Witness To History, Part Deux
This is history that, frankly, I'd rather Tom Glavine had waited till his next start to make, since in notching his 300th career win, it meant a Cub loss, 8-3 to the Mets last night, and despite the comments of Chuck at Ivy Chat in the past that I'd rather see history than a Cubs win, that's simply not true, particularly now, when every win is critical in a pennant race. In fact, with storms ripping through parts of the Chicago area last night, it might have been better had this one been rained out.
Incidentally, I find myself in agreement with Chuck this morning (yes, I know you're gasping). Chuck wrote of the scary-looking right quad injury to Alfonso Soriano which is apparently going to keep him out from 2-4 weeks:
Chuck's got it pretty much nailed here. I'm not sure I agree with "weak mental makeup", but Soriano doesn't approach at-bats well, and is one of the streakiest hitters I've ever seen in a Cub uniform. When he's going well -- as he was during the month of June, when he hit .336/.379/.697 with 11 HR in 28 games -- he can help carry a team. But when he's cold -- and since the All-Star break he's hitting .255/.277/.439 with 3 HR in 23 games -- he can drag a team down. Dave and I have discussed this quite a bit in the bleachers all season, how Soriano has almost never -- save that game-winning single he had against the Rockies on June 25 -- had a hit in a key situation all season.
So apart from the little bunny hop he makes before every routine catch in left field, will the Cubs miss him? I say no. The obvious move is to recall Felix Pie, shift Cliff Floyd back to LF, and have Jacque Jones and Mark DeRosa split time in RF (with DeRosa and Mike Fontenot splitting time at 2B). This won't help the defense much (except for the huge upgrade in CF with Pie), but most of us have noted the big boost in energy the Cubs have received each time Pie has been added to the roster. It may be a coincidence, but the Cubs' record in games in which Pie has appeared is 32-16, and 26-36 in all other games.
So this move ought to be a no-brainer today -- Soriano to the DL, Pie recalled. And one more move I'd make -- sign Jose Cruz Jr., who was waived by the Padres on August 1. His batting numbers were depressed by having Petco Park as his home park, and he has always hit LHP well (.276/.360/.464 lifetime). He could spell Floyd in LF or Jones in RF, and would give Lou a switch-hitting pinch-hit option.
About the two other significant events last night; first, Tom Glavine's 300th win. People are saying, again, that Glavine will be the "last" 300-game winner. "People" said this more than forty years ago after Early Wynn won his 300th game. There weren't any after that for a while, but Glavine is now the ninth pitcher to notch 300 wins since Wynn. It's an odd milestone in this sense -- the player accomplishing it doesn't necessarily have to be on the field when it happens, unlike a 3000th hit or 500th HR, and Glavine wasn't (and neither was Greg Maddux three years ago in San Francisco). The remnants of the Wrigley Field crowd (many of whom left after Will Ohman turned a still-close 5-3 game into a 7-3 game, and still more left when DeRosa accidentally hit plate umpire Marty Foster on a swing, causing a delay of a few minutes), a fair number of whom were Mets fans but also the Cub fans in attendance, gave Glavine a warm ovation after the last out, when he and his teammates celebrated on the field. I've now seen two of these (this one and Maddux', and I know Jeff and Jessica, who were both in SF in 2004 for Maddux', can say the same, but how many other fans can say this?) and despite the fact that I'd rather the Cubs had won, I was glad to have been a witness to this historic event.
The other significant event last night was the return to the mound of Kerry Wood for the first time in fourteen months. He got three ovations -- the first for warming up, the second when he trotted in from the bullpen (after everyone made sure it wasn't Bob Howry again), and another when his name was announced. Wood threw a scoreless inning, though I'd be less than truthful if I said it was "triumphant". His velocity was good, but he didn't have total command -- he went to a full count twice, and gave up a hit, throwing 8 strikes among his 14 pitches. That said, it was a good thing for him to get this first appearance out of the way and now he can move on to being a productive member of the bullpen.
Which is more than I can say for Will Ohman, who stunk again last night. Suddenly, Scott Eyre, who again had a scoreless appearance last night (the two walks were intentional), is the most effective lefty out of the pen.
This is what this club has done the last two months -- someone fails, someone else picks him up. It wasn't enough to win last night's game, but since the Brewers lost in a spectacular meltdown to the Phillies, blowing a 5-run 9th-inning lead, the Cubs remain only a game out of first place, going on the road on the same trip as Milwaukee (trading off opponents Houston and Colorado) where they've played well and the Brewers haven't.
Incidentally, the Cubs' +54 run differential is tied for best in the NL with San Diego, and despite the 36-21 run since June 2, the Cubs are still underperforming their Pythagorean projection by three games (should be 61-49 based on that).
So I'm still cautiously optimistic, but there's one important thing that still must be addressed: starting pitching, which seemed such a strength a month ago, is now shaky. Jason Marquis was mediocre last night -- he was getting the ground balls he needs to succeed, but they were all getting through for hits -- and with Rich Hill and Sean Marshall also shaky the last month, that leaves the Cubs with only two reliable, consistent, every-time-out starters. That's not enough. If there's a starting pitcher out there who's available at not too high a cost, the Cubs should make an effort to go get him.
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At least....
by hawkeyenation on
Aug 6, 2007 8:52 AM CDT
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We were thinking about...
What time was that, anyway?
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 8:54 AM CDT
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Too True
I didn't hear a lot come out of Joe's mouth about how bad the Cubs were last night. They were too captivated with every single movement Tom's parents or wife made. Of course, Joe would actually have to watch and comment on the game to say how bad Marquis really looked last night. Joe doesn't actually have to watch the game to say his completely neutral "opinion." The man makes Brenly look like an activist.
by hawkeyenation on
Aug 6, 2007 9:03 AM CDT
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agreed
by Willgly on
Aug 6, 2007 9:28 AM CDT
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Probably
Also Al, you may be interested...I wrote a recap on the ESPN announcing here for those who missed the game on TV.
by Cribbs463 on
Aug 6, 2007 9:05 AM CDT
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Was Tom Glavine mentioned?
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:11 AM CDT
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He played last night?
by Littlerock Rynofan on
Aug 6, 2007 12:09 PM CDT
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Did you hear John Miller
To which I just have to say "um...ya' think?"
by Neifi Puppy on
Aug 6, 2007 9:16 AM CDT
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Yeah
Normally, I can stomach those two, but last night I had a belly full.
Al, if I were a gambling man -- well, hell, I am, I would guess the word "Glavine" was said over 500 times last night. I bet his family -- wife, children, mom, and dad -- all told had about 30 minutes of air time. There was one point where in between EVERY PITCH it would switch to a camera on them.
by Cribbs463 on
Aug 6, 2007 9:20 AM CDT
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My friend
by cubstoseriesby100 on
Aug 6, 2007 1:22 PM CDT
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Favorite Jon Miller moment:
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 9:20 AM CDT
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Yeah, haha
ESPN had this on their front page of the web site during the 7th inning of the ball game when it was 5-1, and then we scored 2. I really wanted to win that one just for that reason alone. Can you find where they may have jumped the gun a bit?
by Cribbs463 on
Aug 6, 2007 9:27 AM CDT
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Those two are the absolute worst
by lostinthevines on
Aug 6, 2007 11:56 AM CDT
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Switched to radio support
by Cajuncub on
Aug 6, 2007 12:32 PM CDT
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I usually...
If the casual fan can't tune into a program and expect to get accurate basic facts, it's time for you to change your broadcasters.
by Damen Jackson on
Aug 6, 2007 9:41 AM CDT
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Izturis
by rgonzale on
Aug 6, 2007 12:47 PM CDT
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Yeah,
Y'know, having moved out of Chicago several years ago, there's nowhere to get good sports programming anymore. ESPN, as we all know, is a poor excuse for a sports station. They are MTV now; it's all about the entertainment and the spectacle, less about the games, the action. I live in Michigan, so I can't even indulge in Comcast Sportsnet or whatever, because for me it's all Tigers and Lions and Red Wings. Yikes!
I really miss the days, y'know, back in the 80s, when you could watch a sports report and see a ton of highlights from the days games with no BS, overstory, or even a point of view hammered into you. I can't imagine most sports fans wanting what ESPN is dishing out.
by Kegler on
Aug 6, 2007 12:54 PM CDT
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Those were the good ol' days
Impression time! You guess who this is:
"V-Guerrero, GET AT ME DAWG!!!! He's all swole up with his 23rd jack of the season"
<left eye drifts off about 2 inches to the left>
by Cribbs463 on
Aug 6, 2007 1:26 PM CDT
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I didn't tune in until the 6th...
by SilkyD on
Aug 6, 2007 9:54 AM CDT
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That said...
by hawkeyenation on
Aug 6, 2007 8:59 AM CDT
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Agree
Marquis inability to finish innings is exasperating. But he certaintly isn't the only Cubs hurler guilty of this problem. How many times lately have we gotten two quick outs only to then see our pitchers unable to get off the mound until after runs are scored and their pitch count balloons?
by wrigley1 on
Aug 6, 2007 11:45 AM CDT
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I was at the game last nite....
by cubboy89 on
Aug 6, 2007 2:04 PM CDT
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I love Me Joe Morgan
base for the Marlins every time they visted
Wrigley ????????????????????
by FlaCub on
Aug 6, 2007 1:17 PM CDT
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Morgan
by cajuncubbie on
Aug 6, 2007 8:59 AM CDT
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Wow.
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:02 AM CDT
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Welcome to Joe Morgan's world...
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:07 AM CDT
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Ah yes
firejoemorgan.com
Every single chat seriously blows my mind. And not in a good way.
by hawkeyenation on
Aug 6, 2007 9:09 AM CDT
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Oh yeah, my other favorite
by hawkeyenation on
Aug 6, 2007 9:04 AM CDT
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Guys like
by Matt Allison on
Aug 6, 2007 9:24 AM CDT
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Voice?
by hawkeyenation on
Aug 6, 2007 9:27 AM CDT
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Moments of Truth
by coral on
Aug 6, 2007 9:06 AM CDT
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concerned
I think the Cubs need to focus on getting a long relief guy or going out and picking up another starter.
by Willgly on
Aug 6, 2007 9:31 AM CDT
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I can usually stomach Joe Morgan
by zevkalman on
Aug 6, 2007 9:06 AM CDT
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No offense...
ESPN was just guiding their coverage toward what the majority would want. Sucks for us, but that's the way the media works. "300 wins" is a huge story. "Mets win a game" or "Cubs win a game" isn't really that important.
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:11 AM CDT
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Makes sense.....
by hawkeyenation on
Aug 6, 2007 9:13 AM CDT
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True
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=schreiber_leanne&id=2897260
by cubsbak on
Aug 6, 2007 9:17 AM CDT
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Good point...
It doesn't help that Joe Morgan did the game. I'm pretty sure he doesn't even watch the games he's broadcasting at this point.
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:19 AM CDT
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Exactly
by hawkeyenation on
Aug 6, 2007 9:20 AM CDT
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Sportscenter, Baseball Tonight, etc...
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:22 AM CDT
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Very seldom
by sue369 on
Aug 6, 2007 9:24 AM CDT
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Same here...
by Neifi Puppy on
Aug 6, 2007 9:31 AM CDT
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More like, "Who's Jumped the Shark"?
I travel a lot for work, and Sportscenter used to be the first thing I'd try to find on my hotel TV. But this "Who's Now" crap takes the concept of witless filler to a whole new level, and I feel like I'm rapidly losing brain cells every time I watch the show. Who's (not watching) now? Um, that would be me...
by SilkyD on
Aug 6, 2007 10:06 AM CDT
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celebs
by Willgly on
Aug 6, 2007 11:14 AM CDT
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That 's a wonderful column ...
--t.
by Littlerock Rynofan on
Aug 6, 2007 12:05 PM CDT
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I was disappointed
One thing I have noticed about this team this year is when there is an injury the others step up and they go on. I don't think they will miss Soriano much. I hope Murton gets a chance to play in left field.
It was nice to see Wood get the ovations he got last night. It would have been nice to have CSN or WGN do the game. At least they would have known the ovation was for Wood and not for Glavine.
I have been a big supporter of Len & Bob all season and after having to listen to ESPN last night I appreciate L&B so much. If either of you are reading this site I love you guys.
by sue369 on
Aug 6, 2007 9:18 AM CDT
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Sue ...
--t.
by Littlerock Rynofan on
Aug 6, 2007 12:02 PM CDT
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Whoa!!!!!!!
As for a replacement, Cruz Jr. could work. IMHO, the best option is through waivers IF a player reaches the Cubs. Again, I still do not believe Hendry has the authority to add payroll, which would kill any deal before it starts......
by timeforachange on
Aug 6, 2007 9:19 AM CDT
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Hey timeforachange...
by dat cubfan daver on
Aug 6, 2007 2:40 PM CDT
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LMAO!!!!!!!!!
by timeforachange on
Aug 6, 2007 7:04 PM CDT
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I'm hoping
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 9:24 AM CDT
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Well
by krummy12 on
Aug 6, 2007 9:56 AM CDT
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True.
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 10:02 AM CDT
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1-2
If Kendall continues to improve, he could be a great candidate as well.
by californiachicagoan on
Aug 6, 2007 2:04 PM CDT
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Just some optimism
by crw89 on
Aug 6, 2007 9:24 AM CDT
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So if that's the plan...
And I really wish I knew how serious I was about that idea.
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 9:25 AM CDT
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Murton
by frustratedfan on
Aug 6, 2007 10:57 AM CDT
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Witness to History
As to "weak mental makeup," what would you say is the cause for a guy who allows his position in the field and batting order affect his approach at the plate?
But, thanks for the kudos. Soriano wasn't that much of a halp to the Cubs in any month other than June. His absense won't hurt them. This is likely the final nail in the "Jim Hendry Incompetance" coffin as, if the team does better with Pie, Theriot and Fontenot, what the hell did they need to give Soriano, Jones and DeRosa big bucks?
by Ivychat on
Aug 6, 2007 9:26 AM CDT
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I figured you might show up.
There's a difference. You "called me out" on something I didn't say.
I wonder if Soriano would be hitting any differently if he were hitting fifth. You might say he'd have more RBI, but it seems to me he's come up many times with RISP and failed this year, even batting first. His BA is above his career average and his OPS of .847 is above his career OPS of .837. But he just doesn't seem to be having a very good year.
Chuck, nice to see you here, really. You and I agree more than we disagree, I've discovered. C'mon back out to the bleachers soon.
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:32 AM CDT
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Soriano did not have a particularly...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 9:38 AM CDT
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Whoa.
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 9:37 AM CDT
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A little over-zealous
But to say that the Cubs won't miss him is a bit much. As sad as it is, his 18 HRs lead the team. He was finally starting to steal some bases and he saves some runs with his arm in LF. I'm not heartbroken, and I think that the only way that this team stumbles is if they lose their confidence after seeing him go down.
However, I look forward to having a guy with a better than .336 OBP at the top of the order for a change (wasn't Pierre's OBP in this range last year?). And Theriot at the top will still steal some bases, and he can actually work the count and give the team a good look at the stuff the pitcher has on the day.
Losing Soriano shouldn't spell the end of the season, I don't actually consider him to be a big impact player for the team. I'll take his solo homers, but would much rather see some big knocks with guys on base (homers or not) as opposed to the strikeouts that I've become accustomed to seeing. But it's not as though the team will be able to just shrug this off. He is still Alfonso Soriano, and he is still a presence in the box, even if we've been underwhelmed by his prodution thus far.
by WittyUserName on
Aug 6, 2007 9:30 AM CDT
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Would it be too crazy of an idea...
Lee's not hitting for much power and he has a .414 OBA.
Thoughts?
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:33 AM CDT
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Another wacky idea.
What about that idea?
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:36 AM CDT
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I like Theriot
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 9:39 AM CDT
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What about...
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:40 AM CDT
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I like it.
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 9:41 AM CDT
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The one thing we do know is...
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:43 AM CDT
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Thank Goodness!
Gotta have a hit and run combination out of the one and two men in the line-up. Theriot and someone who makes a lot of contact. In the past, relying on Soriano's big bat has been just nuts.
I like the idea of small ball.
--t.
by Littlerock Rynofan on
Aug 6, 2007 11:57 AM CDT
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Me and my slow typing...
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:44 AM CDT
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Maybe it's just me...
by Damen Jackson on
Aug 6, 2007 9:49 AM CDT
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Yeah.
by jshipp on
Aug 6, 2007 9:43 AM CDT
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I like this idea.
To your previous idea, Lee is actually better suited at number 2, leadoff would put the team in a difficult spot with Ramirez being the only "true" power hitter.
by HIGGY on
Aug 6, 2007 9:40 AM CDT
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I think
The tough spot to figure out is the 2 spot. The list is pretty much: DeRosa, Fontenot, Kendall, and maybe Murton. Murton isn't one of Lou's favorites so he's probably out. I don't really like the idea of DeRosa in the OF regularly, he should be at 2B, so that kind of bumps Fontenot out as he only plays 2B.
The leaves DeRosa and Kendall as solid #2 options for us. I like DeRosa hitting 6th and getting RBI chances, but I'd also like him hitting second. Kendall is a good OBP and contact guy, which is great for #2, but he's not exactly fast, which is an asset to have at the top of the order.
I guess I'd lean towards a lineup of:
1.Theriot SS
- Kendall C
- Lee 1B
- Ramirez 3B
- Floyd LF
- DeRosa 2B
- Jones/Murton RF
- Pie CF
by WittyUserName on
Aug 6, 2007 9:56 AM CDT
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Other option
- Theriot SS
- Murton RF or DeRosa 2B
- Lee 1B
- Ramirez 3B
- Floyd LF
- DeRosa 2B or Murton RF
- Jones CF
- Kendall C
by WittyUserName on
Aug 6, 2007 10:01 AM CDT
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Not to quote Dusty
This is tabletop baseball, but back when I played a lot in the 1980s, someone (sometimes even me!) would always come up with the idea to bat Mike Scioscia leadoff. Good OBP, makes contact. The problem was that Scioscia was so damn slow that it took three singles to get him home. If he was on third, he wasn't going to score on a sac fly. And if anyone after Mike hit a hard grounder, Mike wasn't going to break it up at second.
When Kendall was younger, I think he had enough speed to make it work. Now he's Mike Scioscia running around the bases.
by Josh77 on
Aug 6, 2007 2:44 PM CDT
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Interesting idea...
by hawkeyenation on
Aug 6, 2007 9:38 AM CDT
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Not too crazy...
by John Q Freejazz on
Aug 6, 2007 9:38 AM CDT
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Not crazy, but...
Lee has been hitting for more power lately, and we are short on players with power.
I think I'd go with Theriot in the leadoff spot. He's patient at the plate and has a solid OBP (better than Soriano, actually). He's nothing spectacular, but I think he can handle that role.
In the #2 spot, there are a few options, although none are very exciting. Fontenot or DeRosa could do it, and scarily enough even Kendall, who's been decent at the plate lately (11-30, 4 BB in his last 9 games), could be a short-term fill-in there. And then we keep the #3 and #4 hitters in place.
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:41 AM CDT
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Depending on Where DeRosa Plays
If he's at 2B then he should hit 2nd. If he's at 3B, he's probably spelling Aram - he should hit 5th.
If he's in RF, he's probably spelling Floyd or Lou wants to stack the lineup with righties vs. a Lefty - he should probably hit 2nd, 5th, or 6th.
Don't know about anyone else (and I like Fontenot just fine) but I'd rather see DeRosa in the infield a lot more for his solid glove work. Of course that makes Fonty odd man out except when DeRosa plays 3B but so be it.
If the Cubs are going to pick up the slack without adding a bat, then they should stack their infield and outfield with the best possible defenders that they have.
by BJ Simpson on
Aug 6, 2007 9:53 AM CDT
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Soriano is very streaky...
by WartburgCub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:31 AM CDT
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Any hope of recalling Soto?
Soto continued his tear in Iowa last night, going 3-5 with a HR, 4 RBI and 2 runs. His season line is now .345/.417/.631 with 19 HR and 76 RBI.
by John Q Freejazz on
Aug 6, 2007 9:35 AM CDT
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its absolutely
you have a CATCHER with 19 jacks in triple a with the season still going on, how do you not try to tap that offensive output for the big club?
by kylejo on
Aug 6, 2007 2:51 PM CDT
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Starting pitching...
That being said, I'd be interested to see the Cubs call up Gallagher as a temporary 6th starter - leave Z and Lilly pitch on their normal rest, but slot Gallagher in with Hill/Marquis/Marshall to give those guys some extra rest and save their arms. I'm thinking a little extra rest for the starters here and there would be beneficial, even if it means carrying 13 pitchers for awhile (maybe for the month that Soriano is out?)
Come to think of it, that's exactly what I'd do: call up Gallagher with Soriano on the DL. Give Floyd/Murton LF, play Pagan/Jones in CF, and platoon Jones/DeRosa in RF. Go with a short bench (Cedeno, Murton, Pagan, Hill) for two weeks, and see if we can rest our arms a little bit.
by Chadnudj on
Aug 6, 2007 9:37 AM CDT
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That's ...
If the pitching staff keeps failing like this, you could find yourself without any pinch-hitters in the 8th and 9th innings when you really need them.
I'm not crazy about the 12-man staff. A 13-man pitching staff ... wow, no way, IMO.
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:42 AM CDT
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Although Zambrano could be considered another
by zevkalman on
Aug 6, 2007 9:46 AM CDT
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Zambrano...
Marquis is a better contact hitter.
But do you really want them on the bench as PH options in every game they don't start? That's asking a lot.
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:51 AM CDT
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Gallagher
by John Q Freejazz on
Aug 6, 2007 9:46 AM CDT
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I'm not sure Gallagher...
Clearly, though, Marquis is a problem at this point. He's not providing much quality in the rotation. He's gotten worse each month, and has just 2 solid starts in his last 13 appearances.
It may be worth a shot to give Gallagher a chance (as we don't have any other alternatives). I'm just not very confident that Gallagher will provide us much more than Marquis at this point.
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:54 AM CDT
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Tonight
The result of that game of course was Ryan O'Malley making a spectacular major league debut and Michael Barrett providing the only run of the game, a left field home run.
Here's to making Wandy Rodriguez look like Jason Jennings!!!
by sanantonecub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:42 AM CDT
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Hey...
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:45 AM CDT
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Will do
by sanantonecub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:50 AM CDT
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Or
by Kinky Reggae on
Aug 6, 2007 10:05 AM CDT
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Lets see now
OhMan - Point taken.
Dempster - Lately, point taken. However, I still have faith in him. He's still pitched overall a good season.
At the same time though, Jason Jennings is currently the only pitcher to of given up 11 runs in two outs...
by sanantonecub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:19 AM CDT
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Nothing wrong with last night?
June: 5.09
July: 6.29
August (1 start): 8.44
Not one of those months is acceptable, and they are trending in the wrong direction. The only reason his season doesn't look awful is because of what he did 3 months ago.
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:32 AM CDT
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I'd call up
by Clark Addison on
Aug 6, 2007 9:43 AM CDT
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Hill...
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:44 AM CDT
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I'm not sure he wouldn't clear waivers...
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:47 AM CDT
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But with the bench such as it is...
by John Q Freejazz on
Aug 6, 2007 9:50 AM CDT
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You don't normally use your backup C...
I'm not saying Soto isn't a better option than Hill. I just doubt that Lou will rock the boat and get rid of Hill as a backup catcher.
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 9:57 AM CDT
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Yeah
by John Q Freejazz on
Aug 6, 2007 10:11 AM CDT
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So that means...
by John Q Freejazz on
Aug 6, 2007 9:48 AM CDT
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I don't know who'd claim him...
This isn't idle speculation on my part, either. The Yankees DFA'd Wil Nieves after he hit .164/.190/.230 on the year and they were able to trade for something better. Nieves cleared waivers and is playing in Scranton right now. I don't see how Koyie Hill is anything radically better than Nieves, such that we'd lose him to a waiver claim.
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 9:52 AM CDT
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Exactly
by BJ Simpson on
Aug 6, 2007 10:02 AM CDT
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Do they usually wait
by jshipp on
Aug 6, 2007 9:46 AM CDT
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That depends...
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 9:49 AM CDT
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Ohman
by zevkalman on
Aug 6, 2007 9:53 AM CDT
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Not that suprised
by hawkeyenation on
Aug 6, 2007 10:02 AM CDT
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Ohman - Lefties only!
He should have put Wuertz in to face Castillo and Wright, and then Ohman for Delgado.
by californiachicagoan on
Aug 6, 2007 2:26 PM CDT
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Witness...BLECH!
I have been asked in the past that if the Cubs are losing and there is a perfect game being thrown, wouldn't you like to see "history"? I say a resounding NO! I root for the Cubs and I always hope the other team is terrible. I don't ever want to see "history" at the expense of the Cubs. In the 40 years I have been going to games, I have always felt this way and I will not change my feelings on this.
I did not stand to give Glavine an ovation when he walked off the field...hell, thats the pitcher who was shutting down the Cubs. I left after the ump was hit because a)I had a very long ride home and I get up very early and b)who needs to see the Mets of all teams celebrate on our field. So I say, witness to history??? Count me among the ones who were upset to see it happen at Wrigley last night.
Kasey
by kaseyi on
Aug 6, 2007 9:46 AM CDT
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I don't think there is anything wrong
However, that doesn't mean you have to give him a cheery standing ovation like he just pitched the game for you. If I was at the ballpark, I would of stood to show respect when he was taken out of the game, and lightly clap after the game was over and the scoreboard flashed the news.
My college team, Nebraska, has a tradition that after every game, no matter the score, the stadium claps for the opposing team as they head off the field for the final time. Even if they beat us. I like this - during the game, boo all you want, yell profanities, get inside their head however you can, but after the game is over, show respect to them for being a worthy opponent, and if you see one of their fans, buy 'em a beer.
by sanantonecub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:02 AM CDT
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Count me in
by billybuck on
Aug 6, 2007 10:18 AM CDT
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I have a feeling that Murton gets no playing time
Floyd LF
Pie CF
Jones RF
That really isn't a bad lineup really if all of those guys could start hitting for power (except Pie). I still think Murton should be platooning in both RF and LF if that is what will happen..
by Chanman25 on
Aug 6, 2007 9:50 AM CDT
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its funny
by kylejo on
Aug 6, 2007 3:42 PM CDT
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eric patterson
by rm463 on
Aug 6, 2007 9:53 AM CDT
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Really now.
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 9:54 AM CDT
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He'd fill the need for a leadoff man...
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:01 AM CDT
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Maybe you pull a DeRosa with him...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 10:03 AM CDT
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All of this, of course....
I just hope nobody does a freakout if they see "Patterson, CF" in the leadoff spot in the lineup. Deja vu much?
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 10:05 AM CDT
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What would be the point...
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 10:05 AM CDT
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Lou seems to have a very Earl Weaver-esque...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 10:08 AM CDT
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Can you provide the link?
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:05 AM CDT
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Gotcha...
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:11 AM CDT
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I don't see this either.
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 10:08 AM CDT
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It's mentioned
by cubsbak on
Aug 6, 2007 10:11 AM CDT
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patterson in cf
by rm463 on
Aug 6, 2007 9:57 AM CDT
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What, like calling up Jake Fox...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 9:59 AM CDT
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yeah
by kylejo on
Aug 6, 2007 3:44 PM CDT
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truth be told
if patterson gets called-up and produces that's paramount to hurting pie's feelings.
by rm463 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:04 AM CDT
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I don't know anything about Patterson
by cubsbak on
Aug 6, 2007 10:06 AM CDT
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Eric Patterson is very different...
As far as tangibles go, he still has played mostly second base in AAA Iowa this year, but has experience in the outfield in left and center (I don't think he's played right field). He's a patient hitter, takes walks and has shown a decent amount of pop in the minors. He's mostly batted leadoff or second in AAA this year.
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 10:12 AM CDT
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link
...while top prospect Eric Patterson is expected to be recalled to replace an injured Alfonso Soriano.
that's the best i can offer.
by rm463 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:08 AM CDT
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Here's what another link there says...
That seems more logical to me.
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 10:11 AM CDT
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I too
by Kinky Reggae on
Aug 6, 2007 10:08 AM CDT
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Kendall
avg. .301
OPB .370
Walks 39
K's 39
I can live with these numbers. He does something that Soriano doesn't do and thats take pitches, work the count, and walk more while striking out less.
by cubfaninSTL on
Aug 6, 2007 10:08 AM CDT
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I dont follow the logic on Patterson?
by JB 23 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:10 AM CDT
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I believe their thinking is
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 10:24 AM CDT
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Calling up Patterson?
by Chanman25 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:10 AM CDT
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Maybe because he's a leadoff hitter...
And, as someone else pointed out, maybe Patterson isn't expected to play regularly, so he doesn't want to screw Pie up.
Or maybe he just wants to see what Patterson can do, having already seen what Pie can do.
There are lots of possible explanations.
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:15 AM CDT
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I'm sure that Lou/Hendry had a talk...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 10:15 AM CDT
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Im sure thats probably right.
by jshipp on
Aug 6, 2007 10:18 AM CDT
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I agree
then again, if EPat comes up, plays decent defense and has a massive two weeks with the bat, I'll happily be wrong.
My guess is that Soriano will be out for 15, pinch hit for a few games, and then be back full time. Say what you will about the guy, he wants to play EVERY day.
by SouthsideCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:36 AM CDT
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what i saw last night.
why do we due poorly against lefties. well many that we have dont throw very hard. so why are we standing so far back in the box just helps to pitcher to get more late movement on the ball. next look at floyd and fontenot they basically stand in the vistors dugout when they hit against a lefty.
most good lefty hitters crowd the plate against a left handed hitter, as a lefty who pitched in college, i can tell you its as awkward for a pitcher to face a left hitter and it is for the batter. plus most lefties throw a ball that moves to the left, like a screw ball so it hard to throw inside to a lefty plus when throwing breaking stuff most again throw it so it curves into a right hander, its hard to start it at a left handed batter to break inside if a guy is crowding the plate, it just looks small to your eye.
most batters stand back in the box to get as much time to judge a pitch, if a guy is throwing 84/85 you have to move up a little to get your reaction time the same. most of the pitches we missed last night look like they needed a 9 iron to hit.
But then again it does help when the ump calls most every thing 6 inches off the plate, i almost got the feeling that he was wanting to part of the history as well, part of the reason he did not come out last night
by cubsfaninkc on
Aug 6, 2007 10:18 AM CDT
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I was sitting behind the plate last night
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 10:29 AM CDT
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k zone
by cubsfaninkc on
Aug 6, 2007 10:40 AM CDT
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pie
in an effort to alleviate some of the pressure to produce offensively, it wouldn't hurt lou to inform pie that what is required is for him to perform defensively...that's it.
at this point in his young career, the cubs have to ride-out pie's offensive struggles in the stead of giving him a 15-20 game opportunity only to send back to iowa. put pie in cf and keep him there for the forseeable future.
by rm463 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:18 AM CDT
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Jacque Jones and Cliff Floyd...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 10:20 AM CDT
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Not necessarily.
Jones might be dealable in the offseason.
Let's fix the here and now first.
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 10:22 AM CDT
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Yes, but Soriano is going to...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 10:27 AM CDT
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Maybe.... but September is close
by SackMan on
Aug 6, 2007 10:44 AM CDT
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That doesn't let the team play four outfielders.
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 10:52 AM CDT
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Dumb ballplayers
Kerry Wood looked great, but I think he needs to eat a few cheeseburgers.
by psennett on
Aug 6, 2007 10:26 AM CDT
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patterson over pie, potentially
by rm463 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:27 AM CDT
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true
by rm463 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:31 AM CDT
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Bruce Levine on AM 1000
--Soriano looking at a month on DL, maybe more
--Levine says E-Pat, not Pie being called up to play in the OF, not to play 2B
--Derosa likely to get bulk of RF playing time
--None of the Cubs options in RF have the "second gear" speed to get to balls in the gaps.
--Wavier deal unlikely because Levine says there's a lot of blocking going on right now. Apparently, the Orioles put Tejada on waviers, the Sox claimed him, but were blocked by someone.
--Gallagher Cubs' only option to add to the rotation. Says Hendry will try, but there are no starters to be had.
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 10:31 AM CDT
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And Levine's always been right, right?
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 10:33 AM CDT
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He is a tool...
by seang03 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:38 AM CDT
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Then he's
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 10:42 AM CDT
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I think you're referring to...
by seang03 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:46 AM CDT
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Ah.
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 10:48 AM CDT
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yeah...
by seang03 on
Aug 6, 2007 11:05 AM CDT
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Hindsight
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 11:16 AM CDT
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Not only that but
by Kornchex on
Aug 6, 2007 4:18 PM CDT
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Absolutely
by SouthsideCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:39 AM CDT
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But wasn't close to 100% for a while
by lostinthevines on
Aug 6, 2007 12:00 PM CDT
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Yeah,
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 10:40 AM CDT
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Although DeRosa certainly needed
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 10:46 AM CDT
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That was not a case
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 10:48 AM CDT
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Considering he's a second baseman
by jds2 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:49 AM CDT
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I agree it was a bad read.
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 10:53 AM CDT
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No, he's right.
http://www.sportsinjuryclinic.net/cybertherapist/front/frontthigh/quadstrain.htm
Patterson more of a lead-off guy than Pie, ho hasn't proved that he can hit in the majors.
Unless they get a power-hitting outfielder (doubtful at this time) DeRosa is Lou's platoon guy and has played RF a lot. He'll certainly play more.
There's a lot of blocking on waivers. The Tejada block was a story by Buster Olney last night on Baseball Tonight.
It's positive that Hendry is thinking about getting someone up to start games (Gallagher) and thinking about who's available for the OF after clearing waivers.
by Fraggin Judge on
Aug 6, 2007 10:53 AM CDT
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did you really just call pie a ho?
by rockpantson on
Aug 6, 2007 11:10 AM CDT
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Something else that just occured to me...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 10:34 AM CDT
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Bingo,, that has to be it..
by JB 23 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:39 AM CDT
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Pie is playing now
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 10:42 AM CDT
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So based on that...
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:36 AM CDT
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That seems odd
by cubsbak on
Aug 6, 2007 10:41 AM CDT
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So what's the point, then?
by Al on
Aug 6, 2007 10:44 AM CDT
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I'd rather see the Cruz
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 10:46 AM CDT
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I agree
by cubsbak on
Aug 6, 2007 10:47 AM CDT
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I agree too...
I was just guessing based on the comments by Levine. If DeRosa is seeing most of the time in RF, then LF would theoretically be manned by Floyd and Murton, and CF by Jones and Pagan, right?
Of course, it could be that Levine is just speculating out of his ass, too.
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:52 AM CDT
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Or it could be that Matt Murton...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 10:53 AM CDT
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That could be too...
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:57 AM CDT
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Only if I've been a really, really...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 11:00 AM CDT
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Little OT, but
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 10:57 AM CDT
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I assumed Patterson is coming up to
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 10:50 AM CDT
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Levine is an idiot
Sounds like he's been getting medical reports from Joe Morgan.
Secondly, the White Sox weren't "blocked" by anyone on Tejada. The White Sox put in a claim on Tejada and either the Orioles pulled it immediately or they called up Kenny Williams, asked him what they would trade for Tejada, and then the Orioles pulled the waivers.
The Devil Rays, Royals or Rangers were the only teams that could have "blocked" Tejada and from all accounts they didn't put in a claim. If you are reporting this accurately, Levine has no freaking clue as to how waivers work.
by Josh77 on
Aug 6, 2007 2:53 PM CDT
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I wrote it
by gary varsho on
Aug 6, 2007 4:11 PM CDT
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they should call up pie...and patterson
by jds2 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:48 AM CDT
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Some Thoughts
With Cliff and JJ and DeRo roaming the outfield, we really need someone to go after the ball. EPat is not a centerfielder and we definitely need one with the current OF situation.
The best one-two combination is Theriot and Fontenot. Two guys who are decent hitters and will work the count and get on base. That is something that Fonzie definitely did not do on a regular basis. As we all well know, Fonzie is definitely suited for the middle of the lineup.
Soto should be with the club. Why are we worried if Hill is picked up? If Lou is going to play Kendall five days a week, Soto will be fine. He has caught Hill, Marshall, Wuertz, and Marmol at Iowa. It's not as if he is coming in completely unprepared. He is definitely an upgrade over Hill at the plate and can play defense. He also has played a little 1B and could give Lee a day off if necessary.
Finally -- the pitching. If we had a long guy in the pen and did some tinkering with ineffective short guys, we would not have to even think about carrying 13 pitchers. First of all, bring back Gallagher. Use him in long relief. If Marquis continues to struggle, put Gallagher in his spot and move Marquis to long relief.
Then pleeeeezzzz get rid of Ohman. The "good" and "bad" Ohman both have to go. He is totally unreliable. It does not make a difference if he starts an inning or comes in to stop the bleeding, he does not get the job done on a consistent basis. His replacement does not have to be a lefthander -- I just want a guy who can get people out at least 75% of the time.
And after watching Eyre enter the game last night with a guy on base and letting him score after a hit and a SF, I would move him as well. Once again, too inconsistent just about all season long. With 8 weeks to go in the season, Eyre just does not make me believe that he will ever return to form of last year and the one before. We cannot continue to rely on him and Ohman. If we do, last night was only an OMEN of what will happen again.
by ceegeewow on
Aug 6, 2007 10:49 AM CDT
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That was a crappy homestand
by SackMan on
Aug 6, 2007 10:49 AM CDT
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eyre
by rm463 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:53 AM CDT
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He faced 5 batters last night in 2/3s
by SackMan on
Aug 6, 2007 10:57 AM CDT
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Those walks were intentional...
by SouthernCub on
Aug 6, 2007 10:59 AM CDT
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Ugh. My memory failed me.
by SackMan on
Aug 6, 2007 11:04 AM CDT
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THINGS TO BE POSITIVE ABOUT
- Woody looked great last night. And it was great to be there in the stands when he took the field.
- The Soriano injury might fix the line-up and give us a real lead-off hitter (Pie, Theriot, or even E-Pat). If things are clicking with one of those guys at the top, Soriano might be moved down in the order when he returns.
by SackMan on
Aug 6, 2007 10:54 AM CDT
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Where would you lead Pie off?
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 10:59 AM CDT
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He's batting .359 in Iowa
by SackMan on
Aug 6, 2007 11:02 AM CDT
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The problem is that...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 11:04 AM CDT
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Commitment issues?
by californiachicagoan on
Aug 6, 2007 2:47 PM CDT
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Pie was overmatched
by cubsbak on
Aug 6, 2007 11:08 AM CDT
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I'm in total agreement.
by Fraggin Judge on
Aug 6, 2007 11:09 AM CDT
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Still think we might catch lightning in a bottle
by SackMan on
Aug 6, 2007 11:23 AM CDT
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Maybe we can get the same pitchers
by lostinthevines on
Aug 6, 2007 12:08 PM CDT
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yabbut
by rm463 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:58 AM CDT
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If Sori's injury is a grade 3 strain
by JB 23 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:58 AM CDT
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It wouldn't be the first time...
by Fraggin Judge on
Aug 6, 2007 11:07 AM CDT
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Another thought...
but IF the Cubs without Soriano, come up with a lineup with Theriot leading off, that ends up scoring like crazy, what are the chances that Lou might just throw Soriano out there batting fifth when he comes back, and maybe out to right and just say screw it. If we can score runs without him, surely we could score runs with him uncomfortable in right field and batting fifth... it's just a thought.
by eamuscatuli1881 on
Aug 6, 2007 10:59 AM CDT
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It's nice to think about...
by cwyers on
Aug 6, 2007 11:01 AM CDT
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The fact that Soriano wasn't a good leadoff hitter
Now, Al, you're right that this season, a different player always picks up the slack. But to replace Soriano for a month or so is too much to ask now of the available players. Just remember how the team sank when Soriano got injured in the beginning of the season. His injury wasn't the only reason for the team's funk but it contributed to it.
Someone posted the other day that Soriano needed a rest. If he had only taken it last night. Sigh!
by Fraggin Judge on
Aug 6, 2007 11:04 AM CDT
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Agreed... however,
My recommended lineup would be:
SS Theriot
C Kendall
1B Lee
3B Ramirez
LF Floyd
2B DeRosa
RF Jones
CF Pie
Pitcher
I believe that this lineup, even without Soriano is good enough to win the division.
One other move I would make would be to bring Rapada or Pignatiello down and do something with Ohman, but at this point I trust Eyre WAY more than Ohman, and I'd like to see one of the youngsters get a shot to show the consistency that Ohman lacks.
by eamuscatuli1881 on
Aug 6, 2007 11:13 AM CDT
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Addendum
if Pie comes up and starts hitting well, I think I move him to second in the order for two reasons:
- That gives plenty of speed in Theriot and Pie in the top of the order.
- If Pie bats 2nd and Kendall 8th, the lineup goes righty, lefty, righty, righty, lefty, righty, lefty, righty, pitcher. Hopefully this would prevent managers bringing in lefties late in the game and facing a ton of lefties in a row.
by eamuscatuli1881 on
Aug 6, 2007 11:17 AM CDT
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if Pie comes up and starts hitting well?
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 11:25 AM CDT
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doesnt
by tbizzle83 on
Aug 6, 2007 11:26 AM CDT
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Fair enough.
SS Theriot (R)
2B Fontenot (L)
1B Lee (R)
3B Ramirez (R)
LF Floyd (L)
RF DeRosa (R)
CF Jones (L)
C Kendall (R)
by eamuscatuli1881 on
Aug 6, 2007 11:31 AM CDT
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I really don't think EPatt and fontenot
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 11:36 AM CDT
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Patterson is a butcher at second
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 11:32 AM CDT
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Apparently,
by Fraggin Judge on
Aug 6, 2007 11:35 AM CDT
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EPatt plays second the way
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 11:40 AM CDT
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I think Soriano's Home Runs are getting over hyped
Having said the above I want him to come back healthy and tear it apart in the post season because I think we will get there given the crappy NL Central. Also in all fairness I don't think we will suffer much without Soriano in the lineup. Now Lou will have a lot of flexibility as because of Soriano Left Fielders were forced to man the tough Wrigley RF.
by cubsnlinux on
Aug 6, 2007 11:31 AM CDT
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Can Pagan start carrying a clicker in the OF
by Jayo525 on
Aug 6, 2007 11:13 AM CDT
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I suspect that Pagán has ADHD.
by Fraggin Judge on
Aug 6, 2007 11:15 AM CDT
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As demonstrated by his poor baserunning
As Buddy Ryan would say, dumb players will get you beat.
by SackMan on
Aug 6, 2007 11:17 AM CDT
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Sounds like trade-bait
by psennett on
Aug 6, 2007 1:08 PM CDT
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A BIG IF...
by Bardusk87 on
Aug 6, 2007 11:17 AM CDT
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Eric Patterson
by Willgly on
Aug 6, 2007 11:22 AM CDT
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Then the Cubs are convinced...
by Fraggin Judge on
Aug 6, 2007 11:31 AM CDT
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Defense At Second?
by ms9av on
Aug 6, 2007 11:44 AM CDT
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Yes, I know about Patterson's defense
by TR on
Aug 6, 2007 11:48 AM CDT
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EPat's last 10 games
10 for 43 (.233), 4 walks, 9 KOs, 2 RBI... is this the right call up to make in a playoff push?
Pie is 30 for 43 (.302) with 3 Steals and 5 RBI.
by Willgly on
Aug 6, 2007 12:19 PM CDT
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30 for 43? That's .698! No way.
by SackMan on
Aug 6, 2007 12:33 PM CDT
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30 of 43 would be...
by HIGGY on
Aug 6, 2007 12:34 PM CDT
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My mistake!
by Willgly on
Aug 6, 2007 12:46 PM CDT
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Disappointing homestand.
Several things worth noting:
- The starting pitchers performed badly and forced the bullpen to overwork. Only Lilly did his job this week.
- The bullpen is strong, but:
b. Scott Eyre isn't.
c. Ryan Dempster is not a good closer.
d. Bob Howry did a better job closing during our winning stretch.
e. Carlos Mármol is doing his job well. Lou better not overwork him.
f. There is hope about what Kerry Wood can do for this team. We still need to see if he can be consistently good.
- The worst news this week was Soriano's injury. This is serious. We lost our biggest HR threat during a pennant run. There is no player currently in the roster or the minors who can provide what we miss with Soriano out for a month. The Cubs will probably call Pie up but the guy hasn't shown that he can hit in the major leagues. And remember, the Cubs didn't do well the last time Soriano missed playing time.
- Cliff Floyd is just a shadow of his former self.
- On the positive side, Jacque Jones and Jason Kendall improved their offense. I like the idea floated around about Kendall batting 2nd in the lineup.
- The Cubs have serious trouble against left-handed pitchers. A steady diet of them could eliminate the Cubs from contention, if Soriano's absence doesn't do it first.
- The lack of power in this lineup hampered the Cubs this week. With Soriano's absence that deficiency is magnified. I like Al's idea of signing José Cruz, Jr. The guy can hit and play a solid RF although he won't wow anyone. He should have more power than anyone who's played RF this season for the Cubs.
- Obviously, Matt Murton is in Lou's doghouse. Lou says he'll play him but if he didn't send Murton to RF last night after Soriano was injured, I don't think Lou ever will.
Is the season over? Of course not. After all, the Cubs are only a game back in the standings and the other teams have weaknesses too. It all depends on how management and the players react. However, Soriano's absence just when the schedule gets tougher, the inconsistency of our starters and our closer, and a losing homestand against good teams aren't good signs.
Regardless, let's hope for the best and cheer our team.
by Fraggin Judge on
Aug 6, 2007 11:30 AM CDT
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Yep
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You are right I said the same many times up here. We might be scoring x runs per game so far but our offense has been really struggling. As you rightly said we cannot expect to beat good teams by advancing runners 90 feet at a time. I do not expect 4-5 hitters in the lineup to hit the long ball but there should at least be 2-3 who can consistently be able to get the long ball. Many times with the bases loaded or with two men on we ended up getting a run and at most 2. Now if only we had some consistent raw power then we could have blown a lot of games apart. I was not impressed with our performance in the Phillies series as well. Now we all hear that we should be able to split with the good teams and crush the lesser ones. But in all reality a team is only as good as it plays on a given day. DeRosa in his post game comments said something on the lines of "well it was a typical Tom Glavine performance". I would say that is an excuse. Glavine was struggling yesterday and we could not put more runs on the board only because of our ineptitude.
by cubsnlinux on
Aug 6, 2007 11:40 AM CDT
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