Cubs Lose Sixth In Last Eight, 6-4 To Brewers
by Al Yellon on Aug 28, 2011 8:01 AM CDT
in Chicago Cubs Recaps
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All Alfonso Soriano's three-run double in the eighth inning Saturday night accomplished was to make the Cubs' 6-4 loss to the Brewers appear closer than it really was.
After Milwaukee's three-run first inning off Ryan Dempster, the outcome of the game was never truly in doubt. Dempster had one of his worst outings of the year, giving up seven hits and two walks in four innings and taking 89 pitches to record 12 outs. The Cubs are now 1-7 in Milwaukee this year and have been outscored 45-24 in the eight games.
The Brewers are now an otherworldly 49-16 at home. That puts them on pace to win 61 home games. Only four teams (1961 and 1998 Yankees, 1962 Giants and 1975 Reds) have won that many games at home since the 162-game schedule was instituted 50 years ago. The cautionary tale for Brewers fans is that their road record (31-38) isn't that much better than the Cubs' road mark (25-39). Milwaukee, roaring toward the NL Central title, will likely have home field against the Braves, who appear to be headed toward the wild card. But if they lose just one home game, they could be headed for a quick playoff exit. (The best home record for a Cubs team in the expansion era is 55-26, in 2008.)
What more can be said about a game like this one? Not a heck of a lot. The Brewers hit three home runs (Corey Hart, Casey McGehee and Prince Fielder). The Cubs didn't. When the Cubs had a shot at getting back into the game in the seventh inning, they left the bases loaded. Sound familiar?
I don't have a lot more to say about Saturday night's game, so let me mention that Justin Verlander of the Tigers won his 20th game of the season on Saturday. He's the first pitcher to register his 20th win in August since Curt Schilling did so for the 2002 Diamondbacks, and was the first Tigers pitcher to accomplish that since Mickey Lolich in 1971.
The last Cubs pitcher to win his 20th game in August was Fergie Jenkins, also in 1971, the year he won his only Cy Young Award. In those four-man rotation days, Fergie made nine more starts after that 20th win, on August 20, 1971 against the Astros. He went 4-3 to finish 24-13.
Of course, starting pitcher wins don't mean what they used to; since Jenkins won 24 games in 1971, only three Cubs have won 20 games: Rick Reuschel in 1977, Greg Maddux in 1992 and Jon Lieber in 2001, all winning exactly 20. We seem so far from a Cubs pitcher being at that level.
I'm rambling, I know. And dreaming. This bad dream of a season continues in Milwaukee today. The game preview will post at 11:30 a.m. CDT.
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Today's Boston Globe had an article speculating whether Theo Epstein would consider moving to the Cubs to be President of Baseball Operations.
I can’t get the link to work. Basically it says that Lucchino (Red Sox President) is not budging so Epstein could possibly move to the Cubs to have more control over a club. I’ll keep trying to send the link.
"Hey-Hey! Home Run! Attaboy Ronnie!" ~ Jack Brickhouse
Who knows?
Epstein has done a great job in Boston. Whether he’d leave, and whether Tom Ricketts would hire him — anyone’s guess.
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Al,
I always feel like you know more than what you’re allowed to say. Secrets, secrets, secrets!
"Whenever one finds himself in the majority, it is time to step back and reflect," Mark Twain.
by WindisBlowingOut! on Aug 28, 2011 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions
Actually..
…. in this case I’m just guessing like everyone else. No inside knowledge.
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There is some smoke here -
First Buster Olney, now the Globe. My guess is either that Epstein is considering such a move, or that he wants Boston to THINK he’s considering such a move.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Or the writers could just be speculating.
Happens all the time.
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Writers?
Speculate? Bah.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
If Dempster is considered the "Ace" of this staff,
and I may be stating the obvious here, but the Cubs really need to make some changes this offseason. Garza should be the ace, and Dempster is pitching like a 3rd or 4th starter at best.
"Whenever one finds himself in the majority, it is time to step back and reflect," Mark Twain.
by WindisBlowingOut! on Aug 28, 2011 8:14 AM CDT reply actions
Sure
He seriously needs to work on his own fielding, however. He has 14 unearned runs, and a decent portion of those are due to his own 7 errors.
This season’s terrible fielding may be a fluke for him, but it just keeps happening.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Same with Garza.
I believe Al posted a stat the other day that said in Garza’s last 3 starts (or maybe in 3 or Garza’s previous starts) the Cubs have averaged 4 errors a game? This team’s fielding has been atrocious. Maybe Dempster’s goofy glove waggle is distracting them.
"Whenever one finds himself in the majority, it is time to step back and reflect," Mark Twain.
by WindisBlowingOut! on Aug 28, 2011 8:38 AM CDT up reply actions
Dempster only has 3 unearned runs.
Garza is the one with the horrific defense. He’s contributing to that 4 errors per game and those 14 unearned runs. It’s like having a pitcher who SHOULD be allowing 3.5 runs/game, but instead the opposition gets an extra free run.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Where's Maddux?
Before he leaves the Cubs again, the greatest fielding pitcher of recent memory should be willing and able to give Garza a few fielding tips that apparently are not in the Mark Riggins skill set.
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
Positions in the rotation are really overrated.
you could say Garza is the three starter because he pitched the third game of the season, but he’s obviously the top guy right now and I’m sure the Cubs know that and consider him the “ace”.
Sure
But Len and Bob continued to call Demp the “Ace” yesterday, stating that it was a battle of the “Aces,” Gallardo and Dempster. And with Greinke and Marcum on the Brewers, is Gallardo really the “Ace?”
"Whenever one finds himself in the majority, it is time to step back and reflect," Mark Twain.
by WindisBlowingOut! on Aug 28, 2011 9:39 AM CDT up reply actions
Does it really matter?
In fact, Randy Wolf has had a better year than Greinke. By most measures, Gallardo has been the Brewers’ best and most consistent pitcher this year.
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No, it doesn't.
It just seems like teams put too much importance on having a staff “Ace” then on having a well put together staff.
"Whenever one finds himself in the majority, it is time to step back and reflect," Mark Twain.
by WindisBlowingOut! on Aug 28, 2011 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Hmmmm...
Not sure I agree. The Braves had a very well put together staff in the day. With the ridiculous amount of postseason off-days, they were all-too-often beaten by inferior teams (iirc) with top-heavy rotations.
Maddux was great against mediocre teams. He could be beaten by really good hitting squads, though, way more often.
Baseball requires balance through the year, and prefers top-heavy health in October.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
by timh815 on Aug 28, 2011 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Correct.
In fact, seems as if Cubs (yet again) have no true Ace…just a lot of 2-5 (if not 3-5) SPs trying to play the role.
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
hey jeff....where ya been?
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on Aug 28, 2011 10:57 AM CDT up reply actions
Hello CG
I’m in process of settling in at Pops (temporary), arranging financing and home shoppin’…it’s keeping me pretty busy. Also, yardwork, b-day parties and weddings… yipes!
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
glad to see you're having a little fun with all that work you're doing....Go Cubs!
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on Aug 28, 2011 11:04 AM CDT up reply actions
Thanx!
Gotta run… To-Do List is longer than my arm! Hello to ALL! Go Cubs (Lets just hope it’s in the right direction!!!) :]
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
You're right
I definitely don’t view Dempster as the ace of this staff. He is the first starter in the rotation, so he’s got that label as a default. So, the question is, what defines the ace? The guy with the best stuff? The leader of the staff?
"Whenever one finds himself in the majority, it is time to step back and reflect," Mark Twain.
by WindisBlowingOut! on Aug 28, 2011 11:43 AM CDT up reply actions
IMHO
a lil of both. A stopper. Someone the opposition doen’t look forward to facing. We do not (currently) have that SP.
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Going to the game today
I might just treat it like I do when I go to Brewers games with my friends:
-Play it dumb when we have 5 minutes before the game starts and I still have some brats on the grill; miss opening pitch.
-Only get excited for the Sausage Race
-Pray for a quick but solid game
We’ll see how it goes today in the stands. Miller Park is quickly becoming Comiskey North. If you’re a Cubs fan going up to Miller Park this season, you’re paying for all the idiots before you who went, got drunk, and embarrassed our fan base. All we can do is grin and bear it.
"You just don't know understand how frustrating this is"- Kevin Borseth
Didn't the Cubs lose 6 of 7 (not 7 of 8)?
"Hey-Hey! Home Run! Attaboy Ronnie!" ~ Jack Brickhouse
Colvin has been making some really good contact lately, nice to see him finally find some holes.
feet firmly nailed to the floor of the Tyler Colvin bandwagon...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Aug 28, 2011 8:53 AM CDT reply actions
I can't tell if you're being sarcastic
But he deserves it after 2-4 with a double and a single.
feet firmly nailed to the floor of the Tyler Colvin bandwagon...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Aug 28, 2011 8:57 AM CDT up reply actions
I am being sarcastic....He has to play while looking over his shoulder at Quade.
He has more pressure on him (and Castro) than other players becasue of the way Quade has treated them.
And yes Colvin brought some of that on himself for hitting .140…..
But it does not matter now. The team is horrid. Just let the kid play.
Looks like he did
lineup per bruce:
CubsInsider Chicago Cubs
by BruceMiles2112
#Cubs lineup @ #Brewers (8/28): Castro SS, Barney 2B, Ramirez 3B, Pena 1B, Colvin RF, Byrd CF, Soriano LF, Hill P, Coleman P
6 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply
Game preview will post at 11:30 am CT.
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Wish Tony could get a start in CF, or better yet Jackson....
I guess its better to lose with the vets that got us here,
Daily Herald says
Jackson “iffy” as a call up. (They don’t seem to want to start his “big-league clock” running…)
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
I want to see him, he's just tearing up AAA.
feet firmly nailed to the floor of the Tyler Colvin bandwagon...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Aug 28, 2011 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions
Thusly
the perplexing Cubs habits continue. Is he the next Starlin Castro… or the next Corey Patterson/Felix Pie???
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
cant really
bitch because nobody is beating the brewers. plus it’s a lost season so let’s get it over with.sooner the better.what will be interesting is how the brewers fare in the playoffs. if you had to play them now you’d be in deep shit. will they carry this over or succumb to the curse of the central 3 and gone?
A few questions
Why is Byrd still playing? I find it a baseball anomaly to see someone hitting .297 with 350+ ab’s, 7hr, while only being able to drive in 29. That number is shocking for someone not hitting 1st or 8th in the lineup.
Will the new GM be allowed to structure his staff after the new baseball model. No longer in today’s game do the new GM’s play the role of lone wolf, they actually have staffs with co or assistant GM’s that they can bounce ideas off of.
Can we please be rid of dumb and dumber by the end of this season. Quade and Riggins both seem unsuited to manage and coach the Hackensack Bulls, which is a fictional team…..you know where I’m going. I’ve seen enough.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
I’ve seen enough.
I think we all have. But, we have to see 29 more games before changes come.
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Do you think Quade is coming back next year?
I don’t. I expect him to be fired the day after the regular season.
by jeffmills1972 on Aug 28, 2011 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions
You have to see
We have choices
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
Although our starting pitching is in shambles and the defense is awful
I hope the new GM does not overlook how bad our offense is in manufacturing runs. Last place in all of MLB in taking walks and everyone knows how bad the team is with RISP, and Byrd is part of that problem. We will not be able to make it to the playoffs with a 1st baseman that hits .220 and less than .200 with RISP as our cleanup hitter.
Al, I'm amazed all these guys want to be Cubs
Dempster, Ramirez, Pena, Byrd…they all want to come back. I question whether this guys really want to win. Says alot about their mental makeup, stay here and keep losing 90 games rather then go to a contender. Other than a couple guys (Castro, Marshall, maybe Garza)I hate the nucleus of this roster. The new GM when he gets this job is gonna realize what a mess this is.
Dempster actually was a little cagey about returning after Hendry's dismissal.
And Ramirez’s agent said he’s no sure thing.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Now that the cushion might be gone, some players may want to move on.
ARam was all for staying before Hendry got canned. It may not be quite the country club next year and some of these players will not like it.
I'm not too sure A-Ram hasn't played his way to a ....
…3 year, 40-45 M dollar deal with someone. Cubs may lose him.
Good job, Tom...now on to the manager problem.
Back in the day
before multi-year deals, it is purported some players wanted to hit .285 and keep the checks rolling in, instead of hitting .310 and raising the ante and expectations.
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
The Cubs are on pace to finish about 25 games out
A stunning number when you have the second highest payroll in the NL. Just laughable. What’s the farthest out the Cubs have ever finished since they went to divisional play?
The Cubs have 29 games left.
In order to EQUAL the number of wins from the really bad 2010 team, the Cubs would have to go 18-11. I really don’t see that happening.
I’m not sure if winning 76 or 77 games would have saved Quade, but I’m pretty sure winning less than last year’s total will be it for him. I’m also really starting to think that some speculation about who will be on the team next year — including yours truly — is probably premature. The new GM will have a LOT of say, and I wonder if whoever that is will be more burn-the-village-to-save-it then any of us here are predicting.
This squad just doesn’t work very well together. It’s not a “player or two away.” Other than Castro, Marshall, Garza and maybe Soto, there isn’t a lot here that should be considered a plus if they return next year. Some other guys can be viewed with upside — i.e. dealing them shouldn’t be a priority, but not as locks (Colvin, Barney, etc.).
The better play for most of August probably saved us from 100 losses. But I’d be surprised if this bunch cracks 70 wins.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Ha -- I meant to say speculation FROM yours truly
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Question.
In September 2006, did you see that team as constituted as being a contender in 2007?
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I did not.
However, there are some pretty important differences between now and then.
The Cubs in 2006 weren’t maxed out (or close) on payroll. They had a fairly legit ace in Zambrano, and two guys (Lee and Ramirez) in their primes who could stabilize the lineup.
Those are the pluses the 2006 team had that we don’t have now. And we have a helluva lot more negatives.
You know I hate this kind of thinking: The 2005 Astros came back to win the pennant — so have hope that the Cubs can when they’re 15 out by Memorial Day! Similarly, the 2006 Cubs had fewer bad payroll obligations, more legit cornerstones and an owner who was willing to spend a helluva lot more money.
We have none of that now, so pointing to the turnaround from 2006-07 doesn’t seem to apply.
Here’s another question: In September 1999, did you see that as a team as constituted as being a bottom feeder in 2000?
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
by elgato on Aug 28, 2011 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
In answer to your 1999 question...
… yes, it looked that way.
While you’re right that you can’t necessarily see this team as improving in 2012, we also do not yet know what kind of budget will be set and who the new general manager will be. Once we know those things, we can make some more accurate projections.
Until then, assuming 2012 will be a repeat of 2011 is based on insufficient information.
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Given what Ricketts has said about focusing on player development ...
which I agree with, do you really see him greenlighting a 2006-07 style spending spree? Or even anything close?
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
G'morning El
I too tend to agree that we’re a bit further from being a true contender than we are from being just another team in the NL Central
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
I keep saying this ...
but Zambrano really hurt the Cubs. Instead of having an overpriced No. 3 starter, we have an $18 million tab (maybe less, if another team will pay some of the freight) and the need for another No. 3 starter on top of everything else.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
There's no guarantee yet that Zambrano is done with the Cubs
that’ll be for the new GM to decide. Worst case scenario you keep him and if he flips out again you cut him. He’ll still give decent production as a #3-4 starter. If Z doesn’t come back, then it’ll kill the Cubs, instead of needing a bat and one SP, they’ll need a bat and 2 SP. There’s not enough money for a bat and 2 SPs and still being able to resign Rami if we are still paying Z $15+ million to go away.
I know its not likely, but I’d love to see a new GM give BigZ another chance, we kind of need him next year…..
I'd say he's 90 percent gone.
I agree with the scenario you laid out, but I don’t think Z ever pitches for the Cubs again.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
I agree.
The 30-day disqualified list ends on Sept. 12. We should have a resolution by then, I’d think.
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Z is finished as a Cub
It speaks volumes as a man when you can’t get one teammate to step up on your behalf. If they hire the right GM one of the first and most important changes we’ll see will be cultural, business as usual will have to change. It’s sad when it took this long for the Cubs to finally be rid of him, in fact because Barrett was not the talent of a Carlos Z he was the one shipped out when it should have been Z all along.
Or how about a manager that decides to bench his player only after taking criticism from a sports commentator the night before? That all has to go, it needs to end beginning with Z.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
by troutfishin on Aug 28, 2011 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't know eg,
We can spend big on Fielder and another upper-tier FA and maintain our payroll this year. Just a wild guess, but I don’t think Ricketts is going to significantly drop payroll. I think there will be a small decrease or it will maintain until we’re in a better position to spend.
Castro only hits doubles.
See above.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
A "spending spree"?
Probably not. But that still doesn’t mean the new GM can’t make significant changes.
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Well, of course not.
But how do you make those changes — given the Soriano and Zambrano contracts, to say nothing of the other big deals that aren’t trainwrecks — and improve this team enough WITHOUT a 2006-07 style bump?
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Improve this team to possible contenders, I mean.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Ask Andrew Friedman how he does it in Tampa.
Yes, I know that requires building a strong system.
But teams have made the playoffs in recent years without spending sprees. Not saying it WILL happen, only that it’s possible.
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We need a strong system or a lot of money to spend.
Do we have either?
Now, I like Ricketts’ long-term thinking. But short term? The Z incident sets back contention by a year unless the new GM is a freaking wizard in dumping some cash so we have it to spend elsewhere.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
serious question....do we really have to eat his contract if no other club will take him?
would making him a reliever be a horrible choice? remember there would be a new GM, new manager and hopefully a new clubhouse culture?
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on Aug 28, 2011 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions
The Cubs don't seem open to bringing him back.
Ricketts said as much on ESPN.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Right.
My guess is that they’ll reach some kind of buyout settlement with him — probably somewhat less than the total he’s owed — and he’ll become a free agent.
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in your opinion, do you think it will hurt the Cubs more overall if he stays or leaves?
“leaves” as in leaving a huge gap in our rotation
"Well-behaved women seldom make History"---Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
by cooliogirl47 on Aug 28, 2011 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions
It will help if he stays.
Enough of that behavior.
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Sorry, I meant it will help the team if he LEAVES.
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The Rays didn't suddenly get real good
Years of finishing near the bottom and good drafting and player development made them a contender. There is nothing that can be done by next year. We have way too many holes and payroll commitments to expect major improvements with any GM.
I will be happy to see real accountability begin. Dump guys like Pena and Byrd and Grabow. Let’s lose with prospects in the field rather than vets with no more upside.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
not happening, Qaude is gone
bank on it, nothing is saving his job, not even a 29 game winning streak.
The only thing that could save Q is if Bush was hired perm GM
And the owner has already said that isn’t happening…
I'd be thrilled if they go 14-14 the rest of the way.
I just don’t think they have it in them. they look dead at the plate in their approach and some look like they have already mentally checked-out.
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on Aug 28, 2011 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions
So Al. Are you predicting and end to the NL Central playoff drought
With the Brewers thus year?
"...the name on the front is a lot more important than the name on the back." Ryne Sandberg 7/31/05
by shifafaontheside on Aug 28, 2011 11:27 AM CDT reply actions
It would look that way, wouldn't it?
But then, the 2008 Cubs looked like they’d win their division series, too.
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I was thinking the same thing.
Pretty remarkable that no NL Central team has won a playoff game since 2006
"...the name on the front is a lot more important than the name on the back." Ryne Sandberg 7/31/05
by shifafaontheside on Aug 28, 2011 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions
That may change this year.
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on Aug 28, 2011 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Brewers won one with CC around
I'm a Cubs fan. The Jaded Bitterness comes as a Standard Feature.
Right.
No NL Central champion has won a playoff game since 2006. The 2008 Brewers won one as a wild card.
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