The Prospects Acquired For Kosuke Fukudome
John Sickels at Minor League Ball has some further details on the two prospects acquired. (Note: you won't be impressed.)
10 months ago
Al Yellon
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Phil Rogers likes Abreu
so who knows?? don’t put much stock in this stuff these guys are still soo young could develop. the guy we got for Fontenot seems to be comin on….
At 21, Abreu still has a chance to improve.
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I don't know who expected much in the first place.
Now, if Ramirez was traded and this is all we got, I’d be very upset. I really didn’t expect much back at all. I think Pena, maybe Dempster and certainly Ramirez can net more back.
'Never look down on anybody unless you're helping him up.'
Exactly
We weren’t going to get sure-fire prospects for Fukudome. We got a lottery ticket in Abreu and a AAA relief arm as well. Likely neither of these guys does anything for the Cubs. But we weren’t getting anything significant out of Fukudome via trade.
Are you toonsterwu?
Or are you just copying what he said? (I’d have no problem if you are, but you just said the exact same thing as him on another site, and it’s weird that name his never comes up here anymore when he knows more about the Cubs minor leagues than anyone.)
--------------------------------
Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 29, 2011 5:25 PM CDT up reply actions
He can post here any time he wants.
Not sure why he doesn’t any more.
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Agreed. I for one really miss his input.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
He talks a lot over on minorleagueball.com
Not sure why he never stops by here anymore.
lots of people said similar things
on the old thread. don’t have to be a genius to call Abreu a lottery ticket (I did too)
by PrincetonCubs on Jul 29, 2011 10:57 PM CDT up reply actions
I thought
the idea was that the Cubs would get better prospects if they paid most of Domes contract. If this is all they could get, can you imagine what they would have gotten if they didn’t pay as much?
See the Cubs 2011 schedule at http://cubsbythenumbers.com/sched2011.html
Also see what old Cubs Scorecards looked like at http://cubsbythenumbers.com/scorecards.html
Look at it this way...
The 775K that Cleveland is paying could go a long way towards signing Dillon Maples, or Dunston Jr, or Jacquez from the amateur draft.
Maybe the savings gives them enough flexibility to sign all three instead of two out of three. There’s another prospect for us as a result.
by Southside Steve on Jul 29, 2011 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
I heard the Cubs won't do that.
Too many walls to climb. Not only are those completely different budgets but that 750K could go a long way towards covering any losses taken this year.
In any case...
… it’s nearly $1 million budgeted for this year that the Cubs don’t have to spend.
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Financially, I find this doubtful.
I don’t agree with everything Ricketts has done… but he stated in the offseason the overall baseball ops budget would remain the same. Even if the payroll dropped (it has/did, nearly 10.4M according to Cot’s), that money would be redirected to amateur / international spending (IFA, rule 4 draft, building facilities in foreign lands, etc.).
That means Ricketts planned to spend roughly 10M more (i.e., not ‘total’) on those areas this year.
I was very encouraged by this news… and was glad to see some of the resources redirected. I was never part of the “Ricketts will just pocket the money” brigade.
Going off what Ricketts said… and I believe him, based on the draft signing scuttlebutt we’ve heard… the rule 4 draft budget (created before the season) likely could be in the 10M range. Even with all the overslots we apparently may ink, I’m doubting there’s a need to go beyond the generous budget already in place. I believe extensive spending, including picking several overslot “signing risks”, was part of the plan all along.
My contention in another thread, misrepresented here, is that it is more likely the major league budget is experiencing a shortfall. I make this prediction based on the very high likelihood that the major league club has experienced shortfalls from projected revenues because of bad weather and poor play.
Any money the Cubs get “back” in deadline deals is good for the organization… but my feeling is that it is more likely that ‘savings’ stems some of the likely experienced losses rather than allowing us to do something “extra”, such as sign an unexpected draft pick, particularly given the high likelihood that a substantial rule 4 draft budget was already in place.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
I expected much more myself.
If the Giants can get a Wheeler for a 35 year old OF, why wasn’t Hendry able to get more for Kosuke?
by SenorGato on Jul 29, 2011 8:38 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
Because Beltran is good and Fukudome is not
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jul 29, 2011 8:44 AM CDT up reply actions
I think, which it's very hard to tell with SG, that he's being sarcastic.
'Never look down on anybody unless you're helping him up.'
agreed
he posts so much nonsense it is hard to tell if he is being sarcastic or dumb
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jul 29, 2011 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions 7 recs
There is no way the return was going to be even close for Dome as it was for Beltran.....
Cant blame Hendry for that.
.289 / .391 / .513 vs .273 / .374 / .369
Beltran is having a great season.
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
Exactly.
Beltran is having an All Star caliber season. He’s among the league leaders in RBI and other categories.
Fukudome… isn’t.
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I believe it's referred to as a Blake DeWitt type season.
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 29, 2011 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions
Um, I think you need to take another look at DeWitt's numbers.
Or Fukudome’s.
Baseball is pitching, hitting, baserunning and defense.
...
Fire Jim Hendry. Injuries aren't the problem.
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 29, 2011 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Ha!
Rec’d.
And now here comes the obligatory “Oh I forgot, Quade is Shanghai and cubswynn’s boy” line.
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
I won't be sad.
That means we won’t have to deal with SenorGato anymore.
Minor League Contributing Writer, Athletics Nation.
State high point count: 4/50
If you are grouchy, irritable, or just plain mean, there will be a $10 charge for putting up with you.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jul 29, 2011 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, because anyone who disagrees with you loves the current regime
Regardless of what else they say.
You and Senor Gato are the same person, aren’t you?
Fire Jim Hendry. Injuries aren't the problem.
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 29, 2011 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
We all know DeWitt is the clear cut MVP.
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 29, 2011 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions
That the Cubs got any ...
more than league-minimum salary relief, and a prospect with even a chance of making some sort of contribution to the big-league club in the next year or two is really more than anyone could have expected from this situation. Just my opinion.
The market is what it is.
I’m sure everyone in baseball knew Fukudome was on the market. The market must not be very good.
I’m not a Hendry fan but I’m comfortable saying that I don’t think he passed up better offers to take this one. He is in a no-win PR situation here. If he doesn’t take the minimal offers, he will be criticized for standing pat. If he does try and get what he can, he will be criticized for not getting enough.
I agree with you as this what about what I expected.
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
Abner Abreu has some tools.
He has also struck out in 30.36% (102/336) of his ABs this year, in his second year in A+.
According to Fangraphs, among qualifying batters in the major leagues, only Adam Dunn (36.1%) would have a higher rate.
You can still find some success in the major leagues with a high K rate (though it is often paired with a high BB and/or SLG %), but man, it makes your job harder.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
There are lots of players who can succeed to a degree with a high K rate
Ryan Howard, Adam Dunn, and Mark Reynolds, for example. But as you said, those guys have high BB totals and SLG too. It’s difficult to find successful players who strike out a lot and almost never walk – that description fits guys like Corey Patterson and Tyler Colvin.
by Jody Jody Davis on Jul 29, 2011 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think anyone expects much from Abreu...
That’s why Lottery Ticket is as high as the praise goes with him. He’s got legitimate upside given his speed, power, youth, and defense, and that’s pretty much all you can ask for when giving up a no-power mid-30’s corner OF.
Agreed
If Abreu can get to the major leagues and can give us one season that’s even half of Patterson’s 2004 season (.266/.320/.452, 24 HR, 32 SB, 3.1 WAR), it would make this a fantastic trade.
by Jody Jody Davis on Jul 29, 2011 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Agree 100%
This is what the Colvin fans are missing. Players with his stats lines very rarely ever succeed.
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
I think it's worth noting that Abreu can play almost every position.
200 games in right
70 at third
24 in center
11 at second
and 15 at shortstop
Maybe he can make for a good power bat off the bench late in games. He could even pinch run too.
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 29, 2011 12:05 PM CDT reply actions
No one can be the next Enemy Blake DeWitt.
Those who even moderately resemble him should be fully eliminated.
DeWitt for MVP!!!
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 29, 2011 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions
These aren't "trades" in any meaningful sense at all
Most of the trade deadline deals made these days, the Kosuke deal included, are not “trades”. They are just ways of saving 10 cents on the dollar of the remaining balance owed on what has turned out to be a bloated contract. The “suspects”, ……errrr…….. “prospects” are just a little window dressing. It’s very rare that taking a flyer on a B or C list prospect results in that prospect contributing anything at the major league level.
I'm not very happy with this deal.
We paid all that cash for one marginal prospect, and a AAA arm? Were we even scouting the Indians organization for the past several weeks, leading up to the deadline?
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
So you would rather have...
… paid all that cash to Fukudome and get nothing?
This was about as good as it was going to get.
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I understand it's either...
A. Pay him to play out the season, or
B. Deal him and pay less.
But, to get some crappy OF prospect in return? That’s the best you can get? All of the best prospects in our system right now are OFers. At least add a 20-21 year old starting pitcher, instead. As an organization, we’re in real need of pitching right now.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
But, to get some crappy OF prospect in return? That’s the best you can get?
Yeah, unfortunately, I think it is. You’ll note that there were NOT teams lined up outside Hendry’s door for Fukudome.
I thank him for getting something in return. The Cubs could have had nothing.
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Exactly...
There wasn’t a huge market for Fukudome. We can argue on the margins over the quality of this trade, but it wasn’t likely to be a substantially better return.
My beef is... why target an OFer? We have tons of good OF prospects.
Target a young arm of the same value, and cross your fingers that something starts to click. We need all the pitching we can get.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
Maybe the Tribe didn't have any such player.
Or weren’t willing to give one up.
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I'm not real enthused by Abreu, as noted above.
But if you’re looking for “upside” at the ‘A’ level, then position shouldn’t really matter since you’re talking about a player likely two years away (at best).
The Cubs also don’t have a ton of corner OF (i.e., power) guys… they have plenty of the toolsy CF types (Jackson, Szcuzar, Ha, Easterling).
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
Did we end up paying all but an insignificant amount of Mike Fontenot's salary too?
That team also ended up winning the World Series, and has a good chance to win another. I really don’t have a reason to hope the same won’t happen for Fukudome with Cleveland.
--------------------------------
Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 30, 2011 5:14 AM CDT up reply actions
I wouldn't have expected...
…to get much in return for Fukudome.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Remember the last time we traded with Cleveland?
For a lottery ticket and some bullpen pieces..yeah, well that trade turned out pretty well, huh?
Ah memories....
Landing the best pitching prospect since Prior as the third arm. Maybe if were so lucky Abreu will help out in another Garza-esque deal.
by SenorGato on Jul 29, 2011 9:07 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
The sale of Fukudome
allows the Cubs to get 2 months of full time Colvin. Either he starts to improve or we’ll know he isn’t part of the team’s future. We’re not in contention and therefore we have no reason to watch Kosuke play out the season. Addition by subtraction.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
Agreed.
Giving him play time will allow us to determine if he can be a useful bench/part-time player, or a non major leaguer. Much better to find out now and knowing what you have in him going into next season.
big waste
i would have let him finish the year.and colvin scares the hell out of me.have the cubs ruined another prospect or can you forget how to hit in 6 months? hmm.
It's a lost season
So why not let Colvin play everyday? What are we going to finish 30 games under .500 instead on 26? Let the kid play full time and see what he can do. He’s been jerked around, so let him play and know that it’s his position. Maybe RJ can work with him and fix some holes in his swing.
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it. -- George Santayana (1863-1952)
Hmmm,
you worry the Cubs somehow ruined Colvin by not playing him, but if they play him you are scared. You can’t really have it both ways.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jul 30, 2011 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions
Colvin situation BCB'd.
That was pretty lawlzy.
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