"The Make-Believe Manager"
by troutfishin on May 16, 2011 9:06 PM CDT
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PrintRegardless of the outcome of tonights games, Mike Quade has proven once again how truly inept he is at managing a Major League Baseball team. In the bottom of the sixth inning it took until after the 7th run had scored for Mark Riggins to come out of the dugout and talk to his pitcher.
I understand if Riggins isn't seeing anything in the pitchers delivery or doesn't have any information to share as far as how they want to attack the next AB, I understand if Riggins seems as useless as the pitching coach Daniel Stern played in the kids movie "Rookie of the Year". What I don't understand is why Quade didn't send his pitching coach out to talk with Z, if only to slow the game down.
From Quades constant lineup jockeying of Castro, his insistence on playing Koyie Hill, and his defense of his equally inept 3rd base coach Ivan DeJesus.
“But he’s an aggressive guy and wants to be aggressive. As long as he gives himself as much time as possible in making his decision and understanding the situation, he’ll be fine.”
No Mike he can't give himself enough time because he refuses to leave the 3rd base coaches box to give himself a better perspective of the play developing in front of him.
I wonder how long Quade can last as manager of this team by playing make-believe.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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He is a joke
and the team is once again a laughing stock.
I am a traveler of both time and space to be where I have been. Robert Plant 1975
I didn't get to see the game but
you go to the bottom of the 6th with a 4 run lead and if the tying run gets to the plate you need to go make a mound visit. There should be no questions or excuses wake you butt up and somebody walk the 100+ feet to the mound.
by Cubsfan Waveland on May 16, 2011 9:18 PM CDT reply actions
Especially when Z grimaced really badly after a pitch a couple of batters earlier
After that pitch, it was all downhill from Z. He seemed, if not hurt, to be in discomfort.
It's a simple question, Doctor: would you eat the moon if it were made of ribs??
by Invalid User on May 17, 2011 5:44 AM CDT up reply actions
that is on him as much as the manager and coaches
if Z knows he tweaked something, he is an adult and a professional, he can call time out and make it known himself. Other pitchers have done it before
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
Oh I see
It’s the managers fault the players couldnt get the job done? I love Big Z but he just lost his game tonight. Not Quade’s fault.
he did put the lineup together tonight,
on a side note: he seems to think like Hendry and Ricketts, which I’m thinking is why he got the job, so there’s that too.
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 16, 2011 9:36 PM CDT up reply actions
the above is a sarcastic comment
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 16, 2011 9:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Yea that's what I said. Good Job?
IMO the manager doesn’t make nearly as important of impact as some of you think. If Quade were managing the Rays, with their actual good players, he would be doing well.
The players need to get the job done. Quade is not losing these games.
Quade would be doing a good job with the Rays?
Your not serious are you. They lose Pena, Crawford, a closer who had 45 saves, they have Longoria hurt for 3 weeks and they have Sam Fuld starting in left and they lead the AL East.
Please, Please, don’t insult Joe Madden.
by Grockcubs on May 16, 2011 9:46 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
correct
At least Madden has had the balls to play Fuld everyday….
Soriano is useless again and has been for a week…TAKE HIM OUT
ARAM has no business batting 4th……TAKE HIM OUT
These are things a manager can do.
But our manager is excellent at watching starting pitchers implode!
The balls to play Fuld?
How’s that working out?
Colvin has been more useless and is a worse option than Soriano. Who bats fourth for A-Ram? Who plays third? Are you going to give him credit for sticking with Pena and then ask that he gives up on Ramirez?
My guess...
would be that it is just deep resentment for the large contracts. But that blame should not go to the players.
More Fuld revisionist history
had the balls to play Fuld everyday
Truth is
1. Manny Ramirez started the first 4 games of the season for the Ray at DH. He PH on April 6, then retired on April 7.
2. Johnny Damon was the starting LF. With Ramirez’s retirement, Damon became the DH.
3. Fuld becomes the starting LF.
So let’s stop shaping this as Fuld was option #1 in LF.
"Easy on the words, brother,'' Quade said.
by RiskyBusiness on May 17, 2011 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Ummmmm what?
You actually think these players would suddenly learn how to play if Maddon was the manager?
You’re kidding yourself.
why do you think that, seriously...how can a manager not have an impact
now I dont think one person can turn a totally loser team into a WS winner but I do think a manager can organise a team to play at a higher level than what we’ve seen so far
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 16, 2011 9:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Well I can see how their decisions can matter. Like the hit and run with Pena and Hill tonight. It was a good call......because it worked.
The point is, the players need to get the job done. When they don’t the manager is often thrown under the bus.
Correct...
…but Quade has misplayed some very fundemental decisions as well so far this year.
This is the first real pressure he has felt as a major league manager (last year was junk time) and I don’t know if that is impacting his decision making, or if he just isn’t real sharp.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
You can't be serious.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 10:57 PM CDT up reply actions
I can be and I am. Could u make better choices? Would they all work out?
Quade is not the problem with this team. They just suck.
He isn't the main problem...
…but that doesn’t mean he hasn’t made some fundementally poor decisions, which I believe he clearly has.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
No...
…it really isn’t.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
I disagree
Because good decisions don’t always work. So please tell me how you know you can make better choices. And that they would work out better.
Which decisions?
Not arguing abou tit, but lj has a point in that sometimes it’s not a right/wrong decision, it’s just a matter of opinion.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 16, 2011 11:12 PM CDT up reply actions
How about using Mateo in the 6th inning of a tie ballgame?
Or playing Jeff Baker in Right Field against a RHP.
Or giving Russell more than 3 starts?
There is no proof that making a different decision would result in better outcomes, but those a just about the worst choices off all the possible ones he could have made.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions
You just made my point.
There is no way to say if those are wrong decisions. The players Quade has just arent that good.
Well this is a very interesting debate tactic.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
It's obvious he doen't want to actually debate. He wins.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 11:23 PM CDT up reply actions
And he made you look like a fool in the process.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
What an incredible feat!
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 11:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Husker, er, lj-whatever
is a pretty skilled fellow.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
Oh dear God.
Don’t compare me to that guy. I like to have a real conversation.
Was I being rude here somewhere?
Because you seem to have something against me suddenly.
really you just made his point...
the players Quade is using in certain situations aren’t good.
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 16, 2011 11:23 PM CDT up reply actions
Considering what Quade knew...
…do you think those were intelligent baseball decisions?
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Well in that case...
if he puts Barney at 3rd base tomorrow and plays Soriano at 2nd and Reed Johnson in left it will be OK.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 11:24 PM CDT up reply actions
No, because there are better choices for those positions.
Were not exactly overloaded with backup outfielders that are actually good, or starters who could for certain be better than Russell.
You keep bringing up this idea of "certainty" as if you can only judge a decision...
if there were a rock solid guarantee that the other choice(s) would be better.
We can’t judge a single thing ANYONE does if we take your line of reasoning.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 11:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Well.....
How can you be so certain Quade is a bad manager? IMO he could make the same choices while managing the Rays and they would still be as good as they are.
I don't know what your idea of a bad/good manager is...
but you obviously don’t have a problem with the way Mike Quade has used the players on the roster so far this year.
Several others here, like me, don’t see it that way and are becoming convinced that he’s not very good at managing a baseball team. Both what he’s said and what he’s done have played a role in the opinion I’ve formed of him. He’s got about 3/4ths of a season left to change my mind though.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 11:47 PM CDT up reply actions
That's fair.
I disagree with all of it. But that’s the point of a blog i suppose lol.
So Quade listing DeWitt as starting in LF isn't a bad decision?
You’ve lost me here.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
State high point count: 3/50
If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on May 17, 2011 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions
In the games I have watched...
…starting Russell for as long as he did, leaving Dempster in too long (I believe he threw almost 120 pitches in one early game), using Mateo and not using mound visits properly when the other team has you on the run.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
how you can assure us he is doing fine?
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 17, 2011 7:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Even though...
the Cubs finished 24-13 under Quades watch last year, he continued to trot out Koyie Hill game, after game, after game……
I agree, people wonder how an NBA coach can...
…have an impact on a bunch of overpaid players and I tell them to look at the Bulls.
Basketball coaches have a way bigger impact than baseball managers.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
I agree to an extent but that does not mean...
…mlb managers don’t have an impact. Quade appears to be passive, so does his team. Sometimes a team can take on the nature of its manager.
So then what's the difference between this year and when Quade was the interim manager?
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
I don't know what that was the product of
Was it that the product of Lou’s departure? Was it the product of a sense of urgency on certain players parts because of a regime change? Was it because Quade was a great manager? I don’t know but I do know that the pressure of beginning a full season in a major market isn’t wearing well on Quade.
by troutfishin on May 16, 2011 10:06 PM CDT up reply actions
it was said here that teams usually
do better for awhile after a manager change….Quade really was a surprise choice for an owner and GM that was FINALLY gonna change things around for this organization.
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 16, 2011 10:06 PM CDT up reply actions
It was a small market, small minded...
…approach when they hired Quade, definitely not what I wanted or expected.
by troutfishin on May 16, 2011 10:08 PM CDT up reply actions
totally agree
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 16, 2011 10:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Who was your choice?
Please don’t say Sandberg.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 16, 2011 10:30 PM CDT up reply actions
What are the acceptable choices?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 10:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Why not?
Sandberg would not have been my first choice but Quade is an admitted non-believer in sabermetrics, I believe Sandberg is the same way. Sabermetrics or not it’s clear to me that Quade has no business managing a professional baseball team.
by troutfishin on May 16, 2011 10:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Anyone who is a Hendry guy...
…will not be a believer in Sabermetrics, that has been well established.
I’m not saying Sabermetrics is the end all be all (because I don’t think it is), but I do think you need someone that balances the data, with their instinct.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Well, then, this discussion ends
Hopeless. Utterly hopeless.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 16, 2011 10:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Afraid of a little math and science mixed with baseball?
by troutfishin on May 16, 2011 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions
See my post just below
Sabermatricians can bleed baseball dry, but there is a use for what they offer.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 16, 2011 10:45 PM CDT up reply actions
why not yes to Sandberg
I hear all the time that the future of this team right now is in our farm system, doesnt Sandberg know those players better than anyone…maybe he should have been even a short term manager instead of Quade who seems to mostly know the veterans. I think Sandberg would have played them more and that’s why he wasn’t hired. Why did they hire Q? Ricketts just bought a $850M franchise, wouldn’t you want all-stars running the show?
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 17, 2011 12:23 AM CDT up reply actions
"Why did they hire Q?"
That is the million dollar question. There was zero evidence that he had any kind of ability to effectively manage a big league club full time.
I am a traveler of both time and space to be where I have been. Robert Plant 1975
Million dollar question? Well, yes.
Literally. It would have cost the Cubs millions more to sign Sandberg. Hence the decision.
There are 108 beads in a Catholic rosary and there are 108 stitches in a baseball. Who says baseball isn't a religion?
right, so now we have Gilligan and Skipper at the helm
of an $850M ship….
:(
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 17, 2011 8:09 AM CDT up reply actions
its been said and i believe it
that Q was the fall guy. Hendry let Q realize his dream of managing in the big leagues. He didnt Tarnish Sandbergs legacy in Chicago, he put a finger in the dam until all of the bad money comes off the books and they can reset. The problem with the way they handled it was they tried to pass this off as a contending team, a team that we could get behind and root for, like we were idiots. I’m not buying it.
"There had to be a place where the game could be fun again….that place is called Wrigley Field"---Andre Dawson
One thing you learned as a Cubs fan: when you bought your ticket, you could bank on seeing the bottom of the ninth. Joe Garagiola
I could not agree more.
I think they still want Sandberg (ugh) for when this team is ready to contend again. I like Quade, but he was put in an impossible situation.
I hope he sticks around and joins the next managers staff though. He’s a good coach.
If they want Sandberg
for when this team is ready to contend, then the front office really is nuts.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 17, 2011 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions
Wouldn't be my first choice..
But like I’ve said, I don’t think it matters. If the players are good they’ll win.
I agree...
…and frankly, this front office doesn’t think that far in advance.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
That really doesn't make sense
If Sandberg’s the guy, he’s the guy. They go young and wait for the contracts to expire. Why waste a year, and $10 M on Pena? Let the “guy” learn the young players.
Now Sandberg is in someone else’s organization and the Cubs would need permission to talk to him.
Plus, not too many GM’s get to hire FOUR managers.
No offense, epsilon, but this sounds like tin foil hat stuff.
by Shanghai Badger on May 17, 2011 7:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Pena
was given a contract because we don’t have a “young guy” that can play first base. Besides, you throw out a roster of no-names and you are going to lose a TON of money on ticket sales and jerseys. The idea was to put enough out their that if everything went perfectly we could be fringe contenders this year, while still building for the future.
by thebluecrew1908 on May 18, 2011 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Why would it have cost them millions?
Was he gonna leverage his offer from Lehigh Valley to get a big fat paycheck?
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
Hiring Sandberg
really would have been a sign that all Ricketts cares about is money.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 17, 2011 1:29 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh man...and what do you call...
his request for $200 million dollars from the state, the rain-out ticket policy, the new (foolish) ticket pricing tiers and his comments about how he hates when he hears people say they can’t afford tickets to come watch his crappy baseball team? What are those signs of?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 17, 2011 1:54 AM CDT up reply actions 6 recs
dingdingding
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
State high point count: 3/50
If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on May 17, 2011 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions
I thought I remember people saying Quade did use some form of sabermetrics
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
I thought he had, too
I"m with MPH. They aren’t the Alpha and Omega, but they can be useful in combination with other things.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 16, 2011 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Joe Maddon utilizes sabermetrics quite a bit...
…I’m not sayin… I’m just sayin.
by troutfishin on May 16, 2011 10:49 PM CDT up reply actions
I suspect even if Joe weren't a SABR-head,
he’d still be a pretty good manager. You could tell that years ago in Peoria, not to mention his long apprenticeship in LA.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 16, 2011 10:55 PM CDT up reply actions
If you're referring to a metric on how to misuse...
…a bullpen, you might be right.
by troutfishin on May 16, 2011 10:46 PM CDT up reply actions
or how to ignore the complete ineffectiveness of a pitcher in certain situations.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 10:47 PM CDT up reply actions
IMO...
…The relationship and quality of the pitching coach and manager probably has the most influence on the game from a coaching perspective.
A manager needs to drive the bus here by having a good feel for the game and the pitching coach has to be adept at recognizing when the lug nuts may be loosening on a guy before they come completely off.
This is a reason I think LaRussa has had so much success. He has an exceptional pitching coach in Duncan and those guys seem to compliment each others thoughts very well.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
its the walmart brand of Sabermetrics
its kinda the same, taste’s a little different as doesnt work as well…
"There had to be a place where the game could be fun again….that place is called Wrigley Field"---Andre Dawson
One thing you learned as a Cubs fan: when you bought your ticket, you could bank on seeing the bottom of the ninth. Joe Garagiola
Exactly!!!
At this stage in the Ricketts regime, it’s more important to sell the “Wrigley Experience” than to put a winning product on the field and in the dugout. 3 dollar beers and bison burgers don’t win baseball games. This is not a freaking carnival, it’s major league baseball.
No, for the most part, very few NBA coaches matter.
Its the few that get their team to buy into: to quote Bill Simmons “The Secret,” like Phil Jackson, Red Aureobach, Jack Ramsay, Jerry Sloan, Chuck Daly, Gregg Popovich, and possibly Tom Thibodeaux that ultimately matter in the NBA.
Most coaches in the NBA just let the players play.
"You've got to get your damn shirts rolled up and go out and kick somebody's ass. That's what you've got to do. Period." -- Lou Piniella
and so do the officials....
which is why I can’t watch NBA basketball anymore.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 17, 2011 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions
FWIW,
there is an amazing amount of young talent and potential superstars in the NBA right now and games are quite entertaining, at least to me. If the Bulls and the Thunder, which just sounds weird, make the Finals, we could potentially see the first of many battles between two young stars in Durant and Rose, who are both 22.
"You've got to get your damn shirts rolled up and go out and kick somebody's ass. That's what you've got to do. Period." -- Lou Piniella
By "amazing young talent" do you mean they can do super cool awsome dunks?
Or that they can pass/rebound/shoot the basketball really really good?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 17, 2011 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't buy that.
1. Colvin has not started a game since April 28th. How many times must we see Soriano strikeout with the bases loaded. Do I want to start Colvin 6 games a week, No. However at least one start a week would not hurt.
2. Is there any defense of Koyie Hill anymore?
3. Tonight’s game. Soriano getting thrown out at home by 17 feet, when his run means Nothing I mean NOTHING. Instead of 1st and 3rd and nobody out with the tying run coming to the plate, Cubs have a runner at second and one out.
4. The constant screwing around with the lineup. I mean the rainout game on Sunday having Dewitt hitting 5th and Pena ( who has been hot) hitting 7th?
5. And as mentioned why Quade doesn’t communicate with Riggens to go talk to a starter when struggling is beyond me.
Sure players have to preform, however managers and coaches need to put players in position to preform well.
1. Colvin sucks, Soriano is much better and should be playing.
2. Koyie Hill sucks, but so does Welington.
3. Not on Quade.
4. Lineup construction is way overblown. These guys need to hit, it’s that simple. You would be complaining if Quade left the same lineup out there after a bad game too right?
5. Other than slowing the pace of the game, I can’t see a real reason why a ound visit isso damn important.
I take the first one back.
Colvin and Soriano both flail at shitty pitches, but Soriano is still playing better right now. So he should be playing.
This is a rookie who hit 20 Homeruns and you say he sucks.
68 At bats, that is it. Your way over your head here buddy
He has a horrible approach at the plate.
He doesn’t walk, he can’t hit a breaking ball, and he’s having trouble with a simple fastball. Soriano is better right now.
I could go up and swing at balls in the LH batters box and strikeout with runners on 3rd base....
At least Reed usually puts the ball in play.
If you take out the one hot streak of solo HR, Soriano hasnt done crap…
and if you take our loses and give them to the Cardinals
and give us all their wins, people will still bitch and moan on BCB about Hendry/Quade/Ricketts/Tickets/Fuld/Murton/Hill/Soriano/Lilly/Gas Prices/Hemorrhoids and so on
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
by Cubbie-Tim on May 17, 2011 5:32 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yea Colvin should be the starter right?
If you just give him 20 more hits he’d be hitting over .400
Clearly he’s better. lol
Judging Colvin on his limited AB's this year...
…is as smart as declaring that Wellington Castillo sucks because he didn’t get a hit in his only 4 ab’s.
by troutfishin on May 17, 2011 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Colvin is being judged on hiw whole career so far....
Which hasn’t exactly given anyone with a brain hope that he can be more than a 4th outfielder on a good team. Same with Castillo, I think he sucks because he couldn’t manage to hit .250 in AAA.
what? you must be joking...
you mean a 245 BA 315 OBP and 408 SLG isnt impressive?
/sarcasm….except the stats which are true and sad for our “second coming” especially when there is a post about trading Soto to make room for Beef
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
If you take away all of the strikeouts,
Pena is probably hitting about .500.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
State high point count: 3/50
If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on May 17, 2011 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions
Johnson could get you a clutch hit...
while Soriano will give you many solo homers. No matter where they put Soriano in the batting order, his big hits come when the bases are empty.
Are you kidding me? Do you EVER even look at players splits?
Soriano is batting .359 with the bases empty and .178 with men on base.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 17, 2011 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions
Are you kidding me? Do you EVER even realize that it's a small sample size?
I’ll take the previous 10 years of his career versus a month a half to form a judgment.
Soriano’s at a career low baserunners scored %. As is Albert Pujols.
career splits...
RISP – BA .252 SLG .463
bases empty – BA .281 SLG .523
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 18, 2011 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions
Touche...to a point.
I went with his RBI percentage with runners on base, which is 11% last year (compared to 16% last year). Pujols, by comparison, is at 13% (vs 19%). I thought it was a better indicator, but perhaps not. Still, his splits are dramatically worse this season vs his career, if that was your point.
Yeah, sit Soriano and his selfish home runs on the bench.
Those aren’t useful at all.
if Soriano has the most RBI's that's telling me how bad the rest of the team is.
here’s what I think about Sori…I dont think he can use his legs anymore…the guy is hurting, he isn’t lazy, his knees are done. He has to hit HR’s cuz he cant run the bases. The cruelest thing would be not to eat his contract and trade him to be a DH.
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 17, 2011 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I would be all for trading him if they could.
He belongs in the AL for one, and I would also like to see him get a chance to actually win. Same as Ramirez.
Keep this in mind...
…with Colvin, Castro and with Barney; major league scouting reports take time to catch up with a players weakness, which is why you don’t get overly excited when someone has success in the early going of their career.
Everyone will go through an adjustment phase and some guys adjust better than others.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
The players that can adjust to what the league does to them...
are known as “Major League Baseball Players”. They sometimes have to make these adjustments from month to month and series to series. This is the biggest distinct difference between the minor and major league player.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 10:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Precisely my point...
…and when you have a rookie, it takes the league a while to figure out the guys soft spots. With a veteran, the scouting reports are well established, but they are a work in progress with guys until they have been around for a while.
There are countless examples of this; look at Corey Patterson and Gorden Beckem. Derrek Lee was a good example of a veteran who made a change in his stance prior to the 05 season. Lee opened up his stance a tad and moved an inch or two off the plate (the book on him was to bust him inside because he has long arms). For the 1st half of 05, he started crushing the pitches from the middle half in and it took the league 3/4 of the season to adjust back, and he started to cool down dramatically and never had that type of run again.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
They both suck at hitting same-sided pitching.
Soriano is destroying left-handed pitching. He’s hitting .238/.257/.515 against righties. The power is there, but not the consistency.
Moreover, he is old and breaking down before our eyes.
Colvin should get the occasional start in LF against RHP, and the occasional start over Dome against LHP.
The fact that neither instance occurred – really, ever, is an indictment of Quade.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
When a team's margin of error is so small
like the Cubs, little thing really do make a difference. Sending the runner in a questionable situation, leaving a pitcher in too long, lineup construction, choosing the wrong time to steal a base or hit and run, etc…… can add up over the course of a season.
I know there’s no really good studies on the effect of a manager on a team’s W/L record, but I’d venture to say that a manager and his staff can have an impact on probably 7-8 games per year……….
I'd like to see a link to any article that says a baseball manager is only worth 1-2 wins
and I would love to see their analytic methods.
The only really good methods would be extremely cumbersome, you’d have to look at every play of every game for every manager of every MLB team for as many years as possible. And then you would have to decide how to look operationally define a managerial staff’s importance and then determine if it was reliable and valid.
There are a number of different metrics to base the success...
…of a manager, one being the plus side of the pythagorean winning percentage, I’m just saying I find it extremely hard to believe that a good manager would only be worth 1-2 wins.
by troutfishin on May 16, 2011 10:38 PM CDT up reply actions
It may be even less than that.
In the essential 2006 book Baseball Between the Numbers, analyst James Click tried to tease some signs of managerial impact out of the statistical record but came up empty. After examining the measurable impact of in-game strategies (bunting, stolen bases, intentional walks), wins and losses relative to run differential, playing time distribution, in-game substitutions (pinch-hitters, relief pitchers, and defensive replacements), and direct impact on player performance (coaching), Click was unable to find evidence of a repeatable skill in any one of those five areas for any of the 456 managers he studied. That is to say that, much like clutch hitting, individual performances varied so much from season to season that the results appeared to be as much the result of chance as anything else.
From here
I liked this anecdote especially:
It’s interesting to note, however, that Click’s 2006 study did make one relatively firm conclusion regarding the impact of certain in-game decisions. “Only six times in thirty-three years has any manager used sacrifice attempts, stolen base attempts, and intentional walks to increase his team’s win expectation over an entire season. Even the best managers cost their team more than a game per season by employing these tactics. At worst they can cost a team three games per season.” Over multiple seasons, no manager employed those tactics for a positive effect.
I've searched and searched and there really hasn't been a single good study on
the influence a manager can have on a team’s performance, it’s really too difficult since there are so many factors under the control of a manager.
If a team is in 40+ 1 run games per year, just 1 decision a manager makes (e.g., sending a runner home from 3rd in a close game, letting Demp pitch to the middle of the lineup in the 7th inning when he’s over 110 pitches) can be the difference in a win versus a loss.
Since we are never able to see what would have happened if the manager didn’t make the same decision, there is really no way to determine how a manager adds or subtracts from a team’s win total. But given the fact that they control every aspect of the team’s strategy, it would seem that a manager could be an important factor in several games per year, but we’ll just never know………
True, I don't know.
So until I am shown otherwise, It seems obvious to expect the players to do what they are told. And not blame the manager when they don’t.
But what if the manager or his staff tell the player to do the wrong thing?
these are the situations I’m talking about, these are situations where the player’s performance can’t be questioned, but the decision to have the player execute the play was made by the manager or his staff.
A good analogy would be Mike Martz deciding to go with Collins over Hanie to replace Cutler in the NFC championship game. Collins was worthless and the whole 3rd quarter was lost. Who knows what would have happened if Hanie entered the game in the 3rd over Collins, but Hanie was pretty good.
It was a stupid coaching decision and Martz admitted it as well. That 1 decision was a big reason why the Bears lost that day and it wasn’t the player’s fault.
Well good decisions cannot work out and look horrible also, it doesn't make them bad decisions.
I think alotof Quade’s haven’t worked out because the players aren’t too good.
I guess what I'm saying is that, sure a manager can't win a team many games based on his decisions
since it’s the players that hit, field, run, and pitch.
But a manager’s decisions sure can cost a team some wins, at least that’s the way I see it until there is some really solid study that suggests otherwise…..
I'm sorry but you're suggesting that Wellington sucks...
…based on 4 at bats. Wow, tough critic.
by troutfishin on May 16, 2011 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Not really.
That judgment would be based on the fact that he’s been struggling in the minors. He should still play more than Hill, but he hasn’t exactly shown much in the minors.
Thats all I was saying.
I’m not excited about either of them.
"Lineup construction is way overblown"
Your joking right. Its simple math and it is extremely important.
I am a traveler of both time and space to be where I have been. Robert Plant 1975
Quade cannot win no matter how he sets the lineup.
The moment it doesn’t work people demand it gets changed. Then if he doesn’t change it, he’s labeled as a guy who is asleep at the wheel. It’s odd.
This is an awfully simplistic view
Tango indicates that an optimized lineup might not be worth that much (maybe 5-10 runs per season), but for some teams, a simulated optimization of their lineup can result in a 3-4 win improvement, over the team’s typical everyday lineup. In an ideal world, the optimized lineup would change from pitcher to pitcher.
But it seems like you are missing the take home message of lineup optimization, that is, to get your best hitters the most ABs over the course of the season. That’s why the 1-5 order in a lineup are important, the 6-9 spots, not so much.
Most teams play a lot of 1 run games every year, 5-10 runs could be the difference between making the playoffs or being home in October having missed the playoffs by 1-2 games.
The bottom line is that the managerial staff should do everything in their power to put the players in the best positions so the team can win the most games. Lineup construction is a small, but still important part of a team’s success.
And if you think about it, if lineup construction didn’t matter that much as you suggest, then why not just bat Koyie Hill leadoff and bat Castro 8th every game? Intuitively we all know that if Koyie Hill were leading off, he’d be getting around 700 ABs a season and Castro in the 8th spot would get significantly less and that would be completely stupid. So lineup construction is important in that you want your best hitters at the top of the lineup where they get more chances to hit the ball and score runs, which helps a team win more games. All good things……
Which is how Quade is putting them in the lineup.
Other than Soto at the bottom for whatever reason, the lineup’s haven’t been bad.
A statistical analysis showed that for a MLB team
an optimal lineup has the best hitter 4th, 2nd best hitter 1st and 3rd best hitter 3rd. How many times do you see the Cubs meet that criteria?
I am a traveler of both time and space to be where I have been. Robert Plant 1975
With as streaky as these guys are.
It’s pretty difficult to determine who’s who on a regular basis. But basically everyone is hitting about were they should be. Quade also shuffles the lineup quite a bit. He can’t win either way.
The lineups that Quade throws out there are not optimized
part of it is his own fault and part of it is just the construction of the team, too many 5-8 hitters and not enough top of the lineup hitters
I'm not missing anything.
Lineup construction is indeed overblown. 5-10 runs per season is not that big of a deal for a non-contending team.
Sure, one could leadoff Hill, but that’s a drastic hyperbole of my statement that the batting order is “not EXTREMELY important.” And I don’t see Quade doing that, so what’s the point in that statement?
I think that the lineup construction is way overblown for this team because our players are simply not that good. As you said in another post, our lineup is not constructed all that well from a player standpoint.
I think it’s being overly critical of Quade to get all torn up about our batting order. I won’t defend some other things Quade has done, but I don’t have that much of a problem with his lineup construction. I think moving Castro around in the order is a decent idea to see where he fits into the future.
So now your qualifing your previous statement?
I think that the lineup construction is way overblown for this team because our players are simply not that good.
You had previously made a general statement that “lineup construction is not extremely important” and now you’ve qualified it with “for this team.” So which is it? Lineup construction is always not extremely important or it is important, but just not for the Cubs and other bad teams.
I just want to be sure I’m following your logic here. Either way it doesn’t make sense to me. Lineup construction is important for ALL teams and 5-10 runs can be the difference between wining and losing anywhere from 1-5 games and can be the difference between going to the playoffs or staying home.
I would think that it would be more important for fringe contenders and bad teams over good teams to optimize their lineups so as to squeeze as many potential wins as possible.
I don’t disagree with you that even an optimized Cubs lineup wouldn’t be very good, but I can’t see a lot of harm in trying it since nothing Quade does has seemed to work
I'm not qualifying my statement.
I think it’s easy enough to comprehend that lineup construction is not extremely important.
Personally, I don’t feel that Quade’s lineup has been that bad; thus, I find it ‘overblown’ to chastise this facet of his job. At what point do sample sizes justify change? A few people screamed at Pena batting in the middle of the order, only to have him turn around to expected production. We have our historically best player at the 3 or 4 every game, our best young player alternating spots in the top third (notwithstanding his one or two games at 6, I believe), Pena in the 4/5/6 spot, and Soriano in the bottom third. The only misuse I can see is using the old-fashioned logic by batting Soto so low in the lineup.
Maybe I really wasn’t clear with my point, but I would be interested to see (no sarcasm here) what your criticism of his lineup is and what you suggest the optimal lineup would be.
Furthermore, I don’t see us as a fringe contender, where a game or two will matter in the long run. But I suppose that’s me being overly pessimistic.
There's alot not to like about the way Quade has constructed lineups
We’ve had at least 30 different lineups this season. My problems with the lineup are many. Castro should always be leading off and NEVER hitting in the 3 hole (at least not until he develops some decent HR power), the #3 hole is a power spot, for that matter Byrd is probably the worst 3 hole hitter of all time and shouldn’t be hitting there either, but this team doesn’t really have an ideal 3 hole hitter, Geo would be my choice to bat 3rd because he’s got a good mix of plate discipline/power to be effective in this spot, especially when protected by an excellent 4 hitter (i.e., the best hitter on the team with power – which ARam has traditionally been). So far, Barney is an ideal #2 hitter (a bat-control guy). I like Pena batting 5th, which is the spot for your wannabe cleanup hitter (next most important spot after 1, 2, 4. And you mentioned Soto already, but Quade/Lou should be arrested for this decision (sarcasm), utterly stupid. #6-9 should be your next best hitters in descending order from best – worst.
My base lineup (quasi-optimized) would be:
1. Castro (speed and contact, more important than OBP (i.e., Fuke) and he’s been a monster leading off).
2. Barney (bat control hitter, get the leadoff guy over)
3. Geo (solid average/power, plate discipline, won’t kill you with subpar-2011 style production)
4. ARam (traditionally our #4 hitter, not so far in 2011)
5. Pena (your wanna-be cleanup hitter)
6. Byrd (should never bat 3rd, I’d have Fuke here, but wanted to split up the 2 lefties)
7. Fuke (love his OBP, but he doesn’t have the speed for leadoff to go from 1st to 3rd on a well-placed single when not in a hit and run situation that’s why I have him here)
8. Soriano (the only thing Fonzie brings is power, he has a sub .300 OBP, K’s a ton, and has bad legs, so he should be batting 8th, not Soto, he’s got Fuke in front of him so plenty of RBI opportunities with Fuke’s high OBP).
9. Pitcher
I’d have Baker play the utility role where he’d sub or platoon at 3B, 1B, 2B, RF, & LF. I like this lineup a whole lot more than the one Quade throws out there on a regular basis, while it’s not completely optimized, it’s as close as we’ll get, IMHO.
I would love to see what this lineup could do if Quade used it consistently for 2 months. I see a lot more run production than I am seeing right now, especially with Geo likely getting better over the rest of the season due to regression to the mean.
http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2009/3/17/795946/optimizing-your-lineup-by
Yes it is
Lineup construction is one of the most important job functions of a manager. And yes it is simple math. Your best hitters should be in the spots that give them the most PA’s. It really is that simple.
I am a traveler of both time and space to be where I have been. Robert Plant 1975
Ever watched a basketball game...
…when a team goes on an 8-0 run? What does the coach usually do, he calls a timeout to gather the troups and to try and break the other teams momentum.
You have seen this same thing in baseball for over 100 years. When a pitcher is struggling and the opposing team has him on the ropes, you go out and talk and try to break the other teams mojo.
This is especially true when you are trying to protect a lead, as you want to do whatever is possible to break things up.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
I still don't buy this concept
…in baseball anyways. I’ve seen first pitch homers following mound visits too many times to think that they really do much to disrupt hitters rhythm. That just seems to be the 2011 motto around here: “We want more mound visits”
by thebluecrew1908 on May 16, 2011 10:39 PM CDT up reply actions
I disagree...
…when I played ball, I wanted to get in the box as quickly as possible after 2 or 3 hits in front of me. This is especially true when you are playing catch up, because you are starting to feel life and it energizes your thought process.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
I understand
and I think it just varies from person to person. Maybe good for some and bad for others. As I’ve brought up once before, one of my better friends is a pitcher at the collegiate level. He always told me personally he didn’t like mound visit, it just got him out of sorts I guess. He always said something like if they are coming out to talk to me, they better have some change in strategy planned or something, not just coming out to talk. otherwise, you’re just pulling my focus away, and being relaxed isn’t always good as a pitcher.
by thebluecrew1908 on May 16, 2011 10:56 PM CDT up reply actions
And allowing 5 straight batters to reach base...
really helps keep a pitcher focused?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Agree...
…when you have a chance to slow up a game when a team has you on your heels, you take it.
When Greg Maddux pitched, he would play all kinds of mind games to try and break up the mojo. He would ask for another baseball, throw to the bases a bunch of times, go for the rosin bag etc.. When he was going well, he would get the ball back and waste no time throwing his next pitch.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
I've seen this done to the Cubs enough to know that it kills our momentum
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 16, 2011 11:10 PM CDT up reply actions
This
is what happened in game 6 in 2003. If Dusty would have gotten up off of his lazy ass after the error by Gonzlez, or when the marlins tied the game, or ANY point in between, gotten the infield together, told them to calm the hell down and refocus, there may have been a big parade in mid october. This is baseball 101 stuff. But maybe not for a guy who spent 19 years in the minors.
Trade me right f@#$ing now!
And walking out there
and saying “pitch better!” is going to save the game?
by thebluecrew1908 on May 17, 2011 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, that's exactly what the pitching coach does....good lord.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 17, 2011 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
False
Pitching coaches do many, MANY other things for the team, such as working with pitchers’ mechanics, reviewing scouting reports with the pitchers, help them develop their pitches, and developing a game plan for each opposing batter and different situation the pitcher may face. Pitching coaches are responsible for all of this, and it is all far more important than making mound visits.
by thebluecrew1908 on May 17, 2011 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions
that was sarcasm
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 17, 2011 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Ahhh
I should’ve guessed. Disregard my ranting then. I’m just tired of hearing that not having mound visits is costing us games when in reality it’s just poor play and lack of situational hitting.
by thebluecrew1908 on May 17, 2011 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions
"he seems to think like Hendry and Ricketts"
I gotta tell ya, that’s not much of an endorsement. lol
wasn't supposed to be....lol
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 16, 2011 9:41 PM CDT up reply actions
See my recap.
That issue isn’t what bothered me. It was the choice of Mateo to come into the game in the first place, a man who is simply not a major league pitcher.
Check out Chicago sports coverage at SB Nation Chicago
"a man who is simply not a major league pitcher"
I agree and my contention is that Quade is not a major league manager.
19 years in the minors
supports your theory.
Trade me right f@#$ing now!
I agree Al.
The situation called for Shark to come in for an inning or two. He’s been pitching well, and the game was still in hand. Every time Mateo enters a game, I cringe.
You also love "The View" and Chamomile Tea...
your turn-offs are overcooked vegetables and NASCAR.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 16, 2011 10:23 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think I was one of the first to support Q for the job
but so far I agree with SWL, QIAFI. No, the team isn’t very good. But he hasn’t really done anything to impress, either. It’s amazing, granted it was September in a meaningless season, but he seemed to have the golden touch last year. I was expecting a lot more.
The sun is up. They sky is blue. It's beautiful, and so are you. Dear Prudence, won't you come out to play? ~Lennon & McCartney
by SouthWabashSoul on May 16, 2011 9:57 PM CDT reply actions
Thats whats funny to me.
The Cubs were pretty much the same team with Lou as with Quade last year. They just got kind of lucky with the wins when Quade took over. I honestly think the manager doesn’t matter too much.
I think he matters, just not to the extent that some here think.
I agree with your post
But I still think Quade has more than proven that he is not a very good manager. Would the Cubs be much better with Larussa, Maddon, Sandberg or anybody else, probably not, but Quade is doing things on almost a daily basis that make it even more difficult for the Cubs to win.
I am a traveler of both time and space to be where I have been. Robert Plant 1975
I had this conversation with a buddy of mine last year
He was making your argument, that the manager didn’t matter that much. My best case against that is that you can break baseball down into two elements: talent and strategy. Obviously talent and performance is going to win 95% of the time. But all the strategy runs through the managers brain. As the old cliche goes, baseball is a game of inches and at the major league level where parity of talent rules, all the little strategy stuff wins games. Player positioning, knowing the outs situation on the bases, anticipating the other managers use of his bench or bullpen, etc. When I heard that Q wrote line-up cards for entire series I was in love. I thought, "here is a guy who will be a strategic manager. He’ll be playing chess when all the other managers are playing checkers. He’ll get Sori to move a runner up, for chrissake.
None of that has happened, and I think the other posters are right to point out that some of his moves have not only seemed ridiculous at the time, but became obviously so because the result was so predictable. Everybody here knew Mateo was going to give up 3 runs, how the hell come Q didn’t?
The sun is up. They sky is blue. It's beautiful, and so are you. Dear Prudence, won't you come out to play? ~Lennon & McCartney
by SouthWabashSoul on May 17, 2011 1:01 AM CDT up reply actions
Wait what???
The pitching change was made when the game was 4-4, so how are you telling me nobody made a walk to the mound until the 7th run scored? After that, any trip to the mound would have had to result in a pitching change, correct?
So what exactly was the problem you wanted Quade to wave his magic wand at, Z melting down? Mateo being very hittable? He can’t make those problems go away. The main issue was (as Al stated) the decision to go with Mateo in a tight situation.
Bottom line is, the Cubs had plenty of chances to get more runs but failed, Z melted down, and Mateo showed again that he can’t get it done. These are all fine reasons why we lost tonight. But hey, if you’d rather lay this at the feet of the pitching coach, be my guest, I simply don’t agree
by thebluecrew1908 on May 16, 2011 10:34 PM CDT reply actions
Are you telling me that Riggins couldn't go out to the mound...
…to get a feel for how Z was feeling during the hit parade or to just slow the game down a little?
by troutfishin on May 16, 2011 10:41 PM CDT up reply actions
He could have
but I do not in any way blame him for not. They pulled him when the game was tied, they didn’t wait til after the 7th run scored as you stated in the OP
by thebluecrew1908 on May 16, 2011 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions
That visit to the mound was to remove Z from the game.
The damage was already done and the hit parade continued with Mateo, it wasn’t until the 7th run had crossed the plate where a pitcher was verbally addressed by a coach.
Considering how bad the Cubs have pitched this year
maybe part of Quade’s strategy is to keep Riggins away from the pitchers as much as possible.
I am a traveler of both time and space to be where I have been. Robert Plant 1975
Look, what do you what him to do?
(Hey, it worked for Lou…)
Oh wait. No it didn’t.
Nevermind.
There are 108 beads in a Catholic rosary and there are 108 stitches in a baseball. Who says baseball isn't a religion?
Well that goodness Z understands.
“Obviously, he wants to win and everybody here wants to win, but it’s up to us,” Zambrano said. “‘Q’ can be the best manager in the big leagues, but if we don’t perform as good, he’ll be the one who takes the blame. If we do good, he’ll look good. It’s up to us.”
You certainly don't want to interject
logic and rational thought to this conversation, do you?
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 17, 2011 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions
I knew there was a reason Big Z has been my favorite player for 10 years.
I guess he just “gets it”, as some on this site like to say.
Logic, rational thought, and Zambrano
errrrr…………….
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on May 17, 2011 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh FFS
nobody here thinks Quade doesn’t want to win. There are many of us who simply don’t think he has a clue how to do that. He’s a bad manager.
I love when people hold quotes like this up as “proof” of their opinions. Did you really expect Zambrano to say “holy shit is Mike Quade a terrible manager, how in the holy hell is he even able to tie his own shoes?”
And if he HAD said that, would you have claimed Zambrano “understands”?
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on May 17, 2011 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions
couldn't have said it better :)
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on May 17, 2011 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Did you think after last year
that Quade was going to be Manager of the Year after his performance?
Then you can’t say “he’s a bad manager” after a similarly small sample size.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 17, 2011 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions
how much is bad managing, how much is lack talent
IMHO there is more than enough blame to go around
Chronologically inept since 2060
Q: Why did Chuck Norris cross the road?
A: Ditka
Ditka's mustache can block a Chuck Norris round house
Ditka's mustache can kill two stones with one bird
He wouldn't have said that.....
Zambrano is smarter than that, and smarter than you too apparently.
You might want to consider a course in debate
Because you’re really not convincing anyone with these “arguments”
by Shanghai Badger on May 17, 2011 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions
This is what happenes when the inmates run the asylum
At the end of last year, all you read was how much the players loved Quade. How great of a manager the players thought he was. How much they loved his approach to the game. So Hendry in all of his wisdom (HA! I laughed while typing that) bypassed every logical option for the next manager and picked the aforementioned "players guy". Never mind that when a guy spends 19 years in the minor leagues before landing a gig in the bigs, there is probably a reason for that. Nope, Hendry is the smartest guy in the room and gave Quade his big chance. Now he is learning that Quade has no chance at managing a pitching staff, is throwing darts to pick his lineup, stunting the growth of a top prospect by playing him every 4th day in lieu of an average to below average player hard to make adjustments to major league pitching when you get 8 at bats a week.), and basically getting pantsed by the opposing manager every night. By the all star break the boo birds will come out, the papers will start to beat the drum for his firing, and by the end of the season the failed Mike Quade experiment will be over. (along with Hendry and Kenny, fingers crossed)
Trade me right f@#$ing now!
Funny, everybody was saying
the inmates were running the asylum when Lou was the manager.
I wish you guys would get your bitching straight.
Not even one full season and the Quade lynch mob is at the door.
Cubs fans get what they deserve.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 17, 2011 4:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Please comprehend what is typed before running your mouth (or keyboard)
the players where running the organization in Quade being hired. They where running the team when Lou was the manager. Kinda same, but different. Before they where controlling Lou, now they are controlling Hendry. COD offers a reading comprehension class. You should look into it.
Trade me right f@#$ing now!
Right after you take
a writing comprehension class. I’m not going to hold my breath on that one.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 17, 2011 6:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Please hold your breath
for about 8-10 minuites.
Trade me right f@#$ing now!
by Mister Zero on May 18, 2011 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions
and
It is writing “composition” not “comprehension”. Apparently you may need more than one class.
Trade me right f@#$ing now!
by Mister Zero on May 18, 2011 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions
Why are you even responding to this...
you really don’t give a shit about this team anyway…right?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 17, 2011 5:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Hendry...
…has a habit of putting managers in that position with his rosters.
Dusty has to be laughing his ass off inside. He won the division last year and has absolutely kicked the Cubs ass.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
We obviously have different ideas of what makes a top prospect.
He was a 1st round draft pick in 2006, topped BAs top 100 prospects once (and that was in the 90s if I remember correctly) and struggled throughout the minors. He needed to have TJ surgery early in his pro career and didn’t fully recover until 2009. After the TJ surgery, he was ranked #7 and #17 in the CUBS system.
He has never shown good discipline and he’s very streaky. But please, where have you seen him as a top prospect?
It may be like being one of the tallest midgets in the circus (read:Cub organization)
but being a first round draft pick (13th overall) makes him a top prospect. Even though he did have the injury he still was one of the players the Cubs where counting on to make a major contribution to the big club someday. I know this does not mean he is the second comming of Mickey Mantle (Ty Griffin and Earl Cunningham where once “top prospects”) but dangling the carrot of playing every day at the end of last year and then playing him sparingly this season and against the majority of left handed pitching, while for the most part, sparing “Fuk” that burden (only 7 AB’s against lefties this season) is no way to try and develop a young player.
Trade me right f@#$ing now!
by Mister Zero on May 18, 2011 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
Considering that Jaramillo was hired as the hitting coach guru...
…Colvin was a guy he should have been able to work with. I don’t pin this on Colvin it’s hard as a young player to develop when was only given one time this year to play in back to back games.
BTW, Colvin had a .500 slugging pct. last year as a rookie, that’s not bad and that’s something to be built on.
Starlin Castro is proving he’s a freak because this organization couldn’t toast a pop tart much less develop young talent.
by troutfishin on May 18, 2011 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions
Hey...
…one good position player every 20-25 years isn’t bad.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
considering the last one was a first baseman
…that was a prototypical 2-hole hitter, I have to ask, who was the last superstar they developed?
Maddux,
unless we’re only talking about position players.
"You've got to get your damn shirts rolled up and go out and kick somebody's ass. That's what you've got to do. Period." -- Lou Piniella
Palmeiro.
….I know, I know he was busted for roids, but I saw this guy close up and personal and the dude could flat out hit.
By the way, Palmero was drafted by the Dallas Green regime and traded after Green left.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Did you ever think he'd hit for that kind of power?
Nothing in his minor league record or his time with the Cubs suggests that.
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His first AB in college....
…I was in the hole (hitting 5th), Palmeiro hit 3rd and Clark 4th. I turned to someone in the dugout and I said; “I’ll bet he takes this guy deep”.
Granted, we had all watched him in fall practice through the spring and knew he was special, best hands and tempo I have seen that close up. Well, Raffy proceeds to take the first pitch he sees as a freshman at Mississippi State and he hits the big scoreboard out in right center field (400 ft +).
He hit more homers as he got more college experience and he did the same thing when he turned pro (it just took him time to adjust to the wood bats and get confidence). Even if the roids helped him late in his career, he was still a 400+ homer guy and he also walked as much as he k’d, something that was stressed at MSU.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Also...
…I saw Palmeiro in 1989 at an alumni baseball game at MSU. He knew I was from the Chicago area and he told me he hated leaving the Cubs. He also said he was told by Frye and Zimmer that they needed someone with more power and boy did they turn out to be wrong on that one.
The funny thing was, Palmeiro was wearing t-shirt that day under his uniform that mocked both Frye and Zimmer. I can’t remember what it said, but it showed how pissed he was to be traded.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Love this story.
I don’t think the Cubs would have won the NL East in 1989 if they don’t make that trade.
But they paid for it for many years after.
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Those t-shirts read
“I got Fryed and Zimmered” I beleive they had a picture of 2 players jumping up and down in a frying pan.
Trade me right f@#$ing now!
Exactly right...
…you just refreshed my memory. He pulled off his MSU jersey and he showed me.
The worst part about this alumni game was seeing Will Clark. I never cared for the guy, and he made it a point to tell me how he was just waiting on that pitch from Maddux that he deposited in the bleachers – what an ass!
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
The infamous
lip reading story? The legend of which is why pitchers cover their mouths with their gloves when the manager visits the mound.
Trade me right f@#$ing now!
BTW
you should have reminded him how they got their d***s knocked in the dirt by the A’s in the WS.
Trade me right f@#$ing now!
we
know quade will last through next year.cubs went out and got some decent players in the offseason. just did not work out.if the players did their jobs this team could contend. but lately this has looked like a circus of horrors.looks like another fire sale come july.
hate
to give up on q already but remember joe maddon took a couple of seasons to settle in here in tampa and now everybody considers him a delicate genius.i still wish they had hired ryno.
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