Yankees scouting Cubs Ramirez and Soriano
It appears the Yankees may have some interest in Cubs left-handed reliever John Grabow as well as hitters such as Aramis Ramirez and Alfonso Soriano.
11 months ago
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It's Happening!?!?!
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
I actually thought the Yankees might have some interest in Soriano earlier this year...
… when Posada was struggling.
Posada may retire after this year. The Yankees could afford Soriano’s contract and make him their DH. He’d likely succeed in that role. If the Cubs can move him… do it.
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more power to them
if they’re willing to take on a good portion of his contract.
DEJESUS!!!
Awesome
That would be great if we can unload Soriano. I like his bat, but not at the price tag that is associated with it.
price tag be damned
its the defense and slowness that is associated with it…if he had one or the other working for him he wouldnt be terrible to have around
The Cubs will have to eat some significant salary.
There’s no way the Yankees would be willing to pay $18 million for three years for a guy who can’t hit higher than sixth on a fifth-place team.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
I tend to agree with you, but I think Soriano's value does go up a bit if he no longer has to play the field
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions
I'd make the move ...
if the Yankees were willing to eat half of Soriano’s remaining salary.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Agreed
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions
Same.
And I think there’s also something to Soriano hitting in New Yankees stadium. That could be a really good park for him to be a DH in.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions
I think if ALL he has to do was hit, he'd excel at being a DH...
playing the OF is wearing that guy down and I think his defense – or lack of – ways on him. I liked Soriano. It’s just pretty sad the way his legs have let him down now. Even if the Cubs have to pay half…ship him.
With the 1st pick in the 2012 Baseball Amateur Draft, the Chicago Cubs select...
That's overly optimistic.
While Soriano might have fresher legs and hit better if he was a full-time DH, he wouldn’t have the speed that made him the player he used to be. No amount of time not in left field will make him younger.
The other problem with Soriano is that his game was built around speed, power and pull hitting. None of that ages particularly well. Remember, Soriano is hitting sixth or seventh on a team that has a really bad offense. Maybe I’m jumping on the word ‘excel’ too much. But I don’t think Soriano would, say, put up 2007 style numbers as a full-time DH. Remember, the guy is already 35.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
The Yankees could do much, much better at DH for that cost.
Though, I’m ok with covering even more than half of Soriano’s contract if it gets him off the roster, and gives the Cubs a little more money to spend.
--------------------------------
Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Totally agree.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Where would they play
Ramirez? They’ve got future hall of famers at just about every infield position.
Also, I’d be surprised (nay, delighted) if even the Yankees were interested in taking on Soriano’s contract.
DEJESUS!!!
He would DH for them
Posada, as Al mentioned above, struggled early. He killed the ball in June, but has been bad in July again so far. Rami would definately be an upgrade there.
Maybe they could move A-Rod to SS...
Jeter to LF…
and, let’s see…Cashman to the Cubs front office!
Angel Guzman is the man.
Jeter isn't going to LF
He should, but you’d have a media s—-storm that would engulf the entire team.
by Josh Timmers on Jul 8, 2011 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions
I forget what I was watching
but in it, they said there was some speculation among serious Yankee observers (take that FWIW) that Jeter may retire in the off-season seeing as how much his game has slipped.
It seems that the SS position may have moved past him. Could he consider a shot in LF to take some pressure off his body? I’m not sure anyone knows the answer to that yet. I could see it being less of a s—- storm that you may think.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions
If I were Cashman
I would goto Jeter and tell him they are moving him to LF and he is going to tell the press it was his idea…if he balks just remind him of the sweetheart contract he is on
I'm not sure who has the power in that deal
Jeter is well liked and at $16M per year, I think he has a lot of sympathy with fans. Sure, no one else in the league is going to pay Jeter $16M a year, but no other player means more the the marketing of the Yankees than Jeter does.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions
if he sticks as SS
into next year he better hope he has a late career career-year in him ala Thome, Berkman or the fans will quickly turn on him
Yankees fans will never, ever turn on Jeter.
Nor should they. He’s not great, but Pena and Nunez would have to get a lot better real quick for them to not be better off with Jeter. In his case, the money is 150% irrelevant.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Agreed...
He’s got a spot in “Monument Park” waitin’ for him. He’s a Yankee legend and NY treats those guys like royalty…and rightfully so.
With the 1st pick in the 2012 Baseball Amateur Draft, the Chicago Cubs select...
It still kinda shocks me...
that he’ll be the first Yankee to get to 3000 hits in a Yankees uniform.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
That IS unreal, isn't it?
As great as that franchise is…and as great of players they’ve had…ZERO 3000 Hit Club guys.
With the 1st pick in the 2012 Baseball Amateur Draft, the Chicago Cubs select...
Nobody even close, really...
Babe was the closest, and nobody knew how important 3k hits would be when he was playing… maybe we should go back to that.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Gehrig had 2721
Had it not been for ALS he most certainly would have hit 3000.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm sure he would have...
but that was 1939, and they didn’t have anyone even come close until Jeter.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Ruth had 300+ hits as a Red Sox
In a Yankee uni, Gehrig was closer. But the point about Gehrig was that a disease fell him. Ruth just didn’t have 3000 in him. Gehrig did.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, there the guys who have hit 300+ HRs
Which was the traditional Yankee style – never were a singles team after Ruth arrived.
Sorry, missing sarcasm tag
Angel Guzman is the man.
by cubzfan on Jul 8, 2011 2:39 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Except A-Rod can't play SS any more
He is having problems with his hip at 3B – no way he could move to SS. He would make Jeter’s range look good.
Grabow yes
I even mentioned him several weeks ago as one of the more likely trade candidates. They may even consider Ramirez for one year as DH but I really doubt the Yankees would lock up their DH for the 3 years with Soriano. I think that is just a media rumor to fill space. He isn’t even very good other than he hits HR’s. They can match his production a lot cheaper.
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
Grabow will be traded, I'm almost sure of it.
I don’t think the Yankees will take either Soriano or Ramirez off our hands, but I do see them being generous for Jeff Baker. They have no place for Ramirez and I highly doubt they want to take on Soriano’s contract.
Red Sox are in on Baker as well
or so the rumors go.
What would we get for Baker?
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
Not enough for this board.
There will be complaints that Hendry was robbed. Most people have unrealistic expectations for these deadline deals.
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
and unrealistic expectations
on how many Cubs would be moved…I see at most 3 players being moved and if we are lucky 1 of the big contracts
I dont think we have unrealistic expectations
we will happily take montero, texteria and hughes for baker.
I live and die with the Chicago Cubs.
Sara Paretsky
Add Philly to the list. 9 more and it'll be a Baker's Dozen
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Agree with you here
Relievers are one of the more easily traded positions at the trade deadline.
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
And yet the "Village Idiot" is still around...
…to help facilitate these trades. sigh
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
BCB should facilitate the trades.
Our armchair GMs are amongst the best on the internet.
OMG, I'm sorry I will refrain from insulting your hero.
btw, with your love for this current regime I’m guessing you must be a sadist.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Or it's just not that dramatic.
May I ask what’s the point of following a sport/team if you’re miserable about it?
Why do you follow BCB if you dislike it so much?
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
At this point, the only reason I can figure ...
is that you get to cast yourself as “above the fray” or “smarter than everybody else” or something. It’s really getting old. Not because you have the opinions that you have — you’re welcome to those.
It’s because you bitch and moan preemptively about the sky-is-falling-mentality of a bunch of fans on a blog dedicated to following a fifth place team while you post here more than just about anyone else.
In other words, if I had such marked contempt for so many people on BCB, I wouldn’t stick around.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
by elgato on Jul 8, 2011 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions 6 recs
Sure but the formatting makes it easy to read.
Also, I’m far nicer to my fellow poster here than the crowd that follows me is to me. The difference is I don’t get the support of Al because…as has been said…I’m different. Therefore, when I bark back it’s a far bigger deal than the fact that usually I’m just retorting.
The above should provide some good material for my fans.
You just made me remember my favorite line from 'Bull Durham'.
“The world is made for people who aren’t cursed with self awareness.”
I’m going to go back to ignoring you now. I enjoy my life more that way.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Cat fight!
Get it, everyone? SenorGATO and elGATO? I slay myself.
Reason to stay……….
amount of attention someone receives when they are on here. Reminds me a bit of a Brad Paisley song :)
by Madison Cub Fan on Jul 8, 2011 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
If different is code for dumbass
then sure.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions
If SenorGato says something like Al jumps all over him.
Where is Al now to jump all over you for this comment?
Because I just posted it seconds ago?
And Al isn’t on this thing 24/7. Let him admonish me for saying it though, I’m just calling it like I see it.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm also convinced you're a sock puppet account for SenorGato
There is no other explanation
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh my! I've been figured out!
Just because I don’t see a point for anybody name calling, aside from Worf, doesn’t mean I’m his puppet!
Is it name calling
when it’s an accurate description of someone’s behavior?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions
WILL YOU ALL JUST PLEASE FREAKING KNOCK IT OFF?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!
I AM SICK OF THE NAMECALLING. TIRED OF IT. TIRED OF HAVING TO PLAY HALL MONITOR EVERY FREAKING DAY.
JUST STOP. NOW.
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by Al Yellon on Jul 8, 2011 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well...
A couple temporary account suspensions might do the needed reinforcement, maybe it’s a possible solution while staying short of the banhammer.
by MN exile on Jul 8, 2011 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
This might happen.
You’d think posters here would be too old to be given timeouts. But maybe not.
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I'm starting to wonder on some of the ages of the posters here, anyway.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
by Unique on Jul 8, 2011 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I've seen blogs/forums spiral in very quickly
I can give you examples of how, left unaddressed, the bad drives out the good. I’m pretty sure you’ve seen a few yourself, though.
Brigging a time or two first might get the point across. Makes more work for you, unfortunately.
I don't understand why
people can’t argue with one another. It’s an internet message board. Not a 2nd grade classroom.
I find all of the “hall monitoring” annoying.
Come on Lisa, I'm trying to impress people here. You don't win friends with salad. ~ Homer J. Simpson
by TheBeerBaron on Jul 8, 2011 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I don't understand why the discussions need to turn into name calling
No one said you can’t argue – just be respectful, it’s not too much to ask.
I guess Al
seems to me like the teacher that steps in and breaks up the fight in the hall way when all of the students want to see the two fight it out.
Come on Lisa, I'm trying to impress people here. You don't win friends with salad. ~ Homer J. Simpson
but why fight it out here
Ruin for the rest of us who don’t want to read though that. It’s why this is the only forum I come to….. I don’t enjoy reading insults that are on the level of 12 year olds
by Madison Cub Fan on Jul 8, 2011 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions
How old are you, 12?
This isn’t junior high. I expect people to treat each other with respect here. It’s all in the community guidelines, which maybe people ought to re-read.
Disagree with someone vehemently if you want. Make your argument logical and back it up with facts.
BUT STOP THE NAMECALLING!
Join us for complete MLB coverage at SB Nation's Baseball Nation
Al's issue is more with the namecalling
and while I wish he’d take more of an issue with the person that constantly, and repeatedly starting arguments and labeling people here one way or another, I fully understand the name calling doesn’t help and “he” isn’t going to stop whatever it is he’s doing by people calling him a dumbass or whatever. I can usually read so much before I can’t help myself from speaking out. Whatever, it is what it is. I’ll be put on the proverbial bench, and that’s not going to bother me much. What will continue to bother me is the other type of namecalling that goes without any mention at all. Why a poster here, is allowed to start multiple arguments and essentially call most people here names repeatedly by talking down to us, is beyond me. I would fully welcome an email from Al explaining this though, and I personally would be more than happy to not call “him” any more names.
Like I said though, as much as Al is tired of namecalling, a lot of us are tired of basically being called dumb Cubs fans by another Cubs fan.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Who's that person?
It seems like there’s 6-7 of them to me, but then again, I’m different.
You hit the nail on the head.
You are different.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
Maybe you should change their avatars to a dunce cap or something.
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 8, 2011 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Hammer does not like the banhammer
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
Yet you love hammer pants...
What’s with the double standards?
I actually
bought a pair on EBAY one year for halloween. They were Zubas actually
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
Part of fandom is partaking in the armchair aspect that you so despise.
I know you try and act as though you are above the fray but you come off as clueless when you defend this current cast of clowns.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
FTFY
I know you try and act as though you are above the fray but you come off as clueless when you defend this current cast of clowns write anything.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Come off as clueless here?
I’m sure there’s worse.
do you relish the role of devils advocate?
because you’re defending the indefensible.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
No I just legitimately believe that...
this team is not doing anything they weren’t expected to do. I know there’s this thing here that Garza meant the front office thought this 2011 team was right on the cusp, but I had no delusions that this was a contender unless things went very well.
For instance, people here whine that this team is 16 below .500. Would you be happier if this was a .500 team? We’d just hear about how they’re only a .500 team. What good is that? There’s no winning this year, and I respect the Cubs for realizing that and putting their head down and doing work where they can do work in season.
I was going to just ignore this, but this stance is just so asinine.
the Cubs were going to be bad, so we shouldn’t be unhappy that they’re bad. In fact we’re whiny and STUPID if we’re unhappy that they’re bad.
And this sentence makes zero sense " I respect the Cubs for realizing that and putting their head down and doing work where they can do work in season." As opposed to not setting foot on the field? I’m honestly confused by this comment.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions
This is far too overly simplistic.
Us long-time Cub fans can deal with a bad season. This one is drawing extra angst for some of the following reasons:
1. An exorbitant payroll. Which leads too…
2. Some of the highest ticket prices in baseball. All while…
3. The millionaire owner whines that he doesn’t understand why people can’t afford to see his team play. Speaking of whom…
4. The owner seems to honestly believe this team was a contender, if only they had stayed healthy. All while…
5. The new manager promised to focus on fundamentals. And all we’ve seen is (in?) arguably the least fundamentally sound team in baseball.
You also don’t seem to connect that a lot of the angst in the fanbase is driven by a true passion for the Cubs. For many of us, this is a life-long passion. So to see an old, expensive, uninteresting team… OUR team… flounder on the field while the owner appears completely out of touch and mostly clueless from a PR standpoint (note: this is different than saying he is incompetent or hasn’t done anything right) and the rookie manager has failed to deliver on one of his biggest promises (again, different than saying everything is his fault)… well that hurts. And it leads to “whining” and “bitching”.
And we’ve all heard “next year is our year” / “the future is coming” / “trust in the way we’re building the system” many, many times before. So for many of us… we want to see some evidence of improvement on the field at the major league level.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
by fsuapollo on Jul 8, 2011 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
The fundamentals at the major league level have regressed even...
…from last year. Quade is to blame for that.
Some of the highest ticket prices in baseball. All while…once again becoming the laughing stock while seeing the progression of teams like the Pirates.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
IMO the whole comparison to the Pirates is getting out of hand.
Is Pittsburgh making progress? Sure. But they’re competing for .500 this year… they haven’t had a .500 season is closing in on two decades.
So despite the Pirates owning the Cubs the last year and a half and given the Cubs dramatically larger pool of resources, I think it is rather premature to say the Pirates have completely passed the Cubs (even though they’ll almost assuredly have the better record this year).
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
They're certainly on better footing right now.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Perhaps... I just don't think it is a slam dunk.
They certainly are better this season.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
The Buccos
have had a plan for about the last 4 years. We’re about to see if it works.
Our seven plans over the last six or so haven’t.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
Agree on both.
If some of their prospects come along and they can find a way to keep the more established guys (e.g., McCutheon) like the Rays did… it certainly could work.
The Cubs are pretty clearly floundering. But there are some small good signs in the minors, draft, and IFAs. And even with finances in something of a state of flux, the Cubs still have more resources than all their division-mates (most certainly Pittsburgh). If they can spend money more intelligently going forward, there is the potential to turn things around in fairly short order.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
Excellent point!
One of the most frustrating aspects of being a Cub fan has been the front office’s inability to see a plan through. It seems like every minor setback or delay is greeted with panic and a new plan.
"Sometimes you eat the bar and sometimes..."
The Bcus have been working on this for 4 years?
It’s been at least 6, when they drafted their current best player.
I'd have to check a list
of what they’ve spent on draft pick bonuses. IIRC, they’ve ratcheted up the number the last 4 years or so. Spend on the draft. Count on your scouts to be good at their jobs.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
Nutting bought the team in 2007
and fired Littlefield that same year. They’ve had a strategy and have generally stuck to it since.
by Damen Jackson on Jul 8, 2011 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Seriously though, why in your opinion do you think it's a good idea to afford Hendry...
…the huge responsibility of fixing it, when most think he should have been shown the door prior to this season?
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
In this case
We are talking about two trade deadlines that are coming quickly. There’s no one else that can do it.
Besides, nothing that happens is going to be a huge deal. It’s not like Castro is being dealt. In this current baseball environment, the only big deals that happen at this time of year are small market teams that have to trade superstar young players because they can’t sign them to mega free agent deals. The Cubs are neither a small market team nor do they have superstar young players that they can’t re-sign.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
If you look at Hendry's trade deadline history,
he’s done a good job at unloading players for some useful pieces that eventually played for the Cubs and/or were used in future trades.
Baseball is back!!
by cowsarecool220 on Jul 8, 2011 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions
Meh
Minor deals that really didn’t mean much.
That’s not a knock on Hendry. Show me any large market team that’s done a huge deal as a seller this team of year in the last decade or so.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 10:01 AM CDT up reply actions
Odd thing is... we could see three of them this year.
Cubs, Mets, Dodgers.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
But we won't
Perhaps Reyes, but that’s it and I doubt it highly. With the money that Einhorn brings, I doubt they are sellers and will actually re-sign him. The Dodgers seem too confused right now to make any sort of deal with Kemp or Eithier. They are staying put. That may be different this off-season, but they won’t do anything now.
As for the Cubs, they have no one other than Castro that is worth a large haul and he ain’t going nowhere.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions
Probably not...
Mets are an above .500 team. There’s some trades they could make, but they don’t exactly have a lot to trade. They have a really smart GM, so it’s going to take a lot to get Reyes away from them when they can just take the draft pick compensation.
Cubs and Dodgers just don’t have a lot of pieces they can sell for enough value to make it worthwhile… nor do they have stable front offices in place which can make that happen.
--------------------------------
Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions
A bunch of minor moves (Huff and Burrell) helped the Giants significantly
last year. I see no reason to underestimate players just because they’re not big name.
and Fonty helped them a bit for a few weeks.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
I'm not saying they are worthless
But they are minor deals. Huff and Burrell did help, but you know as well as anyone that it was Cain, Lincecum, the other pitchers, and Posey that were far, far more important.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions
Sure, but after Posey Huff was there best hitter...
Burrell was probably right behind him.
Again
I’m not saying that those guys were irrelevant, but had they missed on them, someone else could have been added and produced good numbers too. Cain, Posey, and Lincecum cannot be replaced – not in any sort of easy fashion.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions
It's a major assumption to think that...
just anyone else could have come in and put up an .872 OPS (Burrell) or an .891 OPS (Huff).
I doubt you’d find a Giant who’d call those guys replaceable or that some nameless other person could just step right in and bring what they brought to the table.
They caught lightening in a bottle
They got lucky that those guys played the way they did. They could have just as easily crapped out. There are a number of guys that they could have brought in that could have lit up like that.
They got lucky that these guys did. Let’s not kid ourselves that Sabean knew these guys would perform like that. He hoped. They could have flamed out just as likely.
Cain, Licecum, Posey, et al weren’t “lucky seasons” or “lightening in a bottle” guys. They are solid players doing what they should be doing.
There is a huge element of luck in all of this. If the Giants didn’t have a base from which to work from, the numbers Burrell and Huff put up would have been irrelevant. Cain, Lincecum, Posey are irreplaceable. Burrell and Huff were just guys they got lucky with.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Let's also not forget
…that if you’re making the case that Burrell was a savvy pickup, the Cubs reportedly passed on him. The Rays were supposedly offering him up for Bradley, and we took Silva instead.
Well, but where would Burrell have played for the Cubs?
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
And that would have made what difference?
I’m not trying to be facetious, but that still doesn’t save last season or this season. It would have been a minor deal. Sure, it would have been better than what happened, but who cares if the Cubs are slightly better if they still are in the bottom third best baseball teams?
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions
They caught lightning in a bottle by taking
on a couple of cheap, battle tested, at one point pretty good ML hitters. Burrell was a season removed from posting an OPS in the .800s for instance….these were small but calculated moves that helped push them over the top. Teams need guys like that, and the assumption that just anyone else can do it is an enormous one…
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 1:22 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
My point is that there are so few Lincecum/Cain types
And if you get one of those types you hold onto them fiercely.
Burrell and Huff, while useful, have a lot more competition within the sphere they live. There are lots of guys they could have taken a risk on, but they chose the ones they got lucky with. Good for them.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Another minor guy I can think of...
Most casual fans probably still couldn’t tell you who David Robertson is. He was a vital part of the Yankees 09 bullpen and has been their most consistent reliever since (well after Mo).
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 1:28 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I'm not arguing that guys like this don't exist or that they aren't important to winning championships
I’m saying that there are lots of these guys that can help out. If you miss on one, there are others that would be near as good of risks to take.
But you don’t replace Lincecum, Cain, Posey … There aren’t comparable Plan B’s for those guys.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions
This is true.
It’s why I’m excited that 40+ million is opening up for the Pujols/Fielder/Beltran/Wilson hunt.
Any deal made now is a huge deal.
It’s the difference between making the right deal, which lands us impactful players for the future. Or the wrong deal, which lands us failed prospects.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
+1
Each move is a chance to stock up for a future. I’m not sure we’re going to get what BCB would approve of as “impactful,” but they should be pieces we can use in trade or within the system.
Money saved is also a big deal
Assuming it gets reallocated somewhere else. Hell, even if it only goes straight to the team debt, that means there might be more available next year for amateur talent or FA signings. People can groan and complain about Ricketts all they want, but the guy has certainly spent some serious money on amateur talent early on.
Who is going to trade impactful players for Pena, Ramirez, Soto, Grabow, et al?
No, they are not huge deals.
Don’t get me wrong, these could be helpful deals, but no one is going to trade a potential difference making player for those guys. These deals could work out very nicely for the Cubs. I hope they do, but they won’t be huge.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions
People continue to underrate Soto's value...
He would, without a doubt be able to bring back a difference maker.
But then the Cubs would need a catcher
I could see Marmol potentially bringing in some noteworthy talent. The Cubs could then have Samardzijia or Carpenter see if they could fill the role.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Well of course they would, and im not even advocating trading Soto.
But your post said he wouldn’t bring back impact players. I was disagreeing.
Ya know
just looking back, I’m not sure why I included Soto in that.
Too many posts going on. My apologies and you’re right.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think you're wrong...
not because Soto really isn’t worth it, but I don’t trust the team to get full value from trading him. Especially if they end up having to trade with the Rays… I can just see a team successfully arguing they shouldn’t give up as much for Soto because he’s been injured this year and doesn’t have a good BA because he’s been unlucky. I don’t trust Jim Hendry to make a good counter argument based on his actual value. Because I can see him having value in 2 years and the team shouldn’t have a replacement by then, I don’t include him in the tradeable assets… unless some team blows the Cubs away.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions
I know a team on the west coast
that just might do that…and they said they were interested in rental players – make an informal agreement to trade again in the offseason with the Cubs giving back less
It seems weird to say this...
but I think our bullpen is in pretty good hands for quite some time.
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 8, 2011 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions
As much as I want to jump with joy
It was written on MLBTradeRumors yesterday that Yankees scouts would be in Nationals park primarily to watch Sean Burnett.
With the $ due to Ramirez and Soriano, one has to be realistic that they aren’t very tradable pieces. However, the deep pockets of the Yankees would be one of the only matches for those two.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
My God, please let any of these rumors happen
Please free up the roster spot. You just know that the Cubs will keep starting Soriano out of loyalty/money owed when Brett Jackson and soon after Matt Szczur need to get their time.
Come on Lisa, I'm trying to impress people here. You don't win friends with salad. ~ Homer J. Simpson
Do the Yankees really have that much Monopoly money?
The Soriano contract is one of the worst existing contracts in MLB. Grabow making 4.3 mill is a joke as well. If the Yanks are willing to take on a substantial portion of either/both of these contracts, then I would make run, not walk to make that deal.
Ramirez? I’m starting to think that exercising the club option may not be a bad idea. He’s shown he is still productive…..the Fuke/Silva/Grabow/Pena contracts are all coming off the books after this year (Although I would prob re-up Pena as well). So the Cubs will have some significant $$$ coming off the books. Who is gonna play 3rd in 2012? Jeff Baker??? Might as well keep Ramirez.
Yes
The value of the Yankees franchise is over 2.5 times the value of the Cubs. I think it’s even double that of the Red Sox.
I don’t think Ramirez is going to get deal because I believe the Cubs haven’t decided quite what to do with Ramirez.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions
I think the Cubs won't deal Ramirez because they want to keep him.
Unless the Mets are trading Wright or the Padres want to deal Headley we’re not going to land a young 3B or probably even a good 3B this offseason.
Exactly
And I doubt that Wright is going anywhere. As for Headly, I guess, perhaps, but my guess is that he’ll be expensive. A fair few teams would be looking at him considering the lack of league-wide talent at the position. All the Cubs have to do is re-sign Ramirez and all that will cost is money.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions
money that could be spent elsewhere.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Where?
The Cubs have the cash to bring in Fielder and Ramirez and still another. Who in the next upcomng FA market are you interested in spend double-digit millions on?
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 10:57 AM CDT up reply actions
I like CJ
I don’t think he’ll be worth what he signs for.
Also, I think the Cubs have the cash to add all three if they’d like.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 11:08 AM CDT up reply actions
Honest question, what are you basing that on?
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions
The lack of solid pitchers in the market
And the fact that the Yankees need one if not more. After Wilson the next best is, what, Edwin Jackson???
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm asking what are you basing the "I think the Cubs will have the cash to sign all three"
The last two years, all we’ve seen is a VERY budget conscious front office. I’m not sure they’ll be willing to open the pocket book
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions
They've been budget concious because they've been waiting
for the 40+ million coming off the books this year. That’s why Pena got one year, and that’s why they didn’t go hunting for a long term 1B option last offseason.
Man most of you guys really aren’t going to see what they’ve been building towards until it happens…Makes sense of course and it’s completely respectable, but I’m just curious as to how it’s not obvious if you’ follow this team. D’you honestly believe they just suddenly became poor?
What you don't understand
is that I don’t TRUST this particular front office to spend that money, or spend it wisely.
I understand money is coming off the books. There is no guarantee NONE, that it will all go back into the pot.
And honestly, in a way, the team DID just become poor. The Tribune was spending money out of its ass. That’s how we got to the point where there is $40 million coming off the books. They increased the payroll in part to increase the value of the team. It is not a given that we will STAY at this level of spending.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions
It's not a given that they won't.
Hell, I don’t see how it’s likely they’ll cut payroll in any significant way. I doubt they sign just one free agent.
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 11:03 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Oh, that
They have $50M coming off the books. Big market teams still have to spend big. There is no way that ticket prices can hover where they are without a corresponding payroll. Couple that with the fact that next year Z’s and Demps contracts are up.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Why don't you think he'll be worth what he signs for?
I think he’s a coup in the making. He’s pitching like a legit ace.
Lack of other good options
And the 800 pound Gorilla (aka Yankees) need one. The Rangers also have a need to keep him and they aren’t out of the picture at all.
I just don’t see the Cubs winning out on this one. The only reason the Yankees lost out on Cliff Lee was because he really didn’t want to go there and the place he really wanted to go found the cash to bring him in.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't see the Cubs winning his services either but...
I do hold out the hope. Lilly probably had his suitors and we still landed him…Competition in FA should be expected anyway. Not even one of the 1B are locks to come here…
I'd like to have him be a Cub too
For that, I’ll hope but I don’t intellectually think the Cubs are the team that will land him.
I think there are going to be some surprise teams in regards to the 1bman. Orioles, Nationals, Mets (yes, Mets), and Cardinals (if they dont’ re-sign Pujols somehow). Angels, San Fran, seem in too.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Pujols to Cards yes
But I still think that the Cubs land Fielder.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Do you have knowledge of the payroll that others don't?
If they keep ARam and sign Pujols or Fielder, the Cubs will have about 116.5 million tied up in 9 players next year. That leaves 16 more to field a team and probably about 24 million to do it.
Who are the 9 and
Z and Soriano are 36. Penas 5 million. Byrd is at 6.5 million. Marmol is at 7 million. Marshall is at 3.1 million. After that I get lazy.
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 11:18 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Dempster has a player option for $14m.
That’s the other big one. Garza makes $6m this year and will be due a raise in arbitration. Soto will be back on a raise from his $3m. Not including Pena (and including Fielder or Pujols)… there’s your 9.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 9, 2011 1:30 AM CDT up reply actions
Good thing Castro, Barney, Jackson, Colvin, Carpenter,
DeWitt, Russel, and whoever else are all going to be dirt cheap.
That’d still leave room for a FA IMO.
Dirt cheap isn't free...
those 400k contracts add up real quick and if that’s all they end up having, that’s a very, very bad ballclub. They’ll have a mediocre ballclub if everything goes to it’s potential and that never happens…and that’s if they convince Fielder or Pujols to sign.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 9, 2011 4:41 AM CDT up reply actions
No
He’s 30, the cubs will overpay him, he’ll have a couple good years, then everyone will complain that he sucks when he starts going downhill.
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 8, 2011 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions
Sorry, I'm talking about MLBers who've recieved MLB training,
nutrition, and coaching for years. Not career minor leaguers having their best couple seasons in their late 20’s.
But if 30 is the new 25 then 28 is like the new 23. He's still a kid!!
How can you throw him aside when he stumbled a little when he was just 20! lol
Context buddy, context.
Keep pushing LaHair, it’s almost guaranteed to fall on deaf ears.
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 1:37 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Because you say so? Okay armchair scout...
…tell us in the analysis of your in depth scouting of Mr. LaHair, why he wouldn’t be a viable option at 1b for the Cubs.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
30 GMs seem to agree with me…and have for a good decade now.
Don’t you think if LaHair was going to be something that maybe SOMEONE out there would notice by now?
Give me one legit reason this guy has any chance to be anything of significance in the major leagues. He’s got so many things going against him…age…he plays the most offense oriented position on the diamond and would have to hit the crap out of the ball to be taken seriously…lack of positional versatility…What about a player who’s spent a good 5+ years in AAA screams “future anything?” If LaHair is so legit why isn’t a prospect service like Baseball America or even Baseball Prospectus or even friggin Project Prospect pointing him out?
The guy is NOT a viable long term option, and he’s baaaaaaaarely a viable short term one.
That's not a scouting report.
You seem to think that a player can’t mature in his late 20’s and some of us have given example after example of players that have. Is it tougher to redefine yourself as a players once the book is out? Yes it is, but that doesn’t mean a player shouldn’t get a second look.
Again, Armchair Scout give me your scouting report that tells me he isn’t even a viable short term option.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
I do think he has a point.
If he’s a viable option, why aren’t 29 other teams banging on Jim Hendry’s door trying to get him?
Because he’s Micah Hoffpauir 2.0, that’s why.
Join us for complete MLB coverage at SB Nation's Baseball Nation
.358AVG. 700+ SLG. PCT.
+400 OBP and he’s not worth even a look. Give me a break.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Who said he's not worth a look?
MH got a look…Shelley Duncan got a look…it lasted 5 minutes…they’re nice guys and they fill out an organization…they’re not sleeping giants.
Oh and for context sake...
Those numbers are being put up in AAA. Not just AAA, but the PCL, a notorious hitters league, perhaps the best hitters league in the minors. He’s doing it in his SIXTH go around in that league. SIXTH.
This isn’t even a contest…
That's right...
he’s not worth a look. He’d be worth a couple weeks if you were desperate, but he probably wouldn’t be worth it if you had to take someone off the 40-man to add him.
I saw him when he was coming up through the minors. He was always the same. I saw when he got to AAA the first time. He was still the same. I saw him when he got to Seattle. He was still the same. I’ve watched him with Iowa. He’s still the same. I’m happy he’s hitting AAA pitching better. I’m happy he can play in the AAA All-Star game, but that’s what he is. He’s never had the talents or skills to be a major-league 1st baseman. It’s no different now that he’s 28. He needs to go to Japan. He’d have a nice career there and make some money.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 2:49 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Exactly.
I can’t believe a good 400+ posts were dedicated to this guy being a future 1B option here.
Not like we have winning baseball or a franchise with a future to talk about
When the Cubs give us something good to talk about, we’ll do more talking about that.
This whole thread is basically begging and pleading for the Yankees to bail us out… the rest is just window dressing.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions
There is a huge difference between a player maturing
in his late 20’s at the MLB level and a player doing it in the PCL. WHY that’s not amazingly obvious to some of you guys is absolutely, completely, totally beyond me.
Just because you asked lets do it again:
- He’s old. 28 is not the age of a prospect, and he’ll be 29 in the offseason.
- He’s been in them minors for almost 10 years now. I realize this board had a thing for Chirinos, another organization guy who spent a decade here, but those guys generally don’t actually do anything in the long run.
- He plays the most offense oriented position on the diamond. He’d have to mash to be taken seriously as a 1B option. The AVERAGE ML first baseman hits .267/.344/ .443 at the MLB level. He’d have to do much better than that to be viable.
- Not only does he play 1B, but he only plays 1B. He’s not even supposed to be a good defender there or anything.
- Did I mention that besides for less than 200 ABs with hte Mariners that he hasn’t seen the majors? And that he’s 28 going on 29?
I’d love to hear 4-5 good reasons as to why he’s a viable 1B option moving forward. I’m not just talking after/if Pena got traded. You legitimately seem to buy that he has an MLB future.
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
My working definition of
a Prospect is a bit specific. For a hitter, it’s based on likelihood of 3000 AB. For a pitcher, the threshhold is 1000 innings. I don’t see LeHair getting 3000 AB.
While it’s possible that a call-up in 2011 could lead to a decent statline in 2011 (I’m not buying, but hey), I would have no confidence he would be good in 2012. Quade had a very successful 2010, and the Cubs bought it as legit. So far, it hasn’t been.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
the only thing is
if LaHair gets a shot at the big league roster this year that means Pena is gone, I would much rather (barring we dont trade 2 of 3 outfielders weird not excluding Soriano anymore) see Colvin get some quality playing time at 1b to get consistant AB’s over LaHair – see if we can include him on a trade with one of the big fella’s
Player development, a better front office, a better manager
more scouts, more personnel…….
And on and on and on. The chances of the Cubs contending next year are slim. We aren’t a Pujols or Fielder away from being a playoff team, save the 16 million and reinvest it, or even hold it until 2013 and further improve the team. Bringing ARAM back for another lost season is certainly Hendry’s MO. It’s one of the reasons he needs to be fired.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions
They've put money into player development...
that’s why people (outside of here) seem to like our farm system. They don’t rave about it like the Royals or Rays, but you don’t need that to have something good.
And if the Pirates can contend in the NL Central this year, we can compete in the NL Central next year with one of the 1B plus whatever they do.
I’d rather just keep the good player. I hear that’s one of the ways teams get good.
Plus your ideas are too general and incomplete.
I’d like to add more front office personnel and find this manager that will save us too. I don’t think it should get in the way of putting a good product on the field, nor do I think it should come close to costing 16 million. If it did then Ricketts is probably wasting his money and actively making the major league team worse.
Who’s the 3B you’d like to see next year then?
Oh, and why is 2012 lost already?
Yet another way I will never understand how guys like you think…or why you’d spend you’d waste your time on a team who’s so far gone.
Wait, isn't one of your supposed points is that you KNEW 2011 was going to be a bad season?
And that’s why we’re all dumb for not just accepting it, and applauding crappy play?
Why do YOU follow the team if you knew it was going to be bad?
I follow it because I have been a fan for decades and I hope that at some point it will turn the corner. I don’t believe that makes it acceptable to languish in mediocrity, I still want indications the team is ATTEMPTING to build for the future. I don’t think getting ARAM for one more year at that price tag fits that bill.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions
If you don't follow the team when they are going to be bad then you are just like the typical bandwagon Arizona Diamondback fans
Sometimes you ride out the bad weather for the sunshine that follows.
Which is what I just said.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, but there's nothing in the rule book that says you
must be so intolerably miserable about it.
I'm not remotely miserable
I think the team sucks and the people who brought us to this pathetic level need to be given their pinkslips before next season.
the only thing that makes me annoyed is that I don’t believe that will actually happen.
There’s no rule you need to be just plain intolerable, but here you are anyway.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
I'll never understand why thinking a team sucks
or making valid complaints about why they suck, equates to being miserable.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Well,
How else are people like SG gonna be condescending pricks without claiming I’m inherently sad and that’s why I don’t agree with their narrow point of view?
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions
People don't need to act like children to get points across
The attitude isn’t necessary or appreciated. Grow up.
For posters like him it is necessary.
It’s been necessary for him since he decided one day to open communication with me with troll pictures. He’s that kind of poster. Like this years cubs, it’s best to lower your expectations when talking to him.
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 1:40 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I agree
The Cubs don’t make me a miserable person. Even if I don’t like this current team much. The Cubs are my get away from real life time. If I’m pondering why someone making 19 million is batting 7th and needing a defensive replacement that means I’m not thinking about real actual problems.
by Madison Cub Fan on Jul 8, 2011 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions
No..you're mistaken
MrCat said it, so it’s true. Proof to the contrary isn’t applicable.
Accept it, you’re miserable.
That's a serious question?
Do you see me miserable with the fact that they’re bad this year? I follow this team because they’re interesting, and I see a plan where half their fanbase sees only a sky mere inches from their face.
Seriously…you talk of “building for the future” and have already conceded next year too…So when’s the future? What are these “indications” that they’re ATTEMPTING to build for this great future? Let me guess…a few lopped off heads for the masses and then a wait and see approach with prospects? Mmm stop teasing me with such good ideas.
And the status quo is interesting to you?
Do you like watching towels dry as well?
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
See it's only the status quo if you're not paying attention.
All I’ve done is taken note of certain things and reviewed them positively. I like where the farm system is, and I like it even more that it’s still growing. I like that there’s 40+ million coming off the books. I like that we have a star/stud player already lined up for the future in Castro. I like that they’ve built a very talented group of bullpen arms. I like that some of our vets have been able to go to other teams no problem in trade, and I like it even more that the GM shows respect for his vets, even when trading them. I like that they’re now considered one of the more mysterious organizations out there as far as getting info on who they’re scouting, who they want to draft, who they want to sign, and so on. I like that they’ve brought more athletes into the farm system, and I like that more and more hitters within the farm system are showing plate discipline. There’s plenty of things to like if you care to notice and not sit around and mope.
If that’s the status quo then I think we’ll be alright.
The farm system should be in a much better...
…position as far as young arms are concerned. Brandon Guyer would have been a nice late season call up but we now have the very inconsistent Matt Garza and my contention was and still remains that the Cubs could have done better than Garza considering what they gave up. By default, once Archer was traded, Cashner became the organizations best pitching prospect and that’s not saying a whole hell of a lot.
In regards to the 40 million coming off the books, Jim Hendry has been given even more money than that to work with in the past and look what he did with it, we’re sitting here waiting for 40 million in bad contracts to come off the books.
You’re delusional to think that Hendry can turn this around.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Everything should be in much shape according to our board GMs.
While you’re not entirely wrong, none of you actually shows a strong enough understanding of what a farm system is supposed to do. Mostly you just mope about how we traded some prospects and don’t have a system that gets called tops in the game.
Archer being the organizations best pitching prospect wasn’t saying alot. The guy was the 3rd arm in a trade for a declining utility guy two years ago.
Oh not to mention he can't not walk 5+ guys per 9.
It’s like a thing he does.
Though I do hear that if you make it a ritual...
people respect you for it.
This is rich
“Archer being the organizations best pitching prospect wasn’t saying alot.”
this coming from the same guy who just a few posts earlier was touting the Cubs farm system?
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
You're delusional to think that Hendry can't.
If anything it sounds more like a hope you have so you can one day proclaim how right you are.
What Hendry did with that money before was build a team that won the division 2-3 times, went to the playoffs, and even pulled off a year where they won the most games in baseball. A real disaster…
When did they win the most games in baseball?
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh NL...2008.
2nd to the Angels (100) and tied with the Rays with 97.
The purse strings opened and he spent....
…like drunken disgruntled hooker. Top tier, no trade clause contracts for B level talent. He should have been fired just for the signing bonus he gave Shark.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Just out of curiousity...
Why should the farm system be in better shape? They’ve picked in the top 10 what…3 times in the past 10 years?
So you can only have a successful farm system picking in the top 10??
The Yankees, Red Sox, and Braves would all like a word with you.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
What's unsuccessful about our current farm?
Currently they’ve produced our starting SS, a certified stud, and everyone but Grabow in the bullpen. On the way is a starting CF prospect. Not to mention it just landed us the guy who’s been our best starting pitcher this year.
I’m wondering what they coulda/woulda/shoulda done that would make it more BCB acceptable.
Are you even capable of staying on topic?
You just suggested (two posts above) that not picking in the top 10 would be justification for the farm not being in “better shape”.
I listed three teams that never pick in the top 10.
I don’t think the Cubs’ farm has been “unsuccessful”. I would, however, expect an organization with the financial resources of the Cubs to produce impact players, particularly hitters, more consistently.
The starting 8 currently feature only Castro, Soto, and Barney as home grown. Castro should be a star, Soto has been inconsistent, and while I like Barney a lot as an 8 hitter, he’s not an impact hitter by any stretch.
The Cubs have done a fairly nice job at developing major-league useful arms. There still isn’t a bona fide, rock solid #1 or #2 starter on the major league squad… and the minor leaguers who might be are showing health question marks (Cashner, McNutt) and/or are far away (A ball or lower).
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
The Red Sox and Yankees...
do not have loaded farm systems. They have solid, productive ones that get them what they need. Both started their farm system projects before us anyway, and right now both of their farm systems are in mediocre lulls as the big league teams thrive. That’s how farm systems work. Notice how our farm system is on the way up as our MLB team lulls a little…it’ll switch off again…it’s been like that.
I don’t get what you wanted me to say, I said nothing untrue about the system, and I even forgot Soto, a top hitting catcher who won ROTY just three years ago. Catchers, even inconsistent ones, don’t put up .263/.356/.462 as a career line very often.
The Yankees had to go out and buy their #1 starter…then buy their #2 starter with him…we’re not poor…we’re not Yankee rich either but we can spend to fill holes if the situation calls for it.
They also made trades that are far superior to the Cubs trades...
and you want to give the Cubs farm system credit for that.
--------------------------------
Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions
I "wanted" you to answer the reasoning/logic behind this post:
Why should the farm system be in better shape? They’ve picked in the top 10 what…3 times in the past 10 years?
The Red Sox and Yankees are indeed both “down” on the farm. They still use their farms successfully.
However, there certainly is no direct “switch on, switch off” to the success of a big league team and their farm. That was the example that I was providing with Boston and New York. Both those clubs have had long, successful big league runs… and have used the farm to supplement. The Cubs have had much more mixed results on both ends.
And what the heck is this:
Both started their farm system projects before us anyway,
Hendry and his minor league staff have been largely in place for 8 years. With the Cubs’ resources, that should be well more than enough time to build a truly top tier farm system. They seem to be moving in the right direction, but they certainly aren’t there yet.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
And Hendry was the minor league coordinator before that.
You’re exactly right, fsu. It’s great that the farm system is apparently turning a corner. But it took a really long time for Hendry to get it there.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
We were a top 5 system a decade ago...
Farm systems work like that…in cycles…notice they went down when our ML team went up.
Even then,
wasn’t it due to a few “can’t miss 5 toolers” that tanked? Have we ever had six or seven good pitchers in Boise at the same time?
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
This still doesn't address your post.
And simply explaining it away as a “cycle” is dismissive of the people who oversee the process. It means they should never get any “credit” or “blame” for the strengths or weaknesses. They should only wait it out because it will get better… just because.
And the farm system a decade ago was overrated (obviously)… and it wouldn’t have been put together entirely by the current administration (Hendry obviously was part of it).
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
What else are they supposed to do?
I say it’s a cycle because it is. A FO is often shooting for balancing the major league team and the minors, but in the end if you want to win eventually the scale tips towards the MLB side. That’s what happens. I know this board, and all boards, have a need to hand out blame for those times, but the people who actually deal with that stuff don’t care for blame because blame doesn’t get anything done, ever.
ALL top ranked farm systems are overrated…we were ranked high at the time because we had a crap ton of high upside talent that everyone liked. As what often happens, most of those guys didn’t turn out. You can do this for pretty much any farm system, ever. Weirdly enough there’s still guys from that system in the MLB…a good thing. That overrated system still set us up for a 5 year run with Lee and Ramirez, and THAT is the job of a farm system.
No.
Just no. To label farm systems a “cycle” suggests there’s nothing a FO could do to impact the outcome.
Regardless of whether you care to assess “blame” (you certainly have no problem giving credit), FOs have an impact on the success (or lack thereof) of a farm system.
Of course you’ll eventually tip the scales toward trading prospects for MLB help.
And there’s a 99.87% chance you have no direct knowledge of how “the people who actually deal with that stuff” think… so there’s no need to play amateur psychologist.
And the system of 10 years ago had a rather limited impact on the 5-year run.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
There's plenty a FO can do to impact the outcome...
MY POINT is that at some point the focus WILL and HAS TO switch to the MLB level.
What do you think the Wilken hire of ‘05 was? The FO sitting on their hands with the farm system? You think you’re so ahead of them as you sit and ignore everything they’re working on and have worked on? It’s…something.
The system of 10 years ago landed us Ramirez (Hill and whoever) and Lee (Choi, our top prospect after Hill plus others). Those were the two hitters they built the run on. So yeah…Back to the drawing board for you.
Your big bit of evidence is the hiring of Wilkin 7 years ago?
So that means we’ve entered the point where you start talking in circles while moving goal posts.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
Wow.
So now the hiring of Wilken means nothing because it happened 7 years ago. Then you accuse me of moving the goalposts…the comedy in that…
Here’s the thing…you care more about being right right now on this than I do. What I’m saying requires time and patience to see it unfold. I’ll enjoy watching it because well…the sky is where it should be where I am.
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 9:44 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Oh and just so it hits home again...
The system of ten years ago that…according to you who never moves a goalpost but rather kicks the ball right through….landed our best hitters for that 5 year run. Both of them.
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 9:48 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Oh and just so it hits home again...
The system of ten years ago that…according to you who never contributed….landed our best hitters for that 5 year run. Both of them.
Sorry to bring that up again. Just me moving the goal posts!!
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 9:49 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
As for goalposts...
Look where this thread started and where it ended up.
You made a fair point and I made a mistake. So good on you.
Too bad only the Harden trade qualifies as a really good trade made by Hendry since the Lee and Ramirez trades (which were 7-8 years ago).
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
Didn't say at all that it meant nothing.
Hiring Wilkin is one of the better things they’ve done.
The system should still have more high impact talent, given that the same FO group has been around for 7-8 years.
And most of us have been “patient” for much, much, much longer than you have. So you can save your speech about that particular virtue.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
Moving in the right direction
It is moving under the Ricketts. New DR training facility. New ST home (even though the contract was up). More ML scouts. More money being spent on ML signings. Eventhough I do not trust Hendry 100% it is under his direction that the low teams are doing well. It does not mean we have blue chip players but it is a interesting sign. The Ricketts move should start with replacing Crane K. with a bonafided MLB President.
Besides any trad eof Sorano would lead to DeWitt playing LF.
They haven't built anything in the DR.
They hope to.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on Jul 8, 2011 9:36 PM CDT up reply actions
The Yankees and Red Sox systems
are fairly weak right now, IMO. Red Sox due to trading, Yankees pretty much always have some guys that are overrated.
Most prospects are overrated.
The Yanks and Sawks use Prospects to get All-Stars near their prime. Also, to pick up expiring contracts to get more picks.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
fortunately for some of us I don't think Jim Hendry...
…will be given the chance to screw it up all over again.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
It's to the point where that's literally all I care about.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
Seems like that's literally all anyone cares about here.
It should take us far.
Luckily we're just people on a blog so it doesn't really matter.
GM's are in charge of Managers, not the other way around.
FYI, without using google what was Jim
Hendry’s first job with the Cubs? …..you know what? I know you will use google so I’ll tell you, he was hired as “director of player development”. Who/ what did he develop? What were his accomplishments that would bring about his promotion once McFAIL was gone.
You seem to not realize just how bad the Cubs farm system has been for the last 30 years. Starlin Castro is the first player since Mark Grace to come out of the Cubs farm system that is an All Star Caliber player. MARK friggin GRACE!!!!
You ought to learn a thing or two before you go shooting your mouth off because the Cubs farm system hasn’t been good enough to stock the MLB roster with good position players and it certainly hasn’t been good enough to act as a feeder for other organizations.
btw, most of the turnaround (if you want to call it that) with the farm system has been due to Tim Wilken not Big Jim.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Well, if the team would like to hire me I'd be more than willing to
put together a detailed and complete examination of the ENTIRE front office. For now, when debating with someone who has minimal reading comprehension skills on his best day, I’m going to stay generic.
I don’t particularly care who the 3B next year is. I don’t think it will matter in the grand scheme of things. I think that much money could be put to work elsewhere. Which was my point. I believe resigning ARAM to one more year is throwing it away.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm sure that detailed and complete examination would be...
unbiased without a hint of bitter.
Not particularly caring who the 3B next year is exactly why I’m ecstatic with the fact that our front office does not hold people who think like you. You sound like a guy who enjoys losing. Your master plan includes actively making the team worse because “you don’t care.” I think I’d rather have Hendry.
I believe that resigning Ramirez for one more year would be wise, considering what’s available at 3B. I believe we could probably get away with a platoon at 3B, but only if they don’t mind fulfilling your prophecy and tanking 2012 too.
This is where fundamentally you and whoever else will always disagree with me. Most of you have not only thrown away this year, which is fine I guess, but you’ve chosen to throw away next year and I’d even guess the year after too. Someone posted an article from the Economist about how Cubs fans have learned to live with losing…even find enjoyment in it….this is a perfect example of that.
And this response is why I said there's no point in detailing it to someone like you
who is so obviously lacking is reading comprehension.
Explain to me please, how signing ARAM saves 2012? He’s on the team this year…how’s that working out?
I also find it funny that you keep calling me out for saying that 2012 is not going to be a contending season, when you are on record as saying you knew 2011 was going to be bad. The hypocrisy is hilarious
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions
You're not going to detail it because
you’ve got nothing. At least admit to it. You’ve already conceded 2012. That’s the kind of FO guy you’d be, and the kind of fan you are. I probably wouldn’t want to hear it anyway.
If I really have to sit here and hold your hand while explaining to you what having a good, productive MLB 3B would do for the 2012 team then you only continue to prove how much of a waste of time it is actually talking baseball with you.
BTW: As with most things, the hypocrisy you see makes no sense. 2011 is not only actually happening, but MANY called it during the offseason. I’m not making some special physic reading on 2011 like you are on 2012. Anyone who knew anything saw this team as maaaaaaaaaaybe .500 or slightly above if things broke right, which it didn’t from the moment the 4 and 5 starters went down in week 1. The imaginary hypocrisy is imaginary.
There's that lack of reading comprehension again.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Hey there's an insult again.
Still ROTFL at this imaginary hypocrisy.
there is a difference between
saying that 2012 is lost ABANDON HOPE ALL YE WHO ENTER and saying that 2012 is lost so lets do everything we can to rebuild for the future.
In scenario A you throw a crap ton of crap money at buying a ball of clay to fix the Hoover Dam and after it breaks you say, well shit, that didnt work and you are back to square 1 rebuilding the entire dam, unfortunately you now dont have anything but a pile of rubble (Soriano-esque contracts) and a lot of dead people (empty seats) that you have to clear out before you can properly rebuild the dam.
Scenario B has you saying that the bad part of Hoover Dam need to be taken out carefully and rebuilt with new concrete and then you keep doing this until you have a brand new Hoover Dam ready for the next 100 years but in the mean time you have power for a large area and no dead people.
You're literally not making any sense.
So to recap, in the offseason, many people made a prediction looking at home bad this team is, saying that, what a shock, we were going to be bad in 2011. This is, to you, just fine and dandy. So when Nunya, or anyone else, looks at how bad this team is and how many aspects of it there are to fix, and says we’re going to be bad in 2012, that somehow is wrong? IT’S THE SAME THING and I can practically guarantee that every f’n argument you’ve started this year about seeing how bad 2011 was going to be are going to be the same arguments you’ll start NEXT YEAR, saying that you saw how bad the team was going to be.
I also have no clue what you’re getting at saying anyone who kne anything saw us as .500 or slightly better at best, when many, yourself included, said we would be bad “period”.
I mean, what, are you being purposefully difficult? Is English not your first language? What?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Honeslty, I would guess that he doesn't believe half of what he says
and is one of those guys who just enjoys annoying people.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Clearly acceptable behavior...
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions
*how bad this team is
not “home bad this team is”
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions
I really don't think what I'm saying is that complicated.
Unfortunately, you guys make it so. I try and I try…but clearly it’s not going anywhere. Oh well.
But that's the thing...
The Cat thinks that a stud 1B fixes everything and makes the Cubs division winners next year.
But as you point out, those who look at the team, see glaring holes and about 116.5 million already tied up in payroll for 9 players by following MrCat’s plan for 2012 and see anything but roses are just delusional.
No, I dont.
Some here just like to think that so that they have something easy to go after.
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 9:37 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I'd agree that the Cubs may well pick up Ramirez' option
now that he is leading NL third basemen in hitting.
However, if he left, the Cubs could consider a platoon of Flaherty and Baker, with LeMahieu, DeWitt, and others in the mix. The position would be maybe league average for 2012, but they could go that route if they want to spend Ramirez’ money on someone else.
Angel Guzman is the man.
maybe league average in batting average
but ridiculously below average in power categories
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jul 8, 2011 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions
Have you looked at the 3B position lately?
An OPS of .750 with a line of something like .275/.330/.420 would be middle-of-the road. Flaherty’s career minor league slugging is .471, and it’s higher against righties. Baker’s career major league slugging is .446, but .549 against lefties. Their defense might be below average, and they may K too much, but power wouldn’t be the concern, relative to the league.
Angel Guzman is the man.
You can't be elite everywhere...
If you can fill middle of the road for cheap and go elite elsewhere, you do so.
It’s a balancing act. Unfortunately the current roster is all off balance.
That's...
we’re talking about 3B, a position we’re currently one of the few teams who can say we’re above average at. We’re going to make that position worse next year for what? The future one day?
I just don’t see it that way. It’s not that inflexible, and Ramirez is probably as good as we can do at 3B next year. I want to contend next year. I want this franchise to be taken seriously next year. I don’t care if they fail at winning a WS so long as they put a good product on the field that can help us compete in the Central. Ramirez would help there. If the lowly Pirates can compete in this division with a mediocre at best team, then this team is very capable of showing a spark next year.
If Baker/Flaherty + player they add helps more than Ramirez
It’s not worth paying to be above average at 3B… You need to plan for the big picture, not position by position. Planning position by position is how the Cubs got themselves into this mess.
When does this big picture show up?
I’d think looking to get lucky on an inexperienced platoon while trying to draw in big FAs is showing two separate plans….Which is not a good thing. Waiting around for the big day makes far less sense than going after it…A Fielder/Pujols – LeMahieu/Barney/whoever – Castro – Ramirez IF is a pretty damn good one.
LaMaheieu is no more proven than Flaherty who you're trying to tear down.
Barney, after only 60 games is less proven than Baker too.
How can you push a Barney/LaMehieu 2B combo and say Flaherty/Baker is inexperienced? That’s insane.
3B is more offense based.
Also, Flaherty despite being two years older and posting his best offensive season got beat out by Lemahieu to the show. LeMahieu is probably the better prospect.
Oh and Baker is a FA so the platoon partner would be Franchise.
by SenorGato on Jul 11, 2011 12:08 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Baker? No. It'd probably be Flaherty
I seriously disagree with the Pena re upping. Especially before going after Fielder.
Disagree with Pena re-upping
or re-upping Pena? I’m in the ‘offer him arbitration’ camp.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
A hunch and body language "tell"
Ramirez appeared distant and emotionally removed from the game and team last night after the big comeback even though his hit took an 8th inning lead.
I think there are real negotiations under way where ever they may be.
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
He always looks like that. LOL.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
I was just going to say that, without the LOL
He’s seemed pretty distant and uninterested for most of the season
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jul 8, 2011 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions
LOL
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either
by Doggie Stalker on Jul 8, 2011 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions
Honestly, there's something to this.
Ramirez often looks less than enthused.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
he could be one of those guys
that plays baseball because he is good at it not because he loves it…just like a 7 footer playing basketball in high school because he is tall
Sorry
But did you see Ramirez glad-handing Campana in the dugout after he scored the go-ahead run? If you did you wouldn’t have groused about his body language an inning earlier. The reality is, that while seemingly apathetic, I don’t think he should be fingered for body language issues in a game that got a club going nowhere 18 games under .500. I’d rather have him show restraint than the clappy clapperson routine of Campana scoring the go-ahead run as if it were a high school regional game.
"When the day comes with that last winning run and I'm crying and covered in beer. I'll look to the sky and know I was right to think someday we'll go all the way." - Vedder
And after the game he was obviously, or at least it was obvious to me, relieved that Marmol got the 27th out.
He was shaking his head in amazement that it had to be such an intense end. I saw him and Darwin razzing each other in a celebratory way at the end of the game hand shake.
"Beisbol been berry berry good to me." -Tony Oliva
Aramis hates everything.
I see it in his body language.
God I hope Soriano catches fire in the near future.
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
Even saving half of his contract over the next three years ...
would be huge for a team that is clearly in need of regrouping.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Yep.
And we would be getting rid of the worst defender on the team. Soriano’s occasional power is nice, but he clearly isn’t a good match with a rebuilding team.
Question, would you swap Soriano’s with the Yankees?
R.I.P. to my grandfather, Andrew Wiley
The reason I am a Cub fan forever
Will his insurance cover his contract if that happens?
What are the odds on spontaneous combustion??
What's the chances we could get one of Betances or Banuelos?
That would be awesome. Trading them for anything would be awesome as long as the Cubs don’t have to eat too much salary.
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 8, 2011 11:39 AM CDT reply actions
G'luck with that.
Maybe shoot for Brackman.
Could do worse...
Maybe he turns into a Rauch type…I don’t mind going after tall athletic pitchers with plus fastball and breaking ball stuff…especially since we’re doing quite well with pen arms.
There’s plenty of other arms in their system to look at though.
Not for Soriano, that's for sure
But there’s an extreme outside chance they could get one of them in a Ramirez deal. Especially if Ramirez keeps raking and the market for him keeps climbing.
Bleacher Nation - Cubs Rumors and News
Maybe if they negotiate with the Steinbrenners directly instead of Cashman.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions
It won't end well.
They’d probably lawl.
by SenorGato on Jul 8, 2011 9:32 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
interest in soriano and grabow?
maybe teams really do exist to take our crap
Blake "The Franchise" DeWitt will lead us to the promised land
After Wells to the Angels
nothing can be surprising.
by jerry morales rules on Jul 8, 2011 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions
and gave the cubs cash
Blake "The Franchise" DeWitt will lead us to the promised land
by jesus christos on Jul 8, 2011 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions
...and two aspirin to cover the future headache.
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Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes...
I’m hoping the Cubs just stop taking their calls… as long as Zduriencik runs that team.
--------------------------------
Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 8, 2011 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions
the mariners are so generous
Blake "The Franchise" DeWitt will lead us to the promised land
by jesus christos on Jul 8, 2011 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions
We got a Wells, too...if the Angels want him
With the 1st pick in the 2012 Baseball Amateur Draft, the Chicago Cubs select...
On a side note, I'd trade my left nut to get with the blonde in the Miller Lite Banner
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
Gonna show her your O face?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jul 8, 2011 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Last time I heard that expression it came from blue mike LOL
Thankfully my computer blocks those
by Madison Cub Fan on Jul 8, 2011 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions
This is the best thread I've read in awhile.
Good topic. If there’s anyone in MLB willing to take on Sori’s contract, its the Yankees. Moving on would be best for both sides. Ramirez has been typical. Hopefully his hot streak pays off enough for either NYY or another club to take a gamble. Time for him to move along as well, since he only “cleans up” effectively for 2 months in a season. Grabow… meh.
But the best part was Al going “big font caps lock”. Awesome!
I have a really hard time time believing this.
Well, maybe Ramirez. But if the Yankees weren’t interested in Z, an average pitcher who is overpriced, I can’t see them being interested in other pieces that are below average and overpriced.
"Playoffs?!" -Jim Mora
by Castro Por Presidente on Jul 8, 2011 11:12 PM CDT reply actions
here we go
the annual maybe someone wants soriano hope game. and ramirez wont go to a team that has arod at 3rd. and if you think this team is bad now watch when ramirez leaves next year.the only run producer we have on this team.
A-rod has a slight meniscus tear-do the Yanks want Aramis?
Sounds like A-rod will try to play through it-if he has surgery, he’s out a month.
Here’s the tweet:
DKnobler
If A-Rod has (knee) surgery, probably out a month. Otherwise will play through, have surgery end of year
Not wishing injury on anyone
but this is about the only way the Cubs are going to unload a high-priced veteran (other than Pena) mid-season.
Angel Guzman is the man.
The untold story could be that ARod will be limited in the field the rest of the year
And with his ailments the past few years, may need a lot of time at DH next year, too. That would make Ramirez a potentially attractive pick for the Yankees.
Can’t see much of an argument for Soriano. Ramirez would be a better DH, plays an infield position adequately (vs. horror show in LF), and has a shorter commitment even with his 2012 option.
Get on the phone, Jim, see how much you have to add in to get Montero!
Either way...
Ramirez will get a lot of exposure DH-ing for the Yankees and splitting time at 3B, keeping both of them fresh. The Yankees are the only team that would want to trade for Ramirez without him waiving the option for next season. It’s almost too perfect.
--------------------------------
Just North of Wrigley Field
by jameslcrockett on Jul 9, 2011 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Montero
No going to happen. We’d have to include a top tier prospect and a buttload of money for that to happen.
I’d be happy with dumping salary, and calling up someone who may actually impact the future of the organization.
Can't we go ahead and officially replace Wayne Messmer with Dwight Smith?
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- Eric Hosmer redefines the Baltimore chop with infield double (Video)
- College player makes impossible over the fence catch to save tournament game (Video)
- Security!: Camden Yards guard collides with Royals’ Mike Moustakas
- The Juice: Nelson Cruz matches career high eight RBIs, Pujols stays hot in Seattle
- Benches clear at Fenway as Red Sox-Rays rivalry heats up
