Cubs Finish First Half On Even Lower Note Than Usual, Lose To Pirates 9-1
by Al Yellon on Jul 10, 2011 3:14 PM CDT
in Chicago Cubs Recaps
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PrintHere's all you need to know about the first half of the 2011 Cubs season.
In games started by Ryan Dempster, Carlos Zambrano and Matt Garza (53 starts), those three starters posted a collective 4.61 ERA. That isn't great, but in those games the Cubs have managed to post a 28-25 record (even though the three starters' record combined is only 16-17, more proof that the W-L record for starting pitchers in modern baseball is virtually meaningless).
In all other games, Cubs starters have combined for a 6.43 ERA. If you take out Andrew Cashner's one start, a good one, that jumps to 6.57. The team record in those games is 9-30.
Another one of the second-category games happened today -- the Cubs lost to the Pirates 9-1, mostly because Ramon Ortiz reverted to his original, bad form. The key blow was a three-run homer by newly minted All-Star Andrew McCutchen, who seemed to be spending the day proving he belonged on the NL team -- he hit two sacrifice flies and drove in five runs overall.
Can we knock off the retread starters now? Ortiz, Doug Davis, Rodrigo Lopez -- none of them are any good, none of them give the Cubs a chance to win games now (the Cubs are 3-13 in games those three have started), and none of them are a part of this team's future. Even if he's not quite ready, let's see Trey McNutt starting games. Or anyone who might give the team an actual chance to win and who might give some hope for the future. I'm tired of seeing 35+ year old starters whose last good year (if they even had one) was 2002. (Oh, and I'm about done with having to look at John Grabow, too. Just release him -- he has zero trade value.)
The other big Cubs news today, apart from dropping to 17-29 on the road, saved only by the Astros from having the league's worst road record, was that Aramis Ramirez declined the invitation to replace Placido Polanco on the NL All-Star roster. The best tweet sent out after this:
Congratulations to every player in baseball for making the All-Star team. Couldn't have happened to 750 more deserving guys.less than a minute ago via Twitter for BlackBerry® 
Favorite 
Retweet 
Reply
Aaron Gleeman
aarongleeman
This is getting ridiculous; the rosters are 34 players, so that makes 68 in all, but it seems like there are probably 80 players who have been offered or declined or been injured or just don't want to fly to Phoenix.
"This time it counts"? More like "This time, it's a split-squad spring training game that counts" -- the refusal of some players to go smacks of, "I don't want to ride the bus to Tucson" that you knew was the reason a lot of players didn't want to take the two-hour trip to that former spring training site.
So the Cubs hit the break 18 games under .500, and that likely means a 95+ loss season, as I noted in this morning's post, based on similar seasons over the last ten years. Enjoy the break. As Cubs fans, we need it as much as the players do. I'll have threads for the Home Run Derby and All-Star Game, and feel free to use this one for the Futures Game, if you're going to be watching.
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Boring, awful game.
It was hard to even concentrate on what was happening.
We'll miss you Big Boy. #10 for Hall of Fame.
by mrcubsfan on Jul 10, 2011 3:17 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
I wonder if Ricketts was paying attention....
Or maybe a documentary about Africa was on the Discovery channel and he watched that instead.
Perfect time to clean house, nothing like a 4day break for some reflection and ass kicking.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
We only get 3 days.
We’re back on Thursday.
by Bled Dry on Jul 10, 2011 3:37 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
My bad, forgot.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
still enough time for a house cleaning
that would definitely spark some interest in this team for the rest of the season.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
The WORST owner of any team ever
He will go down in history as the man who destroyed the CUBS
He does not care … and if anyone cant see it … “you can fool some of the people all the time…ect”
how does one destroy something that's been broken for over a century?
Blake "The Franchise" DeWitt will lead us to the promised land
by jesus christos on Jul 10, 2011 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Huh?
this team has long been broken long before Ricketts bought the team. It’s been run piss poor going back to the Wrigleys and who knows who before. The Tribune Co saw the Cubs as a cash cow when they bought it.
Now if you think you can run the organization any better, I suggest you pony up the billions of dollars and purchase it yourself.
What the hell?
So we can’t criticize the Ricketts unless we’re billionaires?
How….dumb
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 10, 2011 7:49 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Rickettts is doing a great job! Being rich means that you are smart and can run a ML baseball team right?
The point is, Ricketts can do something about this mess and is not…..He is a weak owner….Just like bud and Jerry wanted
Ricketts is proving he's nothing more than a figurehead.
He doesn’t have the ability to make financial decisions without approval from daddy and this team to daddy is nothing more than a secondary asset.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
We can
criticize Ricketts all we want. That wasn’t my point to the dude I was responding to. If you didn’t see the irony in that last sentence then whatever.
First order of business
you will add an exclamation point to the uniform….. Cubs!
by LT on Jul 10, 2011 7:56 PM CDT up reply actions
3 days of this?
In 2 years he is the worst owner in history and destroyed the Cubs?
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
by rlpete on Jul 11, 2011 11:53 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Talk about a dead team....
Not that it mattered, but why was Ortiz allowed to face Walker again before being pulled? It was not a matchup thing….and Walker owned Ortiz….just one of those Quade moves that make little sense….
At least Barney and Johnson looked alive….Maybe Johnson could be the starting LF after the break….wait, his paycheck isnt big enough. Or maybe his .330 avg is too high….
Let's stop about RJ.
I love him, but he has a 1.5% walk rate and a .400 BABIP. He’s lucky to have a .330 BA, for all that’s worth anyway.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Still better than Soriano....plus he can actually field......I would rather see Colvin, Campana, or Jackson play, but since the Cubs dont like to give them regular ab's, play johnson....
Producing means nothing to the Cubs….Its all about the size of your contract.
That's right...
producing doesn’t mean anything, which is why it doesn’t make any sense to play Johnson, other than how they have been playing him.
That’s why September can’t come soon enough. Then they can bench Soriano and Fukudome and play the kids that need the ABs like Colvin and Campana (Jackson will be dependent on the plan with him). Until they’re traded or the roster opens up, Soriano, Byrd and Fukudome have to play… after that, the gloves are off, but it’s still not going to change anything for RJ.
I wish this team were closer to competing, then it wouldn’t be so.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 3:31 PM CDT up reply actions
It's my fervent hope that Dome will be on another roster come September
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 10, 2011 4:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Hence "gloves are off".
meaning the gloves they would use in the field for the Cubs. Everything’s on the table, including straight-benching them if they’re still on the roster. The motto for the rest of the season should be "Time’s A Wastin’ ".
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 4:42 PM CDT up reply actions
other motto suggestions
just collectin’ our paychecks
move along – nothing to see here
you want it when?
Victories and winning are overrated anyway
we have a plan, it is so secret, even we don’t know what it is
I'm going to the 2012 Randy Hundley Fantasy Camp!!! Who's with me?
I like it!
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 6:24 PM CDT up reply actions
mottos?
how about:
IT’S NOT HAPPENING!?!?
"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk
Let's not kid ourselves
Other than a series with the Mets and Astros, all Sept games are against teams competing for division championship. We’ll be reminded we have to play our vets or destroy the integrity of the game. Just like every year, we’ll bring up prospects and watch them sit and see the same lineups that got us into this mess.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
I never understood that argument, either
What does it gain exactly? Would one really expect a Tony LaRussa or Ozzie Guillen to appreciate a gesture like that and file it away, so they can return the courtesy the following year? I have a feeling those two – or any other good manager out there – would put the needs of his own team first and foremost.
I believe it's one of those
unwritten baseball rules. It seems to me that as long as one team doesn’t throw a scrub lineup against one team in contention and it’s top pitchers and #1 lineup against another, it should be ignored. Remember last year when Hill played almost every day. instead of playing Chirinos. September should be the equivalent of our spring training.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
ill take it and
get the super bum out of left, and big siesta off of third
by Mike the ex cub fan on Jul 10, 2011 7:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Do the Cubs even have enough eligible players to release all of the players that have no trade value?
September can’t get here soon enough.
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Actually...
they wouldn’t be that much worse, if they had to go put on the unis themselves.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Don't call up McNutt to start
He is definitely not ready. He hasn’t even been good in Tennessee this year.
by Mulhollandmania on Jul 10, 2011 3:25 PM CDT reply actions
There are other minor leaguers having much better seasons
They should be called up before McNutt.
by Mulhollandmania on Jul 10, 2011 7:03 PM CDT up reply actions
I think there is a misconception around the idea of when players should be called up
I guess with the club in the position they are in right now, it wouldn’t do anything in regards to hurting his psyche by bringing him up now. Couldn’t be worse than the crap that we are seeing right now.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
And anyone you call up
(Cue Al’s response) to put on the 40 man won’t be able to play during the 2012 strike.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
You really are convinced there's going to be a strike, aren't you.
I think MLB will settle. Labor/management relations have been good in MLB for almost 10 years.
Join us for complete MLB coverage at SB Nation's Baseball Nation
On top of that
if there was going to be a work stoppage next year, there would be all kinds of saber-rattling going on right now about how much money MLB is losing and such. No one has said anything about that.
by Josh Timmers on Jul 11, 2011 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions
It couldn't hurt his psyche to get pounded by big league hitters?
it doesn’t matter how much the team sucks, if a pitcher is losing games badly and not pitching well, it will affect him.
by Mulhollandmania on Jul 10, 2011 7:04 PM CDT up reply actions
The Cubs' winning percentage right now would give them a 65-97 record by the end of the season...
Or they could just have a 1.000 winning percentage the rest of the season.
Jack Brickhouse: "Hey! Hey!" Harry Caray: "Holy Cow!"
Vince Lloyd: "The Chicago Cubs are on the Air!" Len Kasper: "Oh Baby!!!!"
Ron Santo: "YES!" "All Right! Let's do it!" "Ohhh Nooooo!" "Gee Whiz! Come on!" AND... "This Is The Year!"
by #1 iowan cubs fan on Jul 10, 2011 3:25 PM CDT reply actions
Its more likely they would lose all of their games...
I wonder if a 100 loss season with a 125 million dollar payroll and attendance going down the toilet will be enough for weak owner Ricketts to make some moves?
Probably not….Its all because of the injuries!
It happened to the Mariners a couple years ago... and they cleaned out their FO afterward.
(It wasn’t quite 125m, but they were the first team to lose 100 games with a 100m+ payroll.)
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions
interesting stat, guess we'll be the second team
with a $100+M payroll to lose 100 games
I'm going to the 2012 Randy Hundley Fantasy Camp!!! Who's with me?
It's really, really hard to lose 100 games...
but I think the Cubs can do it with hard work and perseverance! There’s no way Fielder turns us down with this logic… and $215M over 8 years.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions
I can't say I'm questioning the Cubs commitment here...
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
the scrubs will turn it on around the middle of August
thereby saving everyones jobs and everybody gets a nice raise to stink it up next year
by Mike the ex cub fan on Jul 10, 2011 7:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, half the season is over...
…too bad it’s the wrong half
With the 1st pick in the 2012 Baseball Amateur Draft, the Chicago Cubs select...
I find it humorous that Aramis declined an all-star spot.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
He's a got chickens to fight.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Silly troutfishin!
HE doesn’t fight the chickens!!! The chickens fight OTHER chickens!!! :)
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Yeah, some idiot bounced a clown check down at the Bodaiga.
by LT on Jul 10, 2011 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't/didn't watch it
tho I suppose that’s a reference?
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
The check comes down as long as little jerry wins his cock fight.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Jerry Seinfield big or little takes a dive for no one.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Oh, I thought that's how Aram prepared for the season.
you know like in Rocky II.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Was this before or after Rolen got a spot?
I’d decline just based on having to associate with Rolen being an All-Star.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Probably no monetary incentive for him to go...
Hendry needs to start adding in incentives into those NTC contracts.
With the 1st pick in the 2012 Baseball Amateur Draft, the Chicago Cubs select...
Ramirez gets 75 grand for each All-Star selection.
Chump change, I guess.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
He can get much more than that...
by resting up and making that contract-year push.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 4:20 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't have a problem with A-Ram declining the spot
the All-star game is a joke this year anyway.
I'm going to the 2012 Randy Hundley Fantasy Camp!!! Who's with me?
Just this year?
Minor League Contributing Writer, Athletics Nation.
State high point count: 4/50
If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jul 11, 2011 6:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Its too much work
Plus he might be in the dugout farther away from 3B unlike wrigley….That is much to far away for him to walk.
All the more reason to not pick up his option.
Classless. Why not go to the game with Starlin. Of course maybe he is not the type we need to show Starlin around an All Star clubhouse.
Nice knowing you Ramy.
Bring on the
Blackhawks! Counting down till hockey starts.
The Cubs are a dismal team, save for a couple of players. They should just forfeit the rest of the season the way they’re playing or should I say the way they’re not.
Seriously though I love the Cubs and baseball in general, but watching this team is like watching paint dry.
Please, please, please...
end this stupid NFL lockout!!!
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Wait...
you mean the NHL didn’t lockout the players? I thought every winter sport was going to do it.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions
You can be like me and become a Red Sox fan too.
"Hey-Hey! Home Run! Attaboy Ronnie!" ~ Jack Brickhouse
At least next year we'll have the Summer Olympics to turn to...
…because, there really isn’t anything on this team right now that’s worth getting excited about for next year…unless the firings begin in the off season.
With the 1st pick in the 2012 Baseball Amateur Draft, the Chicago Cubs select...
Reds lose
Thom is pissed…. “That’s the ol ballgame right there Reds blow another one”
I had to chuckle but at least they are in it.
Why don't they schedule the All Star Game to after the World Series?
Isn’t that what the NFL does?
"Hey-Hey! Home Run! Attaboy Ronnie!" ~ Jack Brickhouse
because no one wants to play baseball in the middle of november
especially a joke of an exhibition game
Blake "The Franchise" DeWitt will lead us to the promised land
by jesus christos on Jul 10, 2011 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Won't be a joke if it determines who get homefield advantage in the following year WS.
"Hey-Hey! Home Run! Attaboy Ronnie!" ~ Jack Brickhouse
It would still be a joke.
It would just be a really moronic joke that our idiot of a commissioner dreamed up
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 10, 2011 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Injuries are bad enough at mid-season...
imagine the shape of a lot of these guys after a full season of play. Could be ugly baseball. Not CUB ugly basebal…but ugly, still!
Here is why
The playoffs last a month. Do you really want one of your players playing in a game after sitting for a month??
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
manager
Was thinking ,,,where was BB today,, hope he was filling out his job application for cub manager for the second half,,I can dream can"t I
BB in minors
watching his kid play. And, IMHO, there’s a good reason he hasn’t managed Cubs yet…dunno what…but I suspect there is
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
I think it's more that he's perfectly content where he is.
No Pressure, good pay, can take off when he wants to.
Why give that up?
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 10, 2011 4:35 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm sure that plays into it.
It’s a nice gig.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
Hey the game was a TERRIFIC pitchers duel
decided by two bad throws in the 8th. Oh wait i went to Yankees/Rays game today. A thing of beauty until the Rays turned into Cubs with back to back throws that were not even in the vicinity of the base. It is fun watching two great pitchers ( CC & Shields) work. Sadly Fuld did not get an at bat and Joyce & Damon never played either. Still fun game AND I missed the entire Cubs game.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either
On the bright side:
In about 218 days pitchers and catchers will report for 2012 spring training.
If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.
by eths on Jul 10, 2011 4:07 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
Ahhh...leave it to you eths
hope forever springs eternal!!!
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Yup, that's me, the eternal optimist?
If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.
by eths on Jul 11, 2011 12:08 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Remember that time Jim Hendry gave John Grabow a two year contract for 7.5 million dollars?
Holy hell that was stupid.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
We should compile a list of dumb moves by Hendry
That one definitely in my top ten but I don’t thing Ricketts is cognizant of these things.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Mr. Ricketts what chances do you give the Cubs for the 2012 season?
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Hey Tom how much faith does your father have in you??
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
Remember how many people said it was so stupid at the time...
but we were told we were wrong and should never, ever criticize Jim Hendry, because he made that great trade for Aramis Ramirez 8 years ago! They should just keep doing the same dumb things over and over and over and over and over…
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 4:19 PM CDT up reply actions
His moves in '03 were really good.
I still think he had pictures on Dave Littlefield because Hendry has done very little in regards to dealing with other GM’s.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Harden was also a good trade
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 10, 2011 4:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Hielemann...
Nady… But we couldn’t bring back Edmonds
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
I'm on the fence with that one.
Beane knew that he was dumping damaged goods with what we gave up, I would call it a wash. The deal didn’t really benefit anyone.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Harden's '08 was unfathomably good. It was like getting half a season of Pedro.
That was probably Harden’s best half-season. Considering what we gave up, I’d say that was a big win.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
...but ultimately a hollow victory, right?
But I’m ok with more trades like that… but better… and better follow through would be nice too. That trade, and the one or two others which might have some positive, doesn’t make up for his abysmal track record developing young players and signing free agents.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, of course it doesn't make up for the abysmal track record.
But in a vacuum, that was a totally awesome trade, both in theory and in results.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Awesome...
and to really count that for anything, it had to come with much more of that type of good. By itself, no one move is worth doing.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions
again, I think the fact that he did have some arm issues during the '08..
..season and pretty much lost his effectiveness the following season tampers my excitement for that deal. Beane has a history of dealing damaged goods and that was another example.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
whats he supposed to do
keep damaged goods?
by Mike the ex cub fan on Jul 10, 2011 7:25 PM CDT up reply actions
good point
everyone knew Harden was fragile
"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk
I agree good second half pickup...
…but the Cubs were going to win that division without him. He didn’t fair very well in the playoffs either.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
No one did well in the playoffs
"A dream you dream alone is only a dream. A dream you dream together is reality." John Lennon
"My favorite food is Macaroni and Cheese, from the blue box." Geovany Soto
It wouldn't have mattered how Harden did.
He got screwed by a horrible call at third base in the 1st inning, and wound up giving up 3 runs while pitching into the 5th.
He could have thrown 7 innings of no-hit ball and it wouldn’t have mattered – the Cubs offense was pitiful.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Right...
so if they didn’t fix that, they shouldn’t have bothered giving away any players for a marginal upgrade they still had to pay next year to be injured and inconsistent too. Beane knew what he was doing… Hendry was hoping. I’m not a huge fan of his like some others, but Billy Beane would be dangerous running this franchise. I like dangerous vs. incompetent.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Beane didn't get anything of value in that deal.
We got something of value. Granted, that value was concentrated over a very small timeframe.
But Beane got a giant pile of nothing. We, at least, got a half-season of total greatness.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
So, what?
He didn’t need to get anything in that deal. Not like the Cubs really had anything worthwhile to offer anyway, because of the system Hendry’s managed (and it’s still the case today). He got rid of Harden and Chad Gaudin, who were worthless to him. Even if you appreciate what Hendry did, you can’t call Beane a loser in that deal. (Beane ended up nailing Hendry on the Wuertz and Miles deals anyway. Eventually, Beane always gets the upper hand.)
What always bothered me about that deal was how little the Cubs actually needed Harden and Gaudin. They needed a much better option in the bullpen than Gaudin (and Howry and Cotts), and Hendry couldn’t get that done. They also needed an offensive upgrade, even if it were just on the bench, and they didn’t get that. I will remember ‘07 and ’08 (and ’09 to an extent) more for what the Cubs didn’t do, than what they did do.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 6:51 PM CDT up reply actions
That would be the one...
where he got the Cubs to throw in Jake Fox and cover a big chunk of the money owed to Aaron Miles, who he then was able to trade to another dumb team for at least one player with actual baseball talent.
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by jameslcrockett on Jul 11, 2011 3:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Wow
I’m a big critic of Hendry, but this is lame.
They shouldn’t have given up players who never did anything in MLB because Harden was fragile, they didn’t keep him, and they didn’t go deep in the post season? Ridiculous.
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 11, 2011 8:33 AM CDT up reply actions
The deal absolutely benefited us for the same amount of time that the CC trade
benefited the Brewers. Extending him arbitration and bringing him back next year was a mistake, but we gave up literally no one of any impact.
He went 5-1 with a 1.77 ERA for us down the stretch. That was a good trade.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 10, 2011 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions
yes
Don’t understand Crockett dinging the trade because we didn’t get EVERYTHING that the team needed.
"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk
Good trade or not...
it wasn’t what the Cubs needed to win. They still win the NL Central and make it just as far in the playoffs without him. They needed a bat and a late-inning reliever. Instead they get a starter and a long reliever. That trade was far from where Hendry needed to spend his time and resources.
--------------------------------
Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 11, 2011 3:38 AM CDT up reply actions
Idiotic
Wonder if Crockett was the first guy standing and applauding when Hendry got Harden for a bag of baseballs, basically?
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jul 11, 2011 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions
But Josh Donaldson was going to be a star!
It's a simple question, Doctor: would you eat the moon if it were made of ribs??
by Invalid User on Jul 11, 2011 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Way to interject your worthless trolling skills...
into a reasonable discussion. Keep up the good work.
--------------------------------
Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 11, 2011 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions
Hell yeah they should!
Bring back Aaron Miles!
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
JC- you forgot the "D"
as in The Cubs, RULED
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
do you mean
Back in the era of the horseless carriage?
"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk
This is as bad as it gets
How can anybody in this organization justify getting crushed by a team with half their payroll?
by Mapmaker on Jul 10, 2011 4:31 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
A little more than a third of the Cubs payroll
Pirates 2011 – 45million
Cubs 2011 – 127 million.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
This honestly has to be one of the lowest points I've ever felt as a Cubs fan
This is what makes the Cubs’ situation so damning:
1. We’re absolutely terrible and nowhere close to contention in the worse division in all of baseball
2. We have one player who may become a star. One player. One player on the entire ML roster
3. There isn’t one star in the entire farm system. Not one. Yes, the farm system has some nice players, but no players who will make an all-star like impact.
It really is depressing following this team right now.
I hate to do this but their is a bright side to the post steroid era.
It’s all about pitching and timely hitting.
Construct a team with good OBP guys that have the ability to hit above their mean average with runners in scoring position and you have a winning ballclub. Kind of like the Pirates.
I’m not Mr. Optimistic but the Cubs are a lot closer now than if this were 10 years ago.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
It's gonna take at least three years to get back to contention
unless we’re going on a 2006 like shopping spree, maybe 5.
I agree especially if we go young(which I hope we do)
but the Pirates have given me sense of renewed tampered down skepticism. :)
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
I am still trying to figure out what this means
Have you been drinking?
Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk
Well I'm a natural born skeptic...
…so I couldn’t necessarily say that I have a renewed hope or optimism because it wasn’t there to begin with. Wow, now that I’ve just read that I really need to listen to a Anthony Robbins self help tape or something.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Um..
I could see either Brett Jackson or Matt Szczur being stars… not really that hard to picture that.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
by Unique on Jul 10, 2011 4:45 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I think they can both be really good players.
Szczur could be a Brett Butler type. Brett Jackson could be a Mike Cameron type. Those outcomes would be pretty great.
But the fact that those are the beginning and end of our best-case scenario from the farm makes me a little sad.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
exactly what I was about to say
Brett Jackson could be a very nice player, there’s no question about it, but he’s most likely never going to have a huge impact.
Our top prospect has a 31% K rate in AA. In AA!!! That’s insane. Not to mention people are already raising questions about whether Jackson can stay in CF for the long run.
Jackson immediately loses value if he’s moved to a corner OF spot.
Mike Cameron has put up the 19th highest WAR in MLB since 1997
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/mike-cameron-stealth-star-of-the-90s-and-aughts/
I’ll be more than happy if Brett Jackson becomes a Mike Cameron type player who “most likely never going to have a huge impact.”
I don't think his defense is as good as
Cameron’s and I think Sizemore is more of his ceiling.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
by Unique on Jul 10, 2011 5:20 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Good point. It's a long way from Jackson's "may not be able to stick in CF" and Cameron's "greatest CF of his era".
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
I'm a huge Mike Cameron fan...
but he never really did have a huge impact. That’s not really all his fault (James shakes his fist at Safeco Field and Shea Stadium and PetCo Park), but it’s still true. He’s a fantastic player, and I’ll be so lucky to have him on my team (especially if he has Cameron’s makeup), but he’s not a franchise superstar who will get the team to the next level. There was really good player Mike Cameron, and ok player Mike Cameron, who was also not healthy Mike Cameron. There’s a lot of room for Jackson to be less than Mike Cameron (who I wanted the Cubs to acquire many different times) but still a fantastic baseball player
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 6:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Seriously? well WAR disagrees with you and says he was the 19th most valuable position player between
1997 and 2010. I know WAR has some disadvantages, especially on the defensive side of the ball, but those numbers are pretty amazing, especially considering he was an excellent glove in CF. His bat was way above average for CF for much of his career.
IMHO, what separates BJax from Cameron is his high OBP and Cameron being better defensively than BJax will probably be. But BJax should be an above average CF that will play average/above average defense and hit 20 HRs and steal 20 bases a season for several years of his career……
Plus if BJax can stick and bat leadoff with a 370+ OBP, he'll have a ton of value
high OBP leadoff hitters playing a premium, up the middle position with an above average (for the position) combination of power and speed has a ton of value at the MLB level.
I’ll take that.
Invalid User's ladder of CFs was developed in the KKKKKorey Paterson era
It goes like this:
Ken Griffey
Andy Van Slyke
Garry Maddox
Paul Blair
Henry Cotto
All of these guys were in the major leagues 10 years.
If either Jackson or Szczur can get to between Maddox and Van Slyke, that would be excellent. Poor KKKKorey is trying to make it to the Henry Cotto level.
It's a simple question, Doctor: would you eat the moon if it were made of ribs??
by Invalid User on Jul 10, 2011 7:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Those are ok comparsions..
But we have a long way to go to determine if they become stars. Both have the tools to become stars, however.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
by Unique on Jul 10, 2011 5:14 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
But sign free agents like a sailor on shore leave in the red-light district...
and everything will be coming up Cubbie!
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Ah now... that'll have
a great deal to do with Ricketts and his pocketbook, won’t it? So far, I’ve seen pretty bathrooms and a 10 million drop in payroll… hardly encouraging, is it?
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Part of me wants the Cubs..
to go after Reyes and move Castro over to 2b. Get another bat in FA and everything else through trades.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
by Unique on Jul 10, 2011 5:18 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
IMHO, sadly, the money "freeing up" this off season
isn’t going to be enough to bring this team into contention in 2012… ergo, we’re back to Ricketts bankroll.
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
If Reyes was 100% sure thing, maybe...
that would be a much, much better use of the money than Fielder. I still don’t trust either of their long-term values (though I trust Reyes much more). The organization needs a lot of work before they know where they should spend this mythical windfall. I would be able to get on board with that if they’d stop spinning their wheels, but they haven’t done that.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 10, 2011 7:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Hmmmm, I actually think Fielder's results are more predictable
Even with a probable end point that is not 8 years from now. Reyes has had too much trouble with his legs – I don’t recall a player where that got better over time.
Reyes on a long-term deal could be scary.
He may eventually need to move to 2B not Castro.
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
No Reyes. No.
No long term deal. No. No. No.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jul 11, 2011 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions
Hmmmm
Not sure what you’re trying to say here…
"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk
3 reasons?? That's all you got??
Depressing is right. Makes me happy to not have Comcast right now.
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
Rather than watch the Cubs today
I took a nice nap and read a book.
At least one of us accomplished something positive.
There are 108 beads in a Catholic rosary and there are 108 stitches in a baseball. Who says baseball isn't a religion?
I've never questioned your intelligence Zeke :)
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Did anybody else think....
Soriano was a kind of an @$$ for not even bothering to assist umpire John Hirshbeck when Soriano fouled one hard off his man-region? There he stood while Hirshbeck rolled in pain. He had to have seen him tumble over in a heap, but worried more about re-velcroin those batting gloves, so he could go onto hit a lazy pop-up.
In my lifetime please!
Looking too hard into it, buddy.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
by Unique on Jul 10, 2011 5:21 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I'm behind your staement 100% Unique
(Woulda been easy to have been “brief”…and awaited the TWSS) :)
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
And, it goes without saying, your "staTement" also! :)
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
You hit a guy accidentally in the jewelry bag the least you can do is ask if he's okay.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
The answer
to being asked after being hit in the nuts are you okay? Duh what do you think. I am peachy kean.
Cubs 2011 70-92
Do you need an ambulance or can you walk it off
There’s varying degrees of damage that can occur from something like that.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
ALFONSO SORIANO IS AN EVIL SADIST
Blake "The Franchise" DeWitt will lead us to the promised land
by jesus christos on Jul 10, 2011 5:26 PM CDT up reply actions
WELCOME ABOARD Kennabelle!
Only been here a few days, eh? Man, hate to say it…but you picked a baaaad year to join BCB. Oh well…
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Thanks
Oh I’m not new to the BCB site. Just finally got around to setting up an account. Trying to find my niche.
In my lifetime please!
there are some journeys
That a man has to take by himself
"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk
Welcoming the break
I’m ok with Ramirez refusing the All-star invite.
The rotation is what makes this a train wreck. They need 1-2 starting pitchers for next year. Two if they can find two and afford two and Wells is traded. The number goes up to 3 if Dempster leaves. They needed two starters from the system to help-out and found none, so I don’t know what surprises are in-store for next year; maybe Cashner will be in shape to start again.
I’m not as down on the offense as some are. They will probably play the money game with expiring contract players in attempting to improve it. They have to have a middle of the order hitter; two if they don’t have Ramirez back. They have to improve on RISP. To do this in the fewest number of moves and without mentioning Soriano, then they want to let go of Pena and Soto. They would have to replace them with a middle of the order hitter and both with players who can hit for better average and, of course, be good defensively. Among players who don’t play alot, they can drop Hill and maybe Baker. If they have CFer ready for the major leagues, then they can just trade Byrd because his contract expires next year anyway.
the offense sucks too.....the clutch hitting is terrible
How many can bunt?
Hit with runners in scoring position?
But we do not have a manager either so…
Maybe Ricketts needs to hire the two Bob's...
…Bob Slydell and Bob Porter the two consultant’s from the movie Office Space that were brought in to thin the herd. In fact maybe they can just stop giving Quade a paycheck and “it’ll work itself out” ,maybe he’ll just stop coming to work or…… he’ll burn Wrigley down.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Who's Counting
I only get a figure that high for 2012 when Soriano and his salary are also completely dumped.
The trick is to find the needed replacements. And if they dump anybody else, because of salary demands or lack of future potential, finding players from in or outside the organization who are as good or better. If they are smart, and it is always the case, they won’t bring in anybody who isn’t better than the player being replaced and will cut to the chase as much as possible.
by AboutTheCubs on Jul 11, 2011 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions
H-O-P-E...
A-Rod’s gonna have knee surgery Monday…any chance the Yanks might be interested in a BIG BAT (not the performance thereof, just the size of the damn thing…) Like Mr. Alfonso Sorianos? Hmmm?
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
who is going to play third for Yanks with A-Rod out
more likely they go after A-Ram heavy than Soriano
I'm going to the 2012 Randy Hundley Fantasy Camp!!! Who's with me?
There you go VCF...
getting all “technical” on me! :) He could be thought of as "just playing a really, really shallow LF. :)
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Already did that! Hey, I can dream, can't I?
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
arod's only going to be out about a month
Blake "The Franchise" DeWitt will lead us to the promised land
by jesus christos on Jul 10, 2011 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions
I know, but think about this:
you get A-Ram for the month he’s out. The Yanks’ automatically take on his $12/14 million for next year (whatever it is). He can also be DH for the rest of the year or A-Rod can. It alos covers them for next year if Posada decides to retire in the off season. As much as I hate to see A-Ram leave,especially to the Yanks, if you’re the Yanks, it makes total sense. Depending on what the Yankees have to give up to make the trade that is, if you’re a Yankee person, you want A-ram.
I'm going to the 2012 Randy Hundley Fantasy Camp!!! Who's with me?
Makes perfect sense, seriously.
I would thank Aram for the (great many) memories and wish him the best. It’s not like the Yanks have their division sewn-up this year. I don’t think they should risk 4-6 weeks w/o A-Rod when Aramis could be had.
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
I would want a starter back.
A legit one. Phil Hughes.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
by Unique on Jul 10, 2011 5:57 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
good luck with that
Blake "The Franchise" DeWitt will lead us to the promised land
by jesus christos on Jul 10, 2011 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions
So a mid-level prospect for a guy who's probably
the best hitting 3rd baseman in the National league?
It would be the definition of selling high. Something the Cubs don’t do. The question would be if Ramirez would accept a trade to the Yankees.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
I forget... did he say he
was or was not willing to waive his NTC?
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
He said he would not.
But so did Derrek Lee last year.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
IIRC, Lee vetoed the 1st offer...
ok’d the 2nd
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
i was referring to hughes
Blake "The Franchise" DeWitt will lead us to the promised land
by jesus christos on Jul 10, 2011 6:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Wow, in retrospect, very happy my games were at the same time as the Cubs today.
We'll all miss you Ron.
RIcketts and Cubs Organiztion a failure
This organization is plain INEPT…Just like someone posted we the fans and season ticket holders are stockholders..This supposed to be a PROFESSIONAL team…WE PAY FOR A PRODUCT…
The owner gm manager and players should all be fired..yes the owner too..In any job you have ever had be it a broom sweeper, working at Mcdonalds, a lawyer a secretary..ect ..you have to do some job.. whatever it is… and if you continually do NOT do it you will be fired …Correct?.. if you dont win cases as a lawyer noone hires you..if you cant make a hamburger at mcdonalds month after month you are FIRED…. .You are getting paid to do SOMETHING and if you cant .. your fired…what happens on the cubs?
players dont perform although they are the highest priced tickets in the major leagues…. this is no JOKE RICKETTS>>> you may think it is, but people are paying the for a product which you do NOT DELIVER..
THIS IS PROFESSIONAL BASEBALL not a softball game on a backlot..QUADE’s and RICKETTS’s LAME excuse"THEY MADE A GREAT EFFORT" does NOT cut it… if you make a good effort at your job but do NOT perform it YOU ARE FIRED… thats why this team is a joke from top to bottom…
These players are supposed to be PRO’s..and are being paid MILLIONS to play a sport they are supposed to be Better than an amateur at..THEY DO NOT DO IT…..
Its very simple Ricketts is clueless and the chain of command from top to bottom follows in his foot steps…. any CORPORATION other than the cubs, PAYS people to do a JOB ..if they don’t, no mater what the effort ,they are fired… but not on the cubs..we pay the highest price tickets of all the teams and get the worst results..and remember UNDERCOVER BOSS? our owner couldn’t janitor, sell hotdogs(and he cheated and threw them out) or anything else at wrigley and we expect him to lead this organization? lol lol
by edo4cubs on Jul 10, 2011 6:00 PM CDT reply actions 4 recs
I could be wrong, but methinks I sense a bit of frustration in edo4cubs post...
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
This is still JUST year #2 of the "Ricketts Era"...
…I’m willing to wait for some $50M roll of the books to allow Ricketts a shot at putting HIS stamp on this team. As far as everybody else…from Kenney to Hendry and right on down to Riggins and Jaramillo…they ALL should be fired. If Ricketts does that AND hires a TRUE legitimate baseball guy to run this team, I’ll continue to cut him some slack. Year #3 best have a WHOLE bunch of new management, because if not, attendance wise, Wrigley Field 2012 may start looking like Wrigley Field 1976…WITHOUT the enormous afro in left field.
With the 1st pick in the 2012 Baseball Amateur Draft, the Chicago Cubs select...
You're talking about firing an employee...
…who is still under contract. This isn’t McDonalds or Walmart, where you fire them and they’re done…off the pay-roll. I don’t know how much Hendry and Kenney make a year, but, if you fire those guys, you still gotta pay ‘em. That being said and no matter what those guys are paid, once the final out of Cubs ’11 is registered, those 2 guys should be cleaning out their desks and given their severance packages and each a complimentary pair of BIG Harry Caray glasses for their service. I’m sure Hendry did his best AND he got this team closer to a title than anyone else has in MY lifetime, but, the team has horribly regressed since, and that falls mainly on him…and Kenney.
With the 1st pick in the 2012 Baseball Amateur Draft, the Chicago Cubs select...
I'm convinced 100% that Kenney and Hendry will be back next season.
Listening to Barry Rozner on Friday made me realize that. If Hendry would be fired, you’d fire him now. You don’t fire him at seasons’ end when he already made moves before, at and after the trading deadline. You would want someone else taking over right now, so that the new GM can make his own moves prior to the deadline.
Hendry’s job is safe. Sad……
Two Words: Salty Saltwell
If they're back next year Ricketts will lose a portion of the teams fanbase and I'm...
…convinced he already has. If they are here next season, it will prove to me how much financial control Papa Ricketts has in making key monetary decisions. Papa’s no fan of baseball and what he got stuck with in the purchase of this franchise is an asset that will remain secondary to his primary business.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Not for nothing but...
Those fans would come back if the team won.
by SenorGato on Jul 10, 2011 10:10 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I agree...
…but it would be foolish and costly on his part to continue down the current path. Most of us are smart enough to realize that it’s only the first step in a long process but to ensure he maintains interest and ticket sales he better do something soon.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
by troutfishin on Jul 10, 2011 10:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Won't be much most costly than what he's paying...
and this time he has say in the FAs rather than the Trib.
by SenorGato on Jul 10, 2011 10:53 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Not for nothing but...
Those fans would come back if the team won, which is what this comes down to.
by SenorGato on Jul 10, 2011 10:12 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I certainly hope...
…Rozner is wrong.
I think it’s 50/50 whether Hendry is back next year. If he is, I won’t be able to stomach watching the hole thats been dug turn into the Grand Canyon.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
I'm not convinced Hendry will be fired but
the fact that he hasn’t been fired in mid-season doesn’t imply anything. The pool of candidates would be larger after the season so I’m fine keeping Hendry until end of the year when he should be fired. I still don’t see all the riches that the Cubs could get come trading deadline time that som apparently do. This trading deadline will probably be similar to last year.
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
Was it at the All-Star
break 2 years ago that Gerald Perry got the axe ? I would have expected at least a coach to be canned . Unless maybe Ricketts really feels nothing is wrong .
I doubt Ricketts feels nothing is wrong
But I also doubt that axing Quade will have any more positive impact than letting him finish the season.
Quade...
…is a symptom, the coaching staff is a symptom, the roster assembly is a symptom of the core issue – Jim Hendry.
Take care of the core issue with the right person, let him do his job and all those symptoms will go bye bye in time. If you wait, those symptoms will only get worse.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
I'm 100% behind canning Hendry now, because there ARE future implications behind him making deals at this moment
I have much more doubt that Quade is truly going to permanently ruin Castro by batting him 3rd and disciplining him for loafing. Quade can finish out the year and the next GM can make a decision on him. It’s fairly predictable what that decision will be but there’s nothing to gain by canning Quade now.
So disciplining someone for loafing
is going to “permanently ruin him”?
Why do I even bother reading this crap?
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jul 11, 2011 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions
Let's back off on the insults, please.
Join us for complete MLB coverage at SB Nation's Baseball Nation
That wasn't a personal insult, Al
Although it appears I did read it wrong. Sorry about that, Dan.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jul 11, 2011 10:57 AM CDT up reply actions
You might've misread
I said that I have doubt that it would.
I wish McDonald's had their Chicken Nuggets on the Dollar Menu.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
I'm glad they don't
I’d be eating them for lunch and dinner.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 10, 2011 7:28 PM CDT up reply actions
everyday
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 10, 2011 7:28 PM CDT up reply actions
I wasn't really into them when I was younger.
But now, I’ve grown quite fond of them.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
Actually...
the fries and McNuggets were better back then. Tasted better I mean. But all that beef tallow, trans fat, and mystery chicken meat in those fries and McNuggets were probably a tad on the side of gross.
Two Words: Salty Saltwell
actually, I recently saw a documentary that the beef fat that they fried...
…everything in is better for you than the oils they use now. Canola and Corn oil are not really good for human consumption.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Wtf?
They need to institute that s**t nationwide!
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
are you guys forcing me to go to Mcds??
Damn too -just got home.
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
Yeah they should....
I work at O’Hare and out of the three Mcdonalds in the area(not including the food courts at the terminals), I go to that one just for the McNuggets. 8piece for only 2 dollars! STEAL!!!!
Two Words: Salty Saltwell
Damn didnt even think of 8 pieces!!
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
Best think about McD's is the nuggets.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
If it's only a dollar...but imo....
the McChicken sandwich is the best thing.
Two Words: Salty Saltwell
Thats my choice
I add cheese too
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
The McChicken is a solid entry in the dollar menu.
I’ll still take the McDouble or whatever they call it when they take off one of the slices of cheese.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
One of the finest rants...
…I’ve ever encountered.
Baseball is pitching, hitting, baserunning and defense.
by daver on Jul 10, 2011 7:30 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
homemade Carrot w/ cream cheese frosting....the best.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
seconded!
"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk
Remember what happened on UBoss when "our owner couldn’t janitor or sell hot dogs?"
He got FIRED!
Get 'em on, Get 'em over, Get 'em in!
lol.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 10, 2011 10:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Again, Fantasy Baseball rears its' ugly head
I do not understand what this writer wants to do, right now. Contracts are signed. Players are in those expensive contracts. The team had its’ chance to win three times in this decade and did not.
We cannot trade most of these players. There are some exceptions, possibly. I will not rehash the details of this, which has been discussed so MANY freakin’ times on these pages — well, it’s damn boring.
Does this writer believe that all players should be released? Shall every AAA, AA, and A player be dispatched to Wrigley Field?
Fire everybody? WTF? If you have rec’d this post I cannot understand.
If you think baseball is like real life, where you and I exist, you are living a delusion.
I understand that ultimately, the man at the top is the one who takes the heat. But what the hell…..what do you want to have happen? You can blast your frustration all you want, but you just can’t ship players with millions of dollars yet to be paid and then expect, well, I don’t know…buy more players??
I’m not even sure why I respond to this stuff.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jul 10, 2011 10:46 PM CDT up reply actions 5 recs
My dad used to have a saying
“If they were that smart, they wouldn’t be working for me.”
A good manager understands how to make changes in a way that is not suicidal to his or her business. While it is satisfying in a testosterone-fueled way to fire ones entire organization, it generally is not a particularly profitable move, especially when they have guaranteed contracts.
There is nothing more depressing than having an employee who has done good work in the past, and you both realize that it’s not working out. Hendry has that problem with Soriano, and Ricketts has that problem with Hendry. If a manager handles this situation in a wrong way, he or she will have a horrible time trying to attract even better talent.
The organization is going through its purge, but to the chagrin of the impatient it is starting with the historical Quad-A guys: Stevens, Berg, Diamond, Mathes, Scales, Perez, etc., and working its way up from there. Next up, we’ll see the placement of the sub-$3M guys who can be productive bench upgrades for the various division leaders: Jeff Baker, Reed Johnson, and maybe even Geovany Soto and Sean Marshall. They’ll bring back guys to restock Daytona and Tennessee, and we’ll see Brett Johnson, DJL, and either Castillo or Clevenger in Chicago.
I still think it’s possible that Hendry is fired in late August or early September, especially if Ricketts wants to get Andrew Friedman from Tampa Bay, or one of Theo Epstein’s minions out of Boston.
It's a simple question, Doctor: would you eat the moon if it were made of ribs??
by Invalid User on Jul 11, 2011 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions
I hope this is the last time Lopez
starts a game here.
Btw just saw Hak Ju Lee for the first time since 2010. Meh. If he becomes an above average player I still think it’s more Orlando Cabrera than Derek Jeter. Didn’t come off as a very aggressive hitter, and I dont mean that in the “that means he doesnt walk” way.
Miller from the Cardinals has some good stuff. He’s your typical Cardinals future ace. 2 seam away to lefties/ in on righties then a 12/6 curveball in on lefties. Also has good 4 seam velocity and changeup.
No Szczur yet. No Matt period as Moore and Harvey are still waiting for thir innings.
Moore just came on….holy crap what an arm.
First two pitches are 99 then an 88 mph slider. Easy 99.
by SenorGato on Jul 10, 2011 6:04 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
Any shortstop coming up would be pretty stoked if they knew their career...
…would comparable to Cabrera’s.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Yes I know.
That’s why I said above average, which is what Cabrera was.
That’s not quite Castro good. For him, a Cabrera comparison would be selling his bat way short.
by SenorGato on Jul 10, 2011 10:15 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Castro's ceiling is sky high but he needs to improve his defensively which he has...
…already this season but he has ways to go. For as good as Cabrera is offensively (for a SS) he is even better defensively. Castro might be better suited at 2b before it’s all said and done.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
by troutfishin on Jul 10, 2011 10:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Castro will remain a SS.
He’s a way better offensive player than Castro. Defensively he’ll be fine.
by SenorGato on Jul 10, 2011 10:56 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
How can Castro be better than Castro?
::me confused::
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Cole Hamels had a good game.
That’s the game I watched.
by SenorGato on Jul 10, 2011 6:13 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
You didnt watch the Cubs so you can still pretend they won today!
by TJ11 on Jul 10, 2011 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
No man the sky's pretty low here.
by SenorGato on Jul 10, 2011 10:16 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Paul Maholm could be a free agent after the season
He’s got a $9.75MM club option with a $750K buyout. I don’t how highly the Pirates value him, but if he hits the market, I would put him on my list of affordable targets for the Cubs.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
Riggins is as useless as tits on a bull.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
The Pirates have a pretty low payroll this year.
And with their higher attendance and hope for the future, they should be able to keep him. He’s having a good year. I assume they’ll exercise the option.
Join us for complete MLB coverage at SB Nation's Baseball Nation
And it took them only 18 years of sucking
to do it!!!
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jul 11, 2011 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions
Because its 2002 this matter!!!!!!!
they now have a GM, Owner, and manager who know what they are doing.
You are right as always, the cubs should keep what they have going! Its working so well!!!!
Well, maybe it only took them firing Dave Littlefield to do it.
How many AA/AAA/ML-bench players have the Pirates collected in the last three years through trading marginal to decent ML players?
Josh Harrison and Matt Diaz come to mind. And for some reason I keep on thinking that Hanrahan came in the Nyjer Morgan trade, but I don’t know if that’s really true.
It's a simple question, Doctor: would you eat the moon if it were made of ribs??
by Invalid User on Jul 11, 2011 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions
I think Hanrahan did come over in that trade
from the Nationals, correct?
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jul 11, 2011 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, I just looked it up
Hanhrahan was garbage with the Nats, BTW. But the Pirates’ approach seems to be to have collected 3-4 players at each of 10 key positions and let them fight it out for playing time, and mix those guys in with the high upside guys such as McCutchen, Walker, Alveraz (although he’s back in AAA), etc.
It’s not a bad strategy – and it works even better when you are a franchise that can then afford to hand out one higher-end 5-6 year FA contract per year to fill in the gaps.
It's a simple question, Doctor: would you eat the moon if it were made of ribs??
by Invalid User on Jul 11, 2011 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions
Actually, it only took about 4 years - they just wasted the first 14 years of sucking
With the Cubs financial advantage, they should be able to retool faster than that. But the Cubs have already wasted nearly 2 years of sucking by failing to bite the bullet.
I reinvented a new and better way to watch Cub games lately
I tape them and watch them when they’re over. I watch the 1st inning at normal speed. Then I begin fast forwarding the rest of the game and only play the good parts at normal speed. Today’s game only took about 15 minutes out of my life.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
Good for the Pirates.
They needed these wins more than the Cubs.
Baseball is pitching, hitting, baserunning and defense.
by daver on Jul 10, 2011 7:37 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
More about the Aram all star thing
He is mad that it took too long….
Cub fans are mad it took too long for him to get going and waited til we were out of it to start hitting…..
Nice…..
I hope they pick someone else who will enjoy being there.
Well, even with him hitting now the Cubs aren't winning...
…so I don’t know if would have mattered, however it certainly wouldn’t have hurt.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Jason Kipnis
Kid hit home run in the Futures game. He is from Evanston. Of all the years I have ever umpired youth leagues. I am guessing over 500 games and this is best kid I have ever officiated.
Side not. I also umpired Jim McMahon’s kid who had a rifle for an arm – go figure. Lastly – I have umpired for two McPhail kids (I am positive of 1) and the older one was one of the biggest wise asses I ever umped. Great ball player though.
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
Minor League Ball profile of Jason Kipnis
Join us for complete MLB coverage at SB Nation's Baseball Nation
HARRY POTTER 7.5 FRIDAY
BOOYA
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
My daughter got me to watch all the movies up to this latest one a couple of months ago
I gotta say, it’s alright.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
HP7 covered like 500 pages in the book.
HP 7.5 covers the last 200 pages or so, which is the best part of the series, IMO.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
massive death and destruction
coming up!
"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk
Let's recap the first half - DISASTER!
I don’t live in Chicago and I know I’m suggesting this from 1,000 miles away, but I would love to see some form of silent protest by Cubs fans in the second half. I know a lot of you fans either have season tickets or bought single game tickets months ago. Maybe you just want to take in a game at Wrigley to people watch and don’t care if the Cubs win or lose. Or maybe your buddy gave you some freebies…
It’s beyond embarrassing what’s happening on the field and it makes me sick to think the Cubs were winning 97 games just a few short seasons ago. Cubs fans don’t accept the lovable loser tag. We want to contend. We want to challenge for the World Series title year in and year out. No excuses. None whatsoever.
Start sending letters and emails to the Cubs. Massive Facebook campaign. Refuse to put up with this garbage that takes the field every day. Make posters and take them to Wrigley. “Refuse To Lose” “We Want A Winner.” Something. Anything.
Get 'em on, Get 'em over, Get 'em in!
by DKT on Jul 10, 2011 9:08 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
How about everyone uses their tickets
they show up to Wrigley and instead of sitting in their seats they put paper mache likenesses of themselves in their place and then leave the ballpark. A silent ballpark filled with paper people, it would be a kind of freaky while also sending a point.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
The Astros were in the WS 2005.
Perhaps their situation is worse.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jul 10, 2011 10:47 PM CDT up reply actions
There was a fan protest at football (soccer) match here in Germany.
The fans turned up, and stood with their backs to the field, silently for the entire game.
If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.
As crummy as the Cubs are, the Astros are even worse
Which team is actually worse though? I mean, Astros swept us in Wrigley.
I'm going to the 2012 Randy Hundley Fantasy Camp!!! Who's with me?
I'd rather be where we are.
Not by much though.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
The Cubs are 7-7 against teams currently in last place
That is rather brutal.
It's a simple question, Doctor: would you eat the moon if it were made of ribs??
by Invalid User on Jul 11, 2011 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions
Is everyone ignoring the possible political reasons
for Rami to refuse to go to Arizona? really?
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
I agree...it's probably due to the fact that most of these ballplayers after experiencing...
…an All-Star once in their careers would probably just prefer to have the time off.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
by troutfishin on Jul 10, 2011 10:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Political? You're over thinking it.
He had made plans with his family already… and got a short notice invite. He declined to spend time with his loved ones. That’s it. And, my gut feeling was telling me that this was the case, instead of him flat out getting snubbed.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
If you're going to make a political statement...
…it helps to, you know, actually MAKE a statement about why you’re doing something.
No question A-Ram just wanted the time off. The All-Star Game has lost a lot of its luster over the last several years.
by bluekoolaide on Jul 10, 2011 11:28 PM CDT up reply actions
This. He would have said if that was the reason
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 11, 2011 7:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Congrats to the Cubs
for propelling the Pirates to their best 1st half in 19 years!!
Ricketts approves!!
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
Even small kittens are being drawn into the maelstrom
If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.
Agree with you about old retread pitchers. Bring in the youngsters, let them swim or sink.
The AllStar game is slowly slipping away from it’s honorable past. It surly seems it’s slide really gained speed after the stupid decision by Commissioner Selig’s to introduce tie games into baseball — like soccer — during the AllStar game a few years ago. Slowly, we have witnessed the erosion of tradition. You really can’t make players want to play, but with proper leadership you can bring back an environment where they actually want to play and be part of it. The very things that makes baseball so great, like tradition, seems no longer important. I remember with great fondness when Pete Rose slid head first into home plate to take out catcher Ray Fossie and win the AllStar game. Maybe it was because I was just a young boy, but there was an awesome excitement to AllStar games then. AllStar games lately look nothing more than hallow, half-hearted attempts to pacify the fans. Why even bother?
"Don't shed any tears. You think about this: Here I am, the grandson of a slave. And here the whole world was excited about whether I was going into the Hall of Fame or not. We've come a long ways." BUCK O'NEIL
by HotDogDude on Jul 11, 2011 9:15 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
Well, money is the major issue here
…and nobody wants to get hurt. An All-Star Bonus written into one’s contract is great, but hey, no clause says you actually have to play in the game.
Rose/Fosse….that era….obviously, that the was on the cusp of the big, big money. Players then really wanted to play, in the game, they wanted to win. Now, with most of them sharing agents, making bushels of money, (and teams are going along with this, they don’t want their investments ruined) taking three days off isn’t a big deal, especially if you have a few ASG’s under your belt.
Many players are still going to play the game as best they can. But we will see no such plays that could lead to an injury unless there’s a strange issue involved.
It’s a party-time , good-old-boys-club game now. There is no going back.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jul 11, 2011 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions
I will run a poll
what is more depressing, the Cubs season or reading the comments on BCB
Cubs 2011 70-92
gotta agree
the season is shot.why keep trotting out guys like ortiz and lopez.release ortiz and keep lopez around for long relief.what about coleman?this is why the cubs ruin their young players.because they are so desparate to put up a win they wont let the kids get in there unless they succeed right away.
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