reply actions
An African American fan
(and he was the only one to say similar, as i had read it multiple times on various pages when the trade happened) voicing his opinion does not count since you dont think it should.
Then I guess comments here (or general anywhere including media written articles or interviews, etc) also should not count (these are after all full of opinions, just like comments are on a site) when we are talking about how people react, how people vary in opinion and so on.
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
It's a big jump from "how the media treated Cutler" to "what one blog commenter thought of Byfuglien".
There’s a point where opinions start to matter less.
Isolated, anonymous blog comments are way below that line.
Mine included! If I wrote something offensive about some player on BCB, it would have literally no weight. I don’t speak for Chicago, for the Cubs, or for any particular media outlet.
Al’s opinions, on the other hand, matter a bit more. He’s on the masthead.
And if Bruce Miles or Rob Neyer voices an opinion, people listen, and it becomes a topic for discussion.
If a critical mass of people voiced that opinion, even anonymously on message boards – sure, that would matter a little bit more.
But one, or a handful, of random comments? I mean, that could have been a 15-year-old white kid trying to stir up fights in a comment section.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
it was an exact example of the topic about racial issues
within Chicago and their sports teams. how the team is perceived by the fans is exactly what was being spoken about, not the media alone, and if you actually paid attention the topic got into much more than that as well.
Now you are welcome to continue your dbag ways of trying to always take a post of mine and twist it and turn it however you like, but as i said many times before you are not my type, maybe you should look for another man cruch as i am not going to put out for you
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
and btw "mr show your work"
i have corrected your incorrect “fact” about the CTE’s being diagnosed
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Oh, really?
I don’t think that you’re much of a reader, in that case. There was no need for a correction.
I was agreeing with your general point.
CTE is not something that’s “new” in the age of bigger, faster players. There is an entire generation of NFLers, in their advanced age, such as Mike Webster, who played in the 70’s and 80’s and suffered this kind of brain damage.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on May 4, 2011 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions
yes realy
when you decide what era to try and nail it down to (stating 70’s-80’s) and I show you that you are incorrect and in just one google search am able to show you approx 20% of those diagnosed played in the 90’s.
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Oh my god.
Is this so hard to understand? Are you this poor of a reader? Does “80%” no longer constitute “most”?
Here’s what I’m saying.
CTE isn’t something new. It’s just not the result of players getting bigger and faster in the 90’s. In fact, the vast majority of players who have been diagnosed so far played in the 70’s and 80’s.
That makes the problem substantially worse. I don’t even know what the proper solution is. But I do know that I’m not going to continue a weird debate with someone whose argument I was supporting.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on May 4, 2011 9:59 PM CDT up reply actions
try actually reading what you own words are
when you said
It’s all the 1970’s and 1980’s players being diagnosed with CTE now
i said that you must have missed those in the 90’s who have been diagnosed since you are narrowing it down to those decades, and now you are adding words like “most” and so on.
and in typical fashion, you try to insult anyone who doesnt agree with you by saying I am a poor reader, when in fact i am actually responding to your exact words.
and here is my initial comment about being bigger and faster
a big part of it is that with medical science
athletes are bigger, faster, stronger, making the hits that much more dangerous
I DID NOT say it was in the 90’s alone, it said due to medical science, which spanned 70’s, 80’s and so on, YOU are the one who wanted to nail it to a certain era
anything else about my post and your words you wish to change in addition?
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
This is excruciating.
The scary thing about CTE isn’t the huge hits. At some level, we can try to legislate those out of the game. Can’t get rid of them entirely, but we can try.
The bigger problem for football is that the cumulative effect of “normal”, subconcussive hits can cause these tau protein formations in the front cortex, causing CTE.
Like, with Owen Thomas – a college player at Penn State who had never had a concussion, but who killed himself and was found to have CTE. This wasn’t decades of concussions in the NFL – it was a few years of run-of-the-mill high school and college competition.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/14/sports/14football.html
If regular old line play can cause life-altering brain damage, where does that leave football as a sport?
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
a soccer plauyer has been diagnosed
i never said that was the ONLY reason they happen, you are doing a good job, once again, taking my words to mean what i didnt say. I said A BIG PART OF IT, which it is, you are taking that as me saying IT IS ONLY BECAUSE OF which I did not say.
and in the process you continue to try and defend how you decided what decade to point to and in the process you were incorrect, about what decades players who have been diagnosed played.
and you dont need to play a sport to have it,
Who gets chronic traumatic encephalopathy?
Although initially seen primarily in professional boxers, cases have now been identified in a number of athletes competing in different sports. According to Mckee et al. (2009), of the 51 confirmed cases of CTE, 90% of the cases occurred in athletes. The athletes included the following:
• 39 amateur and professional boxers
• 5 football players
• 1 professional wrestler
• 1 soccer player
yes these numbers are from Oct 2010 but the main point i am showing in this is that it is not athletes alone, but the common Joe as well can suffer from it
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Are you confusing me with someone else?
I’ve never said anything “rebutting” any of the statements you’ve made. I’m trying to add to your argument.
I’m saying “Yes – and look how much of a problem it appears to be to the NFL, as it is not only caused by concussive hits.”
If it’s appearing in older players, who predate the “bigger, faster” NFL, and in players who never had concussions, then the problem is very serious for the NFL and the sport of football in general.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on May 5, 2011 7:11 AM CDT up reply actions
I said it then and I'll say it again
It’s awfully easy to be a tough guy with someone else’s health.
"It's all in the game, yo"
Part of it
Part of it was because Cutler didn’t go into the locker room change into street clothes and come back to the sidelines.
HE was trying to get back in any way how or why.
The media also perpetuated the lies. Yes you can walk on that injury. But you can’t plant your foot which is kind of important for the QB position.
My personal favorte is people that say “I went to work with this and that”
I worked with a broken leg. But you know what? I am a computer operator. I don’t need my leg to type. But I wouldn’t be able to play pro sports.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 9:55 AM CDT up reply actions
they also forgot to mention that the staff pulled him, he didnt walk off
now the pouting on the sideline i hated, he should have been Caleb’s #1 cheer leader while on the sideline IMHO
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Caleb said Cutler was very supportive of him
Cutler just isn’t a cheerful kind of guy. He expresses himself in his own way.
by Pre on May 3, 2011 2:30 AM CDT up reply actions
When did Caleb Hanie say that?
"Easy on the words, brother,'' Quade said.
by RiskyBusiness on May 3, 2011 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions
There were articles after the NFC game
Caleb said Cutler was supportive on the sideline and was reviewing the playbook with him.
by Pre on May 3, 2011 9:51 PM CDT up reply actions
i will take your word, but i had not seen anything like that
glad to hear it though
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Said it on the radio too
Had Cutler been doing the Hot Dog Dance on the sidelines, that would have looked hideously phony.
Cutler is a surly dude. He also has an unfortunate jawline that makes him look pouty.
The backup QB said he helped. That should be good enough.
"It's all in the game, yo"
My bad
Mis-read by me. I threw a pick there.
"Easy on the words, brother,'' Quade said.
by RiskyBusiness on May 4, 2011 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions
He played the first series of the 2nd half after the injury.
Still looked better than Todd.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
was?
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 1, 2011 9:26 AM CDT up reply actions
Could you imagine...
if Cutler were black and all that criticism came his way? And the burning of the jerseys? There would have been a massive cry of racism.
But you've just made the case that Chicago
is an equal opportunity hater……….so race has nothing to do with it. Didn’t like Bradley/didn’t like Grossman……
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on May 1, 2011 8:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Even as a Packers fan,
I was upset about that. Having been an athlete (running and mountain climbing) since I was a small child, I know what it means to compete through pain. In my first successful marathon in 2005, I was just a month and a half removed from pulling my left calf muscle.
Cutler deserved better than that. Or had people in Chicago at that game forgotten he’d just taken the Bears to the NFC Championship game?
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
State high point count: 3/50
If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on May 1, 2011 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions
20,000 beers later
and losing to the hated Packers will bring that out of Bears fans. The media, combined with the idiot NFLers tweeting, and every half-assed blogger with an opinion blew the Cutler situation out of control.
Welcome to the new normal.
Kinda like the Roman Empire, but on steroids.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on May 1, 2011 8:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Ain't that the truth.
I was one of the few who said you couldn’t blame Jay Cutler for losing the game. I also was critical of all the trash-talking that took place before the game to begin with.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
State high point count: 3/50
If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on May 1, 2011 9:11 PM CDT up reply actions
You're a smart guy troutfishin
Grossman’s major stats in 2006 when the Bears went to the SB (Comp. %, TD’s, INT’s, QB Rating) were virtually identical to Eli Manning’s in 2007, the year the Giants won the SB. In fact they were identical except that Grossman had eight more incompletitions than did Eli. That’s the only difference in those four catagories. Manning also had more fumbles than Rex did.
After 2007 Eli signed one of the largest contracts in NFL history. After 2006 Grossman was endlessly ripped to shreds.
And again they both had almost identical stats. Go figure.
Thanks I appreciate that
I can tell the treatment of Grossman bothered you as much as it did me, here we finally have a quarterback and the media can’t look past the phrase “good rex, bad rex” it was a complete joke. Another stat that people forget was that he was 2nd in the amount of games with a passer rating over 100. IMHO, he was as big of a reason they got to the superbowl than anyone else on that team.
He won the game against the Seahawks and had a great game against the Saints to get to Miami and then we run him out of town.
by troutfishin on Apr 30, 2011 11:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Right
He was NFC offensive player of the month in September. He was a BIG reason they jumped out to a 5-0 start. Any team that starts out 5-0 has a great chance of making the playoffs.
Then came Arizona and his total meltdown. Still, half his 20 INT’s came in three games (Arizona, NE, and Minnesota) like you said when you stated that he had a ‘few’ bad games. You were right. It was a few for the most part.
The SB?
A). Devin Hester and a Grossman TD pass to Muhammad gave the Bears 14 first quarter points. No team has ever come back from 14 points to win a SB. Only Indy didn’t have to, because sandwiched between those two early Bear TD’s was the BLOWN coverage by Daniael Manning that left Reggie Wayne wide open for an easy score. You or I could’ve caught that ball if we were that open. Instead of Bears 14-0, it was Bears 14-6. HUGE difference.
B). The Bears defense gave up an average of 99 yards rushing during the regualar season. In the SB Indy ran for almost twice that (191). You deserve to lose when a team runs for almost 200 yards.
Talk to a majority of Bear fans and Grossman was horrible. Of course that sentiment bears lottle resemblance to the truth, but why should that stop ‘geniuses’ from shooting off their mouths.
By all accounts he was a hard worker and a good teammate. People ruined that kid.
Actually
If McNabb is traded he will start in Washington this season.
The most disgusting thing I actually ever witnessed is how he and his wife were treated at a Cubs game. They left. He was singing autographs for kids and being friendly but a group of braindead people started harassing him and his wife so they left.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions
kinda like Yankee fans getting on Cliff Lee's wife during the playoff series
then wondering why he would not sign there
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Another thing
People forget is that Rex had found somewhat of a rhythm and then the defense gave up 2 long drives to end the first half and start the second half.
I also have it on good authority the defensive players had his back and specifically URlacher and Briggs told Lovie they wanted to win so they wanted Rex to be the starter for the playoffs in 06.
Some boobs say Orton wouldn’t have lost the Super Bowl. They’re right actually we don’t get there with Orton or Griese. So we don’t lose it.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Good point
Good point about those INTs coming primarily in 3 games. IF they were more spread out it would be a different story.
IT’s kind of like when a closer has 3 blown saves in a week and people want him shot. If those 3 blown saves were over a month would people be reacting so much?
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 10:02 AM CDT up reply actions
Also
Also I should say while the Cubs coverage with one exception really stinks in this town my main problem with the media is the Bears coverage which makes the National Enquirer look like what the New York Times once was.
Grossman wasn’t a butt kisser. Orton was and Griese is the son of someone the sports media loves.
The media mourns the departure of their beloved Orton.
What other city would we wish for someone who has never played well past October 31st and never won a playoff game over someone who won 2 and won 1 in one case?
But he was “Grindy”
I always thought the Cubs should sign Orton. He only performs in September and October. Bad for football but good for baseball.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions
The Saints game
If you look at some of Rex’s performances there were games where he started off bad and he continued to be bad.
But there were other games when he was having trouble finding his rhythm and knowing the defense would keep them in the game played it safe until he found it.
The NFC title game was a great example. I was at the game.
IF he ever comes back here and beats us I wouldn’t blame him for flipping off the fans. He’d never do it but it would be justified.
And he’s a Cubs fan. Grew up one.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 9:45 AM CDT up reply actions
The other thing
Orton and Grossman’s stats were very close.
Except for one thing. Orton wins in September and OCtober. Grossman won twice in January.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Grossman also lost in January and February
and in the four post season games he has played he is averaging less than 200 yards passing so it isnt like he lit anything up compared to Orton who was robbed of the one time he should have been starting in 2005. There was one NFL post season game Orton should have started, in 2005, he was benched after playing 15 of 16 games in favor of a rusty returning Grossman, a move that still drives me nuts by Lovie Baker….er….Dusty Smith….er…Lovie Smith as does his unwillingness to run more in the SB vs Indy.
that said, I was never a fan of Grossman, but I felt bad for how he was treated, often worse than deserved and I acknowledged that. I also always felt Orton was the best back up in the NFL
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
QBing isn't just stats.
There are lots of reasons that Rex hasn’t been able to stick as a starter.
Also, he was hideously lucky in that SB run. Remember his TD pass to Berrian to beat NOR in the NFC Championship game? :)
Rex is a very, very inaccurate passer. There are at least 35 better QBs in the world than him right now – if there weren’t, he’d be starting. No one lets “perception” keep a better player buried on the depth chart.
In fact, this year WAS tried their best to get Rex some PT, and he managed to screw up again.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Part of it
Part of the other players reactions were due to flat out lies by the media. I almost wish Cutler would sue for malicious slander since it was done knowingly, purposely and maliciously.
That one shot on Fox where people said he was ignoring Hanie and listening to his IPOD? The media knew the truth but still continuously lied.
HE was listening to the coaches and was going to relay info to Hanie. By the way this is what you usually see the backup doing.
ANd the media also knew about how you can walk still on that knee injury and he was trying his best to get back in. But again they purposely and maliciously lied.
Orton would always get all of the credit when they won and none of the blame when they lost. Was the opposite for Grossman and Cutler.
But Orton was a butt kisser. Grossman and Cutler weren’t.
They were called rude to the media. They weren’t rude they just didn’t kiss their butts.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Elsewhere
Elsewhere in this topic people have brought up a valid worry about how this perception might hurt the Cubs in getting players. But I think in reality this happens in every city.
I wonder what kind of QB would ever come here. I have a bad feeling Cutler will play well for the next 2 years and then leave.
I’ve even heard some bozos say they want Hanie to start.
Actually I know some people in football that agree that Hanie should start. Management of the Vikings, Lions and Packers and all the other teams the Bears face.
Kind of like all the idiots saying they wish Orton had started the playoff games the Super Bowl year. The Saints and Seahawks wish so too.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions
I said that months ago about how it could hurt recruiting of a FA or getting a player to waive a NTC
but I also wonder how much it affects it when the city of brotherly love still has no problems
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
The primary thing keeping Rex from having a good NFL career is his lack of quarterbacking ability.
The primary thing holding Jay Cutler down is Osi Umenyiora after brutally sacking him 9 times in a row 2 steps into a 4 step drop.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
What worries me...
is that other hispanic/black players will have the same mindset Hunter expressed in his comments. I would hate to see free agents have even the slightest reluctance to play for the Cubs due to a negative fan stereotype that seems to be growing.
I hope security and the Cubs management is aware of this problem and will handle any offenders with very strict punishment.
I get to Wrigley about every other year and the last two times I have sat near fans hurling multiple slurs towards Soriano. The ironic thing was that last time this happened it was a group of hispanics yelling in Spanish at Soriano. It was so bad I told the usher/security guy, but he didn’t speak Spanish, so it didn’t really have any effect.
One time
One time I was at a game and some Cardinals fans were implying that Prior and Wood were very friendly so to speak.
I said “I know Mark and Kerry. I’ll gladly bring them to you after the game so you can say that to their faces.”
(note I really don’t know Mark and Kerry that well but it shut the idiots up).
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions
Man I'm glad we have regular bi-monthly discussions about racism on BCB.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Apr 30, 2011 11:34 PM CDT reply actions
Unfortunately, the world is filled with idiots
Fans, players, owners, and so on. It makes no difference. They come in all shapes & sizes.
Take current Atlanta Braves pitching coach and former big leaguer Roger McDowell.
After making derogatory and homophobic remarks, along with crude sexual gestures to several SF Giant fans in the stands at AT&T Park , he was told by a nearby father to stop because there were kids in the stands.
McDowell then made one of the stupidist statements in the history of planet Earth when he stated that “Kids don’t belong at a baseball park.”
Beyond his homophobic rantings & ravings while working as a paid employee of MLB he said this:
“Kids don’t belong at a baeball park.”
Congratulations Roger. It truly doesn’t get more idiotic than that.
What do you expect
from an ’86 Met? Possibly the biggest collection of jerks to win a World Series in the last 30 years.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 1, 2011 12:23 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
McDowell
The sad thing is he was one of the players we always had fun with when he was a visitor.
He took it from the fans and gave it back but not in a bad way.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't condone McDowell AT ALL but I sympathize with him saying "kids don't belong"
Going to a ballgame for me is similar to attending an R-rated movie. Kids can go with an adult and teens find their way in, but the environment is strictly adult stuff.
This occurred to me at a fairly early age, going to Tigers games with my family. Beer and cigarettes and foul language were all around – probably some tacit wagering too. The playground it wasn’t!
If you don't have kids
You lose your fan base. It’s that simple.
I’m taking the little one to the Cubs/Diamondbacks game today. She’ll probably be a baseball fan for life because of the games we’ve gone to.
Are some baseball players that stupid that they don’t understand that the kids of today are the fans who pay the bills (for their overinflated salaries) of tomorrow?
Saying “Kids don’t belong at a baseball game” again, may be one of the stupidist statements on Earth. And I’m pretty sure you won’t find one player, coach, owner or MLB executive that’ll publicly disagree.
by GeoMak on May 1, 2011 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
well said
if the ball park has become an R-rated environment, then the solution is not to ban kids, the solution is to ban the troublemakers.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 1, 2011 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions 6 recs
a billion times
a billion times rec’d
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions
rec;d as well
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
IT’s the fellow fans problem that they can’t express a thought without using the f word or the s word.
I’ve been to games where people can’t utter a sentence without the f word or the s word or such.
Foul language bothers me in general though especially when it’s for no reason.
It used to be when someone said the f word it was really a bad thing.
But nowadays people use it as often as they use the world Hello.
Nothing happens unless it's first a dream
by puckishcubsfan on May 1, 2011 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions
at the hockey games here i go to
my section of seating (keep in mind we have been grouped together for a decade between the Ice bats and now the stars) can all heckle and get on a player or ref without cursing, the worst you might here is “you suck” from one of us. we are creative and goofy with our lines. i wish more would follow that trend
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Every notice how in the old baseball photos from the '50s and '60s, people DRESSED UP to go to the ballgame?
Gives you an idea how far our society has fallen. No respect or self control anymore.
It's 106 miles to Chicago...
People dressed up to go everywhere, even to stay home!
Ever see Ward Cleaver not in a suit at the dinner table? June slept in her pearls!
I kid, but it’s true. I think people of the 30s/40s/50s/early 60s (if they were magically transported to today) would be horrified at what people now wear on a casual basis.
How would the “I’m with Stupid” T-Shirt be explained???
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on May 1, 2011 8:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Mrs Cleaver dressed up to vacuum for cryin out loud
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 2, 2011 8:00 AM CDT up reply actions
rec rec rec rec rec rec rec rec rec
and how many of us are fans (and possibly Cub fans) today because we went to games with our parents, uncles, aunts, grandparents and so on
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
derek
lee was certainly a class act. cub fans knew lee always gave it 100% and thats why he never caught the same flak as guys like sosa and bradley. i thought pena was the perfect replacement. same kind of guy but apparently neither can one can hit anymore.
still
i just ordered a lee jersey from wrigleyville sports at a very generous discount.i still think very highly of derek.
Love, love
love, all we need is love, do do do, all we need is love, that is all we love
Cubs 2011 92-70
I don't understand the hate mail thing
If I’m the Cubs, why would I let my highly paid athlete read hate mail? Assign a staffer to review all the fan mail out and alert security if they see a threat. And then have the staffer provide the player with his fan mail and notify him if there was som hate mail also.
I’m not trying to shelter the players. They hear it in the stands when they’re not doing well. But there is no need to make it worse if you can help it.
And who writes mail anyways?!
"Easy on the words, brother,'' Quade said.
I sent a letter to Roland Hemond
of the Diamondbacks. Google him he has had a lifetime in baseball. He is 82 years old and shares the same job title with Luis Gonzalez. To my surprise I received a response from him. He wrote me a full page BY HAND on DBack letterhead. It was a class move by I am sure a class guy.
I wrote him a letter although I typed it and mailed it.
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip
too funny
"Easy on the words, brother,'' Quade said.
by RiskyBusiness on May 2, 2011 10:59 PM CDT up reply actions
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