Ryan Dempster Gets 'Respect', But Cubs Lose 2-1
So I have a question for Mike Quade this morning. Exactly what are you in the business of? Giving "respect", or winning baseball games?
Here's what Paul Sullivan wrote in the Tribune about Quade's decision to let Dempster bat in the seventh inning on Tuesday night:
Quade said he wanted to show Dempster "respect" by allowing him to hit with one out in the seventh inning, despite the fact the Cubs were losing by a run and Dempster's pitch count was high. Before the game, Quade said he would use next week's off day to get Dempster an extra start in an effort to let him try to reach the 200-inning mark.
Dempster had thrown 104 pitches through six innings, and after giving up a leadoff home run to Brandon Phillips and another double in the first, had settled down and thrown pretty well (even while walking too many guys; he wound up with six). But Dempster, although an excellent bunter, isn't a very good hitter and is having an awful year at the plate (.078 going into the game). It's really a no-brainer, in that situation, down just 2-1, to bat for Dempster.
Nope. Quade let Dempster bat. He hit a soft line drive at Phillips and after that, the Cubs would have no further baserunners and lost 2-1 to the Reds, ending their three-game winning streak.
I guess you could argue that this is a lost season and so things like this for individual players mean something. Quade also said that he's going to "try" to get Dempster enough starts to get him to 200 innings for the fourth year in a row.
That's all wonderful -- since Fergie Jenkins left the Cubs by trade after 1973, only three pitchers (Carlos Zambrano, Steve Trachsel and Rick Reuschel) have had four straight years of 200+ innings -- but I can't imagine, say, Tony LaRussa doing what Quade did. Or Bobby Cox. Or Joe Torre, or Joe Girardi, for that matter. Those men wanted to win, no matter what. If Quade bats for Dempster in that situation and the PH gets a hit and starts a rally, maybe the Cubs win the game, and Dempster gets a "win", though those don't have as much meaning for individual pitchers as they used to.
To me, it's just another symptom of this management style. Players come first. The team seems to come second. Wins almost seem secondary to giving players "respect".
Ryan Dempster is a great guy. He works hard and has done terrific charitable work and all his teammates seem to like him. But you'd think he'd rather win the game than throw one more inning.
Maybe the Cubs wouldn't have won anyway; Mike Leake was outstanding against them again Tuesday night. The Cubs couldn't hit with RISP (1-for-7) and the only run scored on a double play, after they got runners on first and third with nobody out.
But I think you have to do whatever you can to win when the situation presents itself. The Cubs didn't on Tuesday night. I will be glad when that mindset changes.
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Al you're getting jaded.
It’s easier if you stop caring!
Seriously, I read this as Quade letting Dempster throw as long as he could—it’s the end of the season and we have nothing to play for, so why not stretch him out.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Because you want to win?
Strange concept, I know.
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I'm not saying it makes sense, but that's how I read it.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Then again, I don't really understand the reasoning behind many of Quade's in-game decisions.
For a guy that’s spent his whole life around baseball his MLB in-game management is strange.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Sometimes I feel that he is in awe of all these big league players...
If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.
Well, that was kind of the point of what I wrote.
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Is there a chance you could edit this post
and include the Sarah Palin & Glen Rice bit? Please?
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Wait, what?
Sorry. Not going there.
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Absolutely...
…whatever happened to “respect for doing what is right for the team”.
This propensity to do what is best for the individual, has been firmly entrenched over the years by Jim Hendry. His philosophy was clearly this way and he hired people who do the same.
A serious culture change has to happen throughout the organization.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Which we should get starting with the new GM.
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To quote that great old Cub: Geeeeezzzzzz
If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.
Did you jump?
If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.
See it isn't all that difficult, is it?
If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.
Extra money for the State.
They already take more than their share. Just the principle of it. Not a big deal, because allegedly the Cubs donate all their revenue from this scheme.
"I'm not a broadcaster! I'm me!"--Ron Santo
I don't want to give them any extra money either
but I don’t have a problem with someone wanting to buy a Cubs plate for their car. If you buy anything you are giving them a cut of it in sales tax.
It was worth the extra money
because now I can find my car in a parking lot. I have a silver van. Do you have any idea how many silver vans are out there? Now I just look for my plate. No more do I embarrass myself walking up to someone else’s car.
Football? Football? What's a football?-Ralphie Parker
by katie casey on Sep 14, 2011 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions
We have a full bullpen.
We need to see what some of them can do and we have plenty of bats. No reason to throw the 3rd most pitches in your career this far out if the race. Does not make any rational sense.
We'll miss you Big Boy. #10 for Hall of Fame.
by mrcubsfan on Sep 14, 2011 7:39 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
WIll anyone, anywhere ever care that Dempster pitched 200 innings in 4 straight years?
I don’t even think Dempster will care that much. It barely even qualifies as a trivia answer.
The next time anyone will even think about Dempster’s “200 innings streak” will be a few years from now when someone else is getting close to doing it, and Al posts "since 1973, only 4 pitchers (Zambrano, Trachsel, Reuschel, and Dempster), have thrown 200 innings in 4 consecutive years. And we’ll all shrug, because it’s not an interesting or worthwhile stat.
I mean, Steve Trachsel did it. We aren’t talking about something amazing here.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
For most of the 2000s haven't the Cubs regularly let the league in Ks and IP?
I remember when we had Wood, Clement, Prior, Zambrano, Dempster, etc., we used to always lead in Ks and had tons of IP.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Strikeouts, definitely.
That was a Hendry thing, I think. He was always enamored of pitchers who could throw hard and strike out a lot of batters.
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Dempster sould have told Quade, "Dude, pinch hit for me already..."
“Chances are I’m not gonna get a base hit.”
Get 'em on, Get 'em over, Get 'em in!
I don't understand why this man says things like this
He HAS to know how idiotic that sounds. Why not just say “Dempster was pitching well, we thought he gave us the best chance of keeping the game close and giving us a chance to come back”
Instead he goes with “because I respect him”
Jesus H. Christ what an idiot
Jocketty to Cubs?
latest rumor…makes sense that he’d be a candidate. certainly knows the division well….i can’t see tony la russa managing cubs tho.
According to David Kaplan, no way.
Kaplan tweeted this morning that LaRussa has said he’d never manage the Cubs, and Jocketty seems happy where he is.
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But is the Reds owner happy with Jocketty?
Every day is a beautiful day for baseball!!
by cowsarecool220 on Sep 14, 2011 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions
They just won the division last year.
I can’t see him being fired.
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He doesn't have to be fired to be hired here.
by Nunyabidness on Sep 14, 2011 9:02 AM CDT up reply actions
True.
But I don’t see the Reds changing.
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Changing? What do they have to change?
Ricketts says “hey we’d like to talk to Walt” The Reds say “ok”
What change is needed here?
by Nunyabidness on Sep 14, 2011 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions
No, I don't see the Reds letting Jocketty walk.
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I'm confused
Why is LaRussa saying he’d never manage the Cubs used as a reason to say Jockety wouldn’t come here? LaRussa isn’t his manager NOW.
This seems like the kind of baseless speculation you generally rush in to denounce.
I’m not saying Jockety IS coming, but 1+1 doesn’t equal 3
by Nunyabidness on Sep 14, 2011 9:02 AM CDT up reply actions
True, too.
But the whole scenario put forth when this was reported, said that Jocketty would hire LaRussa.
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But that scenario was nothing but speculation
by Nunyabidness on Sep 14, 2011 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Q is only taking care of an old friend...
As we know, it was Dempster’s public endorsement of Quade last year that jump-started the media push to give Q the full-time job. Four straight years of 200-plus innings should be a powerful bargaining chip for Demp on his next contract, which hopefully will be with a team other than the Cubs.
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
Dempster isn't a free agent for another year.
All those innings will help him get another contract? Doubtful.
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Don't forget the all-important and ongoing push to get our stopper back to .500.
It’s a pity that a guy with an ERA close to 5.0 should have to wind-up with a sub-.500 record, especially after his strong second half. As TJ might say, personal goals matter!!!!!
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
200 Innings
Is what amounts to an achievement on this sorry team. 200 innings of completely mediocre pitching. Big effing deal.
That's up to him
He can choose not to exercise his option for 2012 in hopes of securing a multiyear deal. I don’t know that he will, but I would if I were him. This is his last chance at multiple guaranteed years.
...formerly known as zambranofan
Q's move last night shows confidence...
He may know he’s out, and doesn’t give a damn what anyone thinks. Or, he’s been given a quiet thumbs-up by owners, along with a mission to experiment with new strategies while taking care of his troops.
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
if the owners retain him they will lose ANY goodwill they have left with the fans,.
by TJ11 on Sep 14, 2011 8:54 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Except for my husband.
He still likes Quade. Every time I ask him why, he gives vague answers like “I think he’d be good with the young guys” or “no one would have won with the team this year.” I usually agree (go along) with him about everything, so I have really wanted to like Quade, but this is too much.
Football? Football? What's a football?-Ralphie Parker
Does your husband live in THIS reality?
Because if there’s one thing Quade has demonstrated without a doubt this season, it’s that he’s AWFUL with “the young guys”
That argument passed muster before the season started, before he made comments like “I trust the veterans more” But since the season began, it’s pretty obvious he’s terrible when it comes to giving young guys fair and adequate managing.
by Nunyabidness on Sep 14, 2011 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions
He's been with me too long
to be in reality anymore. It’s blissfully happy here though.
Football? Football? What's a football?-Ralphie Parker
by katie casey on Sep 14, 2011 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Does the casual Cubs fan even know who manages the team,
much less how to pronounce his name, or care whether or not he should be replaced? As we know, the guarantee of 3MM annual attendance regardless of performance leads ownership to discount the complaints of hardcore fans. Common sense tells us he’ll be out on 9/29, but then common sense last year told many of us Quade never should have been given the job.
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
Is it really a powerful bargaining chip? I doubt it.
No GM is going to be dazzled by the round-number-ness of 200 innings. “Hmm… 200, 200, 200… 192?” Don’t sign that guy!"
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on Sep 14, 2011 9:18 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
That is the last straw for Quade
I tried not to think negative about him, but after hearing this, I damn near posted an explitive about Q. He should be fired immediately for admitting his allowing the inmates to run the asylum. What an absolute embarassment. Let’s forgo the chance to win a game in the name of beefing up one players individual stats. Inexcusable!
Its been going on all year....
That is why the older players like him…(though I doubt the young ones do)
Aram does not want to come back because he is scared the Country Club will be leaving.
He should be fired immediately.
Needs to learn a hard lesson that this is absolutely not acceptable no matter if the season is “Lost” or not. Any baseball team in any league should make winning the game the only priority, and if someone is supposed to have a good enough baseball mind to be an MLB manager, he simply cannot forgo any logical decision to attempt a win for any reason other than player health/safety. But then to go and admit that he didn’t make the right choice so as to respect ONE player by allowing that player to achieve a personal statistic is just idiotic. Send him home. He needs to learn a lesson the hard way. If you don’t want to do all you can to win, get the hell off of this team.
He doesn't need to learn a lesson
No one else will EVER hire him to be a manager in the majors again….
by LT on Sep 14, 2011 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions
If Q is thinking
that the season is lost so why not give Demps some love and get his 200 innings, then why not give the kids a chance to play every day “if the season is lost”? Same thing, in my mind, Quade really is something, for a guy that’s been in baseball as long as he has, he really has no business managing a big club. Totally out of touch.
Fire Jim Hendry. Injuries aren't the problem.
It was in Sullivans article that Colvin had hit 4 HR off leake in his career....
Another nice move by Quade….
Guess we need to see what Byrd and Soriano can do this September!!!!
Horrid managing!!!!
The whole idea that LaHair is taking starts from Colvin is ridiculous
and not sitting Soriano or Byrd. Quade is running the team like it is a softball beer league. What an embarrassement, Dusty had to be chuckling inside.
No surprise.
This is the reason that Byrd continues to play day after day. You have to respect the vets.
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
I really don't think you're being fair, TJ
Its not like Byrd is Blake DeWitt or anything. I mean Byrd has 5 WHOLE RBI more than DeWitt! Hell, he’s got one more than Reed Johnson, in only 176 more at-bats! And he’s only two rbi behind former Cub Ronny Cedeno!
You’re way too harsh on Byrdsy
If we had strong upper management
they would step in and stop this “respect” and look to the future.
by LT on Sep 14, 2011 9:32 AM CDT up reply actions
really TJ?
weak on Leadership? Ricketts just fired the players GM. the one guy who was cultivating this feeling of good ole boy back scratching. He Fired him. Hendry is no longer here. Ricketts is now shopping for the next GM. how is that weak on leadership?
So i you can give you can take it.
It took WAY to long to do it and screwed them at the deadline.
We will see who they hire and fire before I think he is providing leadership.
There is a very real possibility that they could bring in a worse GM…..
Hope thats not the case, but this is the Cubs.
it didnt take too long.
the guy just invested a billion dollars. and had a guy that the majority of baseball respected running the baseball side. unfortunately the guy running the ship made one too many bad baseball decisions and had to go and ricketts pulled the trigger.
Bringing in a worse GM? really?
So i you can give you can take it.
So you think they could not bring in a worse GM....So if Hendry was the worst possible, why keep him as long as they did?
because for as bad as Jim Hendry turned out to be
he did do somethings right on occasion. he did alot of dumb things too, and cultivated the good ol boy society. I still dont think he was the WORST gm, in the end he was far from good or even decent. i dont know Hendry’s salary but it wasnt insignificant. and when a hard decision came about Ricketts made the right decision. I’ll trust him to make the right decision the next time and until his decisions lead this ball club to not improve or get worse i’ll trust him.
its one thing to question him while Jim was still pulling strings, Jim no longer is. i cant judge the man until he puts his guy in place. if that guy turns out to be the wrong guy then we can start questioning him.
So i you can give you can take it.
My guess is we will know pretty quickly how serious Ricketts is about winning by who they hire.
most of what you said should have been known by Ricketts long ago. We knew it….
well we knew the information that was available to us...
and we also didnt just invest a billion dollars of our money into the team, and we werent paying some guy a couple of million dollars to lead the team…who was respected in his position.
So i you can give you can take it.
Most fans knew long ago that Hendry had to go.....Ricketts if he was the big fan he said he was, should have known it too.
It led to Quade and this season’s waste of time.
not to get political...
but its like electing a president, fans (voters) can only speculate as to whats going on in the front office (white house)…we may not agree with all the decisions the big guy makes but we also dont really know the scenarios they are faced with.
So i you can give you can take it.
by epsilon on Sep 14, 2011 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Quade...
… is more like Terry Bevington.
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Don't forget Preston Gomez.
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
Yeah, Preston Gomez was pretty bad.
So was Amalfitano. In fairness, those teams had very little talent, probably even less than this year’s.
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Where's Amalfitano?
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
Joey
It was worth having Joey as manager just to hear Lou Boudreau try to pronounce his last name.
As Lou would say, "Uh-fel-ti-mah-no."
"Elder White! Look at the talent on those Cubs!" Harry Caray, KMOX Radio, 4/22/62
"And you have to wonder – What's the matter with Broglio?" Harry, KMOX, 5/24/64
How about
Tom “firehouse” Trebelhorn? Gene Michael?
"It's a funny old world. Man's lucky if he gets out of it alive." W.C. Fields
What about
Wendell Kim? Brilliant and inspirational manager!
"I lof to hit de home ron!"
I've gotta laugh at this. Quade should absolutely go but one day he gets a beat-down
for not playing the kids and trying to win meaningless games and today he gets the same treatment for not trying hard enough to win a meaningless game.
I guess you know you’ve really lost the fan base when this happens.
He should be playing the kids...and try to win the game with moves throughout the game.
PH for Dempster was a no-brainer…..
he did the same thing the first game of the year…..
I think bonehead moves like this piss you off more if you happen to have taken the time
to watch that particular game. I listened to about ten minutes of the game while I grilled last night and was blissfully unaware of the details of the loss until now. I’m sure if I was watching at the time I’d have been yelling at the TV.
I cant help myself, I still watch.
But I DVR the game when I can and speed through…It helps dull the pain.
Yea, sit Byrd
Colvin can handle CF so you can get LeHair, Colvin and Pena in lineup all at same time.
Byrd with RISP is tough to watch, he never comes up with the big hit and he’s had TONS of chances. I guess we have to give him a pass due to getting hit in face by pitch earlier and he could certainly bounce back RBI wise, but I’d rather see him in platoon/reserve role. Need more production from OF than we got this year.
Cubs release 2012 schedule; jump here to discuss.
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Dempster pitching over 80-90 pitches is jackassery.
And rearranging the rotation so he can have his magic 200-inning bonus kick in is bald-faced thievery. But hey, Dempster is hilarious and what not.
"I'm not a broadcaster! I'm me!"--Ron Santo
1st... 80-90 pitches? really??
2nd of all, he doesn’t have a 200 inning bonus.
Did Dempster kick your dog or something?
When I say I hate Quade and the 2011 Cubs.
I mean it. I haven’t watched a game in full in a while, and I’ve watched 95% of games since ‘96. I watch Quade’s press conferences and I can’t tell the difference between the Cubs wins or losses.
I’m fed up with him and this team.
'Never look down on anybody unless you're helping him up.'
by Unique on Sep 14, 2011 12:16 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
Well stated, Al.
To me, it’s just another symptom of this management style. Players come first. The team seems to come second. Wins almost seem secondary to giving players “respect”.
Seeya Jimbo! Good job, Tommy Boy!
Thank You
Al,
Very good column. It’s crazy how mad I can still get when I know the season is already over …but Quade still finds a way to show his incompetence.
"I feel great, I just wish my team played better"
todays article
once again why do people always mention especially about dempster what a great guy he is : what he really is is a overpaid under fivehundred pitcher i guess mthat makes him a typical jim hendry guy nough said
by notcubbiewubbie on Sep 14, 2011 12:42 PM CDT reply actions
I'll be glad when the
season is over and moves can be made. First move the new GM needs to make is getting rid of Quade. I’m sick of him.
Be the kind of woman that when your feet hit the ground each morning the devil says, "OH CRAP, SHE'S UP"!
I think this is pretty much the feeling across the board here.
Case in point, today’s line-up:
Castro SS
Johnson RF
Ramirez 3B
Pena 1B
Soriano LF
Byrd CF
Barney 2B
Soto C
Coleman P
I want to get angry, I really do. Rehashing anger over a veteran-laden line-up is just not on my to-do list today though. All I’m optimistic about these days is a new GM…
Holy crap......
Be the kind of woman that when your feet hit the ground each morning the devil says, "OH CRAP, SHE'S UP"!

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