Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Jerry Sandusky's Wife Tries To Run A Reporter Over

Stop Making Sense

This makes absolutely NO sense.

A year ago, an absolutely horrid Cub team went into Houston and swept the Astros, shutting them out in two of the three games.

This year, a (supposedly) much better Cub team went into Houston and got swept, scoring only five runs in three games and repeatedly squandered opportunities, leaving 28 men on base in the series, and last night was the worst of the three, an 8-2 loss to Houston with the ballclub's best pitcher, Carlos Zambrano, on the mound, someone who usually eats Astros for lunch; instead, he had his worst start since the fight-with-Barrett day on June 1. (I have nothing more to say about last night's game -- it was boring, one-sided, and not well played by the Cubs, who left thirteen men on base. Z breaking a bat over his knee again was fun to watch, but ultimately meaningless.)

What sense does this make? It makes even less sense when you look at the standings this morning and find the Cubs still only a game behind the Brewers for first place, tied in the loss column, and despite the Cardinals' win over the Padres, still five games ahead of St. Louis -- and maybe we should thank the Cardinals this morning, because that win kept the Cubs within a decent distance of the wild-card-leading Padres, still only three games back.

So is this a glass-half-full day? Or a glass-rapidly-emptying-out day? I'm scratching my head because I can't figure it out either. Some of you are hot to acquire Wily Mo Pena from Boston. Good heavens, why? He's hitting .219/.293/.391 with 5 HR in 151 AB. Seems to me we already have a large bucket full of outfielders who can do that, plus Pena has a bit of a reputation as a headcase.

The Cubs have also put in a waiver claim on A's outfielder Shannon Stewart. While Stewart's not as good as he was three or four years ago, he is still hitting .298/.360/.399, draws a few walks, and plays a decent outfield. If it doesn't cost too much to get him, it's worth a flyer, I think.

Otherwise the Cubs simply have to get back to playing the way they were up to the Philadelphia series at home last week. The talent and ability is there. Consider that the Dodgers were, two weeks ago, twelve games over .500 and two games ahead in the West. Now, having just been swept and shut out three straight times by the Reds, they sit with a record half a game worse than the Cubs, five games behind the Diamondbacks, and behind the Cubs in the wild-card race.

This is just a reminder that this is how pennant races go -- remember? It's been three years since the Cubs have even had a race like this to consider in August, so maybe you need a bit of a refresher. Teams sometimes hit slides like the Cubs have had, and still come back and win. Last year's Cardinals, who just barely won the Central and wound up winning the whole thing, had three separate eight-game losing streaks (and another of seven just before the season ended), yet hung on to win anyway.

There's plenty of time to right this ship. But it had better start tonight in Denver. Incidentally, Lou Piniella may be reading this site:

Piniella said he's considering batting catcher Jason Kendall second when he returns to the lineup during the Colorado series. Jacque Jones hit in that spot Wednesday for the first time since April 10.

Good. A lot of us here suggested hitting Kendall second after Alfonso Soriano went down. Let's start generating some runs!

Comment 301 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

Ramirez
The papers say he's going to see a hand specialist.  If the Cubs lose him for any length of time I fear they could be in real trouble.  He's the best run producer on the team and he gives protection in the lineup to DLee.  His loss could be devastating.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 9:06 AM CDT reply actions  

Yes, it would.
Here's hoping for the best for Ramirez.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 9:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

Absolutes
While I don't like to speak in absolutes, I have to agree here.  If the Cubs lose Ramirez for much time they are done.

by Kornchex on Aug 9, 2007 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes...
his loss would be nearly impossible to overcome. Comparable to DLee's loss last year...
You are freaking out man!

by crw89 on Aug 9, 2007 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

Whats that saying?
I'd rather be lucky than good?

Cubs have been pretty lucky the past few days with the how everything has played out.

We all knew something like this was going to happen eventually before the end of the year.  lets be thankful it was not the same time as the 2004 collapse.

This team worked hard for 2 months getting to where they are, they are a little drained, if we can split with the Colorado i am confident that the off day on the 13th will help the Cubs and we will be backt o playing better baseball.

by HIGGY on Aug 9, 2007 9:07 AM CDT reply actions  

Yup.
---"Whats that saying?
I'd rather be lucky than good?"---

Yup. That's pretty much the philosophy of the apologists.

As I have said before - they don't recognize things like 85-win teams winning a World Series for the shocking event that it is.  It is, instead, their recognized philosophy of how winning a World Series is supposed to be done in Chicago.

Only Cubs fans talk about payroll like it's their personal checkbook, trading unproven prospects like it's heresy, and revel in seasons where they aren't mathematically eliminated on August 31st like it's time for celebration.

Which is why folks like us who'd rather be good than lucky are often out-of-place on boards like BCB.  You don't need to be good, just less terrible enough to RELY a series of miracles to get the job done.  That's how you do it, yeah!

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

Outstanding
Super post.  One of the best in the past two months.
Eighty-five percent of the f*ckin' world is working. The other fifteen percent come out here. -- Lee Constantine Elia, 1983.

by krummy12 on Aug 9, 2007 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions  

I am not saying...
i dont want to be good?  Of course i want to be good (and we are good), but it takes situations like this past week (us getting lucky) to continue with a successful season.  If Milwaukee swept the Rockies we would be 4 games back right now...instead we are only 1, big difference.

by HIGGY on Aug 9, 2007 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions  

its funny
you're basically criticizing people for being "super optimistic"

but at the same time you're essentially wanting the team to be good rather than lucky, which i assume means not hoping that an 85 win team wins the world series and instead only settle for a consistent 90+ game winner, correct me if i'm wrong?

I don't disagree with that rational

However, this team won 66 games last year and to "expect" a team to go from 66 wins to 90+ win contenders is really pretty naive. Wouldn't you say? I mean its probably happened less than 5 times in the history of the game to have a 25+ win turnaround in one season...

So in one hand you're ridiculing those "overt optimists" but on the other hand you're expecting a 90 win 2007 season, which seems like an extremely "optimistic" expectation given the team won 66 games last season

So what do you want us to do? The ones rooting for the team to still be in contention aren't actively rooting against a consistent 90 game winner, we're just being fans and trying to root on what we have.

Plenty of us get frustrated with whats going on, the problem is you're trying to make a clear cut distinction between "apologists" and "realists" and it's not black and white

there's plenty of realists that realize this team is flawed, but they're still going to root for this team no matter what, because that's what fans do

There are some fans that are staunch in their utter optimism for this team and quite a few on the other end of the spectrum that are annoyingly pessimistic at every turn, but the vast majority sits somewhere in the middle.

And the majority of those people are just rooting for their team and being a fan

so lay off them for trying to keep their heads up and rooting for this team to win

does the Cardinals World Series last year mean any less than the dominant Yankee teams World Series? Maybe in terms of a historical perspective, but certainly not to all the Cardinal fans last year that got to experience that "magical" postseason run

so while I agree with your premise that the goal "should be" to have the good fortune to root for a consistent 90 game winning contender, we as fans have little control over that

and we as fans for the most part are just trying to be fans....

and lastly, when fans groan about salaries its because they realize that the team is operating within a budget. No one cares personally how much they pay people, they care about it in context to a payroll which we know is limited. That's a really important distinction that you seem to be missing... if we know our payroll is going to settle in around 100 million this year than some people are going to question spending 10+ Million dollars on one player

its not because its "their money", its because they understand the payroll management is working with and poor management of that payroll does effect something a fan has invested in even if its not money

it impacts their time, their love, and the passion they put into each season

and thats why fans get critical of salaries, not because it impacts their own finances but because it has a direct impact on the success of something they're passionate about

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes it is.
Thank you!
I love this team!!!!!

by sue369 on Aug 9, 2007 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

thank you
i try....

but i seem to offend/upset most people for some reason or another

glad to see some positive feedback on something i post :)

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

That was very well said!
n/t
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2007 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Outstanding.
Excellent post. I would implore everyone to take one advice from "Not Rose Colored", though: Let's all start welcoming differing viewpoints instead of jumping on the person who makes them. These differences of opinion are what make a blog like this more interesting than other media.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 9, 2007 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Here's to hoping
That being in Colorado reminds the players how to hit for power.

by Arbusto on Aug 9, 2007 9:10 AM CDT reply actions  

Colitis?
Is it contagious? Because frankly the whole team has taken a big dump on the field the last three nights as though they are having some digestive issues.

I just don't know how a team goes from playing so well together to coming out of the gate the last two nights playing like they were already down by 10 runs. Maybe it's the 2006-ish lineup we've thrown out there the last few nights, maybe it's the consecutive days they've played in a row. I don't know what it is, but it's rather odd and confusing. There's just no...fire. Besides Theriot it doesn't seem like any player is out there playing like they are in the middle of a division race, a race which the other team is trying so hard to just hand them.

I guess the silver lining of all this is that we have played arguably three of our most frustrating games and still remain just one game back in the division. Hopefully the thin air and, what I hope for more, a new lineup will spark this team again so at the very least they can play as though they care.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 9:11 AM CDT reply actions  

Here's one reason
the Cubs offense has struggled so badly.  Ramirez has one hit in the last 4 games.  He didn't play the last two and he was 1 for 8 in the two before that.  Not surprising the Cubs lost all 4.  Let's hope he comes back healthy real soon.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

Very true
As was said yesterday though, ARam was getting in that funk he gets in when he starts to play like he's not really paying attention.

Hopefully these few days off not only get his body healthy but his mind back in the game. We need his clutch hits down the stretch.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 9:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

If they play
the way they did in Houston, there will be no stretch.
"5-8-8, 2-3-hundred, Empire!"

by SyneRandberg on Aug 9, 2007 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

True
n/t

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

re: Colitis?
I was waiting to see how long it would take someone to make a collitis joke. Thank you, sir, for making my wait a short one!
Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 9:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

Thank you Thank you
I had to step up to the plate after someone made a joke about Rockford actually having jobs yesterday. Obvious jokes are the most fun sometimes.

And I was too tired to be creative.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

Gathering themselves
The Cubs just made a huge amazing run to take over 1st place in the Central.  It was predictable that there would be an emotional let down, but before they could gather themselves to get back to work they lost Soriano.  That was another blow.  Now they are trying to gather themselves again.  Hopefully the Aramis thing doesn't become another such situation.

by californiachicagoan on Aug 9, 2007 12:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Any word yet
on Ohman's injury? ;-)
"5-8-8, 2-3-hundred, Empire!"

by SyneRandberg on Aug 9, 2007 9:11 AM CDT reply actions  

I read
Something about irritation on Rotoworld. He'll still be going to Iowa, so that will be nice.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 9:12 AM CDT up reply actions  

Perhaps now
Eyre could have the same injury.  
"5-8-8, 2-3-hundred, Empire!"

by SyneRandberg on Aug 9, 2007 9:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Or...
Wuertz. Either of those two. Unfortunately we have to keep one around for garbage time work.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 9:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

He is a lying sack
of Sh#T! Sure - claim injury after you get sent down and THEN file a union greivance...

You suck Oh-Man!

It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 10:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

Actually, yes.
Read this:
Turns out Will Ohman's shoulder soreness was all bark, no bite, and the left-hander is expected to be cleared today to report to Class AAA Iowa as ordered.

Ohman, who first reported his shoulder was bothering him after being informed the club had optioned him to Iowa on Tuesday, was diagnosed with irritation of the AC joint after an MRI on Wednesday.

It's a condition that typically requires no more than a few days off to subside.

Ohman's revelation that he had been pitching despite a "barking" shoulder didn't sit well with some Cubs officials, and it caught manager Lou Piniella by surprise.

"I don't pitch or play people that have something wrong physically," Piniella said.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 9:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

Can they send him to Daytona instead
as sort of a reprimand for faking an injury?
"5-8-8, 2-3-hundred, Empire!"

by SyneRandberg on Aug 9, 2007 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

IMHO..
Iowa is more punishment than the beach..
Well, sometimes nothin is a real cool hand.

by wicubfan on Aug 9, 2007 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

Daytona's a crap hole
Stats, stats, stats - enough with the stats already!!!

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2007 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Plus the fact...
Ohman never bothered to tell any of the coaches that his shoulder was hurting was a huge mistake.

I'm sure the players are told to tell the coaches when they don't feel right, and when they don't, it ultimately hurts the team, because like Lou said, he would not play someone who was injured instead of playing someone is not 100% healthy.

I totally blame Ohman for everything that has happened to him because he was too stubborn or proud to let the coaches know of any injuries.

the players ultimately hurt themselves (no pun intended) when they do this sort of stupid stuff!

If you think you've seen it all...just wait!

by CubFanSince1970 on Aug 9, 2007 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions  

Is Hill back to being Z's personal catcher?
I can't think of another good reason why Koyie Hill is still with the Cubs while Soto, who's batting .352 in AAA, waits his turn.  Hill's hit last night may have been the highlight of of the game, seeing how rare they are.

by John Q Freejazz on Aug 9, 2007 9:13 AM CDT reply actions  

Let's Go to Soto
I'd like to see Soto brought up too, but it would mean probably losing Hill.  If something happens to Kendall, then the Cubs would be stuck with a rookie going into the stretch drive (and possibly post-season).  Soto should be up in September, but I don't know how long the Cubs can put up with weak-swinging Koyie Hill.

Did anybody else catch Brenly slobbering on the "man-crush" for the defensive abilities of Hill?  It was rather nauseating.  Hill may be above average defensively, but to call him the best defensive catcher is a stretch.

Pie, Fontenot, Theriot and Soto up the middle ... yippie oh, oh, oh!

by SpudV on Aug 9, 2007 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions  

BB
I heard that too and did a double take at the TV.  Maybe Brenly meant the Cubs' best defensive catcher?  Even then though you could probably still make an argument.
"Dad gum right this games gonna be played under protest. . . I guarantee this is gonna be one protest that's upheld." --Hawk Harrelson, 6/24/07

by RynoHoF on Aug 9, 2007 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

Gah.
Rob Bowen hit 2 HR last night. Go figure.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

Good grief.
2 HRs?  Ugh.

Now I think I'll take up drinking.

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions  

To add insult to injury...
he hit them from both sides of the plate. One RH, one LH. The sun truly does shine on a dog's backside sometimes.
"One thing you learn as a Cubs fan: When you bought your ticket, you could bank on seeing the bottom of the ninth." - Joe Garagiola

by gary varsho on Aug 9, 2007 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not clear - what happened to Ramirez?
I think we will get back to better baseball soon.    I've asked this quite a few times:  Any word on Ward ?

by coral on Aug 9, 2007 9:14 AM CDT reply actions  

Should return this weekend
From what I read it looks like he's in Denver with the team and should be activated sometime this weekend. Should make for an interesting roster move.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm guessing...
... Patterson gets sent down when Ward is activated.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 9:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

Makes sense
But I think it also doesn't solve any of the problems facing our team right now. We have an outfield full of 4th outfielders, with our right fielder unable to really get it out of first gear. I really hope we move Jaque (and that pains me to say it) to right and insert Pie into center. At the very least that gives us a half functioning outfielder. We still lack any sort of "corner outfield" power without Soriano.

I hope Lou does something like a Patterson, Pie and Derosa outfield tonight just for giggles. Switch it up a bit. Of course, this is impossible if Ward is activated prior to the game, which is a good possibility.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

I agree
for one game, Lou should just throw out a young lineup. Shake it up. DLee looks like he could use a day off. Strikes out a lot to me.

Theriot 3b
Fontenot 2b
Dero rf
Ward 1b
Kendall c
Patterson lf
Pie cf
Cedeno ss

The deadline has come and gone. Looks like our Triple A Hall O Famers will have to lead us to the promise land.

by cubbyblue137 on Aug 9, 2007 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

How about
Theriot 3b
Fontenot 2b
Murton rf
Ward 1b
Kendall c
Patterson lf
Pie cf
Cedeno ss

Dero looks pretty tired too and could use a break, considering all the shuffling he's done around the field.  Plus we would get a preview of the Cubs outfield for the next ten (at least!) years, if Lou could convince Soriano to go back to 2B.

Pie, Fontenot, Theriot and Soto up the middle ... yippie oh, oh, oh!

by SpudV on Aug 9, 2007 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

re: How about
I like the idea of going younger and faster. It seems like, at some point very soon, Lou needs to abandon the idea that this team's home run power is suddenly going to turn back on and start emphasizing speed and run manufacturing.

But I'd disagree with the notion of putting Theriot at third base. In the one or two times I've seen him play there, he's never looked particularly comfortable. And he certainly doesn't have the arm for it.

And though DeRosa could certainly use a break from time to time, I don't think he looks tired. He's been hitting fairly well (2 for 5 last night) and he plays a mean third base. Plus, the team still needs some veteran leadership on the field.

I'm willing to support an all-youngster outfield, though. As stated in my diary the other day, I'm done with Cliff Floyd. Done. His two walks last night were nice -- I can't bring myself to criticize a walk. But they also brought to light the same problem: The team needs Floyd to drive in runs, not just get on base.

I'm on the fence about Jones. He did go 2 for 4 last night. I just wish the hell Pie would adapt to major league pitching better. If he could at least get on base at a decent clip, I'd drop JJ in a second. Pie's speed and disruptive presence on the basepaths are par excellence.

And, yeah, maybe DLee needs a break. It would be nice if Ward comes back swinging, though he's a big step down in terms of defense.

Oh, and one last thing, the idea of Soriano going back to second base: NOT GONNA HAPPEN.

Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

Continuuing with the sarcasm
Since the entire team has played many games in a row and really could all use a day off, Lou should just forfeit the game today and concentrate on tomorrow.
"Dad gum right this games gonna be played under protest. . . I guarantee this is gonna be one protest that's upheld." --Hawk Harrelson, 6/24/07

by RynoHoF on Aug 9, 2007 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

I wasn't being sarcastic
We really do need to sit down the lifeless blobs we are running out there right now. Not real big on replacing Lee with Ward or excluding Aram from the lineup if he's healthy. I would much rather see an outfield containing Patterson, Pie and Derosa than what we ran out in Houston for 3 straight nights.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

or this?
Theriot ss
Kendall c
Murton lf
Lee 1b
DeRosa 3b
Jones rf
Fontenot 2b
Pie cf
"Who are you going to believe, me or your own eyes?"

by Jettero2112 on Aug 9, 2007 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Lee
Lee does have more strike outs than usual, but he also has as many walks as strikeouts (going back to July 31), and is having a great slugging month so far!

by californiachicagoan on Aug 9, 2007 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ward is in Colorado.
He's going to work for the team and as soon as they confirm that he is allright will be activated, according to Lou.

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/503274,CST-SPT-csep09.article

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 9, 2007 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

I've given up on trying to use logic
and sadly my drinking during Cubs games is no longer celebratory in nature.
AC 00 00 00 - BELIEVE

by mike @ Bleed Cubbie Blue on Aug 9, 2007 9:24 AM CDT reply actions  

when they are playing well
as they had for a better part of the past couple months.
AC 00 00 00 - BELIEVE

by mike @ Bleed Cubbie Blue on Aug 9, 2007 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

except for 2004, have the Cubs ever
had a season where Lee and Ramirez were never injured??
Now that he is back, play Matt Murton!!

by Chanman25 on Aug 9, 2007 9:28 AM CDT reply actions  

Ramirez was hurt in 2004
He had a sore hamstring.

And to answer to your question, no.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

Eh
Ramirez's hammy or quad or knees goes out.
The deadline has come and gone. Looks like our Triple A Hall O Famers will have to lead us to the promise land.

by cubbyblue137 on Aug 9, 2007 9:31 AM CDT reply actions  

Big news from last night was:
Not the lack of hitting or that another starter didn't pitch six innings, thus taxing the bullpen once more. That's old news. A rehash. Nothing new there.

The real news is Aramis Ramírez's wrist injury. Man, when it rains it pours in Cubs Land. Despite Lou's optimism for the masses, the team is taking this injury seriously because they sent Ramírez to Chicago to be checked by the team doctors. This team cannot absorb the absence of another big bat from the lineup for a prolonged period of time. I hope Ramírez can come back healthy on Friday.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 9, 2007 9:36 AM CDT reply actions  

me too...
they wouldnt recover if he went down for any length of time. It would psychologically devestating for the team.

not to mention the lack of run production..

Let me get back to you, will ya, Charlie? I got a guy on the other line asking about some white walls.

by JB 23 on Aug 9, 2007 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

Teams will
walk the bases loaded and then watch Floyd and/or Murton strikeout/hit into a dp/popout.
The deadline has come and gone. Looks like our Triple A Hall O Famers will have to lead us to the promise land.

by cubbyblue137 on Aug 9, 2007 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

Don't forget
The weak popup/grouder or strikeout they can expect from Jones as well.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 9:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

Jones
Jacque actually met with a patent attorney the other day and patented the groundout to second.  So now every time someone grounds out to second, they have to pay JJ royalties.  That is one smart player there.
"Dad gum right this games gonna be played under protest. . . I guarantee this is gonna be one protest that's upheld." --Hawk Harrelson, 6/24/07

by RynoHoF on Aug 9, 2007 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions  

That seems about right
I hope he didn't forget to also claim rights to the first pitch pop up in a key situation.

Also, I hope he told Uncle Cliff to patent the look he has while looking completely clueless at the plate. Seems a combination of constipation and complete shock that starting your swing when the ball is almost to the plate doesn't give you a chance to make any contact.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

Another patent
Throwing straight into the ground for a 10 hop to the cutoff man.

by Arbusto on Aug 9, 2007 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

Or
Throwing into the screen behind home.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

I hope he comes back tonight.......
the lineup sucks without him in it.
RAMIREZ!! PRIOR!!

by PriorandAramisfan23 on Aug 9, 2007 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

Unavailable.
From the Chicago Tribune: "Ramírez is expected to rejoin the team in Denver on Friday, but whether he will be available to play is unknown."

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-070808cubsgamer,1,7224137.story?coll =cs-cubs-headlines

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 9, 2007 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hendry swears..
..that all of the solutions come from within, even to injuries.

So nothing to worry about, folks!

Just sit back and hope for the best - take comfort in miracle stories of teams of prior years; and instead of recognizing them as the miracles they were, tout them as a winning philosophy.  Hope to be good enough to barely get in, then expect a series of miracles.  That's how you do it!

And if doing nothing costs the Cubs a VERY rare playoff opportunity - hey!  It was still the right thing to do.  

Remember, we have once again been told that all of the solutions for 2007 are already in the organization.  A World Series championship is just around the corner.  And no help is needed to do it in 2007 - remember.

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 9:51 AM CDT reply actions  

re: Hendry swears..
Any comment like this immediately begs the question: So what would you have done if you were the Cubs general manager this year? Who would you have traded for and who would you have given up?

I'm not a huge fan of Jim Hendry. But I just didn't see a lot of viable options out there.

Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 10:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

Whoa -
I still think many here just do not realize that Hendry is OBVIOUSLY, imo, not able to tack on any meaningful contracts or salary due to powers above.

Do you not think ANY GM in their right mind would not have a Carlos Zambrano signed by now if he was able to navigate as he had in the past?

Please.

It is our "luck" as fans this year that the club is being sold in the middle of a playoff hunt.

I will be very shocked indeed, if anything much changes other than has-beens added.

It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 10:07 AM CDT up reply actions  

If that's true...
...then Hendry is a unconscienable liar, and someone should just tell us that.

I'm find if he's handcuffed, just as long as they let us know that.

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well, I would not
go so far as to call him a "liar".

Things change, and he can be a real politician when it comes to being pinned down for an answer.

Look - I'm sure John McD and Hendry are nice guys with some integrity - but this thing now, again from what I am seeing - or lack of seeing - is just over their heads.

We hopefully will get the real story after the team changes hands, imo.

It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

Reply:
---"Any comment like this immediately begs the question: So what would you have done if you were the Cubs general manager this year? Who would you have traded for and who would you have given up?"---

I would have acquired a quality player at the trade deadline for the strecth run.  Absent that, I would agressively seek waiver trades, considering the Cubs' position on waivers, to try and make this team better for a run at the playoffs.

I would have looked, and continued now to look for the best deal, setting a limit of no MORE than (and preferably not as much as) two of my best five prospects and two of my #6-10 prospects in exchange for a player who, based on history and ability, would make a difference for the Cubs in the final months.  Where I differ with some folks here is that I actually am willing to give up something to get something.  Many folks here want a free lunch, or they are content just fasting.

Now, if the price was much higher than that for a single player, I would not consider it unless said player had more than two months left on his contract.  But if the price is five of our top ten prospects, I'm a monkey's uncle.

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

re: Reply:
LOL. Are you an attorney? Name names, please.
Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

You're being pretty vague here.
What "quality player" would you have acquired? And what would you have given up to get him?

As I've said many times, this isn't as easy as clicking the mouse a couple of times and making a deal in fantasy ball. You're dealing with real people, both the players and opposing GMs, big contracts, and other factors.

So let's hear it, Not rose colored. Be specific.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

Specifics.
So I have to narrow it down to specific players, eh?  Well, I'll be happy to name a few.

But let me premise that by saying that if my above scenario ever took hold (3 top ten propects, or possibly four), that Hendry would be answering the phone, not dialing it.

Many names have already been mentioned: Griffey, Dunn, Dye (least of my faves, but still HR material), possibly Hunter or even Crawford.

But nobody can tell me that several new names wouldn't suddenly start to appear from credible sources if it became known that the Cubs were serious about being buyers, and weren't just looking for a free lunch.  Set a fair threshold of what you're willing to trade, like the above scenario, and you'll be surprised who's available.  Ask the Astros about Randy Johnson and Carlos Beltran.

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

well..
johnson and beltran were both actively being shopped

so i dont understand your theory of uncovering hidden trade gems

and the carl crawford idea is one that was NEVER reported by anyone in the media

it was a pipe dream brought on by the speculation of uninformed fans and uninformed sportswrites that he'd be available...

and if he was somehow available it would require 2-4 top PITCHING prospects

since we have... well none really

that would be an issue

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions  

Ok, well...
...we already know that Dye costs Marmol. Would you do that? Personally I don't fell it's worthwhileto fill one hole and not the other.

Griffey? Dunn? Every media report from around the trade deadline says that the Reds decided they weren't for sale; the Cubs certainly tried if the rumor mill was to be believed. What, was Hendry supposed to kidnap Wayne Krivsky's daughter and force him to deal away Dunn? I don't understand here.

And the fact that nobody can tell you that the Cubs could have made other names available has less to do with situational reality and more to do with your stubbornness. It's really not my problem.

FREE CARMEN PIGNATIELLO!

by cwyers on Aug 9, 2007 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Wouldn't trade Marmol for Dye.
But if we're to believe the same sources that say Marmol was the price, Hendry didn't exactly negotiate - unless the dial tone was part of it.

Somehow I refuse to believe that there wasn't any other player in the entirety of the Cubs' minor league system that the Sox would have taken for Dye.

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

so
in one case you suggest we really dont know what the negotiations were

and on the other hand, you ridicule Hendry for not getting a move done

doesnt that seem silly?

If we dont know what options he had how can we suggest he did a poor job by not making a trade

for all we know he could've negotiated hundreds of proposals that were all rejected that would've netted a big bat without giving up a lot

or

he could've had a couple boxes of junior mints and done nothing, ignored all phone calls

we really have no firm idea of what went on

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

Where is the future...
in the players you mentioned?  Seriously with the exception of crawford none of those players would be wearing a Cubs jersey in 08 (maybe Griffey - not sure his contract situation).  

The Cubs organization is trying to build a team that wins for years not just one (ie signing, Lee, Soriano, Ramirez for lengthy contracts).  

by HIGGY on Aug 9, 2007 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

Not for the future.
---"The Cubs organization is trying to build a team that wins for years not just one..."---

No, it's not.  It backloaded the contracts so that the payroll will boom in two years, giving a clear indication that they will be trading some of those salaries away at that time.

And yes, most of those aforementioned players would be rentals for the stretch run - that's the point.  Right now, we have a few two-year rentals as it is.

And to the prior comment on shopping, Hendry made it pretty damn clear at every occasion that he wasn't shopping, but that he would entertain a free lunch.  Why would anyone take him as a serious buyer starting from that very public stance?  Would you counter that with a Dunn for Patterson and Veal offer? I wouldn't bother.

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

re: Not for the future.
I think you may be taking Hendry's public comments too literally (or too seriously). I'm guessing most, if not all, GMs don't put too much stock in what any of their counterparts say in the press. If there are good deals to be made, they make them. I just don't think there were many good deals to be made.
Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

I do hope you're right on this...
...and AL...and the rest.

I would really, truly hate to think he was willingly doing nothing for the stretch run again.  

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

Unless...
You are Jim Hendry or another Cubs front office person - nothing you stated here is valid.  You have no idea what the future of the Cubs is regarding trading/keeping players.

All we can go off of is the contracts that were signed and the length, other than that everything else is speculation.

Who are out 2 year rental players that we already have?

by HIGGY on Aug 9, 2007 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

re: Specifics.
I share your frustration, but I'm still not buying your argument. Griffey, Dunn and Dye were all discussed ad nauseum here. The Cubs would have had to give up too much for aging, injury-prone players that would only further clog a cluttered outfield.

And I believe Hunter stated publicly he would not approve a trade to the Cubs because he didn't want to play in front of Wrigley's brick outfield wall. I'm not familiar with Crawford's situation, but I'm guessing another poster can address his lack of feasibility.

I've never gotten the impression that Hendry has been unreasonable about who he would or wouldn't give up for a trade. For instance, I heard the Sox asked for Marmol and Hendry hung up the phone -- a reaction I fully support.

Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

And it's unclear if they're actually available...
or if the other teams are looking to make a killing off of them.  Considering that nobody has made a move for them, I'd say the asking price is indeed too high.

In a perfect world, I'd love to get Griffey or Dye to play RF.  But if the asking price is way too high, it's just not reasonable to do it.

by SouthernCub on Aug 9, 2007 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Here's what I would do
I would look for a solid player available and then given up a package of minor leaguers who may or may not have names.  Luckily every GM out there is willing to trade their players so that I can do this deal, otherwise I may have to stand pat like Hendry did.

Do you not think that Hendry tried?  Your post basically said you would try real hard to make a deal and you would continue to try real hard to make a deal now.

I think Hendry proved in the offseason when he was signing Ted Lilly from a hospital bed that he tries real hard all the time.

"Dad gum right this games gonna be played under protest. . . I guarantee this is gonna be one protest that's upheld." --Hawk Harrelson, 6/24/07

by RynoHoF on Aug 9, 2007 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think "Not Rose Colored"...
is saying just that. He doesn't believe Hendry tried really hard. I have to agree with him because that's what Hendry said himself, that he was happy with the team he had. Many of us disagreed then and continue to disagree now.

Now, to question "Not Rose Colored" and others who believe like him because he doesn't mention names of players to acquire, is, IMHO, too much. You don't know who is available until you try to acquire him and until you engage in a negotiation you don't know what it would take to acquire them either. I would exonerate Hendry based on that were it not for the fact that he said he would not acquire anybody else by the trade deadline because he was satisfied with the team he had. For whatever reason he sais that, including lack of money or authority, Hendry was mistaken.

Hendry's mistake aside, I do agree that other than a good way to spend time arguing, nothing is gained by throwing out names of unavailable players, like Griffey and the like. It's not realistic to think that those players would be available now. I only ask that even at this late stage, Hendry gets more aggressive and get the best player he can acquire at a reasonable price. And on that, I also agree with "Not Rose Colored" that it will cost us prospects because if you want to get something you also have to give up something. Talk of Pie or others as untouchables is misguided, IMHO.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 9, 2007 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

So was nearly every other MLB team stupid too ?
Only two contending teams made signicant trades, the Braves
and the Red Sox. The Braves trades a lot to get  very good slightly long term rental. The Red Sox traded some presumably
good prospects for a strugling set up guy. Several teams in DESPERATE need of pitching ( Indians ( closer) TIgers ( ditto)
Mets, Braves, Brewers ( starters) did nothing to address the needs. Several teams in need of hitters ( Padres, Dodgers,
Mariners etc) did nothing there.
NO ONE WAS MAKING BIG DEALS because most everything available was overpriced CRAP. The Cubs made a serious effort to get Ryan Church who might have helped but it fell through.

None of this was about money. It was about no available players.

I am so glad you know more than Hendry and the other GM's about who was availale and how the Cubs could have gotten them. I am stunned you have not gotten a GMs job yet

"It's the Cubbies. There's always a vibe. It's the greatest vibe in baseball." Greg Maddux on Cub fan's optimism even after the 06 debacle.

by jessica on Aug 9, 2007 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

None.
There is absolutely nobody available via trade from any team in baseball whatsoever who would help the Cubs at all down the stretch run.  Nobody.  Not one person.
"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

I take it this is sarcasm?
Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

If your argument concludes with
either a mention of Willy Mo Pena or Shannon Stewart, then no, there is no one out there right now that will help us.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 10:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

I've yet to see a name that would help...
of all the people moved, the only player of value (Teixeira) plays 1B.  That's not very useful to us.  Stewart isn't discernably better offensively than what we have right now.  Pena may be better or he may be substantially worse.  He's certainly been worse this year than anyone we have played in the OF so far.

I don't have a problem at all with bringing in help from outside.  My only stipulation is that it has to actually HELP, rather than just be more of the same but with a different name.

by SouthernCub on Aug 9, 2007 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

I can agree with that.
Stewart or Pena would be Hendry just being able to say he didn't sleep through August.  I would rather do nothing than acquire someone just to say we added a body.  

I see little that either could add to IMPROVE the team.  And I'm not much for adding headcases unless their talent is a little more overwhleming than Pena's, anyway.

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

What moves were available?
Would you mortgage your future on the HOPE that some player that hasn't worked out/worn out with another team will somehow come in and save the season? These guys come along about once every 20 years or so. For every Rick Sutcliffe, there are 20 Gary Gaetti's, and he was one of the better ones.

by billybuck on Aug 9, 2007 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions  

Nope.
---"Would you mortgage your future on the HOPE..."---

Nope, wouldn't "mortage the future," and already said so.

But I would be willing to let some prospects go for a player who we could credibly deduce would make the team better.

Again, if one trade would effectively "mortgage the future," they never had a future to begin with.

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 9, 2007 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

Soriano...
Still can't understand why the Cubs signed Soriano instead of Carlos Lee.  He seems to hit well in Wrigley Field in the past.  

Any Opinions?

"Hey-Hey! Home Run! Attaboy Ronnie!" ~ Jack Brickhouse

by ronsanto10 on Aug 9, 2007 10:12 AM CDT reply actions  

I was waiting for this to come up....
Lee is a nice player but he probably wont last as long as Soriano.  

In a perfect world we should have just signed both guys....traded Jones and NOT sign Floyd.  But that is a perfect world which we do not live in.

by HIGGY on Aug 9, 2007 10:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

I believe this topic is very ironic.
All Chicago remembers the fielding and baserunning adventures of El Caballo while playing for the Sox and C. Lee is strictly a left fielder.  With the Fonz, they didn't... oh, uh...

The version Hendry signed is faster and skinnier, but the fielding and base running appear very similar.  

Hendry signed fewer HR's, but got some stolen bases. Oh, and some hamstring issues and a torn quad.  I guess Lee is never moving that fast on the base paths to pull or tear anything.

Regardless, here's hoping Soriano comes back healthy and productive.  The Cubs need him.

by N Oakley on Aug 9, 2007 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions  

Wait a second.
It's the first time that Soriano has been on the disabled list in his career. I have criticized a number of Hendry's moves and non-moves, but in fairness those injuries were not part of the package. They're new items.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 9, 2007 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Soriano tweaked his hamstring
in April and was not 100% for a while.  He didn't run the bases as much as jog.  I'm not certain to what you are referring.

by N Oakley on Aug 9, 2007 8:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

"always hits well at Wrigley" theory
Remember, it might not be Wrigley Field as much as it is hitting against Cubs' pitching.

by ballhawk on Aug 9, 2007 10:18 AM CDT up reply actions  

Also called the Jeff Blauser Theory
1-RUN GAMES = 15-18 | EXTRA INNINGS = 1-7 | HOME = 30-28 | updated on 8/7

by SackMan on Aug 9, 2007 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

haha..
Blauser...now there's a blast from the past
Well, sometimes nothin is a real cool hand.

by wicubfan on Aug 9, 2007 11:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

With Scott Eyre on the team
Our post-game spread could not handle another large man. Eyre looks like he dominates that table. And looking at Lee he looks like he puts up a good effort after the game as well. There can only be one extremely tubby guy on the team.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

Soriano was theoretically a better fit...
he was supposed to fill the need at leadoff man, which Carlos Lee would most certainly not do.  Also, he was considered a possibility in CF this year, which Lee could certainly not do.  Beyond that, Lee is a big big guy, and you have to be concerned that he may be forced to become a DH or 1B in a couple of years, which would make him useless in Chicago.  Soriano theoretically would have more longevity because of how he takes care of his body.  And Soriano is better defensively, provides the speed element.  And we were supposed to have plenty of options to hit #5 and #6, between Jones/Floyd/DeRosa/Murton.  We overpaid by a lot, but Soriano did make more sense than Lee at the time.

Obviously, it hasn't worked out right.  Soriano couldn't handle CF, so it screwed up the OF (since we had nothing but LF).  And he hasn't stayed healthy.  And he hasn't hit for as much power as hoped.

by SouthernCub on Aug 9, 2007 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

Lets look at it this way
Soriano and Lee are both 31.  Lee got 6/100 mil and the Fonz got 8/136 mil.  Both play left field.  We want Soriano to hit 5th because of his power, but he wants to leadoff.  Lee, the RBI machine that he is, would have batted 5th and we would have more runs scored, period.  I'm glad we have Soriano instead of nobody, but Lee would have been better.  The Riot is better leading off than Soriano anyway.  
PC load letter, what the f*** does that mean?

by cubfaninSTL on Aug 9, 2007 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

Disagree.
Both play LF now. Before his contract is up, Lee won't be able to play in the outfield anymore. Last night, for example, he looked like Bonds running on the outfield.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 9, 2007 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

From my perspective
I'll take the gazelle over the water buffalo over the life of the contract for the versatility that you get. That, of course, accepts the fact that they're both grossly overpaid.

by billybuck on Aug 9, 2007 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

How about this
Lee lives in Houston, has a farm in Houston and had zero, none, nil interest in going back to Chicago when he was able to accept a huge deal in Houston.  End of discussion, he was never a real option.
Eighty-five percent of the f*ckin' world is working. The other fifteen percent come out here. -- Lee Constantine Elia, 1983.

by krummy12 on Aug 9, 2007 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

Never a real option
I remember hearing he wanted to play for Chicago.
PC load letter, what the f*** does that mean?

by cubfaninSTL on Aug 9, 2007 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions  

re: Never a real option
Yeah, I recall Carlos Lee mentioning at one point that he still had a home in the Chicago area from his White Sox days. (Did I imagine this?) I guess his ranch in Texas was just nicer. Damn horses.
Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions  

Eman
Without proof otherwise, I'd say you're right. Hendry hasn't been allowed to move on anything of real significance all season, including something as huge as the Z contract. And at this point, I don't think there's anyone really available we could pick up given the financial snafu we're in. We played exceedingly well over the past two months - a large stretch of the season.

Why do so many here think those same players can't get it together and go on another solid run without external help? It's not like a bunch of guys were playing well over their heads during the good stretch, excepting maybe Fontenot? TheRiot was slumping, Sori, Lee, ARam, Z - they were all playing as expected. Our pitching was ok but not great during that stretch. Seriously, they've hit a dip in the road. It may prove to fatally throw them into a ditch, but we won't really know that for another 2-3 weeks, maybe longer. Just take the fact that the Brewers can't seem to win either as a good sign.

"Mine, mine, says the squirrel to the transformer, unclear on the capacities of electricity." -Dean Young

by Kegler on Aug 9, 2007 10:16 AM CDT reply actions  

Infield In...
Al - now do you understand why teams bring the infield in?

Just wondering...

by big_lowitzki on Aug 9, 2007 10:21 AM CDT reply actions  

No, I still don't.
Yes, I saw that play last night. Now on what percentage of pulled-in-infield plays does that actually work?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's a good idea
when you've got a hitter at the plate who's easily jammed so you can count on a ball that's softly hit.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

No idea...
I have no idea about the % of success when the infield is in.

BUT... if the infield is back, the run scores.  It is pretty simple.

Not sure what you don't understand about it.

by big_lowitzki on Aug 9, 2007 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

Why is this?
You're telling me that a major league infielder has to be 20 feet closer to the plate to throw a runner out from third?

Sorry, I don't buy it. Plus, when the ball gets through, not only does the run score, but you have another runner on base.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

Distance?
It isn't about the distance... it is about the time that it takes for the ball to travel 20 feet further and then to throw the ball 2o feet further.  If you really don't think that makes a difference, I am not sure what to tell you.

Why do you think runners score with the infield back and not when the infield is in?

And yes... you do run the risk of a ball getting through and having another runner on.  But that is the nature of baseball.  It is just like an intentional walk.  You may avoid facing a tough hitter, but you also place another runner on base.

by big_lowitzki on Aug 9, 2007 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

I see your point, I guess.
I've just seen it fail many more times than it works.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 11:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'd guess this is hard to calculate...
because you (or anyone, not you specifically) probably don't remember the times it works.  In many cases, the result is a groundout to 1B, because the runner holds at 3B.

It would be interesting to see the frequency with which this works.  There are a number of old-school theories whose merits people have debated in recent years (bunting, base stealing, etc).  It would not surprise me at all if the pulling the infield in thing is another one of those counterproductive decisions managers make simply because that's the way it's always been done.

by SouthernCub on Aug 9, 2007 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's all about the odds
You pull the infield in when you really can't afford to have the other team put up a run.  I was a little surprised Garner did that so early in the game, but some of that had to do with Zambrano's potential to shut them down.

I don't know how often it works on ground balls, but the bottom line is this; if you don't pull the infield in, the SS and 2nd baseman have virtually no shot at cutting the runner down on an average hit ground ball.  If you pull them in, you give yourself a chance.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2007 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

Was it Baylor..?
That often pulled them in in the 2nd or 3rd inning? Drove me nuts. He did have a pop gun offense though..
Well, sometimes nothin is a real cool hand.

by wicubfan on Aug 9, 2007 11:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

Last night
when Garner pulled in his fielders we had the bottom of the lineup in play. Even had a single scored a run, the #8 and #9 hitters were due up. I doubt he would have moved the infield in if the top of our lineup was waiting.
Josh Kroeger. Remember the name. Stay tuned for the fame.

by tharr on Aug 9, 2007 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Exactly.
Because the defensive alignment kills the "running on contact from third" play.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 9, 2007 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

It might have worked last night...
But in all honesty Derosa probably should not have ran.

by HIGGY on Aug 9, 2007 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

It was a contact
play.  He was going on contact.  With 1-out and the bottom of the order due up it wasn't a bad idea, IMO.  Just didn't work.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oh right...
i understand why he went and what not - and i also understand they sent him because we have been struggling to score (and if it was Pie, or Theriot they might have scored) and pressing a little bit.

by HIGGY on Aug 9, 2007 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

re: It was a contact
I agree with this. Although I uttered an expletive or two after that play, I was fine with DeRosa running. I'd rather see the Cubs be aggressive on the basepaths and fail than watch them flail away at bad pitches with runners in scoring position time and time again.
Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

Obviously he was going on contact
but you usually don't have the contact play on with the infield that far in.  I found that a little odd, but was probably an indicator that Piniella thought they had to force the issue.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2007 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions  

Exactly.
It was bad running because you don't run on contact with the infield in. The fact that DeRosa was told to go home tells me that Lou wasn't expecting anyone to drive the run in with a hit.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 9, 2007 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sure...
... but that probably wasn't DeRosa's decision.  That probably a coaching decision to go on contact.

But regardless... the reason why DeRosa shouldn't have gone was because the infield was in.  

In other words - the infield in kept the run from scoring (at least in that at-bat) whether DeRosa ran or not.

by big_lowitzki on Aug 9, 2007 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

NL Central division race reminds me of a joke...
Two guys camping in the woods.  One night, they hear something large moving around the campsite.  

First guy says "Oh no, it sounds like a bear.  We're goners for sure."  

Second guy pokes his head out of the tent for a quick look and ducks back in.  "Yep, it's a bear alright.  Big one, too" and then he calmly starts to put on his shoes.

"What are you doing?"  first guy wails.  "You can't outrun a bear!"

Second guy says "Don't have to.  Just have to outrun you..."

Garfield One, 2-3-2-3, Garfield One, 2-3-2-3...

by ballhawk on Aug 9, 2007 10:27 AM CDT reply actions  

haha
that's exactly it...genius.  let's outrun them brewers
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs" - Alvin Dark

by holycow07 on Aug 9, 2007 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed on...
not getting Pena. Stewart would be the better option, but is he worth it? Clearly his skills have diminished over the past 2-3 yrs.
You are freaking out man!

by crw89 on Aug 9, 2007 10:29 AM CDT reply actions  

Worth it? Declining?
His salary is $1M this year.

He has his best numbers in 3 years.  No guarantees he doesn't decline in the near future, but you can say that about anyone over 30.  He doesn't have an arm apparently, so in that respect he is JJ like.  He also had plantar fascitis which made him most of 06 and half of 04.  However, he is not being asked to fill a long-term or even short-term-full-time role, so I wuoldnt be too worried about that.

by californiachicagoan on Aug 9, 2007 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Stewart =
yawn...

Again, I'd much rather have the other one...

It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 10:38 AM CDT reply actions  

LOL
We should know about Stewart the ballplayer in a day or so -- there's a 48-hour window in which the A's either pull him back from waivers, make a trade with the Cubs, or say to Hendry, "Here, he's yours".
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

No.
Stewart has a lifetime BA of .299 and OBA of .363, and he's right on those numbers this year. Jones has never come close to that except for hitting .300 a couple of seasons, and even then his OBA was well below .363.

Agreed that Stewart was a better player five years ago. But he's still a decent RH-hitting OF option.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed
He would be an upgrade from the outfield trash the Cubs currently have on the active roster.  

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

Devil's advocate...
Stewart does pretty much what Murton (theoretically) does.  Solid average, solid OBP, not much power, not much speed  (Stewart used to be real fast, but has had a lot of injuries and doesn't run nearly as well as he used to), not much arm strength.

For 3 years now, Stewart has been a sub-.760 OPS guy (sub .720 in 2005 and 2006).  I wouldn't say he's an upgrade over what we have in house.

Many on this board have clearly not been excited about Murton.  I don't see that Stewart adds substantially more than Murton.

by SouthernCub on Aug 9, 2007 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions  

Addendum...
if he could play CF (which he can't) he'd be an upgrade, because Jones and Pie have done nothing at the plate.  But that says more about those guys and their sub .700 OPS and inability to get on base than about him.  Offensively, he hasn't really differentiated himself substantially from Murton or Floyd.

by SouthernCub on Aug 9, 2007 11:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Then there
is no need for him then.
I love this team!!!!!

by sue369 on Aug 9, 2007 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

Stewart
Stewart is hitting .298, has hit .300 most of his career.  Murton is batting .256.  

Stewart has been in a playoff race and won before.  Murton has not.

Stewart won that playoff race with Jaque Jones.  I think getting that pair together would be a good thing.  Murton has never been in a playoff race.

Stewart is signed for one year so if he doesn't work out these next two months he's gone.  He won't hamper Murton's production next year.

by IllinoisCubs on Aug 9, 2007 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

just for accuracy's sake
Murton is hitting .266 on the season

in non-pinch hitting situations he's hitting .277

and in extremely small samples:

post all star break .959 OPS (20 ABs)

in August 1.158 OPS (16 ABs)

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Don't forget this little nugget...
with RISP: .212/.297/.303

Just for accuracy's sake.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

right
of course in 2006 he hit .299/.389/.419 with runners in scoring position in 103 ABs

as opposed to the 35 AB sample you're looking at

but yes he has struggled mightily with RISP this season

of course these things tend to fluctuate wildly from year to year.... which just so happens to be a result of smaller sample sizes

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

And in 2005
he hit .188/.317/.250 with RISP.  For his career he's .277/.374/384.  I would think someone who lectures others about small sample sizes would be interested in those numbers.  Also pretty funny that someone who's been bragging about Murton's 20 amazing AB's over the last month is lecturing others about small sample sizes.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

i noted both those things
1) that RISP numbers VARY WILDLY from year to year

and

2) that Murton's recent success was in a very small sample size

i dont know what more you're looking for....

i've been trying to judge Murton on his entire career and you said before that you wanted to judge him on just this year

now when he starts hitting, you want to judge him on other statistics that have more variability in them like RISP

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

No
I judge him on this year.  His numbers this year suck, especially his numbers with RISP.  And it turns out his career numbers aren't very good either with RISP.  

And making statements like "now when he starts hitting" is total hypocrisy if you're gonna lecture others on small sample sizes.  

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

a .760+ OPS
with RISP sucks?

sucks?

really?

look i dont know what to say with you anymore. When Murton plays he hits at a reasonable clip and his defense is good enough to make him an adequate OF

an adequate OF on this team is valuable since we have maybe... 1 of them right now???

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Huh?
His OPS is .600 this season with RISP.  That sucks.  Sucks.  Really.  Sucks.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

your post said
"And it turns out his career numbers aren't very good either with RISP."

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree
they're not very good, particularly for a corner outfielder.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

You do know he
loves to argue? He has another argument going in another thread too.
I love this team!!!!!

by sue369 on Aug 9, 2007 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

i know
i'm looking forward to the day Murton gets consistent AB's and puts up a solid .800-.840 OPS with solid defense

and he starts complaining about how he's not hitting 30+ HRs

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

And he
will complain too.
I love this team!!!!!

by sue369 on Aug 9, 2007 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

Career vs this year...
Murton's career numbers: .296/.365/.444, which are better than Stewart over the past 3 years (and this year too).  I blame Murton's struggles this year on lack of playing time and small sample size.

And Stewart had OPS of under .720 in 2005 and 2006.  Thus, I don't see Stewart getting any better, while I can see Murton bouncing back to previous performance.  And in any case, past performance can suggest that Stewart is not an upgrade over Murton.

by SouthernCub on Aug 9, 2007 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

I would wish nothing more
than for Murton to bounce back.  I'm glad you see it, but I don't want to bank on something I just feel in my gut.  I don't want to bet on Murton coming back especially in this kind of situation which he has never faced in his career.

by IllinoisCubs on Aug 9, 2007 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd rather gamble on that...
than bank on mediocrity with Stewart.  Especially considering that even in a down year for Murton, he hasn't done that much worse than Stewart (who has outpeformed his 3-year trend so far).

And just because he's never faced the situation doesn't mean he can't perform in it.  You have to face a pennant race at some point, right?  If you wait till next year, you have the same unanswered questions.

by SouthernCub on Aug 9, 2007 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

if by n/t
You mean "not/true", then I agree with you.  If you are basing it on their race, physique, gender, position, age, and the fact you can use one letter twice to represent them, then I agree with you again.  If you are talking about what they actually do on the ball field, I disagree.  SS is cheaper, more experienced, and a better hitter both career and this year.  Heck, this year he has 100 points of OPS on JJ.  Some say he is a better fielder then JJ too, although I have no opinion on that.  JJ has 2 HRs and 2 SBs in 300 ABs.  SS has 9 and 10 in 400.  

SS doesn't strike out (10.97% of his ABs).  In fact, the only people who strike out less than SS on the Cubs now is Theriot (9.6%).  In fact a 1-2 of Theriot-Stewart might be pretty good.

SS also has hit righties well thru his career.

By the way, he has been playing in a pitchers park too, and would be moving to the friendly confines.

by californiachicagoan on Aug 9, 2007 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

The biggest question
is of course is he a significant upgrade to anything we have and that we can get rid of? The getting rid of thing is important, as we will still have Jones, Floyd, Ward, and Murton. I just don't see Stewart as enough of what we need to justify clearing a roster spot for him. We need either power and/or an actual leadoff man (I love Theriot, but I'd prefer him in the 2 hole).

The 100 points of OPS matters little when, much like Jones, he's not technically a centerfielder. Would he be better than getting Pena? Sure. But that's not saying much and neither one upgrades our team that much.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Also
Adding someone who doesn't come across as excited about a division race isn't something I look forward to. We have enough guys who look like they are sleepwalking through games, we don't need another.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Cubs brass
don't have a history of telling the straight truth, and why should they, especially on financial matters? They'd be the only "company" in the world so transparent, eh?

I'm all for transparency, and would love it as a fan, but I don't expect it. Of all things that occur to a major league team, we probably hear about or are let in on maybe 5% of it. Take ARam's wrist, for example, or the fiasco with The Employee over the years, or Wood, or [Name Player Here].

"Mine, mine, says the squirrel to the transformer, unclear on the capacities of electricity." -Dean Young

by Kegler on Aug 9, 2007 10:41 AM CDT reply actions  

Agreed, Higgy.
The last thing we need is an expensive, aging - even if accomplished - rental player that we only have for 2 months or even a single year. I'd rather see us building to be in the running year after year ala Braves and Cards than a Series or Bust approach we've seen so many times before.
"Mine, mine, says the squirrel to the transformer, unclear on the capacities of electricity." -Dean Young

by Kegler on Aug 9, 2007 10:51 AM CDT reply actions  

The only
seriously backloaded deal, IMO, is Sori's. And if he can play well for 4-5 of those 7 years, I think it's well worth it. Signing ARam or Lee to 5 year deals is pretty standard, isn't it? Other than that, who's backloaded in some long-term deal?
"Mine, mine, says the squirrel to the transformer, unclear on the capacities of electricity." -Dean Young

by Kegler on Aug 9, 2007 10:58 AM CDT reply actions  

I think we're gonna have to pull the plug
on Koyie Hill eventually... and bring up Soto for good.

Love Hill's defense... but lord oh mighty. .155. Jeez. Kendall's not hitting either, and he doesn't throw ANYONE out. But, Kendall's not going anywhere for the remainder of the year.

We can dump Hill... and if an injury hits us st Catcher later, Blanco might be ready to join the team.

1-RUN GAMES = 15-18 | EXTRA INNINGS = 1-7 | HOME = 30-28 | updated on 8/7

by SackMan on Aug 9, 2007 11:18 AM CDT reply actions  

Kendall's actually been hitting...
no power (obviously), but a solid OBP and his average as a Cub is up to .255 after a terrible start (1 for 15 to start).  He does have no arm, but I don't think it's entirely fair to say he's not hitting.

by SouthernCub on Aug 9, 2007 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

I thought the knock
on Soto is that he's not even an average defensive catcher.  So, Hill was kept because the backup catcher ought to be able to play defense well so that the regular catcher's day off doesn't turn into a clinic on bunting, basestealing, and passed balls...

But then, I could be remembering entirely wrong too...

"It's a pier 9 brawl!..."

by rrobinson on Aug 9, 2007 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

that's incorrect
according to all baseball america reports Soto is an average to above average defensive catcher

and he's actually not THIS GOOD of a hitter

i've seen the reports suggest a .270 hitter with 10-15 HR's

think Ramon Hernandez type...

which would be quite nice

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hill's defense?
Hill's defense really is not that good.  He has essentially said so himself, having said that he was always considered an offensive catcher (haha) rather than a defensive catcher.

He is, at best, average defensively.  But is far from good.

And you need to be GREAT defensively to justify playing time with his pathetic offensive production.

by big_lowitzki on Aug 9, 2007 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

BTW - Al -
Like the Thread Headline...

Very nice.

It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 11:33 AM CDT reply actions  

Thanks!
n/t
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

Other appropriate Talking Heads' song titles:
  • Road to Nowhere
  • Puzzlin' Evidence
  • Tentative Decisions
  • The Facts of Life
Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

I was thinking...
Psycho Killer!
It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

The way the Cubs have been playing...
..."Stop Making Scents" may have been more appropriate.

by John Q Freejazz on Aug 9, 2007 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

WSCR reporting
A's "asking too much" for Shannon Stewart.

Hugh Hefner could not be reached for comment.

It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 11:48 AM CDT reply actions  

Are you here all week? :)
n/t
Well, sometimes nothin is a real cool hand.

by wicubfan on Aug 9, 2007 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

Hef is busy with his twins...
..and I don't mean the baseball team.
Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

HA!
LOL
It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

He's got three g/fs.
Don't you watch "Girls Next Door"?

by Arbusto on Aug 9, 2007 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

re: He's got three g/fs.
Sorry, I'm a little behind on all the tail Hef is still getting.
Brew Crew: We have arrived. (Er, at least we did for a day or so. Um, just stay right there. Seriously, keep losing. We're almost there. Help!!!)

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Another lineup change
Floyd should not hit 5th.  Right now he is a rally killer.  I would like DeRosa there most days, but Jones/Murton have actually been kind of hot right now, so I would move them down there when we move Kendall up to 2.

Any word on Ward?  Man we miss his bat right now.  

Pagan was so bad this month, maybe he was playing thru injury.

Pitch hitting is a really hard thing to adjust to.  Mostly it is vets that do it well.  I think Pie and Patterson might not have much success in that role.  At the same time, we are in the thick of a playoff race, and now is not the time to be hurting out offensive output by starting these guys while they learn how to hit in the majors.  They should be D and baserunning subs as much as possible until we can get Ward, Pagan, Soriano back.  Of course, we need to actually be winning or at least in games late for them to be used that way, which hasn't happened lately.

So hopefully, we will be seeing a lot more of them soon.

by californiachicagoan on Aug 9, 2007 12:07 PM CDT reply actions  

this weekend
The reports I've seen on Ward is that he is joining the team today and could be activated by this weekend.

by Willgly on Aug 9, 2007 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

re: Another lineup change
"Pagan was so bad this month, maybe he was playing thru injury."

He was. He's on the DL with collitis now.

Brew Crew: We have arrived -- now step aside.

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 12:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Will he help?
Will Shannon Stewart help? He might because he is hitting close to .300... but again I said it yesterday re: David Wells. I think people play well when they are happy to be there and the quotes from Stewart doesn't seem like he wants to come here.

by Willgly on Aug 9, 2007 12:08 PM CDT reply actions  

And...
If it is confirmed that Stewart doesn't want to play in a pennant race, the Cubs should retreat. What kind of player prefers to play for a losing team in August and September?
"These are terrible times, and I shouldn't joke about them." --Warren Zevon

by ExNorthsider on Aug 9, 2007 12:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

WSCR now reporting...
That the Cubs are looking for a 3rd baseman.

Things are not looking good.

by Rogue 52 on Aug 9, 2007 12:13 PM CDT reply actions  

Wow.
No things are not looking good.  But Dero played 3rd last night pretty well.  And I like Fontenot at 2nd.  Keep Cedeno as a backup infielder, and go get one or two decent outfielders.

OR:  get Braun from the Brew Crew to play 3rd base.  Theriot is good at backing up plays :-)

by zevkalman on Aug 9, 2007 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fontenot?
Fontenot has been pretty terrible at the plate since the beginning of July.

.213/.290/.236

He is not a guy that I want replacing A-Ram if A-Ram is down for significant time.

by big_lowitzki on Aug 9, 2007 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

I wonder if...
Are they looking at Pedro Feliz on SF? He's not very good, but he has power.

If ARam is hurt, Soriano is hurt and Lee can't hit for power, they better hope for some killer defense and starting pitching.

"These are terrible times, and I shouldn't joke about them." --Warren Zevon

by ExNorthsider on Aug 9, 2007 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

No, no, no
That guy is an out machine!!!

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

yes
I tend to agree, but he seems like the type of player Hendry goes for.
"These are terrible times, and I shouldn't joke about them." --Warren Zevon

by ExNorthsider on Aug 9, 2007 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

If that's true
and Ramirez is seriously hurt I would think the season is probably over.  I'm reluctant to say such a thing, but I don't see how the Cubs could get by in the long term without Ramirez's presence in the lineup.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

A-ROD!!!
Stats, stats, stats - enough with the stats already!!!

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2007 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Awww yeah!! Pull the trigger, Jimbo!
Brew Crew: We have arrived. (Er, at least we did for a day or so. Um, just stay right there. Seriously, keep losing. We're almost there. Help!!!)

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

Let DeRosa play 3rd....
Then you got Theriot, Fontenot, and Cedeno for the middle infield.

Keep trying some young guys in LF, until one starts to hit: Murton, Patterson, Fox.  

1-RUN GAMES = 15-18 | EXTRA INNINGS = 1-7 | HOME = 30-28 | updated on 8/7

by SackMan on Aug 9, 2007 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

re: Let DeRosa play 3rd....
I agree. DeRosa is the only viable option for third base while Ramirez is out.
Brew Crew: We have arrived. (Er, at least we did for a day or so. Um, just stay right there. Seriously, keep losing. We're almost there. Help!!!)

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

The fly in the ointment there is Cedeno
Stats, stats, stats - enough with the stats already!!!

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2007 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Cedeno is a pile
of crap.  Never will be an everyday MLB SS.

by Itchy on Aug 9, 2007 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

shhhh....
its already happening....

Murton's last month:

7-20 with a .950 OPS

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sadly.... Murton is ACTUALLY a better LF
Than either Patterson or Fox. I thought I'd have to search for weeks to find a worse defensive OF than Murton.
1-RUN GAMES = 15-18 | EXTRA INNINGS = 1-7 | HOME = 30-28 | updated on 8/7

by SackMan on Aug 9, 2007 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Stats LIE
Stats don't tell you how many friggin balls he's dropped out of his glove... or how friggin long it takes him to chase down a ball in the corner... or how many times he loops it to the cutoff man... or how many times he sits down on 3rd base instead of scoring.
1-RUN GAMES = 15-18 | EXTRA INNINGS = 1-7 | HOME = 30-28 | updated on 8/7

by SackMan on Aug 9, 2007 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yep
Defensive metrics like that need to be taken with a very large grain of salt.

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

not having stats
lets take this one by one:

"Stats don't tell you how many friggin balls he's dropped out of his glove"

1. this stat is called an error, it is referred to in the box score with the letter E

"or how friggin long it takes him to chase down a ball in the corner"

2. the link above shows a stat that measures the range in which a player is able to successfully cover in the OF

"or how many times he loops it to the cutoff man"

3. Well outfield assists divided by opportunities i suppose would give you an idea of this

"or how many times he sits down on 3rd base instead of scoring"

4. base running metrics are also available

as for how many times he actually just sits down on the base, you're right we might not be able to find that

and i thought we were talking about defense, not base-running?

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 4:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

You've
got this game all figured out.  The stats tell you everything!  Why even bother to watch any games!  Just keep doing things like dividing outfield assists by opportunities and you're all set!

by cubsbak on Aug 9, 2007 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

I've been listening to 670 AM and
it sounds like pure speculation to me. I think they are just trying to get the phone lines going. Rami is in Chicago getting his wrist looked at, so obviously there is something wrong, but that doesn't  necessarily mean he'll be out for awhile. I hope it's just something minor and he's back in a week or two.
There are 3 things in my life which I really love: God, family, and baseball. The only problem - once baseball season starts, I change the order around a bit.

by cubsfan4life on Aug 9, 2007 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Besides our hitting has anyone noticed that...
Dempster has an 11.25 ERA in four appearances in August. Is that normal for a closer :-)

by zevkalman on Aug 9, 2007 12:16 PM CDT reply actions  

When Piniella
used Dempster to finish a blowout the other night I believe he was saying goodbye to him as a closer. I'd bet we see Howry close and Marmol still in the needed shutdown inning be it the 6th or 8th.
Josh Kroeger. Remember the name. Stay tuned for the fame.

by tharr on Aug 9, 2007 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

Actually, I wondered about that too
And now that you noticed it, maybe that is what will happen.  Thanks for your comment....

You gotta think that Lou knows what he's doing.

by zevkalman on Aug 9, 2007 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

OT - how you insert a hyperlink into text?
Stats, stats, stats - enough with the stats already!!!

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2007 12:52 PM CDT reply actions  

re: OT - how you insert a hyperlink into text?
Go here. Read.
Brew Crew: We have arrived. (Er, at least we did for a day or so. Um, just stay right there. Seriously, keep losing. We're almost there. Help!!!)

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Thanks - never knew that was there
Stats, stats, stats - enough with the stats already!!!

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2007 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

So, what is Aramis' status??
Is he done?  Will he be in Colo tonight?  Without Sori and him we will finish at least 3rd.

by Itchy on Aug 9, 2007 12:53 PM CDT reply actions  

a great Talking Heads album, Al
I love it.
"You're fired." - Dallas Green to Billy Connors while Billy was staying in the hospital.

by jdoolsiu on Aug 9, 2007 12:55 PM CDT reply actions  

Aubrey Huff?
It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 1:09 PM CDT reply actions  

Aubrey Huff what?
Did you hear something and are teasing us with it? :-)

by zevkalman on Aug 9, 2007 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Too bad...
... the Cubs didn't sign Russell Branyan to a minor league deal when he was available.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

And the Phillies....
Just bought him from the Indians.

by IllinoisCubs on Aug 9, 2007 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

I am starting to Panic.
If Ramirez misses more than this series the Cubs are going to have a tough time staying in this race. The Brewers are not good, but without Ramirez or Soriano they are miles ahead of the Cubs.
"Harlem Furniture......You'll like our style!"

by Imtrejo on Aug 9, 2007 1:24 PM CDT reply actions  

Pitching versus hitting
The Brewers rotation is terrible

Capuano hasn't recorded a win since May, the team hasn't won a game he's started in the same amount of time.

Suppan pitched deep into October (something to worry about with Marquis for sure), and has been terrible as of late.

Gallardo, the one bright spot, was blown out yesterday.  He will probably get back on track, but he isn't bullet proof.

Claudio Vargas has been equally horrid and they might move him to the bullpen to have Parra, who has about 30 IP under his belt, to pitch in the rotation.

Dave Bush has shown talent, but he is sporting a 5.03 ERA and usually only lasts until the 6th inning.  

Sheets is suppose to be out until at least mid-September now.

The Cubs have problems too, but when your pitching options are 3 medicore at best veteran pitchers, 1 crappy veteran pitcher and 2 decent to good rookie pitchers are your potential pitchers, it won't be impossible to catch that even if Ramirez goes on the DL and we don't get Soriano back till mid-September ourselves.  I worry about Marquis' arm, but if Zambrano, Lilly, Marquis, Hill, and Marshall are light years ahead of what Milwaukee is throwing out there every day.

by IllinoisCubs on Aug 9, 2007 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

If you made a team...
with the Cubs starting pitching and the Brewers hitting, you'd win 100 games.

with the Cubs hitting and the Brewers starting pitching, well, you'd have the Tampa Bay Devil Rays.

by eamuscatuli1881 on Aug 9, 2007 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Wh-wh-wh-WHAT?!?
Kendall in the 2 hole? Santo's got a better chance of getting on base.
Stats, stats, stats - enough with the stats already!!!

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2007 1:29 PM CDT reply actions  

Right.
Because Kendall's .375 lifetime OBA doesn't mean a thing.

</sarcasm>

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Aubrey Huff
Is always available it seems.
It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 1:29 PM CDT reply actions  

Well..
... if the rumor below that Ramirez is "out for the year" -- and I think that's a bit overblown at this time, don't you? -- Huff might not be a bad acquisition.

He's on the Orioles. They're always willing to take out our trash.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2007 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Russell B.? Blech...
Branyan has a career average of .229 with 118 home runs and 293 RBI in 688

DeRo is way better than this.

It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 1:33 PM CDT reply actions  

Hey Al - Stoney confirms your suggestion
Al - Steve Stone just now stated how KEndall would be an excellent #2.

Can take the BB, hits deep in the count, understands the game.

It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 1:39 PM CDT reply actions  

I wish he'd start doing those things, then
Stats, stats, stats - enough with the stats already!!!

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2007 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Lineup
So with Ramirez out for maybe the weekend we've got:

SS Theriot
C Kendall
1B Lee
3B DeRosa
LF Murton
CF Jones
RF Floyd
2B Patterson/Fontenot
SP Lilly/Marquis/Hill/Marshall

Let's hope the Rockies scored all of their runs yesterday...  It was enough for a four game series after all.

by IllinoisCubs on Aug 9, 2007 1:42 PM CDT reply actions  

Scratch Cliff
and replace him with Pie, shifting Jones to right and I guess I could live with it.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Good idea
Didn't think about that because Pie is just up.  Do you still bat Pie in the same order?

by IllinoisCubs on Aug 9, 2007 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Probably not
You'd want to split up the lefties so there weren't 3 in a row. Maybe move Jones up. I'm not exactly inspired by the lineup any way it shakes down, but you have to do what you have to do I guess.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why
 
would EPat platoon with Fontenot?  They're both lefties.  I didn't think he could play the infield anymore, anyways.

EPat will platoon with Murton.

by salparadise23 on Aug 9, 2007 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

That could be
But they actually just moved Patterson to LF in Triple AAA because they had a cluster** in the MI with Theriot, Fontenot, DeRosa, and Cedeno.  Patterson's best position is 2B rather than LF.  For rightie/leftie purposes it would make sense to platoon him in LF, but for best defensive purposes it would be best to put him at 2B.

by IllinoisCubs on Aug 9, 2007 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

e-pat in the outfield
Sorry, I watched him in the fall league and spring training. E-Pat can't play second base, too many errors. I think that's why they moved him to the outfield , kinda like the LF on the DL now.
"We tried to set up a double play, and the shortstop doesn't play in the bullpen." Lou Piniella, July 4, 2007, discussing Young's GS

by gp1966 on Aug 9, 2007 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

They moved E-Pat to LF, cause
he's an error machine at 2B... much like Cedeno's an error machine at SS
1-RUN GAMES = 15-18 | EXTRA INNINGS = 1-7 | HOME = 30-28 | updated on 8/7

by SackMan on Aug 9, 2007 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Pie had better..
be in CF all weekend. I don't think I can watch those rangeless wonders in Colorado without breaking at least two remotes.
"Whoever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" - Frank Chance

by STLCubFan on Aug 9, 2007 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Exactly
Watching Murton out there will be tough enough, but we don't need to compound the problem with Floyd. As much crap as I give Jones he really does get a great break on the ball. He still needs to be in right field though, not center.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

Again
He's not a good one. Not that we have one on the roster or have a better option really. I'm not going to get in a Murton fight again. They are pointless.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Define "not good"
By all of the metrics that measure defensive performance, last year Murton was in the top 1/3rd among NL LF in defense.   If by "not good" you mean he's not the top LF in the NL you are right.  But if you use the words the way that normal people use them....

by frustratedfan on Aug 9, 2007 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Murton is not an everyday MLB LF!
PERIOD!  Not for any team in the majors.  I'd take Pee Hands Alou over him right now!!  Geezus, drop the Murton love, please!

by Itchy on Aug 9, 2007 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Thank You!
I couldn't have said it any better.
"Whoever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" - Frank Chance

by STLCubFan on Aug 9, 2007 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Period!
Do you have any "facts" to support your emphatic statement?  

Here are a few facts:

In 2006 Murton was 4th among NL LF in Range Factor,
He was second in Zone Rating.
He was 4th in Fielding Percentage.
He was tied for second (even with fewer innings than many of the others) in Double Plays caused by the Left Fielder.

I understand that Murton must have kicked your dog or something, but this near pathological hatred that a super minority of vocal Cub fans have for Murton is perverse.  (Or maybe you get some kind of gratification out of starting arguments and being a jerk -- sort of like the loser in school who is always pulling the fire alarm -- and then everyone is shocked when he takes a gun to school and kills his teacher...)

by frustratedfan on Aug 9, 2007 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

wow, that's kind of a stretch isn't it?
being critical of Murton - who should not be completely immune from criticism, no one on the team right now is - and someone who would shoot their teacher?

by lji001 on Aug 9, 2007 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd use the B-team today
What are your thoughts on us using the B-Team today?  AKA Cedeno,Patterson, Pie, Font, etc.

Lilly can hold his own on the mound and our opposing pitcher doesn't seem like too much of a threat.

We give everyone who doesn't get a day off, a rest and then play them Friday-Sunday.  

Having 20 straight days of games is killing us and we can't expect to play the best we can without a day off.

by ak123 on Aug 9, 2007 2:02 PM CDT reply actions  

I hope
You don't consider Floyd still part of the "A" team.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

of course
who else can play B. A. Barakas!?
You may run like mays but you hit like $#!%

by cubsirishkillme on Aug 9, 2007 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Slap a Mohawk on him
and he sort of looks like a slimmer, and taller, Mr.T.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Watch what you say:
"our opposing pitcher doesn't seem like too much of a threat"

Neither does Woody Williams

Stats, stats, stats - enough with the stats already!!!

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2007 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Man, with that kinda jinx,
we should all tune in tonight to see history, a Rockies no-no, eh?
"Mine, mine, says the squirrel to the transformer, unclear on the capacities of electricity." -Dean Young

by Kegler on Aug 9, 2007 2:21 PM CDT reply actions  

Ney
A perfect game with 27 strikeouts, every one of which was on 3 pitches.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

You heard it here first
I know someone who's got "ins" on the Cubs and the rumor is that Ramirez is out for the year. Ligament issues with his wrist. I hope to god it isn't true, but I guess we'll see. I wouldn't post this if I didn't trust the person I heard it from.

by SouthsideCub on Aug 9, 2007 2:23 PM CDT reply actions  

Uh Oh
That just made the Baby Jesus cry.

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, the Bears play on Saturday
...and we do have some pitching.  So now we only need to play small ball and put fast people on the bases....

I wonder how Rex will do against the Texans? :-)

by zevkalman on Aug 9, 2007 2:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's actually
lies that make him cry. Todd said so.

by SouthsideCub on Aug 9, 2007 2:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

lies and blasphemy!
/I hope

If it is, then there's hendry's skape goats...nevermind the fat that we have resorted to the likes of cedeno, pagan, Fontenot, etc. etc. etc.

not saying these guiys haven't don esome good (well except cedeno)  but going into the year these were esentially our options

You may run like mays but you hit like $#!%

by cubsirishkillme on Aug 9, 2007 2:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hey SouthsideCub...
...you may want to have words with your friend who has "ins" on the Cubs, because everything I'm hearing on the radio right now indicates that he or she is full of crap.
Brew Crew: We have arrived. (Er, at least we did for a day or so. Um, just stay right there. Seriously, keep losing. We're almost there. Help!!!)

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

SS doesnt want to come?
According to who?  Are you sure you arent talking about Torii Hunter?

And to whoever said they prefer Theriot in the 2 hole.  Why?!?!  He does everything you want a leadoff guy to do.  He takes pitches, gets on, steals bags, goes 1st to 3rd etc.  I mean if you have Jose Reyes on your team, then Ryan is a fine #2, but he is a good leadoff guy.

My idea of a #2 puts the ball in play, doesnt strike out, moves the runner, sacrifices in close games, needs the protection of a big #3 behind him.  That ain't the best use for Ryan to me.

I hate to beat on this drum, because I have been a fan/hater of SS, but that sounds like SS to me.  Actually, Kendall of the past few years (and since the ASB) fits that too.

by californiachicagoan on Aug 9, 2007 2:26 PM CDT reply actions  

I see your point
It's not that I see Theriot as a bad leadoff hitter. Hell, I think he's really good in that spot. He's exactly the kind of player we need. But we need another one of him in the two spot if he's not going to be there. Maybe Kendall will work out there. That, of course, would be very nice.

The SS not being thrilled to come here thing had to do with an article printed where he pretty much shrugged his shoulders about coming here. Of course, we have to take it with a grain of salt, as you can't simply sell out your current team and say "I'd love to go there."

by hawkeyenation on Aug 9, 2007 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh my god
Lilly has five times more losses than Jiminez. I mean, this guy has lost only ONE GAME the entire year. We'll be lucky to get a baserunner at all, let alone get one in scoring position. Oh god, this is going to be a loooooong night (actually, it will be short because Jiminez is going to throw a 2-hit CG shutout).

by park on Aug 9, 2007 2:27 PM CDT reply actions  

The first hit
will be a first pitch triple off the bat of Ryan Theriot, that ricochets of Jimenez's gold-plated junk and carries in to the right field corner.  He will, of course, recover and strike out the next three on nine straight pitches.

by eamuscatuli1881 on Aug 9, 2007 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

3B
I am sad even thinking about this, but who plays 3rd for temas not in contention?

Cabrera?  Yeah right.
Garrett Atkins?  Never pass thru waivers, and then we would have to trade the farm for him.
Melvin Mora?  No trade clause, loves Baltimore, old with 2 more years on contract.
Troy Glaus?  Pretty much just a DH at this point, right?
Ty Wigginton - UGH!  Hindsight is 20/02, but he woulda been the guy.
Ryan Zimmerman - Too young/cheap to get thru waivers.

Looking at guys who havent played a lot of 3rd this year.

Jeff Keppinger? - Who?  CIN.  Young/cheap, no waivy.
Hank Blalock - Nice option here, but hasnt come off the 60 day DL for his illness yet.
Iwamura - Cheap, no waivey, not a slugger either.

Not looking too pretty.  I think you gotta just play DeRosa.

by californiachicagoan on Aug 9, 2007 2:45 PM CDT reply actions  

ARod!
j/k
"Mine, mine, says the squirrel to the transformer, unclear on the capacities of electricity." -Dean Young

by Kegler on Aug 9, 2007 2:48 PM CDT reply actions  

FYI - Tyler Colvin
Has anyone else realized that he's already moved up to AA Tennessee?
1-RUN GAMES = 15-18 | EXTRA INNINGS = 1-7 | HOME = 30-28 | updated on 8/7

by SackMan on Aug 9, 2007 2:48 PM CDT reply actions  

He is slumping...
and apparently, he can only hit fastballs now, from what I have read.

Not super encouraging.

It is AUGUST, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Aug 9, 2007 3:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

very often
prospects struggle their first half season at a new level, so its not terribly discouraging

the more concerning feature is he's never posted a particularly good EYE (K or BB Rates) at the lower levels

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 3:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Curious
What's it saw when half of our starting lineup right now could be comprised of Iowa Cubs? Fontenot, Cedeno, Pie, EPat. Even TheRiot isn't exactly a veteran.

Add Soto and Gallagher (with Murton in RF, which isn't great but bear with me) and you basically are running the AAA squad out there against major league teams. It might be a long month at this rate. Ramirez and Soriano better come back, with a vengeance.

"Mine, mine, says the squirrel to the transformer, unclear on the capacities of electricity." -Dean Young

by Kegler on Aug 9, 2007 2:53 PM CDT reply actions  

saw=say
Ugh.
"Mine, mine, says the squirrel to the transformer, unclear on the capacities of electricity." -Dean Young

by Kegler on Aug 9, 2007 2:54 PM CDT reply actions  

you know
who id like the cubs to go after in the offseason. Brandon Phillips, I mean considering that Dunn will most likely be gone, and griffey on the way out, they are probably going into rebuilding again.  I know we have fontenot but I just dont see him being a good as or better then phillips.  I figure the reds would listen to offers, right?

by Kchance on Aug 9, 2007 2:54 PM CDT reply actions  

phillips
27 years old, making the minimum, under control for another 3-4 years

top 10 in all of baseball at his position

if you were the Reds would you give him up?

by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 9, 2007 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

i didnt know
he was making the minimum, but wouldnt he do your franchise better bringing in prospects to be ready with all your other prospects. Im just saying its worth making the call to the reds

by Kchance on Aug 9, 2007 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Like I said
They would want a King's ransom and probably wouldn't even us out.  They might as well keep him for the next 3 years and if things still aren't going very well in 2010 trade him for prospects then.

by IllinoisCubs on Aug 9, 2007 4:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

I would love to go after Brandon Phillips
But he's either off the table or the Reds would want too much for him.  He's relatively cheap and they have him under control until 2010.  Right now all of the teams in the Central are a player or two away from competing in this league.  The Cubs and Brewers have shown that if you have three offensive studs and decent pitching staffs, you can take the division.  The Reds have Dunn, Phillips, and prospects Joey Votto 1B, Jay Bruce OF, Edwin Encarncion 3B, and Harang, Arroyo in the SP with a couple of pitching prospects like Homer Bailey coming up the ranks.  It doesn't take much to reboost in the Central.

by IllinoisCubs on Aug 9, 2007 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Does anyone else fear the inevitable?
The inevitable being the return of his Samminess???
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 9, 2007 3:38 PM CDT reply actions  

It's like a fairy tale
Slammin' Sammy comes back to help his beloved city get into the World Series for the first time in a century.  He gets a standing ovation in Wrigley Field when he dons his Cub uniform again.  Fueled by his presence, the Cubs begin to hit and the fans go crazy.  Chicago wins the world series on a Sosa walk-off HR.

And then I wake up and realize it's one of my idiotic fantasies again.

by zevkalman on Aug 9, 2007 3:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

A week ago
I would have said yer crazy, but now...

I think this team is pretty burnt right now. The combination of August, emotional letdown of finally catching the Brewers for a couple days, and 20 games in a row will do that to you.

Tinker to Evers to Chance.

by Matt Allison on Aug 9, 2007 3:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

At least include Shannon Stewart
In your fantasy... you know, the Shannon with boobs.
1-RUN GAMES = 15-18 | EXTRA INNINGS = 1-7 | HOME = 30-28 | updated on 8/7

by SackMan on Aug 9, 2007 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

After years of steroid use
I think Sammy has boobs too! :-)

But you're right, the Shannon with the natural boobs is definitely a wonderful fantasy!!!!!!

by zevkalman on Aug 9, 2007 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

re: Does anyone else fear the inevitable?
I don't fear it because it's not gonna happen. Sosa's clearly not an upgrade over anyone the Cubs have out there right now, and it's not like if the team suddenly crashed and burned this season the Cubs don't have enough players to fill up the outfield.
Brew Crew: We have arrived. (Er, at least we did for a day or so. Um, just stay right there. Seriously, keep losing. We're almost there. Help!!!)

by daver on Aug 9, 2007 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

And just where
Do you think he'd play. I mean, after one day of Sammy in Right and you'd be beggin' for Floyd or Jones. Yes, he's THAT bad.
"Whoever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" - Frank Chance

by STLCubFan on Aug 9, 2007 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

the folks
that are concerned about a power outage would like it. He has as many HRs as ARam in fewer ABs.

And honestly, no, I don't think he'd be worse than Jones or Floyd in right.

Tinker to Evers to Chance.

by Matt Allison on Aug 9, 2007 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Possible poll?
How about this poll: Who would be the best fit in RF right now for the Cubs? a) Sammy Sosa, b) Jacque Jones, c) Cliff Floyd.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 9, 2007 5:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to Bleed Cubbie Blue, the Chicago Cubs blog for the SB Nation, created on February 9, 2005 by Al Yellon

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Small
Jazz Up Your Recs!
Img_0001_small
Value of Various Plate Approaches
284_small
Cubs' Fantasy Camp 2012 as seen by a Player's Wife
P7200073_small
Randy Hundley Fantasy Camp 2012

Recent FanPosts

Small
Arguably OT: Aussie Baseball Finals Go To Decisive Game Three
Small
New Cubs draft strategy player development
Jeffnewwork_small
What I Expect From The Cubs In 2012
Wrigley_scoreboard_small
What To Do With Alfonso Soriano
Small
A quick update from the 2012 concessions orientation
Caray_small
Is there any FA left worth going after?
Marvin_the_martian_small
Thoughts On Gerardo Concepcion: Trust The Scouts
Star_small
What if Hendry were still our GM instead of TheoJed?

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

FanShots

Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.

Recommended FanShots

Nice article about Ernie Banks
Yankees Hire Jim Hendry
Dale Sveum Meets Early Arrivals At Camp Buss

Recent FanShots

The Rickettsification of Wrigleyville has begun!
Marlins' Cespedes Offer 6 years, under $40M (MLBTR Link)
BCB Fantasy Baseball 2012
Former Cubs Blogger Interviewed on The Score
Cubs vs. Rangers In Las Vegas Tickets On Sale Monday 2/13
Hoyer driving to Spring Training with his dog
Hoyer-Soriano likely a Cub to start 2012, Garza extension talk a possibility
Law's Top 100 prospects
Ranking the Farm Systems
WGN Releases Season Schedule

+ New FanShot All FanShots >

Featured Poll

Poll
How many games will the Cubs win in 2012?

  309 votes | Results

It Is Only...

It Is Only...

Cubs By The Numbers

Cubs By The Numbers is a history of the ballclub by uniform number, but the biographies help trace the history of our beloved team in a new way. For everyone who's a Cubs fan, anyone who ever wore the uniform is like family. Cubs By The Numbers reintroduces readers to some of their long-lost ancestors, even ones they think they already know.

Click here to order your copy, available now!

Recent Stories in Ticket Exchanges


Managing Editor

Alyellontoppscard_small Al Yellon

Front Page Contributors

Primary_fc_small Josh Timmers

Marvin_the_martian_small Shawn Domagal-Goldman

Other Contributors

Dsc_0139_small David Sameshima

Toonmike_small Mike Bojanowski