Turning Japanese

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 8:32 AM CST in News Comment 138 comments

This one ought to get you going on a Monday morning.

I know I've posted things here before from sources I trusted, and then they didn't happen, even though I was pretty darn sure they would -- and I got flamed for that.

I've received some information over the weekend that I'm going to tell you about -- and it may not happen, but I trust the source and if it does, well, you can tell everyone where you heard it first.

The Cubs are seriously pursuing both Kosuke Fukudome and Hiroki Kuroda and may, if they make good offers to both of them, have them signed within the next week or so, making their first big splash into the Japanese market.

This is very good news, if it does indeed happen, because these players would address some problems that the 2007 Cubs had -- namely, a consistent bat in right field who plays good defense (and in addition, Fukudome is a patient hitter with a high OBA who would be absolutely perfect in the #2 spot in the batting order), and a consistent pitcher who could hold down the 4th or 5th spot in the rotation. Signing both of them would also assuage the fears of either one that he'd be alone in a city where he doesn't speak the language and where the Japanese community is relatively small compared to some other cities (NY, LA, Seattle) where Japanese players have tended to sign in the past -- each would then have a teammate speaking his language.

As I said -- this isn't guaranteed. But from what I've heard, the wheels are in motion.

Oh, and one more thing. Get ready for one of the largest, if not the largest, ticket price increases in team history. Which is OK if the payroll is correspondingly increased (which I've also heard it will be) to put a championship-quality team on the field in 2008.

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That'd be nice... and uggh...

If Fukudome can provide strong defense in RF and have a high OBP, I'll be pleased to have him in the #2 spot. Kuroda seems less exciting (sounds like another #4-5 starter), but it can't hurt to have more solid starters (especially if Marquis continues to fade and/or Marshall is moved).

by SouthernCub on Nov 5, 2007 8:34 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

The "uggh..."

was obviously with regards to ticket prices. Luckily, I live in NC and that won't affect me too much.

by SouthernCub on Nov 5, 2007 8:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Not sure about being first

Here's what Paul Sullivan wrote two days ago:

Another option for the Cubs is 32-year-old Japanese right-hander Hiroki Kuroda, whom they looked at last year before he re-signed with Hiroshima. Kuroda has informed Hiroshima he will exercise his opt-out clause one year into his four-year deal and is expected to seek his value in the majors. Kuroda said there's a 50-50 chance of coming to the majors. If he does, the Cubs and Seattle will be two of his closest pursuers.

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-071103cubs,1,1039535.story?coll=cs-c ubs-headlines

This guy on a the cubs.com message board had the same idea - that they would go hard after both, though he did not cite anonymous sources: http://www.forums.mlb.com/n/pfx/forum.aspx?tsn=1&nav=messages&webtag=ml-cubs&tid=305399

And Bruce Miles reported yesterday that the Cubs have discussed signing both players: http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=70534&src=152

by Porfi on Nov 5, 2007 8:39 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

None of my info...

... comes from any of those places, and from what I heard, the process has gone beyond "options" and "discussions".

We'll see.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 8:41 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Fukodome

Love it, I have watched as much as I can on the internet and he looks steady. A SICK RIDICLOUS OPB % is nice.

Hopefully that translates to high .300s

Hey.....Cubs win!!! Steve Stone is the most overrated scumbag in the business.

by Hammer on Nov 5, 2007 8:53 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

BTW

I say it should be an abslote NO on Khalil Greene and his .290 OPB. UGGG
Let Theriot hit 2 or 8

Hey.....Cubs win!!! Steve Stone is the most overrated scumbag in the business.

by Hammer on Nov 5, 2007 8:57 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I'd take his power and glove

but not for Pie. Save Pie to trade for Santana!!!

by cubswin on Nov 5, 2007 9:18 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I like that...

...now could the Cubs talk the Twinkies turning Santana loose for Pie and 2 of the following 3; Hill, Marshall or Gallagher?

Our grandparents used to say, "I hope the Cubs win the Series before I die". Now teenagers are saying it. Let's change that next season!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 5, 2007 9:38 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

That wouldn't be a bad idea

Except that he makes $13 mil/year.

I'd prefer to see the Cubs stop spending so much, and start actually scouting players better.

Actually... I'll take that up a notch... if you're gonna spend big bucks, spend it on a new scouting department and farm system. Go talk to Colorado, or Minnesota, or Florida... and make their management an offer they can't refuse.

1-RUN GAMES = 23-22 | EXTRA INNINGS = 2-8 | HOME = 44-37 | NL CENTRAL CHAMPS!

by SackMan on Nov 5, 2007 9:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Green would be worth about 2 wins per year

Green:
.270 EQA
5.3 WARP3

Theriot:
.245 EQA
3.5 WARP3

Not as big of an improvement as I was expecting, but it's still a pretty big improvement. That doesn't take into account what we'd have to give up for him though.

By the way, it's OBP not OPB.

by Wreckard on Nov 5, 2007 11:23 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

When he isn't injured.

I'm definitely a Green fan though.

by Kornchex on Nov 5, 2007 12:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Inside G2

Al, nice work getting the inside G2 -- let's see if it happens.

Fukodome addresses many of the Cubs' biggest needs -- a left handed hitting high OBP guy near the top of the order that can play a good everyday RF.

Kuroda? Swapping in more pretty average pitching is how it looks to me.

If It Takes Forever ....

by wrigley1 on Nov 5, 2007 8:44 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

I think what you are seeing

is more of the Piniella impact on the organization. He made his first major impact in June of 07, and I would think this offseason will give him an opportunity to make further impact.

I am a Hendry critic, but I do give him kudos for having the smarts to listen to Piniella and to follow his lead in regards to building the roster.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Nov 5, 2007 9:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I was just thinking about this.

The push to get the two Japanese players may also show Piniella's influence.

In addition to managing Ichiro when he came to the major leagues and seeing how he approached the game, Piniella also had a Japanese pitcher -- Kazuhiro Sasaki -- as his closer for three years, 2000, 2001, and 2002, during which time the Mariners made the playoffs (2000 and 2001) and Sasaki racked up 116 saves (and ten more under Bob Melvin in 2003).

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 9:55 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I'll be shocked, if they get them.....

But I'll bet Lou's pushing this... Sounds like a package deal... Smart approach.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 11:16 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

How does Kuroda compare to Igawa?

What does "sizeable" mean when it comes to payroll? More than the Rozner figure of 115 mill? There were some quotes from Sam Zell a few weeks back about him not understanding the baseball business that made me wonder if there was going to be another big spending offseason, not 300 mill big, but still big.

As for the FAs, we'll see on Fukudome. The OBP at least should be good and maybe great.

Kuroda I worry is not what the rotation needs. Maybe Rich Hill takes a step forward in 2008 and Zambrano rights himself and the Cubs have their three post-season pitchers in Z, Hill, and Lilly, but I'd have preferred taking a risk on a guy like Freddy Garcia or Schilling. More pitching is good, but what the Cubs need is not more #4 starters. They need a solid #2 (since a #1 is not available). Maybe Kuroda will be that. I doubt it, though.

On the other hand, I do trust the Cubs scouts to know if Garcia, Schill, and Colon are all bad risks. I just remember how good Kei Igawa was supposed to be.

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 8:53 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Zell's not even "in charge" yet.

The sale of the Tribune is not yet finished, and thus, the sale of the Cubs is likely not going to be completed until well after the 2008 season begins.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 9:00 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Very true Al

but I do think Zell has a strong presense being on Trib's board and also with his deal to buy the company hanging in the balance.

With that said, Zell is much smarter than his comment "I don't understand baseball" leads one to think. If you translate it, I think what he is really saying is he does not like the baseball business because of so much being out of your control. I do believe he understands it enough, to know you have to show you are continuing to forge forward, despite the team being on the block.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Nov 5, 2007 9:28 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed

The point is that Zell, who at least knows what's going on with the Cubs at a basic level "doesn't understand" a business where you could make a ton of money on the Cubs without ever winning the WS, but still choose to spend money (and potentially make less) to try and win it.

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 9:44 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I don't think Kei Igawa was supposed to be great

I remember reading some that said he COULD be a low-end #3 starter or a #4 starter, but most of the experts felt he'd be a back of the rotation starter or long reliever. They had a lot of concern about his reliance on a mediocre fastball (88-91 mph) and his tendency to give up HR.

Kuroda supposedly has a better fastball, and has had less trouble with the long ball. I'd say he would fall somewhere between Daisuke and Igawa, which would be right about the #4 or #5 starter range.

by SouthernCub on Nov 5, 2007 9:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Yep.

The Yankees, I think, were desperate to show that they could do "something" in the Japanese market after they lost out on Matsuzaka. They WAY overpaid for Igawa.

I don't think Kuroda falls into that category at all, nor do I think the Cubs would have to pay anything near that much to get him.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 9:26 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Some positives on adding Japanese players:

I'm making a large generalization when I say this, but the Japanese players seem to be more fundamentally sound than the current Cubs.

That would be a major plus.

1-RUN GAMES = 23-22 | EXTRA INNINGS = 2-8 | HOME = 44-37 | NL CENTRAL CHAMPS!

by SackMan on Nov 5, 2007 10:24 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I think you are 100% correct

I had the pleasure of playing against a Japanese team when my college team traveled to play in an international tournament in Europe in 1982. We played against an all-star team from Japan, which was very similar to the one that won the gold medal 2 years later in LA.

Watching them practice, we were all surprised at how they went about a simple infield drill before a game. In the US, it is customary to hit routine ground balls for infield, but that was not the case with the Japanese. Their coach was hitting one hop laser beams at the infielders, instead of routine two hoppers. Everything they did appeared to be 100%, with no option for anything less.

Their pitchers were also very crafty and they approach everything as if its a battle they need to win. I think this is a big part of their overall culture - tons of pride and its not acceptable to embarass yourself or your team. Even the current day Japan major league players would seem to have this same high level of pride for what they do.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Nov 5, 2007 11:11 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Memory...

I was remembering it differently - that most were saying he would be a 3/4 and some (including David Wright) were saying he didn't have the stuff.

Here's an old link, which talks of Igawa as a 3/4 right after the fun old rumor that the Cubs had made an offer to Jason Schmidt:
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2006/11/pitchers_on_the.html

I guess the question is - what does a 4th starter do for the Cubs to help them win in the playoffs?

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 9:52 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I guess it depends on which sites you viewed...

I think the ESPN guys (and definitely David Wright) were saying he'd not be very good.

As far as your next question, it depends. Jeff Suppan and Jeff Weaver were #4/#5 type starters in 2006, and they did very well in the postseason. Ted Lilly was a legitimate #2 starter and he stunk last year in his one playoff appearance. Wang was an ace for the Yanks, and he got shelled. You just can't predict what will happen in the playoffs.

I don't think we can look at last year's result as anything more than a small sample. I'd expect better out of Lilly if he was given another chance. I expect Hill to continue to develop as a pitcher. And perhaps a guy like Kuroda would perform well in the postseason.

Where I think a #4 starter would help is in getting us back to the postseason. This is especially true if Marquis regresses. It provides us one more solid option in the rotation that can give us innings and a decent ERA. That's very important. Once we get to the postseason, then it's anybody's guess.

And the other thing to consider is that there just isn't an ace or a #2 starter available in free agency. So Kuroda may be the best alternative.

by SouthernCub on Nov 5, 2007 10:01 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I know every year is different

And, we won't get the same production out of certain players... but last season, our #4 and 5 guys performed remarkably well in the W/L column, compared to the rest of the league.

I'd prefer to keep things much of the same, and let our younger arms mature, instead of blocking them by guys with big contracts. Marshall and Hill are pretty good... and then we have Gallagher, Hart, Pignatiello, Petrick, etc.

Plus, we still have an ungodly amount of money tied up with Marquis. Let's get the most out of Marquis that we can.... or move him now, before adding even more big dollars to the rotation.

1-RUN GAMES = 23-22 | EXTRA INNINGS = 2-8 | HOME = 44-37 | NL CENTRAL CHAMPS!

by SackMan on Nov 5, 2007 10:03 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Marquis' value

I agree about not wanting to block young pitchers with long contracts. If Kuroda can be had at 3 years - well, that's not so bad. If he takes 4, no way.

To me, that's what makes Schilling, the FA pitcher most likely to be a #2, so attractive. Send him a letter telling him he could go into the HoF as THE pitcher to break both curses, keep him healthy for October, and if he flops, well, it was only a one year commitment.

But I can't say "we have an ungodly amount of $ tied up with Marquis." We've got two years and 7 mill a year. That's nothing compared to what Carlos Silva is going to get. Marquis gives you innings and a chance to win a good number of the games he starts. He has definite worth, and in this market, I'm not sure he's overpriced.

Frankly, the Cubs' situation with Marquis reminds me of the situation last winter with Jacque Jones. Coming off a decent year, his contract looked alright. If we had moved him then, maybe we could have gotten a B-level prospect. But we kept him, he flopped in the first half, lost all trade value, and made roster management awkward since we wanted to play a young prospect. I will not be surprised at all if the exact same thing happens with Marquis in 2008.

So, if getting Kuroda allows the Cubs to unload Marquis, then I'm for it. But a rotation with Marquis and Kuroda puts a lot of pressure on Lilly, Hill, and Zambrano to pitch very, very well.

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 10:38 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Schilling...

... has already punched his HoF ticket; he's got over 3000 strikeouts.

He's 41 years old. If he were 36 or even 38, I might be willing to do this. But at 41, he could break down at any time -- he spent about 1/3 of 2007 on the DL.

And he's going to ask for -- and probably get -- $12-$13 million. For that much, or not much more (per year) you could probably get Kuroda AND Fukudome.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 10:43 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

That's a chance to take

for one year. While I agree there is risk of injury, hell, who isn't (look what happened to D-Lee in '06 after a stellar '05), Schilling is the kind of guy that can propel a playoff team to a WS victory. I sign him mostly for OCTOBER. I look at his career postseason stats and it makes me giddy.

Our grandparents used to say, "I hope the Cubs win the Series before I die". Now teenagers are saying it. Let's change that next season!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 5, 2007 10:54 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Even if not

Get ready for one of the largest, if not the largest, ticket price increases in team history. Which is OK if the payroll is correspondingly increased

It's OK, regardless what's done with payroll. When you are 98% sold out, a ticket price increase is almost mandatory. Payroll and ticket prices are not related.

by Ivychat on Nov 5, 2007 8:55 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Maybe not, but...

... clearly, they can justify it in public by saying, "Here, we're spending money to improve the team."

Isn't that what you've said for a long time?

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 8:58 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

What I've said...

...is that they have the money and they've been unwilling to eat bad decisions despite having the money. (Eg. A Gonz vs. Tejada).

Whatever they want to do with the politics around a price increase is irrelelvant to me. They are raising prices because they can. Not because of payroll going up or down.

If they had Cleveland's roster and payroll, would they be increasing prices this offseason? Absolutely.

by Ivychat on Nov 5, 2007 10:08 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Cleveland's roster is clearly superior to the...

...one in Chicago, regardless of cost.

FREE CARMEN PIGNATIELLO!

by cwyers on Nov 5, 2007 11:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Interesting

To this stat handicapped fan, they both look like good catches. With a name like Fukudome, you can't go wrong. When he does well, I can see the signs in the crowd directed at the other team and their fans(prepare to get...! etc etc). He doesn't do so well and... you can imagine the signs directed at him. Lot's of F bombs to come in game threads from the overly dramatic, knee jerk, cussing fans if he becomes a Cub.

As far as ticket prices, what's another $10, $20, or $30 per ticket? On eBay or other ticket sites they will be in the very least double and more likely triple or more the price anyways. Especially after a winning season. I understand the beast. More money coming in means more money toward finding a WS quality team. And unlike other teams' fans, there will be no lack of Cubs fans to buy them no matter the cost and no matter how the team plays. We are all crazy in love with our Cubs and nothing will change that.

Anxiously awaiting the arrival of Opening Day '08

by love the ivy on Nov 5, 2007 8:55 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

just win

and it won't matter how much tickets are.

AC 00 00 00 - BELIEVE

by mike on Nov 5, 2007 8:56 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

spoken like a person

who doesn't go to game often. As for me, I am a partial season ticket holder who has had his tickets since 1984...and it seems the little guy like myself is being squeezed more and more.

Kasey

See the Cubs 2008 schedule at http://ignarski.tripod.com/sched2008.html

by kaseyi on Nov 5, 2007 9:04 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

im not a season ticket holder

but I've gone to probably 30-40 games over the past 4 years. do i live at wrigley like some people on this board do? no, but I feel as though I go to a decent amount of games.

AC 00 00 00 - BELIEVE

by mike on Nov 5, 2007 9:12 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

and for what it s worth

I meant that if they win you won't hear people complain about paying an arm and a leg.

AC 00 00 00 - BELIEVE

by mike on Nov 5, 2007 9:31 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Well little guy,

I would love to have your predicament. There is a waiting list of over 60000 that would love to as well. And if the burden of paying for them is getting too high, you can still go to what, like 10 games, and put the rest of them up for auction and make enough money to pay for everything twice.

Anxiously awaiting the arrival of Opening Day '08

by love the ivy on Nov 5, 2007 9:15 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I know it will hurt me.

I have 5 club boxes(since 1983) and the price was $26500 last year. 1983 it was $3800. A huge increase will definitely hurt.

by cubswin on Nov 5, 2007 9:22 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

So... Al

What you're saying is... since the Cubs spent $300 mil last offseason, and are finally rebuilding the playing field (years upon years too late), we'll have to endure the highest ticket price increase ever?

Yay. Thanks a lot. Like the greedy bastards they are... they pocket nearly all of the revenue they earned from loyal fans, and then charge us more, so we can pay for the improvements instead of them.

If they had spent their money more wisely last year, maybe we wouldn't have to suffer an increase that may reach toward 25%.

1-RUN GAMES = 23-22 | EXTRA INNINGS = 2-8 | HOME = 44-37 | NL CENTRAL CHAMPS!

by SackMan on Nov 5, 2007 9:39 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

As long as Wrigley continues to sell out

every game, the Cubs are going to raise ticket prices. That's how business works. Us fans just have to deal with it.

by Oscarson1 on Nov 5, 2007 10:50 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

EXACTLY

Keep filling up the place, prices will continue to rise. Stay away and they'll drop.

Our grandparents used to say, "I hope the Cubs win the Series before I die". Now teenagers are saying it. Let's change that next season!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 5, 2007 11:00 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Prices will not drop...

At best, if there is a serious attendance falloff, prices will remain steady for some time to come.

by MN exile on Nov 5, 2007 11:16 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I said that about the 'Hawks in the mid-late 80's

and early 90's when Chicago Stadium for a hockey game was the hardest ticket to get in the history of Chicago sports. The 'Hawks averaged 107% of capacity for a decade. Some regular season games I could have sold my tickets for a 500% profit. Playoff tickets were ridiculous.

Then the old man got really cheap and let the stars walk.

There never was a season ticket package besides full season. There were never any discounts, ala the Southside teams' present practice. That's all changed. The team has sucked for 10 years+ now. I mark Aug 16, 1996 as the beginning of the end; when they traded Roenick for that PoS soft Russian Zhamnov.

The same would happen for the Cubs. It's just unlikely from our current state-of-the-team viewpoint. Belive me, if the Cubs [attendance] fell to the sub 1.8M mark for some time, changes in ticket prices would occur. There'd be promo's all over the place, just like the Southside team has.

Our grandparents used to say, "I hope the Cubs win the Series before I die". Now teenagers are saying it. Let's change that next season!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 5, 2007 11:45 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Nothing lasts forever

and this is also true when it comes to ticket demand. If I recall, the Indians have probably had the longest stretch of attendence support in recent memory. I believe they sold out every game for 6-7 years straight, and I don't believe any other team can say the same.

IMO, the longest stretch of "hot tickets" in Chicago history has to go to the Blackhawks of the early 60's to early 70's. Most on this board may be too young to remember, but those teams were loaded with talent, were entertaining and were legit contenders every year. In 71, the demand was so high, they showed playoff games via closed circuit television in area movie theaters and there were lines around the block to get in. I was very young, but my dad would get his hands on 5-6 games per year, and to this day, I can remember details of many of the games.

The closest to the hawks trend would have to be the Bulls from 91 to 98.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Nov 5, 2007 11:58 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

to add on to that

610 straight home games sold out from 1987 to 2000

AC 00 00 00 - BELIEVE

by mike on Nov 5, 2007 12:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Sellouts

I believe there was a 3 or 4-year stretch or so where the Bulls never played in front of an empty seat, home or away. Incredible!

PERRY!!!!

by Goat Whisperer on Nov 5, 2007 12:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Increases are always expected

I believe the MLB ticket price increase average is somewhere around 4-7% annually. I can't find the link I had looked at last week. Some teams increase by very small amounts, some by much larger amounts... and some don't increase at all on a given offseason. Lat year, the Dodgers increased prices by a whopping 26% (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2819597)

The largest increase by the Cubs that I can find info on was a 21% hike in 1999 (http://www.thecubdom.com/archives/2004/11/cubs_increase_t.html).

If they go up over 25% this year... that is a HUGE increase.

1-RUN GAMES = 23-22 | EXTRA INNINGS = 2-8 | HOME = 44-37 | NL CENTRAL CHAMPS!

by SackMan on Nov 5, 2007 11:11 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

..hot dogs

Cost a nickel when my grandpa was my age, JUST ASK HIM. In twenty years we will all be clammoring for them to bring the prices back to where they are. Its the way things work everywhere.

All I care about is the Cubs winning a World Series and me having to think of a new 'thing' in my life to fret over. It would be nice

Hey.....Cubs win!!! Steve Stone is the most overrated scumbag in the business.

by Hammer on Nov 5, 2007 9:55 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

yup

and my dad would be able to get in the park the next day if he brought a game ball from the previous day.

Some times the street car conductor would let him and his friend ride free if they were briging a ball back to "Cubs Park".

Our grandparents used to say, "I hope the Cubs win the Series before I die". Now teenagers are saying it. Let's change that next season!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 5, 2007 11:48 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

FDome in Center

I remember someone asking about this the other day, but I couldn't find it when looking at past diaries. Does anyone know how good an outfielder Fukodome is supposed to be, and whether he has any experience in center? Because of Pie's struggles against lefties I was wondering if they could use Fdome in center and Murton in right when they face lefties.

by ms9av on Nov 5, 2007 10:20 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

The answer

is that he's a very good defensive OFer. He has experience in center, but there is a concern that he has the necessary range to play CF in the majors day in and day out. He's projected to be a very good armed RF.

by NO100 on Nov 5, 2007 11:07 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Soriano and Piniella

These two guys are two other assets the Cubs have in recruiting Japanese players.

Piniella of course was the manager in Seattle with their Japanese imports, and he seemed to have a good relationship with them.

Soriano is another important piece. As I recall, he actually speaks Japanese from his days playing there.

I am sure that in the end, it will come down to how much the Cubs offer, but ensuring a higher comfort level for these guys would be tremendously important for their success.

Eamus Ursuli!

by WGNstatic on Nov 5, 2007 10:26 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Does Derrek Lee speak Japanese?

His Father and Uncle both played Japanese ball, and IIRC Derrek lived in Japan for a bit when he was young.

Also, Chicago has had a Japanese import, Tadihito Iguchi, so they don't all go to the coasts, as some posters have stated previously.

"There are no curses here...Games are won and lost on the baseball field" - Lou Piniella

by El Borto on Nov 5, 2007 11:04 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Lee & Japanese

I had heard that he does, but I know Sori does. In fact, I saw the Carp play many times in Hiroshima without realizing Sori was even on the team.

PERRY!!!!

by Goat Whisperer on Nov 5, 2007 12:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

lineup

Fukudome, from all I've read, would be great. But I'm concerned about the lineup. Who would hit fifth?

Let's assume Sori is the leadoff hitter, Fukudome is in the two hole, then Lee and then Ramirez. That means DeRosa or Soto in the fifth spot -- unless JJ stays, which seems unlikely.

5-8 could be DeRosa, Soto, Pie, Theriot. There's upside there, but not much certainty. Could Fukudome hit fifth and swap places with DeRosa?

I know the Cubs could make other moves after signing Fukudome. But the easiest thing might be to keep JJ, start him in center and hit him fifth. If Pie emerges, it wouldn't be hard to trade JJ during the season.

Another option would be to move Sori down in the lineup. But who would hit leadoff? Shouldn't be Theriot.

by elgato on Nov 5, 2007 10:26 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

DeRosa #5?

To me, DeRosa seems like a find #5 hitter.

He doesn't have a ton of power certainly, but honestly, it seems like a consistent bat is going to do more to protect a hitter like A-Ram than a guy with a bit more power but less contact/patience (i.e. Jones).

Also, if Soto emerges and proves that his 2007 wasn't a fluke I wouldn't mind seeing him in the #5 hole.

Eamus Ursuli!

by WGNstatic on Nov 5, 2007 10:37 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I like DeRosa

But he doesn't have a lot of power AND he's right handed. But JJ's power dropped so much last year ...

I agree that Soto might work in the five hole, but I would prefer it if he were hitting sixth or seventh.

by elgato on Nov 5, 2007 10:42 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Go get...

... Wilson Betemit to play SS v. RHP and bat him 5th.

Sori
Fuk
Lee
Aram
Bet
Soto
DeRo
Pie

Against LHP I'm not sure you'll want Soto batting any lower than 5th.

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 10:45 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Actually...

... my bad - Soto's career splits having him doing better against righties.

Also -
http://www.minorleaguesplits.com/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?pl=434567&tm=IowPCL&bp=b

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 11:54 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Wil Betemit

has put on too much weight to play SS. (He's a mini-Cabrera, talented but lazy.) As this point, unless he does a LOT of off-season conditioning work, DeRo would have more range at SS than Betemit. That's why Bobby Cox gave up on him -- he had lost the range to play SS. He also has a very bad attitude about playing 2B. (He refused to do it at all for a while, and won't practice there.) That leaves him as a backup (on the Cubs) 1B/3B, which we don't particularly need. Betemit does have more power, especially LH, and he still has a rifle arm and soft hands.

"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007

by DeRoMyHero on Nov 5, 2007 12:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

This is why I think...

...it wouldn't be the worst idea to install DeRosa at short and then pick up a second baseman in trade, free agency, or just (gasp!) using Eric Patterson there.

Yeah, I know. Things that won't happen ever, starting with DeRosa and E-Patt.

FREE CARMEN PIGNATIELLO!

by cwyers on Nov 5, 2007 1:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

DeRo at SS

I actually think that DeRo is a better SS than 2B -- he certainly was when he first came up. (I lived in Atlanta back then and saw him play a few times.) He has adequate range, a true SS arm, great hands, and a quick release; he's also a great pivot-man. I think he is better than Riot at SS. (Riot is probably a better 2B than DeRo -- why not switch them?)

The question is: who could we get for 2B? Castillo scares me, because he has knee problems and speed guys don't age too well. Kaz Matsui? Excellent speed and good OBP.

Could the Cubs go from 0 Japanese players to 3 in one winter?

"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007

by DeRoMyHero on Nov 5, 2007 2:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

No thanks.

Kaz Matsui is not that good. His OPS+ was 87. Not worth the cost to upgrade Cedeno/Theriot.

I'm fine with getting potentially below average defense in the mix for SS from one side of a platoon - especially if, in a different organization, coaches might be able to get the target back to a better level. Again, with Betemit, the cost is likely just a reliever in trade and if the Cubs can convince him it's time to shape up and win the job, he has a ton of upside. From a similar perspective, I might kick the tires on Tejada, but if being on a winning team can't reenergize his defense, you're stuck. With a guy like Betemit, T. Abreu, or Zobrist, you can always keep them as backups.

I don't think the Cubs are going to put DeRo at SS. They had plenty of opportunity last year and never did.

Oh, and enough of the "Trade for Furcal" stuff. The Dodgers want to play more veterans, not more rookies. I think we'd have a better shot at trading for Hu than for Furcal.

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 4:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

A-Ram Would Hit Fifth...

... with A-Rod batting 4th. ;-)

Sori
Fuk
Lee
A-Rod
A-Ram
Soto
DeRo
Pie

by initram on Nov 5, 2007 12:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

ok, you want a-rod...

So how how do you want tickets to go? want bleavher seats starting at 50$?

PIE!!!

by LilLPLancer23 on Nov 5, 2007 3:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks

for that info Al. Exciting to see how it folds out.

I'd like Geovany Soto to catch for me everyday. ;-)

by sue369 on Nov 5, 2007 10:28 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Does Fukudome spell the end of Murton?

If the Cubs had Fukudome in RF and Sori in LF, is Murton trade bait or a bench player? Any speculation on where Murton might go and what return he might bring?

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 10:43 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Good question.

Murton's never been a very good pinch-hitter, so his value as a bench player is fairly low. That 4th-OF slot can and would be filled by Angel Pagan, presuming he's healthy.

Thus Murton is trade bait, IMO.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 10:44 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Is Pagan ahead of Fuld...

...in the spare OF depth chart still?

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 10:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

If we get Fukudome...

It almost certainly would spell the end of Murton as a Cub. With Soriano in LF and Fukudome in RF, and with Murton not being a big bat as a PH, that'd pretty much do it.

My guess is that if Fukudome was added, Murton would become trade fodder. It'd almost have to be either as part of a package for someone (SS or pitcher?) or in another "throwaway" deal that Hendry has become famous for lately (low-level prospect in return).

by SouthernCub on Nov 5, 2007 10:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

It seems like

if Fukudome and Kuroda are signed, that would make Murton, Jones, and Marquis or Marshall trade bait. I think we can add Cedeno to the list of guys probably out the door.

How about Marquis and Cedeno for Garland?

by NO100 on Nov 5, 2007 11:13 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Fudodome in CF

If Fukodome can play some CF, I can envision a Murton/Piea platoon for the 3rd OF spot. That of course might mean having Fukodome switch off between CF and RF depending on the starter, but I can see it.

That said, Murton is trade bait in my mind.

Eamus Ursuli!

by WGNstatic on Nov 5, 2007 12:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I would hope that Murton already

worked his way off next year's roster by now.

He's flat out horrible defensively... and does not provide great enough power to the line-up to justify an everyday spot.

If you wanna be an everyday outfielder, and you're below average defensively, you better be able to drive in a boatload of runs. That's how guys like Adam Dunn stay in LF.

1-RUN GAMES = 23-22 | EXTRA INNINGS = 2-8 | HOME = 44-37 | NL CENTRAL CHAMPS!

by SackMan on Nov 5, 2007 11:21 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Murton is Adam Dunn

Only not even close to as good. Murton needs to go somewhere where he can play left field everyday. Thats where you put your outfielding defensive liability, not in right. Lou was forced to and probably cringed everytime the ball was hit out there, just like we all cringed.

Hey.....Cubs win!!! Steve Stone is the most overrated scumbag in the business.

by Hammer on Nov 5, 2007 11:33 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

According to the Fielding Bible...

...Murton was one of the top five defenders in left field over the past three seasons.

According to Zone Rating, Murton probably is only about two runs worse than the league average right fielder. He seems to compensate for some of his deficiencies by having a pretty good range for a right fielder.

I know, I know. File this under things I know that nobody will believe.

FREE CARMEN PIGNATIELLO!

by cwyers on Nov 5, 2007 11:41 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

According to my eyes

Murton stinks in the OF. How many guys actually drop a routine fly ball on more than one occasion during a season?

And it's especially fun to watch him chase down (or should I say, wait patiently) for a ball that's rattling around in the corner.

Ed Lynch is STILL on the Cubs payroll, as our Diamondbacks scout in Phoenix. Lynch attends all 81 home games with a notepad in hand. Great job Ed! <sarcasm

by SackMan on Nov 5, 2007 11:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

An honest question

Why should the defensive liability play left? Don't more balls get hit to left filed than right, shouldn't your better fielder be where more balls are hit?

"There are no curses here...Games are won and lost on the baseball field" - Lou Piniella

by El Borto on Nov 5, 2007 11:53 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I've often wondered that myself

But I guess it centers around two things that I'm whipping up on the fly:

1. The Left-Center gap appears smaller than the Right-Center gap... in terms of where most balls are put into play.

When right-handed hitters pull it, they put the ball into play in a more narrow/defined area. When they go opposite field, there is a greater range of possibilities on where that ball will end up.

2. The long throw from RF to 3rd base.

Ed Lynch is STILL on the Cubs payroll, as our D-Backs scout in Phoenix. Lynch attends all 81 D-Back home games with a notepad in hand. Really paid off for us!

by SackMan on Nov 5, 2007 12:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

In Wrigley

RF is a bit bigger and requires someone with a bit more skill to patrol. Also, one of the most important plays in baseball, is the basehit to RF with a runner on 1st, and you want your RF to deter as many of those guys from making the turn and going to 3rd. Lastly, RF is usually the sun field, which makes reading balls of the bat even more important.

You may be right that more balls are hit to left, but poor OF play in RF tends to hurt your club more for the reasons I stated above.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Nov 5, 2007 12:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Murton and Fukudome

The ironic thing is that I'd put even money on Murton having a .SLG at least as good as Fukudome's if they both get 400 PA in 2008. Just look at the Japanese stats of other players who have come over to ML and remember that Murton is just turning 26.

As for the defense, Fukudome should definitely do better, although Murton was not that bad according to Rate statistics and actually scored an asset in LF in both '06 and '07.

Anyway, the Cubs have money to burn, apparently, so maybe Murton can bring back a useful piece in trade.

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 11:49 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Does anyone ever

....go to ALLCUBS.com??? Sorry if you dont like other websites mentioned on this site, but I honestly can say that I agree with NOTHING that the head writer over there says.

Kudos to AL, for being the exact opposite of this guy.

Hey.....Cubs win!!! Steve Stone is the most overrated scumbag in the business.

by Hammer on Nov 5, 2007 11:38 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

This rumor has been posted on

mlbtraderumors..

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2007/11/odds-and-ends-2.html

Interesting rumor about the White Sox going after Rafael Furcal. Maybe the Cubs can deal Marquis and a prospect to LA for Furcal? Marquis can battle it out w/ Loazia for the 5th spot and provide depth, if Schmidt goes down again. I know Furcal had a down year, but hopefully he can post his 2006 numbers in a contract year..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 11:47 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

If he could

at least get his career OBP of .349 or exceed it that would be great; in addition to moving Soriano to the 5-hole.

Our grandparents used to say, "I hope the Cubs win the Series before I die". Now teenagers are saying it. Let's change that next season!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 5, 2007 11:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Guess I have to scalp more tickets

To cover the price increase. Hard to imagine $50 plus bleachers.
Last year was the first time that there was no increase for season ticket holders but that was a fluke do to the timing of the Soriano signing and the due date for season renewels. I always thought the Terrace Reserve seats where I (and Kasey) sit are one of the better deals but that is because a huge percentage of them have some kind of obsructed view. I record price increase would not surprise but what was the largest increase in the past?

"It's the Cubbies. There's always a vibe. It's the greatest vibe in baseball." Greg Maddux on Cub fan's optimism even after the 06 debacle.

by jessica on Nov 5, 2007 12:13 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Coming off a 96-loss season

will do that from time to time. Notice however that single game tickets went up slightl - and just coincidentally - after all the backloaded contracts were signed.

Our grandparents used to say, "I hope the Cubs win the Series before I die". Now teenagers are saying it. Let's change that next season!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 5, 2007 12:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I would love to see both players

here. I agree with poster above that Japanese players appear to be more hard working and dedicated to growth (as a whole of course). It is what this team needs IMHO.

MMMMM...Fernandos fajitas and margaritas

by Kinky Reggae on Nov 5, 2007 12:32 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

My dos centavos

Take a pass on Schilling. He's too much of a media circus and WAY too inconsistent in crossing back and forth between his Faith (and the humility that SHOULD rightfully accompany it) and his king sized ego and mouth. The Cub clubhouse can do without him.

Even though another good starter would be nice, if it was a case of druthers, I vote for Fukudome instead of Kuroda, but would love both.

To me the dilemma is: are you willing to part with Pie, Hill/Marshall and say a Gallagher for the right to have Santana for a year, then pay him a Carlos++ contract? If you make post season again, it sure would look formidable to have those 2 in several winner take all short series'.

This is unpopular, but i have serious reservations about Pie offensively and how long it'll take him to get it in gear. I saw a pretty fair share of him in AAA and the shortcomings i noted there were still as glaring in MLB.

If Minnesota would take Pie, Marshall and Gallagher for Johann--i make that deal. Pie seems the type who will not only take forever to develop sufficient plate discipline but will also make many base running gaffes.

Z, Santana, Lily, Hill and a fifth. Looks good, But JH won't do it. He'll go for offense mostly. Based on season ending stats on offense and defense, that's probably what he should do.

Would Miguel Tejada be a welcome addition? Or do you prefer Peralta?

BBWAA's name should be changed to "Power in the hands of Fools"

by cubfever7 on Nov 5, 2007 12:54 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Wow, pretty close to what I'd also like

I'd take a shot with Schilling, only because it's one year and he's the stuff for October.

Both Fukudome and Kuroda would be great.

Turning Pie into Santana, along with giving up a 2/3 combo of Hill, Marshall & Gallagher is good. Think the Twinkies would want more.

I'm worried about Tejada's best days behind him, especially if the Cubs have to give up a lot and/or it costs big bucks. Furcal is another option if he can leadoff with his career .349 OBP or better.

I'm not sold on Pie's offensive capability but damn can that kid play D.

Our grandparents used to say, "I hope the Cubs win the Series before I die". Now teenagers are saying it. Let's change that next season!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 5, 2007 1:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Pie

I agree. If he had a picture-perfect swing, but simply lacked plate discipline, we could compare him to Jeff Francouer. That is, we would expect his plate discipline to improve with experience. (Remember that Francouer had only half a season at AA, and no AAA experience at all when he was called up.)

Pie has a really ugly swing. He seems to hack at the ball like he is swatting flies. Thus, even when he sees strikes, he doesn't always make contact. It will be interesting to see what Gerald Perry can do this winter, but I'm not expecting any miracles. If his swing doesn't improve, his lack of plate discipline won't really matter.

"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007

by DeRoMyHero on Nov 5, 2007 1:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

His swing bothers me as well

Pie tends to lean out over the plate and has a very long looping swing. If you noticed, he broke a boatload of bats because he jams himself on pitches that are right over the middle of the plate.

Can he make an adjustment? Sure, he could, especially with a guy like Piniella who was a master at hitting the ball where it was pitched.

The outlook for him (IMO) is not as bright as it was when he first came up, but that doesn't mean he won't pan out.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Nov 5, 2007 1:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

That's funny... cause,

it was his NON-SWING that really bothered me... staring at strike 3 on a regular basis.

Ed Lynch is STILL on the Cubs payroll, as our D-Backs scout in Phoenix. Lynch attends all 81 D-Back home games with a notepad in hand. Really paid off for us!

by SackMan on Nov 5, 2007 1:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Amassing trade bait?

Al, if the Cubs did get Fukudome and Kuroda, would that be an indication that a large trade is in the works? I mean, you'd be adding an everyday RF and starter to the team, making some of these guys theoretically tradeable (depending on who stays/who goes):

Murton
Pie
JJones
Pagan
Marquis
Marshall
Gallagher
Hill

Throw in the "depth" we have at middle infield (DeRosa - who is not going anywhere thanks to his flexibility, - Theriot, Cedeno, Fontenot, plus EPatterson perhaps), and it seems like the Cubs have a LOT of young pieces that other teams might be interested in.

What about, say, a deal with Tampa Bay for Crawford? We could trade Pie, Marshall, and Gallagher for him...gives them young (somewhat proven) pitching and an outfield replacement....lands the Cubs a guy that can play CF and would be an absolute top of the order (or #2) BEAST in the lineup...

by Chadnudj on Nov 5, 2007 2:25 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Once again...

... Crawford's not a center fielder. You have an image of him as "a fast guy who can play CF". He's a fast guy who plays LF. Even when the Rays needed a CF in 2005 when Baldelli went down, Crawford didn't go there.

I do agree that there are going to be some major moves, Jones going probably being the first, if he can be thrown into a larger deal (i.e. "You want such-and-such, you have to take Jones' contract).

If the Cubs add Fukudome, I don't see them trading for Carl Crawford.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 2:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe Gaithright was a better fit??

Crawford's ZR was .950 with one error in 30 games in CF in 2004..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 2:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I'm not sure...

...what kind of larger deal the Cubs could be involved in. Every player that may actually bring in some solid value have full NTCs for the duration. Soriano, Zambrano, Lee, Ramierez aren't going anywhere, and even the likes of JJ and Eyre have contractually limited trade markets.

So what do the Cubs have that people may want to trade for? We have some 3rd/4th OF options in the body of Murton, Pie, JJ, and Pagan, some young arms that show a varying amount of promise (Marshall, Gallagher, Hill, and heck, why not toss in Hart?), and some contracts that we probably won't be able to move favourably (Marquis, who while didn't do a poor job last year, closed weak and will be paid nearly $10M in 2009). However you want to mix it, what kind of package can the Cubs put together to get us that extra starter/power lefty OF/starting SS we've all been clamoring for? Some of these players are attractive but young, while others are experienced but expensive. I myself am not expecting JH to get us much ML-ready talent this offseason, but a couple of shrewd trades could build our farm system quite nicely.

Ultimately, I hope we get Fukudome, because he'll probably be the best all-around RF we can pick up on the FA market. I don't want to have to sign an over-the-hill player or trade half the farm for the same.

by Flatley on Nov 5, 2007 3:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Inconclusive on Crawford in CF...

For one thing, the D-Rays haven't exactly been the smartest of franchises. It could very well be that Crawford is capable of playing CF but the D-Rays didn't realize it. Crawford certainly has the speed to play CF, and he played RF in the minors so I suspect he has the arm to play CF as well. The fact that Tampa Bay refused to play him there doesn't mean he can't do it.

Personally, I think that if Jones can play CF, Crawford can as well. Crawford is faster and has a better arm than Jones.

However, all this said, I think it's probably moot, as I doubt we'd win in a bidding war for Crawford, and I'm not sure I'd want to be the winner in a bidding war (not that Crawford isn't really good, just that I can envision the cost getting out of hand).

by SouthernCub on Nov 5, 2007 3:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Smart rays

If the Rays are too dumb to have Crawford as a CF, isn't one of the men making those decisions now making the same decisions for the Cubs?

Eamus Ursuli!

by WGNstatic on Nov 5, 2007 3:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

He worked with the D-Rays for 2 years...

and in those 2 years, Crawford was already on the big league club. I suspect that his role in the positional decisions of the major league team were minimal at best.

My point is more to say that just because a team didn't try something doesn't prove it's not possible.

But the whole discussion may be moot because (1) we don't know if the Cubs have actually really talked to the D-Rays at all about it, and (2) it'll probably cost too much in prospects any way, and (3) he just as easily could be envisioned as a potential option in RF and not CF.

by SouthernCub on Nov 5, 2007 4:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Oops, guess you meant Piniella...

and as has been discussed elsewhere, there are a number of reasons why Crawford may not have been used, of which only one is that they didn't think he could do it.

And IF the rumor is true that the Cubs have asked about Crawford (which is a big "IF"), that would lead me to believe that Piniella sure thinks he could have a position with the Cubs.

by SouthernCub on Nov 5, 2007 4:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Piniella indeed

My concern with Crawford is that converting him to CF sounds alot like the acquisition of Soriano last year.

I was all for experimenting with Soriano in CF, since there was a spot for him to slide over to without too much short term damage and no long term impact. That wouldn't be the same with Crawford. If he was a trainwreck in CF the Cubs would be stuck.

Eamus Ursuli!

by WGNstatic on Nov 5, 2007 7:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Big difference here...

is that Crawford has played his entire career in the OF, whereas Soriano had just one season in LF. Also, Crawford is a solid defensive OF, whereas Soriano was definitely questionable (throwing arm aside) in the OF in his one year. Therefore, the transition should be a LOT less bumpy for Crawford than it was for Soriano.

by SouthernCub on Nov 5, 2007 9:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Boy , this speculation and debate is fun but

I can't wait for some real news.

I've been habiually checking mlb sites all afternoon reading the same speculations and rumors.

Hopefully there will be some excitement with the GM meetings this week.

Until then I'm running out of ways to avoid actual work.

"There are no curses here...Games are won and lost on the baseball field" - Lou Piniella

by El Borto on Nov 5, 2007 2:49 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Timing

If the Cubs plan on a large price increase, it makes sense that they would want to show the fans a brighter next year. That would suggest the attempt to sign both players early and then hit the fans with an "O, by the way your're getting a cost increase in line with our desire to win the World Series 1n 2008".

It also make a number of guys currently on the roster available for trades sooner than later. We'll be a seller at the December meetings.

It's not to late to go to Soto.

by tharr on Nov 5, 2007 2:53 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Precisely.

Excellent analysis, and I think this is exactly what is happening.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 3:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I still wouldn't mind

Silva on the north side. Fukudome and Silva would be nice additions.

MMMMM...Fernandos fajitas and margaritas

by Kinky Reggae on Nov 5, 2007 3:15 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

McPhail's open to dealing Bedard

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/baseball/bal-sp.meetings05nov05,0,3443819.story?page=2

I'd definitely give up Pie to get Bedard.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 3:17 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

It'd take a lot more than Pie...

Considering that he's been discussing contract extensions with Bedard's agent, I don't think he's jumping at the possibility of trading him.

And the quote "Twenty-eight-year-old left-handers that are as dominant as he was over the course of the season are hard to come by..." makes it pretty clear that MacPhail knows what he has there.

by SouthernCub on Nov 5, 2007 3:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

No doubt

it will take more than Pie..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 3:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Do you think...

Pie and OH-Man! would get it done?

Quantity?

How about Pie, Ohman and Dempster?

Pie and Dempster?

Oh-MAN!, Dempster and Eyre?

Wait 'til next year. And the next. And the Next. And the next after that too.

by TheEman on Nov 5, 2007 8:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Hill & Pie seem sufficient.

imo...

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 8:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

You know...

I was kidding.

I don't think McFail would take Oh-Man again.

Wait 'til next year. And the next. And the Next. And the next after that too.

by TheEman on Nov 5, 2007 9:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Figured so

Just acknowledging your post and suggesting what I think is a fair deal.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 10:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

13-5 with a 1.09 WHIP

for a crappy club. Granted the WHIP is a quarter point lower than his career numbers but I figure the O's may want more than Pie. If not, I totally agree, go get him. I'd be less wanting of Schilling then...

Our grandparents used to say, "I hope the Cubs win the Series before I die". Now teenagers are saying it. Let's change that next season!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 5, 2007 3:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

fukudome

he would not fit in in Minnesota, Tampa Bay, or the Roger Centre

Live is boring until March 31st strolls by..

by Chanman25 on Nov 5, 2007 3:35 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

and ticket prices skyrocket?

they won 85 games last season! Its not like they won the World Series.

One bad thing about winning many games is finding it extremely difficult to buy tickets..

Live is boring until March 31st strolls by..

by Chanman25 on Nov 5, 2007 3:38 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Would you rather...

...pay ten bucks for a ticket to watch the Cubs go 66-96 every year?

by Flatley on Nov 5, 2007 4:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

well no

but i hate it when people who go to games during the bad times get outed when people decide to show up to games when they start winning

Live is boring until March 31st strolls by..

by Chanman25 on Nov 5, 2007 4:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

So if they sign Kuroda

which seems A LOT more plausible than signing Fukudome, do they then look to deal Hill for someone like Santanna or Peavy or Bedard????? Kuroda sounds like a 3 or 4 starter and they already have that in Lilly & Hill.. They need a #2 starter..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 4:28 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Addendum

If they sign Kuroda, is Hill & Pie for Bedard a good deal? A 3.09 ERA in the AL East is VERY impressive..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 4:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Well part of the answer

is what did MacPhail think of them when he was here? You would think that MacPhail has some insights into the Cubs prospects.

Personally, I say that is not enough. You are talking about trading a possible #3/#4 pitcher in Hill and a decent but slightly tarnished prospect in Pie for a #1/#2 pitcher who is only 28 and coming into his own. Bedard is only 1 year older than Hill and a lot more proven. He's gotten better each of the last 3 years. Last year's numbers are second in the AL to Santana. He is also under contract for 2 more years so I can't see MacPhail dealing him this year unless he is bowled over by the offer.

by rlpete on Nov 5, 2007 4:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

He should have a lot of insights..

I've read Balitmore thinks their pitching's fine even if they give up Bedard, and may trade him to fill holes in their lineup. Also, Hill's quite a bit cheaper for several years... I dunno what other hitting prospect Baltimore would like??

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 4:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I don't get it.

Hill was in the top ten in the National League for:

WHIP
Hits Allowed/9IP
Strikeouts
Shutouts
Strikeout to walks

He struck out more batters than Lilly or Zambrano, in fewer innings pitched. He had a lower WHIP, too. He pitched 12 fewer innings than Lilly, and gave up two more runs. His ERA was actually better than Big Z's.

And this, folks, is what Hill looks like during his sophmore slump.

And yet there are so many people ready to write him off as a 3-4 starter. Bull. This is still the pitcher Peter Gammons referred to as the next Barry Zito. Pitchers that exceed their career high in innings pitched by thirty tend to regress in their next season; Hill actually improved. He's a stud, and there's no reason to think that he won't get better next season.

Hill has almost the same ceiling as Cole Hamels, probably his biggest comparison in the bigs. His home run rate and walk rate are a shade high, but Hill still has #1 starter potential and could take a big step forward next year.

FREE CARMEN PIGNATIELLO!

by cwyers on Nov 5, 2007 7:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I sure hope you're right.

n/t

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 5, 2007 7:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

The biggest downside to Rich

is that he tends to forget from start-to-start what the hell to do.

He went to one of the top 15 Universities in the U.S., and GRADUATED. Yet, he grooves a pitch to Chris Young knowing full-well that he should NOT come close to this action.

It is still mental toughness, on a consisten basis, that is preventing him from reaching his potential, imo.

Wait 'til next year. And the next. And the Next. And the next after that too.

by TheEman on Nov 5, 2007 8:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

That... and...

he can't field his position worth a crap, and he can't bunt worth a crap. And he doesn't seem to care to try or improve.

But, I like the way he pitches :)

Ed Lynch is STILL on the Cubs payroll, as our D-Backs scout in Phoenix. Lynch attends all 81 D-Back home games with a notepad in hand. Really paid off for us!

by SackMan on Nov 6, 2007 3:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Cmon

Hamels is 23 and Hill's 27..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Nov 5, 2007 7:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Remember when...

Hendry tried to get Bedard included in a Prior-Tejada deal and everyone said, "Don't trade Mark Prior"?

Oh well.

by DGU on Nov 5, 2007 4:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

you know very well

that the Prior-Tejada rumor was in fact a rumor that wouldn't have occurred. The Orioles wanted Zambrano instead, and Hendry said no.

Live is boring until March 31st strolls by..

by Chanman25 on Nov 5, 2007 7:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Too bad McFail was on OUR side during those talks

We might've been able to fleece to O's.

Ed Lynch is STILL on the Cubs payroll, as our D-Backs scout in Phoenix. Lynch attends all 81 D-Back home games with a notepad in hand. Really paid off for us!

by SackMan on Nov 5, 2007 7:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

MLB Trade rumors

a site that usually just rehashes reported news, reports that Fukadome has had two offers in Japan. One is multi-year.

I did the translation using Google translation, and did not surmise this.

Feel free to have at it:

http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20071105-00000090-mai-base

Wait 'til next year. And the next. And the Next. And the next after that too.

by TheEman on Nov 5, 2007 9:53 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Here's the translation.

I took out the Japanese characters, which this site's software doesn't recognize:

This season FA rights acquired outfielder Kosuke Fukudome of the Chunichi (30) 5th, Nagoya city and the negotiating team, a year and more than two years by the present condition, FA exercise date of the month 12 days, is "coming week, and the answer will not sleep easy. We sit down," he said.

On the occasion, hope to meet the form Nishikawa & Yokoe order from the president to help the team single-year, multi-year terms each presented by the residual urge that they have. About offer, "my assessment is high or low does not know" and the "other team is feeling like to be listened to. FA equal to, but does not use it," he said.

of the season, right elbow injury and surgery in the United States for participating in the first half of the 81 games respectively. FA possible acquisition of players registered for the short days of this season from the introduction of the "disabled special measures" in the days to meet the FA's right to retrieve.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 6, 2007 4:08 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

And on that page...

... one of the "related articles" translates this way (again, removing untranslatable characters):

Chunichi outfielder Kosuke Fukudome (30) was five days, the city's club district in the East Sea in residual negotiations, a four-year 17 billion yen of the teams to remain present. Four years of 20 billion yen would like to draw the line at least fill the gap and the FA now off the market highlights super players, and other teams in their negotiations to explore the value it is dense.

Color did not change. After about an hour of negotiations, the press conference appeared face, resigned color Steeped floats.

Hanshin and the climactic series after the end of the Japan Series eve of the second degree, and the team is confidential negotiations with. The team presented the four-year 20 billion yen less than the amount in the desired amount and is open to GAKU billion units and the same time, the team asked for the summit to reconsider. Two weeks weak when, after no small expectations have NDA negotiations. The first public negotiations with the present team is under negotiation and without change, the feeling is KANAWANAKATTA.

Negotiations Nishikawa, president of the team "decided from the beginning not to changing conditions, we review it. This is the last condition. "Money game and develop a revised denied, as this is the final and presented. The desired amount less than the present conditions, are feeling shaky.

I think the hand or cite no names or the one. Rasp period might be, but I think slowly, I'd like to answer it said." 12th FA declaration deadline to suggest a deliberate Meanwhile, "But my assessment of what is being listened to like the players are as real motive," declared FA lean to the feelings suggest.

This is even "sincerity of the words rather than the amount," says he. We will explore one's own value, to exercise the right to free agency. Hanshin and the other team's evaluation hear that dense.

Right HIJI release of cartilage removed during surgery to visit the United States once the transfer is determined designer. But in October, three days after returning home, PL Gakuen senior, decided to join the Chunichi nomination reverse his presence again and diet residual strongly persuaded. The residual feeling that the time had tilted the calm is supposed to be the heart of a wave again is the team's self-evaluation of the low.

But the FA declaration of equality is not transferred to a diagram. To cite hands of the self-assessment criteria call for a comparison. Major including other team I talked to on the transfer or retention of the final decision.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 6, 2007 4:15 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs