Carlos Pena Signs With Rays
Tweet from Jon Heyman. Turns out his sojourn with the Cubs was just a detour in between stints in Tampa.
4 months ago
Al Yellon
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This will be know as the lumpy pillow contract
"Just shut up and play" - Matt Garza
"Pain is inevitable, suffering is an option." - Dale Sveum
by RiskyBusiness on Jan 20, 2012 11:32 AM CST up reply actions 4 recs
It's like he rolled over from one pillow to another.
"[The Cubs] have a very famous tradition in baseball, and it will be nice to be part of turning it around." ~ Jamie Quirk, Bench Coach
Good for him.
Seemed like a decent guy. Loved the power, walks and glove, but to many swing and misses.
are you saying that many people will remember him for swings and misses?
but to many, swing and misses.
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by Fukudometer on Jan 20, 2012 11:35 AM CST up reply actions
I guess it could go without a comma and still work, right?
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by Fukudometer on Jan 20, 2012 12:44 PM CST up reply actions
Glad we got to look at Pena for a year.
He was the least of our worries, class guy, professional athlete. Good luck. But, glad we moved on. Sure he took walks, but I had concerns about a first baseman with a .222 average.
We'll miss you Big Boy. #10 is going into the Hall of Fame!!
by mrcubsfan on Jan 20, 2012 11:33 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
.222 Average
I’ve got to have a first baseman, who hits at least .240. Is that too much to ask? Sure, I like the HR’s and the walks. He played plus defense at first base. I’m not beholden to batting average almighty. In fact, I’d rather have a Carlos Pena-type than a Bill Buckner-type. There’s come a point to where a low batting average can be too low to be acceptable.
Good things come to those who wait... and wait....and wait.
What's the significance of 7 or 9 hits and a BA increase of .001?
7 hits: That’s the difference (assuming AB’s remain the same) between a .225 hitter, which Carlos was last year, and a .240 hitter.
9 hits: That’s my rough math estimate of what it would take to get to .240 if you didn’t assume he turned outs into hits, but instead assumed he got hits instead of walks. Despite 606 PA’s, he only had 493 AB’s because he also walked 101 times. If 9 of those were instead broken bat singles, he’d be a .240 hitter with 120 hits and 92 walks instead of 111 hits and 101 walks.
1 point: That’s the difference between his career average (.239) and the average you’d require as your minimum baseline.
I agree that the low BA was a problem and would be a concern. But it can definitely be given too much attention and overshadow (a) the terrific defense, (b) good walk totals, and © decent amount of power. He’s a good player, and a good bargain at $7.5 million.
by Orval Overall on Jan 20, 2012 2:02 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
I think the value of walks vs hits is contextual
In the 2011 Cubs with a collections of low BA hitters, there was no one to drive Pena in when he walked – hits would have been better because he could have been the one generating more RBIs (say, 90-100 instead of 80). With better hitters around him, Pena’s high OBP and power have more relative value against the low BA.
For what it's worth
Pena’s OBP was pretty good. If he could pick up the average….and, of course, he had a good glove. I have no complaints with the season he turned in. It was to be expected.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jan 20, 2012 3:52 PM CST up reply actions
That ship sailed a while ago.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
This contract makes me like Theo even more
Because I don’t have a doubt in my mind that if Jim was still here, Carlos would have gotten a bigger contract from us.
For some fans, Kerry Wood is that dollap of pumpkin paste.
Absolutely
Probably around, what, $12 mil?
And I liked his time here and was surprised to see him in Moneyball, which is not near the top, but is maybe one of my favorite all time movies.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jan 20, 2012 11:58 AM CST up reply actions
and given Koyie hill a 2 year contract
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
One of your all time favorite movies??
I still don’t get it. I think it was one of the dumbest pieces of garbage Ive ever seen. Im sorry I rented it.
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
by Hammer on Jan 20, 2012 12:03 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I think you're being a little harsh.
Just a little…
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by Craig in South Bend on Jan 20, 2012 2:17 PM CST up reply actions
true
but I still hated it.
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
yeah - that was no good either.
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
Yeah...gotta sorta agree wih ya on this, hammer...
…I’d give it a star and a half on account of Philip Seymour Hoffman makes any movie a little better.
You mean the 5 minutes he was in it?
Again, you guys are being pretty harsh to what was a well written and acted movie. Not sure what you guys were looking for.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jan 20, 2012 2:30 PM CST up reply actions
---
a climax of a 20 game winning streak was lame, no mention of the starting pitching, making the scouts look like mindless morons compared to the men with computers, Seymour Hoffman oddly cast and I disagree on the acting. Jonah HIll is laughable in this movie…I prefer Jonah Hill to be laughable in a Judd Apatow movie.
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
So basically, if I don't go into it expecting a documentary I'll be fine.
I’m still excited about seeing it on that nice 10 inch screen on my plane on Monday (assuming I can get out of Chicago and into Seattle by some miracle).
I watched it and I don't even have an opinion of it.
All I kept thinking about was the book. Maybe I’ll watch it again.
DUMP GARZA. CORRECT THE COSMIC WRONG.
It's supremely overrated as movies go.
And it’s far too quiet in tone. But wow, you really hated that movie …
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
I agree with it being overrated.
Although I did enjoy it.
The best husband in the world is going to the 2012 Randy Hundley Cubs Fantasy camp!
I watch it seating between Billy Beane and Michael Lewis
Which is great for chit-chatting during the trailers and all. But they kept leaning over to me to talk about how something was edited, or the lighting, or the dialogue not matching up to the book. We kept getting shush-ed! Plus, Beane is a hog with the popcorn. Unbelievable.
"Just shut up and play" - Matt Garza
"Pain is inevitable, suffering is an option." - Dale Sveum
by RiskyBusiness on Jan 20, 2012 2:43 PM CST up reply actions
On this, you & I agree.
Pena was a competent player, but nothing more than a stopgap.
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Correct
On a team filled with stopgaps on top of it.
Makes you wonder why he declined arbitration?
I’m surprised that it’s just a one year deal even more than I’m surprised by the number. Isn’t it likely he’d have beaten that figure in an arbitration hearing? If so, you have to wonder why he declined arb. Someone must have really misjudged the market for his services if he couldn’t get a multi-year deal, or even a single year deal better than the arb award was likely to have been.
(Or am I overestimating what he likely would have received in arbitration?)
Totally agree.
And, IIRC, if they did go to arbitration, the most the Cubs could lower his salary is 20%… which would’ve been $8M.
With that said, it is rather hard to believe that his numbers would warrant a salary reduction through the arbitration process.
So IMO… Pena got bad advice. His agent (presumably) cost him probably $3M. Though he does now have a chance at the playoffs. So there’s that.
"Stuff like this is why they should shut off the internet."
by Orval Overall on Dec 17, 2010 1:19 PM CST
pena
supposedly had a bigger offer from the indians but wanted to go back to TB. He may have had an indication this was possible all along and chose to fore-go the money to go back to Tampa
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by DartmouthCubsFan on Jan 20, 2012 1:36 PM CST up reply actions
Plus...
…he still has that $5 million in deferred money coming from the Cubs. So maybe that played into his decision as well. I do agree it’s a little odd he signed for the amount he did.
"[The Cubs] have a very famous tradition in baseball, and it will be nice to be part of turning it around." ~ Jamie Quirk, Bench Coach
He probably wanted to get back to Florida.
It’s not like he’s going to be poor at $7 million either.
John Grabow - Who will pay you $4.8 million in 2012?
Wish him all the best in his future.
He was a class act, and brought a great presence to the clubhouse.
They're pretty psyched
over at DRays Bay.
He’s a class act. I wish him nothing but the best. The fact that the best probably means pain for the Yankees and Red Sox is just a bonus.
I liked the guy.
I’ll always remember that he was the only player to visit Byrd in the hospital in Boston. Showed a lot of class.
But he wasn’t a good fit with the new direction. Good luck, Carlos.
Where have you gone, Kiko Calero. A nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
by elgato on Jan 20, 2012 1:47 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
I wish him the best of luck as well
because he’s never come across as anything but a fairly level headed person, at least while he was in Chicago anyway.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jan 20, 2012 2:23 PM CST up reply actions
Slow start last year
… would we think differently of Pena if he didn’t have such an appalling start? Not a huge loss to let him go, but its not like he’s the first Cubs hitter to struggle in the cold months.
OPS for the season – .819
OPS by month:
March/April – .464 (with zero home runs)
May – .919
June – .924
July – .682
August – .866
September – .974
Probably not considering his career averages
We’re not talking about Lee, Sosa, or Ramirez though, where it’s like they don’t show up until May sometimes. He was never going to be much better than his career averages, and spending $10+ million on a player like that was always a Hendry-ass idea. That money would be better spent elsewhere and I’m glad it finally is.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jan 20, 2012 2:22 PM CST up reply actions
Or, to sum up
.235/.367/.505 with 28 HR and 75 RBI … in 130 games from May 1 to the end of the season.
Also, hit .255/.388/.504 with 21 HR and 61 RBI in 460 PA against RHP.
If the Rays get that kind of production out of him, they’ll be very happy.
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460 of his 493 PAs were against RHP?
That sounds a bit high. He only had 33 PAs against LHP last year?
Yet when one sees how poorly he did against LHP
Your original guess turns out to be the reasonable option.
DUMP GARZA. CORRECT THE COSMIC WRONG.
yeah, if they match him up
with a platoon partner, they’ll be very, very happy.
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by SouthWabashSoul on Jan 20, 2012 4:38 PM CST up reply actions
Hey, at least you admit it's irrational.
"[The Cubs] have a very famous tradition in baseball, and it will be nice to be part of turning it around." ~ Jamie Quirk, Bench Coach
I thought he would get at least 2 years
Scott Boras is what 0 for 3? I really thought Pena would of waited till Fielder signed.
I will be surprised if Fielder signs for more than 5 years.
At this rate
… Boras should probably advise Fielder to take a one-year deal somewhere and hit the FA market again next offseason.
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Was thinkin' the same thing...back in Milwaukee...
…if Braun gets out of his 50 game suspension (which I don’t think he will) then the “Crew” will be loaded with Hart, Weeks, Braun, Fielder, A’Ram…pretty tough line-up.
Milwaukee is already 10 Million over their projected budget...
How are they going to fit in another 28-30 million???
they have pretty good food there
nachos in a baseball helmet rules
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
They tend to have a full house
will the Cubs this year?
Open betting windows for that stupid Sausage Race?
I enjoy this website because it's so interesting to see folks pole vaulting over mouse turds.
why not a 5 year deal with an opt out clause or something??
I think Braun has been the smarter of the two in getting paid.
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Cubs win....what a lucky break!!" ---Harry
Edwin Jackson will probably settle for a 1 or 2 year deal too
The firing of Hendry really hurt Boras’s market.
lol
I wen to ESPN and saw “Carlos Pena resigns…” and for a second I almost threw my keyboard.
THEO!
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jan 20, 2012 2:48 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Pena's another player for whom I'll always have a lot of respect.
There’s an art to working the count the way he does — even if he does wind up striking out so much of the time. I’m glad I got to see him play for a season, as dreadful as that season was. And I’m even happier we got the extra draft pick.
"[The Cubs] have a very famous tradition in baseball, and it will be nice to be part of turning it around." ~ Jamie Quirk, Bench Coach
I wouldn't have minded a one year deal again
If he was going to take a smaller amount I’d have liked him to stay. I can’t figure the argument then he still has money on this years books from the Cubs. It’s all factored in, he’s taking a pay cut for this year. Now, maybe he really wants to get back to Florida, but, I have to wonder why not stick around for a year. The guy has been a vagabond.
And, offensive quibbling aside, he was a stable presence in the clubhouse, and a fine fielder. We have an erratic throwing SS, and a new guy at third this year. I can think of worse scenarios than having a quality glove man at first. Like giving the keys in Spring Training to a journeyman AAA player. I could have lived with a Pena/Baker platoon this year.
He has a home
in Orlando. It exemplifies Hendrey’s overpaying for lesser talent.
Something like 35%
of the Cubs’ HRs / RBI in 2011 will not be back in 2012.
That’s gotta be the highest in baseball.
You are
… obviously referring to the departures of Pena and Aramis Ramirez. Together, they accounted for 36% (54) of the Cubs’ 148 HR in 2011.
I don’t think that the assumption that their replacements will hit ZERO home runs is valid.
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by Al Yellon on Jan 21, 2012 7:25 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Not assuming zero
But, exactly where are those HRs/RBI going to come from?
Only one team in the NL had a worse run differential than the Cubs last year. And you let 36% of your run production walk.
It’s an interesting way to construct a ball club. To put it mildly.
what's the old saying... "Rome wasn't built in a day"?
I think it’s fair to say a consistent World Series contender wasn’t built in a year, especially given what the Cubs had to start with.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Patience.
We’re gonna lose a lot of games next year.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
Fearless prediction
Not more games than in 2011.
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Certainly possible.
Consider that we had an absolutely horrible manager last year.
Better manager + new advanced scouting + improved game preparation resources for players = winning some games we wouldn’t have won last year.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
Agreed.
I’m not expecting contention. But I am expecting improvement.
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It's possible.
.500 is 10 more wins. That’s a lot, but the Diamondbacks added 29 wins from 2010 to 2011.
It can be done.
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As long as the culture changes
that’s all I need in 2012. Professionalism. Trending upward. (Not necessarily in the win column.)
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jan 21, 2012 10:49 PM CST up reply actions
I believe that change in culture
… will help the talent gain more wins, even in 2012.
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your problem, is you expected the Cubs to compete this year
this is a rebuilding year … one step backwards now in order to take two steps forward later
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jan 22, 2012 9:16 AM CST up reply actions
They will most likely will downgrade offensively but i don't see a huge drop off.
Stewart before 2011 had averaged about 20 home runs in a full season. RotoChamp is projecting 12 home runs from Lahair in 436 PA’s and 12 home runs from Rizzo in 285 Pa’s.
DDJ is projected for 10 home runs which is a little better than last year’s right outfield.
stewart + lahair/rizzo could project for about 44 home runs. Only a 10 home run difference and less if DDJ lives up to his projections.
You are also saving runs with significant defensive upgrades at right and 3rd. And From what iv’e heard Lahair is not a bad 1st baseman and Rizzo is a plus defender.
The Rotation will most likely improve too unless you expect everyone except Garza to put up a ERA of 4.8+ again.
The Cub’s run differential will improve with a better rotation and defense.
Plus eight of Castro's ten HR came after the ASB next year.
I think he’ll take more big steps this year and could very well hit 15+ HR. I also expect Soto to bounce back some as well.
Ya i didn't mention the rest of the staff
The staff is younger and more likely to improve. More upside players now.
Players likely to improve or have upside:
Rizzo, DDJ, Soto, Castro, Stewart, Jackson, Campana, T. Wood, Volstad, Wells, Dempster, Shark, Carp, Russel, Marmol? ( unsure) , Barney (maybe)
Players likely to regress: Soriano, Byrd, RJ, K. Wood, Baker
I think Maholm and Garza might still have improvement , but i will leave them off both lists.
I could see this team being a 80 win team or a 70 win team. Hopefully theo’s coaching staff can develop the younger guys.
he
never wanted to leave tampa.they just would’nt pay.im surprised he got 7 mill from them. once again the only 220. hitter in baseball that can always find a job. good luck carlos.
Someone conform for me- Hendry's gone, right?
So bashing him for things he MIGHT have done, does that not seem just a wee bit over the top for anyone?
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Yeah, made a mistake, meant to write confirm
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Pena's best performance last year was in the movie Money Ball
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
And, when you think about Pena's career OBP
It’s something Billy Beane wouldn’t have turned his back on — NOW. The sample size on Pena was too small in 2000.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jan 21, 2012 10:50 PM CST up reply actions
now
imagine if d lee goes to the brewers. man will those corner spots look familiar.
Huh.
Never thought of that idea, though D-Lee is still unsigned. The Brewers seem committed to Mat Gamel at 1B, though. I suspect D-Lee eventually re-signs with the Pirates, so we’ll see plenty of him this year.
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