Carlos Marmol Strikes Again; Derrek Lee Slam Defeats Cubs After Rain Delay
There was a 91-minute rain delay during Saturday's Cubs/Pirates game, in the bottom of the seventh inning with the Cubs having just taken a 5-3 lead.
Colorful images on smartphone radars made it look like it was going to keep raining for several hours and the teams wouldn't resume play. So I took the opportunity to leave Wrigley Field during the delay. (Looks like that was the right call, given the continued rain and the result of the game. Didn't look like more than a few hundred people stayed till the end.)
It's too bad the umpires didn't make that decision -- in fact, when the game eventually was resumed, it continued to rain at a moderate pace -- because we got Bad Carlos Marmol Saturday afternoon and he gave up a grand slam to his former teammate Derrek Lee with two out in the ninth inning. That gave the Pirates a 7-5 win over the Cubs. Maybe D-Lee was miffed with Marmol for putting him on the DL when he hit him in Pittsburgh just after the Pirates acquired him.
The game started in hot and humid conditions and rain appeared on the horizon but it appeared that it would hold off until the game could be finished. Then a strong storm cell popped up right over Wrigley and the seventh inning was played in a fairly steady downpour until play was finally stopped with Tyler Colvin at bat and two runs already in.
Casey Coleman wasn't really sharp -- he threw 53 strikes in 88 total pitches -- but managed to post his second straight good outing, two runs allowed in six innings. He struck out six. Again, if Coleman can keep posting starts like this, he could be a useful fifth starter for the 2012 Cubs.
Kerry Wood had given the Pirates a run to tie the game after the Cubs had taken a 3-2 lead. Wood's velocity looked pretty good, but some of his outings just aren't sharp. This was one of them. At times, he looks like the Wood of 2008 (or of the second half of 2010 with the Yankees). At other times, he looks done. It's hard to say who the real Wood is at this point. I'd love to see him come back next year and be a solid setup man, but the proverbial jury's still out on that.
Alfonso Soriano drove in four runs Saturday; that gives him 72 for the year. It is sobering to think that with just eight more -- entirely doable -- he'd have the biggest RBI total of his five-year Cubs career. Sure, he was a leadoff hitter much of that time, but he drove in 90+ as mostly a leadoff hitter for each of the five years before that. He's been injured, of course, much of his Cubs career. He won't make it to 140 games played this year. It would still be nice if the Cubs could find an AL team that could take him as a DH and even offset part of the $54 million Soriano is owed.
About Marmol, I really don't know what to say. He's having a bad year. His ERA blew up to 4.26, really awful for a closer, and the three walks gave him 39 in 63.1 innings -- increasing his WHIP to 1.389, much higher than the excellent 1.135 he had in 2010. He's allowed four home runs this year, which doesn't seem like a lot until you note that he gave up just one all of last year, and also that all four of the home runs have directly lost games. Two of them were three-run homers, two of them grand slams. In addition to today:
- May 31 vs. the Astros, three-run homer by Hunter Pence in the ninth inning, Cubs lost 7-3 after having a 3-1 lead going into the inning.
- July 8 vs. the Pirates, three-run homer by Michael McKenry, broke a 4-4 tie, Pirates won 7-4.
- August 16 vs. the Astros, walkoff grand slam by Brian Bogusevic, Astros won 6-5.
Apart from the fact that all four of these home runs were hit by players on bad teams, there's no way a good closer can do this and still be effective. Either someone has to figure out how to fix Marmol, or the Cubs need to deal him and find some other closer -- maybe Chris Carpenter?
Finally, I wanted to say a few words about the signing of farm director Oneri Fleita to a four-year contract extension, already being discussed in this FanShot. The reaction from most of the blogosphere seems to be: "ZOMG Ricketts, how could he do this to the new GM, Fleita wasn't going anywhere anyway!"
Step back for a second and think about this. Do you think that perhaps Tom Ricketts already has a GM hire in mind? And maybe he ran this move by one or more of the candidates and that GM candidate has already signed off on it? About the comments in the FanShot, the one about not using technology is well taken. Perhaps the new GM can institute such a system -- that doesn't have to be dictated by Fleita.
It's the kind of thing that has to have something else behind it other than a knee-jerk "everything the Cubs do is wrong" reaction. While Fleita may not be everyone here's idea of the best director of player development, I know for a fact that he is well-respected in the business.
And I have to believe there's more to this than we know.
In the meantime, winning a game might be nice. The Cubs can finish the season series with the Pirates with a split by winning tomorrow... when, at last, it will have stopped raining.
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Maybe Ricketts
told Fleita the changes that Billy Beane was going to make and he’s OK with them. ducks and runs.
You're joking, but...
… who knows? Maybe that’s exactly what happened.
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Maybe, but if not
I think that means that Rickets is (essentially) the GM. Sure, he’ll get someone in there with that title, but he’ll be a yesman to Ricketts if this hasn’t been vetted thru the new GM.
by jerry morales rules on Sep 3, 2011 6:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Just saying that if Ricketts made this decision
on his own, he’s effectively acting like the GM. If I were Friedman or Epstien or Cashman, I wouldn’t like it one bit that Ricketts is making that decision now.
by jerry morales rules on Sep 3, 2011 6:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Unless it's already been vetted through possible candidates.
Which is possible, right?
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Absolutely, and I hope it is right.
With that and the blurb I heard that Ricketts was on the west coast in San Fran and had some meeting there would lend me to believe that it’s Beane.
by jerry morales rules on Sep 3, 2011 6:07 PM CDT up reply actions
I do not have any inside info.
But I’m getting a sense it could be.
Which would be fine with me.
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I'd be happy
He’s brilliant and I would like to see what he could do with some money and an interested fanbase.
by jerry morales rules on Sep 3, 2011 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Isn't Colletti on the west coast?
I just got a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach.
You know life is good when you hear "Die Hard 5" is in production. Yippee ki-yay, &%^##(&(#&%-ers !
why would colletti be in SF?
I'm a happy panda.
by jesus christos on Sep 3, 2011 7:01 PM CDT up reply actions
He's not in the San Francisco area though
which is where Ricketts reportedly was.
I hope not.
This organization is broken. The new GM needs to look at Fleita’s entire body of work and examine the farm system and the way it’s run. You think the possible candidates have done that already?
Seeya Jimbo! Good job, Tommy Boy!
Maybe they have.
I don’t know that they have. But neither do you know that they haven’t.
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Neither of us knows anything.
I know I often come across as a pessimist, but I think you’re really going out on a limb here.
Seeya Jimbo! Good job, Tommy Boy!
He's going out on a limb to say that
someone who hasn’t even been hired hasn’t had the time it takes to evaluate the entire organization?
I’d say he’s using common sense.
Chiefs Chat: chiefs.sportsblog.com
Doubt there has been that much conversation as the strongest candidates still have other jobs
That kind of contact is called “tampering” and gets a team in deep trouble with MLB.
Unless Ricketts has already decided on one of the weaker candidates…
Sigh.
Incorrect.
Tampering only has to do with players. With executives, no.
I’m sure if Tom Ricketts wanted to talk to Billy Beane, he’d have asked Lew Wolff for permission, and received it.
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Possibility
It’s possible, but it’s still a decision that should have been left to the new GM. The Trib’s Steve Rosenbloom absolutely blistered Ricketts for making this decision. He’s right.
"You know what they do in Philadelphia when the game is rained out? They go to the airport and boo the bad landings." — Bob Uecker.
"Sometimes they boo loud enough to wake up the air traffic controllers." — Me.
by The Underground Conservative on Sep 4, 2011 9:35 PM CDT up reply actions
If Ricketts...
…did make this call on his own, it is a bit scary, with a GM still needing to be hired.
With that said, we don’t know all the details, but I would agree, a good GM will probably be more picky about a guy in Fleiti’s position, than he even would with the major league manager, because it is so impactful to the organization.
We’ll see. Fleiti does have a good reputation, but his track record with the Cubs is not stellar. Same can be said about Wilken and I really wonder how much Hendry’s flawed philosophy, desire to draft players coached by his college buddies etc., have impacted both Fleiti and Wilken in a negative manner.
I guess we’ll find out with the new GM, because Wilken and Fleiti will be here.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Are you suggesting
that the Cubs have been guilty of tampering?
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
Not at all.
See, here people go again, ASSUMING the worst out of the Cubs. “Everything the Cubs do is wrong” is the mantra of some here.
First of all, the tampering rules only have to do with players. Second, as I noted above, if Tom Ricketts wanted to talk to Billy Beane about being Cubs GM, he’d surely have asked Lew Wolff, and received permission
I made no suggestion nor accusation. Only others here have.
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That's not true at all
Look up the baseball Rules, particularly 3g. It applies to players plus coaches plus managers plus umpires. The rule is very explicit.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
Does it say anything about GM's?
[...]when Giants coach Steve Owen, a certified defensive genius, was asked how he planned to stop Nagurski, he said: "With a shotgun, as he’s leaving the dressing room."
by NobodySpecial on Sep 3, 2011 8:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Make That ...
Government Motors. More FAIL.
"You know what they do in Philadelphia when the game is rained out? They go to the airport and boo the bad landings." — Bob Uecker.
"Sometimes they boo loud enough to wake up the air traffic controllers." — Me.
by The Underground Conservative on Sep 5, 2011 2:11 AM CDT up reply actions
You may be right...
…but I have to say, if Ricketts has asked for permission to speak to any of the current GM’s, I have a hard time believing that wouldn’t have leaked out in the media. It’s possible, but not likely in today’s media world with all the contacts.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
At the same time...
… there are some in the business who don’t leak.
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This the same sentiment everyone had about Hendry.
While Fleita may not be everyone here’s idea of the best director of player development, I know for a fact that he is well-respected in the business.
Seeya Jimbo! Good job, Tommy Boy!
True enough.
Nevertheless, with a new boss, things could be different.
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How much improvement did Hendry have under Ricketts.
Tell me Fleita’s job performance regards player development. It’s more about the lack of development that concerns me. Throwing a 4 year contract to him is absolutely foolish at best. Perhaps we can hope for an improvement of Soriano and Pena and Byrd and Lopez etc etc etc with a new boss. You called for a housecleaning. I agreed with that so your position surprises me.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
I think...
…Hendry’s respect was for how well liked he is as a person, not so much for his ability as a GM.
If he was highly respected as a GM, someone should be hiring him in that role in the next year or so, but I doubt that happens.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Right.
He may get a new job right away, but it isn’t likely to be a GM job.
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No GM Spot
Most likely Hendry will wind up as a special consultant to a GM.
"You know what they do in Philadelphia when the game is rained out? They go to the airport and boo the bad landings." — Bob Uecker.
"Sometimes they boo loud enough to wake up the air traffic controllers." — Me.
by The Underground Conservative on Sep 5, 2011 2:12 AM CDT up reply actions
We were sitting in Aisle 413
and looked down the line to watch Marmol warm up. One of us said, “I think he’s put on more weight.” He needs to slim down. He’s off balance. He blamed the mound. This is bad, but when they had that huddle on the mound I thought he was hurt and they were going to have to bring someone else in, and then I was actually disappointed when that wasn’t the case. I feel low.
Rain. Cubs blow it in the 9th. It felt like we were in Pittsburgh.
It was eerie in the ballpark after the delay. You could hear conversations going on many sections away.
One of Lee Elia's 15%
I agree with you re: Marmol's weight.
I noticed it in spring training. He put on a LOT of weight over the winter and has not taken it off, and may, as you say, have put on more.
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Outstanding game today....Minor league managing as usual....
What does it take to get someone up in the pen when Marmol is pitching? Apparently 4 runs in and a runner at 1st base…
Again DeWitt batted when it should have been LaHair….
Soto had issues behind the plate today.
And for all the complaining the Cubs did about the moud in the 9th….It sure didnt bother the Pirates closer…
More of the same for the rest of the year…
You don't really think LaBald will play LaHair?
If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.
I really wouldn't be that disappointed ...
if I didn’t know that the Cubs rejected offers for Marmol at the deadline and generally overvalue replaceable players like Jeff Baker.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
I don't recall them rejecting offers for Marmol.
Baker and Reed Johnson, yes. But Marmol? Didn’t hear about that.
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Anyone got links?
Because I don’t recall that.
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I don't have the original link but you can find it here...
Sorry…got to run..
Tweet from George Offman.
http://twitter.com/#!/georgeofman/status/97706798794018816
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Yes.
Which says
Amazing. Told the Rangers were interested in Marmol but the Cubs turned them down.
Which says less than nothing, actually. Don’t know how far this got, what was offered, whether the Cubs had to eat most of his contract.
There are a lot more things involved in trades than “ZOMG JUST DUMP HIM!”
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I got the feeling the Cubs were shutting down reade possibilities before even hearing them out....
They really have done a bad job this year running this team.
Maybe some of them.
But what if this “turned them down” was Texas offering a low-level prospect AND asking the Cubs to eat most of the remaining contract?
Would you have done that? THERE ARE NO DETAILS IN OFMAN’S TWEET!
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I too would like to hear the details....
But you have to admit the Cubs did a horrid job at both deadlines this season, whether Hendry was leaving or not……
I would rather the new GM make the decision
Keep in mind that Ricketts knew that Hendry was gone at this point and that Marmol was still under contract.
Given your hate for Hendry, wouldn’t you rather have the new GM (even if it was a mentally unstable monkey) making the decision?
by jerry morales rules on Sep 3, 2011 6:11 PM CDT up reply actions
maybe with a chip like Marmol, But there is NO reason that Baker, Pena and Johnson were not traded...
DeWitt, Hill, Grabow, and Ortiz should be released today.
Why are they still here? Why allow them to take any time from the kids coming up?
They could stay on the roster but our manager has no idea how to play the kids over them.
Meh
Small potatoes. Nothing to be received in a trade and no REAL prospects that are being blocked.
Seriously, I think your making a mountain out of a molehill.
by jerry morales rules on Sep 3, 2011 6:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Everytime any of them play from now on is an AB that should be going somewhere else...Our manager cant handle this so it needed to be taken out of his hands...
Like when Hendry took Perez away from Baker
That's true
like all the AB’s that Hill got going down the stretch last year.
by LT on Sep 3, 2011 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't mind keeping Marmol for the next GM.
I think that was a fair thing to do. It was keeping guys like Baker that was annoying.
Seeya Jimbo! Good job, Tommy Boy!
True, but only up to a point.
What’s the point of dealing Baker for a low level minor leaguer who will never turn out to be anything?
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We don't know what was offerred for Baker
However, I’d rather have the new GM rearrange the roster than piece meal these guys out now without an overall plan for the future. I’d hope the new GM would put together a package of our poor players along with guys like Marmol and Soto and Byrd and Soriano. Otherwise we’ll have to eat a whole lot of money.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
I'll say this...
…I’d bet there are numerous teams out there that think they could fix Marmol with the right coaching.
Which brings me to the Cub’s current pitching coach……
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Riggins is nothing more than a stuffed uniform
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
On this, you & I agree.
It’s quite clear why he lasted just one year in his previous job as a major league pitching coach (1995 Cardinals).
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If they were,
they’ll probably be interested in the off-season, as well as a few other teams that weren’t willing to deal at the deadline. Hardly a big deal as far as I’m concerned.
by jerry morales rules on Sep 3, 2011 6:04 PM CDT up reply actions
See tweet from Offman.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Which proves what, exactly?
I agree with jerry morales rules.
It may be very possible to deal Marmol in the offseason AND get a better return that MIGHT have been gotten on 7/31 — if there was even a chance, given that ONE tweet from ONE radio reporter said this was possible.
Really, el — you’re putting way too much stock in this ONE tweet.
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Really, Al.
Can you disprove it?
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Of course not.
But see above. There are NO details in Ofman’s tweet. It’s designed to do exactly what it did to you and others here — incite a “JIMHENDRYSUCKS” rant.
Maybe the deal wasn’t worth doing. Maybe it was nothing more than one phone call. You’re making WAY too much of one tweet — a report that was made by NO other reporter.
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Why would George Offman tweet something designed to do that?
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Oh, come on.
That’s what a lot of reporters do. Look at the way it’s phrased: “Amazing”. As if it were a no-brainer to just dump Carlos Marmol for a bag of baseballs.
You’re smarter than that.
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Hi Al. Smart move to leave the game!
I read in Daily Herald that Ricketts is in “secret talks” with Ed Lynch…can you shed any light on this (oh please be a rumor…) subject?
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
No. Sorry. I
actually read it in the newspaper! I found it unbelievable but it was in NW Daily Herald. (Arl Hts area)…lemme see if I still have it (for authors name)
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Nope. IIRC it was Thurs or Friday on 2nd page
of sports sect.
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
I believe you
but I have not read nor heard this anywhere else.
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Thanks. I just hope it wasn't some
“flashback” from my youth! I’ll keep checking…seems to bizzare to believe. I hope sarcasm radar wasn’t inop when I read it!
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
You know what?
You can draw your own conclusions, I’ll draw mine.
I kind of resent the implication that I’m being dumb here.
Good night.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
You're just mistaken elgato
I mean how could a life long baseball beat guy know anything?
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Hardly implying that.
Only surprised that you would take one random tweet from a freelance radio reporter — who is NOT a “beat guy” — as the gospel truth.
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George Ofman has been one of the best baseball reporters.
and yes prior to his departure at WSCR he was their beat guy. If you didn’t know ,he has been one of the best in chicago at being the first to get to and actually report breaking sports news.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Great.
It still doesn’t mean anything. There was NO info in that tweet about what was offered and why it was (allegedly) refused. Until/unless I know that, I’m taking it for what it’s worth — very little.
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I'm just saying, Ofman is smart enough to know...
…how the trade dance works and The Rangers and any other team inquiring about Marmol would know they wouldn’t have a chance without offering something enticing. I’m sure the Rangers or anyone else would have been offering at least 1 good prospect for Marmol’s services, but Hendry stood pat and the organization allowed him to not do anything. It goes back to my point that Hendry should have never been allowed near this team during the trade deadline.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
You're speculating.
You don’t know and neither do I, what, if anything, was offered.
But my guess is that it wasn’t enough.
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It's very, very likely that "what was offered" was along the lines of what TEX traded for Mike Adams.
TEX asked about Marmol, we said no. They then turned to SD about Bell and Adams, and wound up trading 2 interesting arms for Adams.
The problem with trading Marmol AFTER the 2011 season is that his salary increases rather dramatically. That 1/2 season at 3.5MM makes the other 2 years look a little more palatable in terms of avg. salary.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
BTW, what exactly would you have wanted in...
…a deal for Marmol? Marmol is another beneficiary of the famous progressive Hendry contract. If the Rangers would have been willing to take his 7 million plus salary or next year then the Cubs should have jumped at it, even if the Rangers weren’t offering any prospects.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Hendry's "famous progressive contract"
Is also known as buying out arbitration years and a year of FA. Seriously, it’s a perfectly standard deal and something you would find on 30 of 30 teams. Don’t let that stop you from using it to fuel your complaints.
Well, we know the Rangers were hard after a relief pitcher
http://www.mlbdailydish.com/2011/8/4/2342552/trade-deadline-winner-the-texas-rangers
They certainly shipped some real talent off for Adams. Wieland was terrific in A+ and AA, with 150 Ks and 21 BB in 155 innings. Erlin had 144 Ks and 16 BB in 142 innings at the same levels. They are both 21. Either one would have instantly been the best pitching prospect in the Cubs’ minor league system. Would the Cubs have gotten as much for Marmol? Maybe not, but since he was “untouchable” they never heard what was possible.
by ClarkFan on Sep 3, 2011 8:46 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Carlos Marmol has made his career off one season of being an effective closer.....one.
every other thing about him has been mostly “meh”. He was a terrible starter, and was good for exactly one season as a closer. He’s almost 29 years old, if he was going to learn how to throw strikes to ML hitters, he would have learned by now. He trade value is only going to shrink from here on out. EVERYONE has figured out that you don’t have to swing at his pitch most of the time…you just wait for him to walk you or to make a mistake over the plate.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 3, 2011 6:19 PM CDT reply actions 6 recs
You completely discount the fact that he's only been a pitcher for a few years....
He came through the system as a catcher.
Ya know...
I wasn’t one bit surprised when Lee hit the slam. As a matter of fact, I think I expected it. I know one thing…the new GM is gonna have his hands full turning this franchise into a contender. Castro, Barney, Garza, Russell and Marshall…everybody else on this pathetic team can pound sand.
You know life is good when you hear "Die Hard 5" is in production. Yippee ki-yay, &%^##(&(#&%-ers !
When Len said Lee had hit 11 GS, I thought to myself:
“And here comes #12.” A couple seconds later, BAM! I hate myself and I want to die.
"I'm not a broadcaster! I'm me!"--Ron Santo
I honestly wouldn't have minded if they had brought Lee back for this season instead of Pena.
At least Lee is likeable.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 3, 2011 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Like Jim Hendry.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 3, 2011 6:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I actually think if Lee is 100%
He’s better than Pena. Problem is .. he hasn’t been 100%.
'Never look down on anybody unless you're helping him up.'
by Unique on Sep 3, 2011 6:59 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
He IS a nice guy
There’s no reason to say he’s not.
Help bring Boys of Spring The Movie to life!
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1742828131/boys-of-spring-the-movie
He's just not very good at baseball.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
I'm inclined to think this game was top-three worst of the season.
And I hate being all Blue Mike and stuff, but Marlon Byrd is perfectly useless. And Soto ain’t no slouch neither…
"I'm not a broadcaster! I'm me!"--Ron Santo
I'm willing to do a case-by-case breakdown, as I'm lonely and bored:
Dempster: useful to a certain degree, as a large segment of the populace seems to think he’s “funny.”
Garza: pretty useful, as the ace of a 5th place team; or a perfectly cromulent 4th starter on a good team.
Lopez: keeps a large portion of the fan base interested [i.e. he’s Mexican].
Coleman: can even get a credible ML hit and pitch three good innings every five days.
Grabow: useless. Clump him with Soto and Byrd.
Marmol: may be used in non-save situations.
Marshall: team MVP.
Ortiz: mop up duty champ.
Russell: I think he’s a useful LOOGY.
Samarcha: he’s been OK.
Wells: improving and useful for a 5th place team.
Wood: good pitcher still.
Hill: well, what can I say?
Soto: useless. Actually, now that I’m typing it, he’s quite useful as a backup for Atlanta or Philadelphia. Ergo, he fits in Chicago perfectly.
Baker: untouchable.
Barney: good glove, beer league bat. Useful still.
Castro: God to you.
DeWitt: face of the franchise. Useful as marketing tool.
LaHair: PCL MVP. ’Nuff said.
Pena: great glove.
Ramirez: capable bat.
Byrd: useless.
Campana: speedy as a fart.
Colvin: oh snap. Another useless player. My bad.
Johnson: useful as a bench player.
Soriano: $19M says he’s perfectly useful.
"I'm not a broadcaster! I'm me!"--Ron Santo
What proof can you offer
that farts are fast?
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
I want to apologize.
I knew deep down that D Lee would make us pay today. I may have wished it to happen.
“Sure. Load the bases so our old hero can torch us… holy sh&t that just happened”.
I am not a big Marmol fan. Maybe last season was his time in the sun. Closers should not do what he does.
Keith Law on Fleita's extension
Very odd. Oneri’s solid but why not let the next GM do this?
So Law disagrees with the timing, but he doesn’t think Fleita’s some Hendry crony.
Seems odd to me
Even if they already know who the new GM is and that he is good with this, why not wait? The same behind the scenes conversations could be had with Fleita too.
by LT on Sep 3, 2011 6:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe it got leaked and it shouldn't have been.
Food for thought.
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I got home just in time for the last 2 innings, ugh....
If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.
And just like Bryd and Pena...
we had to protect him from leaving.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 3, 2011 6:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I could never go to Detriot...
I’m allergic to gunshot wounds.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 3, 2011 6:32 PM CDT up reply actions
RPGs are much more faster
I'm a happy panda.
by jesus christos on Sep 3, 2011 8:50 PM CDT up reply actions
The motor city isn't all
that bad . Know where to go and stay in groups you will be fine . As in any big city there are bad areas . The area around the ball park and Greektown get alot of police protection .
Well if someone else wanted to talk to him...he must be worth keeping right?
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
I hope no one wants to talk to Quade
or what did I just say…
by LT on Sep 3, 2011 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions
You'd think there would be some value, yes.
Or is everything the Cubs do wrong?
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So far, that is a predictive model with a very strong track record.....
by ClarkFan on Sep 3, 2011 7:46 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
I find your reasoning flawless
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
Yes, a century + of futility is clear proof that the majority of everything this...
…organization touches turns to pure crap.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Everything?
Absolutely everything? Man, it must suck to be a fan of a team like that.
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Well you are, first step for you is admitting it.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Yep, see your last 3 Game Recaps for a small example.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 3, 2011 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Then maybe
you should find another team. Please.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Sep 6, 2011 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Not everything AL...
…but the scales are weighted heavily towards one side.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
The Cubs had every reason to deny them permission
with the imminent arrival of a new GM.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
Listenning to the Pirate announcers
and commented on how flat Marmol’s sliders have been for the most part every time that he has faced them. Lee’s slam was a spinning 84 MPH piece of nothing. He has fallen in love with this pitch. I would have to guess 70 % he throws sliders. I don’t pretend to be a MLB pitcher, however when I pitched in college the more off speed stuff I threw it seemed to take some juice off my fastball. Marmol needs to throw more no.1’s.
I was in Colvin’s camp from day one. I think it is time to give some starts to Campana or Al’s new favorite Cub. Of course that would mean Quade would have to pencil in one of the two in the lineup card.
What a freaking mess this team is. Brenly’s observation of a DAT ( dead ass team) is spot on.
I was glad that Lee jacked the game winner, good for him. At least the Pirates look like they enjoy playing baseball.
Marmol struck again
I saw that coming after he loaded the bases and D Lee up to bat. I told my neighbor " I hope they don’t under estimate D Lee" Sure enough Lee made Marmol pay.
What pisses me off more is why in the hell didn’t Quade have someone warming up ready to come in before it got to that. Quade has been doing that all effin season.
calm down, swoosie-ie
I'm a happy panda.
by jesus christos on Sep 3, 2011 6:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Hey
I am calm now…………LOL
Can’t wait for the season to end and we have seen the last of Quade. The man couldn’t manage his way out of a paper bag.
At least I have the Blackhawks to look forward to………..counting the days.
Don't be surprised if Quade doesn't get a new contract too
by LT on Sep 3, 2011 7:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe as the
bat boy perhaps. Hell throw in a NTC!
I hope that wouldn’t happen but nothing would surprise with the Cubs. Hell, I’d root for the Cards if that happened.
I dunno...I thought Bob--- from previous thread
hit it on the head when he said “The Quade” (yes, as in “The Gimp”) :]
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
That's the explanation
Quade is quite comfortable doing what has made him so successful.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
Carpenter's numbers
2010 WHIP 1.44 BB 3.8/9 K 7.5/9
2011 WHIP 1.66 BB 5.8/9 K 7.3/9
His numbers have gotten worse as he has moved up the ladder. No way is he ready to take on the job of closer in Chicago. I believe this team needs to get over the undying love for Marmol and find another team for him. I can see either Cashner or Shark filling the role in 2012. Cashner has been dominating in his rehab and should be ready for the job next year. Also, Samardzija’s improvement lately leads me to believe he’d be a good choice. But Marmol has to go.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
thinkk of the salary we could be eating next year, IF we dumped
Z, Sori, and Marmol!! Like 45 mil??? greater than some teams payroll…
if baseball only had non-guaranteed contracts.That would be nice.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Nice job in Chicago when he was up earlier
New role this year, new delivery, new 2nd pitch half way through the season, no previous experience in relief, excellent velocity. 2.79 ERA in Chicago and scoreless 8 out of 10 outings as a rookie in his limited time and handled that without needing a diaper. Don’t know if he’ll be a closer or not but worth a few attempts. Definately an upgrade from Ortiz. WHIP is irrelevant for a reliever who throws 1 inning. How many of a relievers runners score is. Again don’t know if he’s an answer but we wont know until he gets his feet wet a few times.Samard is going to be expensive next year I’d guess, if he’s making 3.3 M this year and I think his contract is up. His first half was nothing to write home about.
WHIP is never irrelevant
How can you claim that? You’re willing to suggest that Carpy’s 9.2 innings along with 12H and 7BB is a positive indicator? Yet Sharks 25 post ASG innings with a 1.13 WHIP are meaningless. Hell, even Samardzija’s 1st half was better than Carpenter’s numbers. He’s been getting knocked around like a pinata in the minors right now. I believe Carpenter will eventually turn into a good closer but he isn’t close to ready now. He’s where Shark was 3 years ago.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
It is for a reliever...
Runs allowed matters. WHIP is a good measure for a starter as it affects pitch count and longevity in a game. I’m not knocking Shark as you should have read in my previous comment. You don’t get runs or give up runs with a high or low WHIP as a reliever. The last time I knew for sure, games were determined by runs scored and nothing else. It does not matter how many K’s you get, flyballs or groundouts you get, strike % or anything else as a one inning reliever. Its RUNS given up. Marmol has always been a heart attack waiting to happen, but this year it’s the big runs he’s allowed. Not much would be said if he only had 2 blown saves. (See J.Valverde for my Tigers). He is an adventure most days but no blown saves. I don’t know whether Carpenter will be a closer or not and I really don’t care, but he has had an experimental year and a change of everything. During his time in Chicago, he threw 10 times and 8 were scoreless and was put in some tough situations . He handled it well as a rookie. That’s all I am saying. Our opinions may be different but in the grand scheme, they have no effect on what the Cubs plans are. I hope Carp and Shark go on to great careers. If they do fine , if not so be it.
Anyone else call the Grandslam when Lee was strolling to the plate?
by braziliancubsfan on Sep 3, 2011 7:19 PM CDT reply actions
Maybe not while strolling....
I think as soon as he swung the bat I recognized the D. Lee home run swing.
Yes my wife said oh no
as D. Lee stepped to the plate . Just like in Houston last month Marmol gives up another grand slam !! Quade looked like he wanted to hide somewhere ,
Waste of the last 2 months
Where’s Carpenter? As posted many times here over the last two months, he should be here instead of ramon ortiz.
Again LaHair sits, again the cubs lose.
No Brett Jackson, no Lamahieu.
Ricketts, our anger is growing. You are wasting all of our time by running out the same garbage managed by the worst manager in the MLB. Make a phone call. You can see the no shows in your park, check the ratings in september. However, you are probably happy no one will tune into this garbage you are “entertaining” us with.
"I feel great, I just wish my team played better"
I think Carpenter may be hurt.
I really don’t understand why LaHair is here if he’s going to sit. I’m not his biggest fan, but he’s here. Might as well play him.
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Carpenter was on the DL...
With a strained oblique. Was minor and he is back pitching again.
Carpenter was on the DL
and just returned a few days ago. He wasn’t very good then and he was terrible before that. He’s just not ready. It would be foolish to bring him up now. Next year.
If it wasn't for the injuries, we'd be printing WS tickets right now.
But the kids
The Cubs have to play the kids. It doesn’t matter if Carpenter is hurt. Bring him up so he can get hammered. Bring up DJL so he can hit .100 with no power.
Most of the kids aren’t ready or are not very good. LaHair should play but otherwise it really doesn’t matter. So much gnashing of teeth over nothing.
John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.
by rlpete on Sep 4, 2011 12:03 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Quade isn't going to play LaHair.
Maybe he’ll get a spot start, but Pena is not going to be benched. Jackson and LeMahieu aren’t up because Quade won’t play them either.
Seeya Jimbo! Good job, Tommy Boy!
There's like 20 games left.
I don’t think Ricketts thinks it matters all that much
Chiefs Chat: chiefs.sportsblog.com
by Nunyabidness on Sep 3, 2011 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions
I get that Randy Bush is just an interim GM, but he's still Quade's boss right?
Chiefs Chat: chiefs.sportsblog.com
by Nunyabidness on Sep 3, 2011 10:57 PM CDT up reply actions
I know it's no longer how the games played
remember when a pitcher would stay in the game until they got tired or ineffective? This “closer” idea should be for teams that have a complete shut-down, never fail sort of guy. Marshall was good in the 8th so just keep him in. The tern “save” and “holds” are modern ideas that I think hurt.
Actually, you bring up a very good point.
I retract my comment above, about today’s being top-three worst games.
"I'm not a broadcaster! I'm me!"--Ron Santo
question for al....
do you think a new gm will be announced before the season ends ? seems pretty important that he hits the ground running when the season is over .
I don't know for sure.
But I would like to think so, for exactly the reason you state.
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About tampering
It happens all the time. You see it so often in college sports with coaches moving around. Rules are rules, but when one guys lawyers talk to another guys/schools lawyers is it tampering? Apparently not.
For Fleita, I doubt it was vetted by a potential GM. All due respect to Al and his site, but, if you have a person on board, it should be public by now, and he’d sign off on a deal. This seems like Rickett’s hamstringing a new GM. Makes me think he already knows he’s going second tier for a new GM.
As far as Marmol, it’s walks again that killed him. He’s been wild all year. If he weren’t getting paid so much money he’d have lost his job by now.
I wouldn't be surprised
If next years GM hasn’t signed off on Fleita.
by Clark Addison on Sep 3, 2011 8:59 PM CDT up reply actions
I share the same concern as Nibbles
I have to believe that someone like Friedman or Cashman or Beane would want to bring in their own guy or hire a new personnel director themselves. Which is why signing Fleita to an extension makes me fear the next GM will be a maleable, reactive type who will be content to work within a set of parameters established by a non-baseball mind like Ricketts.
Maybe
but from everything we’ve heard, people want this job. Maybe not Cashman or Epstein, but pretty much everyone else. Let’s say the choice really is Billy Beane. Is he going to stick around in Oakland with all the problems they have there because he doesn’t want to work with Oneri Fleita that badly?
by Josh Timmers on Sep 3, 2011 11:07 PM CDT up reply actions
He's been wild his whole career
In fact, he’s walking fewer people this year than either of the last two years. The difference is that now he’s also giving up hits (by far his highest hit rate since he was a starter).
Don’t get me wrong – he still walks too many. But the walks aren’t the difference between good Marmol and bad Marmol.
just testin...sorry
<img src="http://<!DOCTYPE HTML>"/>
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Epic Fail
I guess I just don’t get the “post a pic thing”. (If anyone has “post a pic for dummies” handy…My email is in my profile) Grrrr.
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
All you have to do
Is click the picture of the tree and copy and paste the URL of the image (the URL will end in .jpg, .gif, etc) that you want to post.
For example, if I want to post Google’s logo I get the image URL:
http://www.google.com/intl/en_com/images/srpr/logo3w.png
Then click the image and post that URL:
<img src=“http://www.google.com/intl/en_com/images/srpr/logo3w.png”/

Thanks Jove and LT as well, I'm definitely in a fog when it comes this crap.
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
crap...grumble, grumble...
I still appear to be in a fog!!! I don’t get the URL action (I guess).
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Ok...so it wasn't THAT BIG when I saw it...
Let the lessons continue? (Puuuuleeeezzze?)
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
next we'll teach you about previewing, changing size in MSpaint and using tinypic
I'm a happy panda.
by jesus christos on Sep 3, 2011 9:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Looks like I need it!!!
(Sorry). At least I remembered to title it! :]
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Alright Jeff!! You're startin to get it, maybe I'm not to far behind.
FYI, your pictures should be prettier with bigger boobs. ;)
Guys, hitting is not about muscle. It's simple physics. Calculate the velocity, v, in relation to the trajectory, t, in which g, gravity, of course remains a constant.... It's not complicated. - George Costanza
Why thank You Troutfishin!
After a coupla/few years, I figured I should be capable of posting a coupla pics! (Not great big giant ones tho!)
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Thank You!
I’ll give it a shot (on an old/unused thread) JS2
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
the revenge of d.lee
sounds like a horror movie.and it is,for the cubs at least.let’s hope the real marmol shows up next year. he’s been pretty bad this year.and let’s hope quade is fired as soon as the season ends. if ricketts thinks just firing hendry will fix everything he better think again.
Marmol
is just adding another issue the GM will have to deal with next year. The weak spots continue to pile up. Not sure there is much the Cubs can do. No closer in waiting and unless they can find one in free agency which is very difficult seems will just have to pray he improves next year.
Wow. Now I'm glad I missed this one.
I bet even I had more fun than those watching the end of this game. And I was sitting inside a metal tent, under a tree, next to a water fountain, during a thunderstorm.
Cracker Jack does not have an "s", even in the plural.
The even funnier part (well maybe it's the sad part)
is that this was entirely true.
Cracker Jack does not have an "s", even in the plural.
Marmol
Marmol really should be traded, but the nagging questions are what the Cubs could get for him and the who-is-going-to-close question. On the latter, they should get Carpenter up to see more of him, consider Marshall closing, or it might turn-out to be a better role for Cashner than starting is.
Good game for D. Lee.
I set my DVR for 2 hours after the allotted time slot.
With the rain delay, recording ran out when Marmol came in. I just had a feeling a 2-run lead was not gonna be enough. Marmol is useless at this point. I too, would like Marshall to get a shot at closing. I doubt he could be any worse.
ITS 2011, TIME TO GO TO CUBBIE HEAVEN!
Ok... New signature
Hopefully I didn’t plagurize (sp) anyone.
Jim Hendry...We glad, "He gone" "That's One for the Good Guys"
I dunno... "He Gone"
just might be a bit too S Side…
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
BCB Public Service Announcement:
The Quade was quoted today (AP) as using the folksy nickname “Marms” when referring to Carlos Marmol. My Father states hes begun to hate The Quade more than the underperforming players.
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Sigh.
Only 23 more games of that to go.
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Thank Gawd for small favors
The Quade also states “Marms just had a bad day”…he must be disregarding the fact “Marms” leads league in blown saves and has coughed up 4HRs (2 for Grannies). I hope you’re right about 23 more games of this… I’m certain The Quade is a nice enough guy…but he’s no ML Manager.
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
Yeah...was thinking that too
Might just have to re-think that one.
Jim Hendry...We glad, "He gone" "That's One for the Good Guys"
He's just a little too "cutsie" with these nicknames.
These are, after all, grown men. And after yesterdays outing I sure don’t want to call him that. A few explicit names do come to mind, however.
Jim Hendry...We glad, "He gone" "That's One for the Good Guys"
I'm not into any other sports though
I will have a long dismal winter. Not sure which is worse. No Cubs, or crappy Cubs.
Jim Hendry...We glad, "He gone" "That's One for the Good Guys"
I'm hoping the off-season will be more exciting than the regular one.
Maybe we will be surprised for the good. One can only hope.
Jim Hendry...We glad, "He gone" "That's One for the Good Guys"
Was in Chicago in March. Had to take my daughters furniture to her in S. Holland
And, of course always had my Cub hat and jacket on. Afterward I thought…Hmm. Might be lucky no one took a pot shot at me. Does that kind of animosity abound there?
Jim Hendry...We glad, "He gone" "That's One for the Good Guys"
'Animosity'? No.
It’s still a Cubs-Town. (Regardless of the upswing in “Life-long Sox Fans” most of whom, by coincidence surfaced in 2005…). No real illwill, we’re more laughable than hated. I think I remember you Superdave…did you vanish for awhile?
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
No. I'm still here. I just don't post too often.
Maybe we have just been on here at different times. I read everyday though
Jim Hendry...We glad, "He gone" "That's One for the Good Guys"
Yeah. I checked your profile, you've been around.
Well- it’s a perfect day here…I’m off to run errands (which always leads to moar work!!!) Have a great day! Cubs on WGN 1:20 today.
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
You have a good one too.
Got my DVR set. Have to go to wife’s friends wedding. Only supposed to be 102 here today! woo hoo!
Jim Hendry...We glad, "He gone" "That's One for the Good Guys"
by superdave72760 on Sep 4, 2011 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions
102!?
You’re welcome to it!!! Yuck! Until next time…
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
I sometimes post on game threads.
Especially when Cubs are on CSN which I do not get.
Jim Hendry...We glad, "He gone" "That's One for the Good Guys"
My own posting has been down
I moved in w/Pops (lookin for a home) and thought I’d be here 6-8 weeks…likely to be here into Spring as I don’t wanna move in a Chicago Winter! I called a Realtor and I had 100 options in 3 days! Too big a decision to rush… later.
"So sad, This Cubbie Thing" Courtesy of E-Man, 6/25/2011
But it's Vegas you know!
A dry heat! haha
Jim Hendry...We glad, "He gone" "That's One for the Good Guys"

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