A Travel Day

by Al on Sep 10, 2007 10:04 PM CDT in Recaps Comment 208 comments

NEW YORK -- Well, that's what today was supposed to be for the Cubs. Instead, they came home to Wrigley Field and made up last month's rainout against the Cardinals, and brought their hitting shoes along, blowing St. Louis out 12-3.

I'm about to head out to my meeting; when I get back later this evening I'll post more thoughts on today's big win, and a few notes on my interesting travel day.

Enjoy the evening, and GO PIRATES! Later.

UPDATE [2007-9-10 21:56:39 by Al]: Happy to return from my meeting to discover that the Cubs are back in a first place tie! The Pirates beat the Brewers 9-0 tonight.

So maybe all those comments about "oh, we shouldn't have lost to a crappy team like the Pirates" weren't so valid, right? The Pirates aren't all that bad, are they. Let's hope they win two more in a row from the Brewers.

When I got to O'Hare at 12:20, my 2 pm flight was delayed -- so I thought I'd get on the 1 pm flight. Nope, also delayed. But there was still a seat on the eleven am flight -- still sitting there almost two hours later.

By the time it got in the air at 1:40 it was almost three hours late, picked up some time in the air and I wound up landing 45 minutes earlier than I was originally scheduled.

At 4:45 pm, I figured I'd get stuck in some horrendous NYC traffic jam. Nope on that one too -- I was at my hotel in midtown in thirty minutes. So this travel day was rather uneventful for me, as much as it was eventful for the Cubs. If Aramis Ramirez can hit like this for the rest of the month, you know he can carry a team -- I've seen him get this hot for a period of time where you think he's simply going to pound the ball every time up (for example, this month-long hot streak in May and June 2005). He hasn't had one of those times this year -- yet. This'd be a real, REAL nice time to start one.

Ted Lilly threw a nice game and in so doing, became the second Cub lefthander (after Greg Hibbard, 1993) to win fifteen games in the last thirty-seven years (since Kenny Holtzman did it in 1970), and Derrek Lee also homered. The Cubs hit five doubles, including one by Lilly, among their seventeen hits.

The internet connection in the hotel here is a bit balky so I'm going to stop this post here. It's a race, everyone, with all the attendant ups and downs. Enjoy it -- and keep the faith that it will have a happy ending.

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Welcome to the east coast !!!

GO CUBS GO !!!

by parrotinct on Sep 10, 2007 5:38 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Simply amazing

how this team can look terrible one day and unbeatable the next. Let's hope the unbeatable one shows up the rest of the season. Go Cubs!!

"Dad gum right this games gonna be played under protest. . . I guarantee this is gonna be one protest that's upheld." --Hawk Harrelson, 6/24/07

by RynoHoF on Sep 10, 2007 5:48 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

YES!!!!!!!!!

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Sep 10, 2007 6:21 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Interesting direction of both teams

Cardinals are now stuck in a late season losing streak (4) and now traveling to Cincinatti who can smack the ball as well as them.

Cubs are 15-15 since Aug 8th when Oswalt beat them for the sweep in Houston. Cards are 19-19 since July 31st when they just won their 4th straight before losing 3 in a row and Milwaukee is 11-11 since August 15th when lost their 2nd in a row to St. Louis.

Go Pittsburgh and Cincinatti!

Milw-09-23-98--Brown in for defense--bases loaded--flyball--HE DROPPED THE BALL!!!NO NO NO, cubs lose 8-7

by Ivy Walls on Sep 10, 2007 6:24 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Lilly was a phenomenal signing

I thought he would be good, but not this great!

and Marquis hasn't been horrible..

Now that he is back, play Matt Murton!!

by Chanman25 on Sep 10, 2007 6:27 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

They were better than any other

available starting pitchers available thru FA.

by LT on Sep 10, 2007 6:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

remember when people were raving over

trying to get Gil Meche?? He doesn't look to great now...

Now that he is back, play Matt Murton!!

by Chanman25 on Sep 10, 2007 6:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Lilly is...

the true stopper(Sorry Z), 9-1 this year after a loss...Go Pirates!!!!

You ARE freaking out MAN!

by crw89 on Sep 10, 2007 6:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Can we maintain it ?

I really hope so !!! We've been waiting for this type of hitting all year, let's hope it has finally arrived !!!!

Good win. Lily is fantastic. Let's get a groove on !!!

by coral on Sep 10, 2007 6:32 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

As I said Saturday...

The Cubs have a 100% performance correlation to which Zambrano is showing up.

April-May: Z sucks = Cubs flounder

June - July: Good Z = Hot Cubs

Aug - Early Sep: Funk Z = Cubs Funk

I will contend that we will be the June/July Cubs if Z can stay under control. I don't understand how a guy that plays every 5 days can be THE diferrence, but those are the facts.

GO CUBS and GO ZAMBRANO. We are in your hands!!

Prince Fielder...he is neither.

by LAcarl519 on Sep 10, 2007 6:32 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Great win

Just a comment on the mentality of some that won't be happy if the Cubs make the post-season, because they don't think they deserve it, or because they haven't been dominating this year. The Cubs of 69 or 84 probably deserved a WS but didn't get it. The Cards of 04 and 05, and Detroit last year didn't get it. The point is, if you make the playoffs you deserve to be there, and if you can beat all those great teams for the ring, you deserve it. Trying to plan for a perfect Cubs season is an impossibility. You can't plan a great moment like this as you plan other great moments in life, like a wedding or something. You just have to sit back and enjoy the ride.

Tinker to Evers to Chance.

by Matt Allison on Sep 10, 2007 6:38 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

You said it right!!

Everything GREAT in my life has happened at the wrong time or when I didn't plan on it. That's how the best things happen. So many things I expected to happen, didn't.

Look at how the Red Sox finally won the WS after being down 3-0 to the dreaded Stankees in the ALCS. No team in baseball ever came back from being down 3-0. Don't you think it made it that much sweeter?

That is why I laugh at all the BCB posters who say they are mailing it in for the year or calling it quits. Life never works the way you think it should.

Just shut up and enjoy the ride!

GO CUBS!!

Prince Fielder...he is neither.

by LAcarl519 on Sep 10, 2007 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You really

couldn't say it any better.
Never know with this team.
Don't get me wrong I want this team to win it all, however what a joy it is looking forward to a Cubs game in September/October.

by Johnny Callison was a Cub on Sep 10, 2007 7:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Couldn't agree more.

Shawn Johnson, Des Moines, IA, worlds greatest gymnast. 2007 All Around World Champ. GO SHAWN!!!!

by sue369 on Sep 10, 2007 7:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Let me fourth or fifth that sentiment!

n/t

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Sep 10, 2007 10:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

And having just read this part of the thread...

... I will heartily agree.

If the Cubs do win it all this year, not one of the players, and not one of us, would ever think of giving it back, or not enjoying it to the fullest.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 10, 2007 10:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

As the person who started this thread

let me make clear that, if we win the Series this year, I'll be elated. However, there will still be tinges of disappointment, because this simply is not a dominating team. As a Cubs fan, I don't just hope for titles. I want the team to be REALLY GOOD, so that I can enjoy watching our guys play great baseball throughout the season and take pride in the fact that we're better than the competition. Aside from that one great month, I haven't felt that this year. So, by all means, let's win the Series, but let's also not be satisfied until we have a team that obviously deserves it.

Did we really put Jose Macias on the field? Really???

by ksreed on Sep 11, 2007 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

WOW!

hi, mr. idealism, my name is mr. realism.

i couldn't care less if the cubs win the division under .500 and then go 7 games in every series with the lowest run differential in the history of the playoffs...so long as they win the world series!

any team who wins the world series deserves it!

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, that's one view.

Did we really put Jose Macias on the field? Really???

by ksreed on Sep 11, 2007 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Pastor of Muppets

...my fave Mattallison album.

by DonGerard on Sep 11, 2007 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

wassup Donnie?

U surviving down there in Cardinal country? ;)

Tinker to Evers to Chance.

by Matt Allison on Sep 11, 2007 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Great win

after a tough weekend in Pitt.
Hope the hitting continues in Houston.
I agree with Lilly, what a great signing. I was ho-hum about the deal.
Probably only Lilly, his agent and Hendry thought the deal was a good one.
Lets finish strong!

by Johnny Callison was a Cub on Sep 10, 2007 7:05 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

and let's hope DeRo is ok

hope the reports of that hbp giving him pains turn out to be only temporary

by PrincetonCubs on Sep 10, 2007 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Everybody Needs to Take a Rest!

This is the Cubs we're dealing with here. You know they are the best that ever was at breaking you heart. This year, they look like they may be heading to the playoffs and then they slide back into their stereotypical ways.

Reading the game threads one would think the suicide rate in the Chicago area spikes when the Cubs are struggling. Crimes of passion probably peak along the same lines.

No one, not even Al, loves the Cubs as much as I do (what I mean to say is that many of us share equally in our emotional attachment to this team) and we know that even if the Cubs go on an extended winning streak they are going to stumble too. We need to be ready for it when it happens and we need to be able to bounce back just like the team.

I really think we're going to be in the playoffs this year and we may even advance. Who knows, we may even make it to the series but you know what? We're going to lose more games and we're going to look pretty godawful doing it too. Gotta keep the faith baby!

And so it goes.

by Luigi on Sep 10, 2007 7:22 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Pirates up 2-0!

Top of the 6th now.

Tinker to Evers to Chance.

by Matt Allison on Sep 10, 2007 7:23 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Nyjer Morgan...

Is good (hit a double before Mclouth's tie-breakign two run homer!)
Oh and hey, Matt Allsion, do you record music by any chance?

by UptownFreeRadio on Sep 10, 2007 7:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

yes indeedy.

Tinker to Evers to Chance.

by Matt Allison on Sep 10, 2007 7:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Cool.

I'm a huge fan of essentially everythign you've done. If you're as obsessed as I am right now, have fun watchign the Pirates hopefully score on this latest threat.

by UptownFreeRadio on Sep 10, 2007 7:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks much.

Pirates up 4-0!

Tinker to Evers to Chance.

by Matt Allison on Sep 10, 2007 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Holy Cow!

This board draws some people.

phat

by phatass on Sep 10, 2007 10:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

4-0!

Pirates

Now that he is back, play Matt Murton!!

by Chanman25 on Sep 10, 2007 7:38 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Make that 4-0

Prince is no D-Lee at 1B......

by talkingcubs on Sep 10, 2007 7:38 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

from oh boy to joy!

Thank You Rickie Weeks.

by CubFaninNY on Sep 10, 2007 7:39 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

WOO!

4-0 on Weeks throwing error

One of Us!One Of Us!

by HerrProf on Sep 10, 2007 7:39 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

what happened

On that 2-run play?
Sounds kind of funky on gamecast.

by UptownFreeRadio on Sep 10, 2007 7:39 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Non fielder

weeks threw the ball into the dirt and Fielder just swatted at it and missed!

by thepenguin on Sep 10, 2007 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Weeks had all sorts of time

to throw him out, but Fielder should have made that pick @ 1st IMHO...

by talkingcubs on Sep 10, 2007 7:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

excellent

It definitely doesn't have to be a pretty Pirates win...in fact Milwuakee losing ugly would be just wonderful!
I had a good feeling about today.

by UptownFreeRadio on Sep 10, 2007 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

My sig works...

Prince Fielder...he is neither.

by LAcarl519 on Sep 10, 2007 8:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was impressed

with Morgan and Phelps last weekend against the Cubs.

I don't think the Pirates are light years from being competitive again. They just need for their pitching, aside from Gorzelanny, to come around, and to stop spending ridiculous amounts of money on washed-up veterans. Now that Littlefield has been fired, perhaps that part will take care of itself.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Sep 10, 2007 7:41 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Like a Pie that can hit.

I really like Morgan.

by UptownFreeRadio on Sep 10, 2007 7:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Defintely

They seem like the best "bad" team I've seen recently.

Tinker to Evers to Chance.

by Matt Allison on Sep 10, 2007 7:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nyjer makes another web gem

jumps around 10 feet high to grab a Fielder drive at the wall. I like that kid. Can Hendry get him?

by zevkalman on Sep 10, 2007 7:49 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

If not...

maybe he can become a two sport star and play for the blackhawks eh?
I admit it...i like hockey, and liked Nyjer more when I found out he was a hockey player.

by UptownFreeRadio on Sep 10, 2007 7:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I used to like the Blackhawks

when they had guys like Tony Esposito. I wish I knew them when they had Stan Mikita and Bobby Hull. Those were the golden years.

by zevkalman on Sep 10, 2007 7:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wait - the Blackhawks are still playing?

sorry.... couldn't resist.

even sorrier though is the NHL in general and Bill Wirtz in specific. I'd take our Wuertz over that Wirtz any day of the week.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 10, 2007 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Blackhawks are sorry

but the NHL is not. Due to the influx of talent from around the world -- players are bigger, stronger, and faster than ever. Even minor league hockey is better than ever -- there are so many good players that cannot make the NHL for various reasons that are playing for fun (and no money) at various levels, because they love the game.

The problem is that the league has been poorly marketed for years, and that -- with so much competition from other sports led the league off ESPN (which had better ratings with poker) and onto horrible networks.

The game is strong in most markets, but there are still too many teams. The NHL is stronger in California than Chicago. That's awful.

But if you subscribe to the NHL package, as I do -- you can see much better hockey than is being played on Chicago's west side.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Sep 10, 2007 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hockey is still

the best sport to watch in person, bar none. I played through high school and really love the sport.

Most people forget the Blackhawks were the toughest ticket in town for about a 12 year span. When they had Hull, Mikita, Esposito and the gang it was more than a pleasure to watch those guys.

Wirtz has run the franchise into the ground and it's a shame. When you think of the glory years and the fact that they had the greatest play by play man I ever heard in any sport (Lloyd Pettit), it is really depressing.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 10, 2007 11:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed - Hockey is great...

...but I still think the NHL is an extremely poorly run league (yes - worse than ML Bud), hence my earlier comment about the NHL being sorry. Case in point - didn't the NHL lose an entire season to a lockout/strike not that long ago? An ENTIRE season!!! Outside of diehard hockey fans, did anyone notice? Definitely agree with SanDiegoSmoothJazzMan - the marketing is atrocious.

I dunno... maybe my view is tainted 'cause I live in Chicago. All I know is our AHL team, the Wolves, is a bigger (and better) game in town than the 'Hawks. I'm not as knowledgeable about hockey talent so I can't say who has a better team, talent-wise, but I'd love to see them play each other sometime.

Of course, if they played it at the United Center, it wouldn't be televised... ;-)

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 10, 2007 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree

the league is run by a bunch of dumb asses.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 10, 2007 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hey, is this a baseball blog?

Don't get going on the BlackHawks, please. It is so frustrating to see what has happened to my team since the cup finals of '92.

That sorry ass Wirtz just won't kick the bucket. He doesn't get it why 15-year season ticket holders like me have gone over to the Wolves in droves the past dozen+ years.

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 8:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agree

and they let go the other best play by play man go! I'm glad he ended up on the Wolves, I loved going to their games. I was at game 7 when they won their first championship against Detroit. Still follow them out here.

"When you're eight games behind, it's like eight miles; when you're eight games in front, it's like eight inches."- Ron Santo

by BigJohnAZ on Sep 11, 2007 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ah, game 7

against Andy Beezo and the Vipers; the pre-game brawl. Came home down 3 games to 2 and won games 6 & 7 by a combined score of 6-1.

That's what a hockey championship in Chicago is like.

Then 4 years later, Butsyev's 2OT goal to beat the Sound Tigers.

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 9:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Foley was very good

but IMO, Pettit was just exceptional. Many on this board may not be old enouph to remember him, but he also did some Cubs work with WGN in the 60's as well.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 11, 2007 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

There's a shot....and a goal !!!

Yup, the golden voice of Lloyd Pettit doing the Blackhawks games; similar to Jack Brickhouse with the Cubs. How their lives were intertwined, eh?

Foley is becoming the next legendary voice of hockey in ChiTown.

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Foley has got great pipes

no doubt, but I think he is cut out more for television as opposed to radio. Pettit was a pure radio guy and was much more descriptive in his play by play. With Pettit, he did his best to describe every pass, shot, save etc. as it was happening, and his fight calls were ubelievable.

Foley has a lot more dead time in his play by play, but his inflection is excellent.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 11, 2007 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh totally, it was a different era

Pettit never simulcasted either; something Foley did for years with the BlackHawks. Pat slanted towards the TV side. Tell you what though, when he first came to the 'Hawks broadcasting on WYEN FM 106.7, he was radio only and very descriptive.

Think of this, there wasn't a Ron and Pat on the radio at the same time Len and BB were on TV.

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

It was a different time

but Pettit did do Hawk road games on WGN TV for several years. He was never simulcast, because (believe it or not) the road games were not on the radio for several years, they were only on WGN TV. Also, Arthur Wirtz was so caught up in protecting his product, Pettit didn't even come on the radio for home games until after the first perior for 2-3 years. I remember turning the radio on at 8:15 and he would give the score of the game after the 1st period.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 11, 2007 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

For the record, Wirtz didn't just mess up

Hockey in Chicago, He also ruined the local pipeline to those nice folks from Bell's in Kalamazoo.

by N Oakley on Sep 11, 2007 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Go Bucs!

5-0 Pirates!

I'm envisioning their pregame video with the Pirate ships sinking hapless nautical opponents. And I'm seeing big "Brewers" sales on said hapless opponents.

Shaping up to be quite the satisfying day.

¡BLANCO!

by 08Cubs on Sep 10, 2007 7:54 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Um..

"Sails" obviously, not sales. Apparently my typing hands are hooked on phonics.

¡BLANCO!

by 08Cubs on Sep 10, 2007 7:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's amazing....

what a 12-3 drubbing of the birds can do to the morale around here.

That game felt really, really good after what we've been fed recently. Gotta love it!

by martyblue on Sep 10, 2007 7:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

The Joy of Six

Tack, tack, tack.

Arrrgh!

¡BLANCO!

by 08Cubs on Sep 10, 2007 8:01 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

7-0 Bucs

by cubsnlinux on Sep 10, 2007 8:01 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

well i think it is safe to say

we will most likely be tied in an hour or so..

Now that he is back, play Matt Murton!!

by Chanman25 on Sep 10, 2007 8:02 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

You can put it on the board.........YES!

8-0 Bucs Now

by cubsnlinux on Sep 10, 2007 8:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Isn't quoting Hawk Harrelson

below BCB Community Standards? I think we should ask Al to have you banned!

Prince Fielder...he is neither.

by LAcarl519 on Sep 10, 2007 8:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

We'll cut 'em some slack this time,

however quoting that guy is damned near vulgar.

What a chronic waste of Oxygen.

How lucky us Cubs fans are for having Len on the TV side here.

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 10, 2007 8:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

LOL

his comments are a level above profanity

by cubsnlinux on Sep 10, 2007 10:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

7-0 PIRATES BOTTOM 7!!!!

Santo Forever!

by BeerCub on Sep 10, 2007 8:02 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Seven...

RBI double by Paulino. Two on, one out.

Arrgh!

¡BLANCO!

by 08Cubs on Sep 10, 2007 8:02 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Eight

Jumpin' Jack Wilson sac fly.

Arrgh!

¡BLANCO!

by 08Cubs on Sep 10, 2007 8:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

So glad

I became a member of the Cubs Club. Nothing better than listening to the Brewers get beat by the Butt Pirates! Love the Gameday Audio!

fly your W flag Cubs fans!

by love the ivy on Sep 10, 2007 8:04 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

even more fun to watch

get MLB TV

by CubFaninNY on Sep 10, 2007 8:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

"Butt Pirates"?

My best laugh of the day!!

Prince Fielder...he is neither.

by LAcarl519 on Sep 10, 2007 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

9-0 Bucs

by cubsnlinux on Sep 10, 2007 8:18 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

9-0 pirates

arrrrrr

One of Us!One Of Us!

by HerrProf on Sep 10, 2007 8:18 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

And I thought yesterday was bad...

The Brewers have been totally embarassed by the Pirates tonight and Tony Armas; meanwhile the Cubs had one of their most convincing wins all season...I would say this is a turning point, but then again we're Cubs fans. We know better. Nevertheless...YES!!!!!!

by UptownFreeRadio on Sep 10, 2007 8:25 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Final

9-0. Brewers might as well have just forfeited.

Arrgh!!!!

Welcome back to first place. Let's keep it this time.

¡BLANCO!

by 08Cubs on Sep 10, 2007 8:26 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Bucs win!!!

That's Cubs jumbled. heh-heh.

by CubFaninNY on Sep 10, 2007 8:27 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

The BUCS

have turned into the NL Central Bad Guys for all of the contenders!!

HA!

It is SEPTEMBER, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Sep 10, 2007 8:28 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Back to first place!!

by cubsnlinux on Sep 10, 2007 8:28 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

we knew it all along

One day out and we're back again. This time for good.

by CubFaninNY on Sep 10, 2007 8:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh...

sure...!

It is SEPTEMBER, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Sep 10, 2007 8:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

BTW, these obnoxious

Suds announcers kept going on and on about how confident the Brewers are. "Oozing with confidence" must have been said 3-4 times in the early innings. Anyway, the karma sure reversed quickly. I just don't remember Len & Bob talking like this when the Cubs were in first. Lots of games to go. These Brewers announcers were talking like they had this division wrapped up. Time will tell. We are all even AGAIN!

Prince Fielder...he is neither.

by LAcarl519 on Sep 10, 2007 8:30 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Just showed McCloth's homer

on the news. that thing went all the way into the river. wowsa.

Tinker to Evers to Chance.

by Matt Allison on Sep 10, 2007 9:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sure is nice

to have a blowout victory once in awhile. When was the last one? It's only one win, but a good start to this stretch. If we can take 2 of 3 in Houston and 3 of 4 in St. Louis we will be in really good shape. I don't know if we will get it done vs the Astros but we sure do seem to handle the Cardinals pretty well. I have a pretty good feeling about taking 3 games there.

by qccub on Sep 10, 2007 8:31 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Didn't you have

a good feeling about the Dodgers and Pirates series?

It is SEPTEMBER, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Sep 10, 2007 9:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Quite frankly

I don't remember much from last week. I think they call it "shell shock." Seriously, I did think we would at least split with the Dodgers. The fact that I have some optimism about the upcoming games is a minor miracle, I am generally fairly pessimistic in nature. I do think there is a good chance we will lose two of three in Houston, but we do seem to have the Cardinals number. I am certainly hoping for the best. It really won't take a tremendous effort by the Cubs to win this division, maybe four or five games over .500.

by qccub on Sep 10, 2007 9:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Game summary.

Courtesy of Axel Rose.

by Fraggin Judge on Sep 10, 2007 8:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Can someone explain?

We're back on first place but the odds to make the playoffs that Al posts on the site's right column fall to 35.9%. WTF?

by Fraggin Judge on Sep 10, 2007 8:59 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I vote that

Al stays in New York until the Cubs lose again...Don't mess with the mojo. Back in first, so we can sleep well tonight.

by LT on Sep 10, 2007 9:00 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

LOL. I'm afraid that if you prevail...

Al is going to wish (for the first time in his life) that the Cubs lose tomorrow.

by Fraggin Judge on Sep 10, 2007 9:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

T.R. Lilly

The more I see of him, the more I like him. He's not just a pitcher, he's a ballplayer. His head is in the game, he makes contact, runs the bases well, fields well. He, Marquis, and Z give us a trio of ballplayers at position #1.

"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007

by DeRoMyHero on Sep 10, 2007 9:08 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

And he has a sense of humor

remember reading something about this in the Trib the last time the Cards were in town. Might have been posted here in BCB too.

Seems like everyone in the media was analyzing the pros and cons of LaGenius' strategy of batting his pitcher in the 8th slot. Then Lilly comes into the dugout, walks over to where the lineup card is posted, and says to no one in particular...

"Damn, can't believe I'm hitting ninth again..."

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 10, 2007 9:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Jessica pointed that one out....

I heard if from Brenley who stated he was just standing around before the game and overheard Lily.

Is it my imagination or does Lily scream into his mitt after a great strike-out ?

by coral on Sep 10, 2007 9:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

See my signature

Below

Aug 15 - Ted Lilly walked by the lineup card and said to nobody in particular "I can't believe I'm batting 9th again".

by mweil on Sep 10, 2007 10:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hence

Teddy Ballgame

You're killin me smalls -'Ham' Porter

by TheRamZamDLEE on Sep 11, 2007 12:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Welcome to BACK TO FIRST PLACE!!!

N/T

GO CUBS GO! Hey Chicago whatdya say the Cubs are going to win today!

by Galvan316 on Sep 10, 2007 9:20 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Those of you AT the game

today - or if it was heard - did the bleachers give Ankiel shit today?

Did not get a chance to see the game this time.

I was advocating his skewering from our fans as soon as the HGH story broke.

It is SEPTEMBER, and we're STILL IN IT! YES!

by TheEman on Sep 10, 2007 9:39 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I sincerely hope so

And I hope it contributed to him striking out four times.

by lancaster99 on Sep 10, 2007 9:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not sure about the bleachers, but the whole park

gave Ankiel shit in the form of boos every time he came up to the plate. At one point, I heard a group in the LF bleachers start up a "H G H" chant, but it wasn't very loud and it petered out fairly quick. Kinda lame effort, truth be told.

Sounds like he made a great diving catch late in the game and got some cheers for that.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 10, 2007 9:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

btw, I heard they're making a movie...

...about Ankiel's career, chronicling his early pitching woes, followed by his RoyHobbsian comeback as a slugger, leading the Cardinals back into playoff contention, under the cloud of HGH allegations.

Working title right now is... "The UnNatural" ;-)

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 10, 2007 10:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

We DO know our body produces HGH, right?

Our bodies produce less HGH as we age. (There are problems if our bodies produce too much, or too little of the agent. HGH has been studied as an anti-aging agent for over 15 years. There are dozens of amino-acid HGH 'stimulators' on the market. (I would assume the majority of them don't work.)

Someday, we might be 'taking' HGH. I would -- if it was affordable, and proven to be effective. I'd like to stick around to see many Cubs World Series appearences.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growth_hormone

This shouldn't be lumped in with steroid use.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Sep 10, 2007 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Your body also produces steroids

and although HGH and Anabolic steriods are different, they both enhance muscle growth.

Growth hormone is driven by your pituitary gland in your brain and as you age, it does slow down.

If you recall a guy named Lyle Alzado, he died of a brain tumor that they think may have originated in his pituitary gland from HGH use.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 10, 2007 11:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Our bodies produce anabolic steriods, too.

n/t

FREE CARMEN PIGNATIELLO!

by cwyers on Sep 10, 2007 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

anyone play drums around here?

that calls for a rim shot! lol

fly your W flag Cubs fans!

by love the ivy on Sep 11, 2007 12:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Just got home

Ankiel took a beating today in the field and at the plate. Multiple H-G-H chants broke out although a bit weak, I couldn't resist even though I was pretty far from LF where it started.

The amount of Cardinal fans at this game was pretty disturbing. Don't worry I took care of them, some of them anyhow.

The Ted Lilly double and 4 Ankiel K's were my personal highlights. Then again I had a lot to choose from. Awesome game today! Let's keep this thing rollin

You're killin me smalls -'Ham' Porter

by TheRamZamDLEE on Sep 10, 2007 11:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wait

aren't we the classless fans who boo bad performances?

MMMMM...Mannys corned beef and a latke

by Kinky Reggae on Sep 10, 2007 10:01 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

GO SMOKIES!!!

Trying to tie it up in the ninth, smokies down 8-7 with two men on and one out.

Eamus Catuli!

by sackings108 on Sep 10, 2007 10:02 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Bases Loaded

IBB

Eamus Catuli!

by sackings108 on Sep 10, 2007 10:02 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

and that's that.

K, then a groundout, the rally is done. Oh well, good season. And Tyler Colvin had another good game.

Eamus Catuli!

by sackings108 on Sep 10, 2007 10:10 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Excuse my ignorance

But can someone inform me to what HGH is, and what has Ankiel supposedly done?

Thanks in advance

by Aussie Cub on Sep 10, 2007 10:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Human Growth Hormone

Ankiel alledgedly purchased HGH in 2004.

by jck on Sep 10, 2007 11:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

See my earlier post

HGH shouldn't be regarded as something equivalent to a steroid-containing substance, in my opinion.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Sep 10, 2007 11:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

well no, it wouldn't be equivalent to steroids...

...since only steroids would be equivalent to steroids. But isn't it considered a performance-enhancing substance? I'm certainly no chemist nor do I have any first-hand knowledge of these things, but everything I've heard/read leads me to think so.

Don't want to put words in your post, but are you saying HGH does not give a player an advantage and it should not be on MLB's no-no list?

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 11, 2007 12:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Actually, there's a body of clinical research...

...that shows that HGH does not have a significant impact on strength or endurance compared to the benefits of exercise alone.

What HGH is useful for is exactly what Ankiel is alleged to have used it for - as a way to come back from injuries more quickly. [Actually, steroids have proven more useful in recuperation than in strength-building as well, which is why you see so many marginal pitchers get busted.]

FREE CARMEN PIGNATIELLO!

by cwyers on Sep 11, 2007 12:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You can find a body of research

that says just about anything.

Bottom line; if you talked to any physician knowledable regarding HGH, it is not intended to be prescribed to normally healthy athletes coming back from injury. It is also true that anabolic steriods are not prescribed to athletes who are injured as well.

Both HGH and steriods are only prescribed when it is proven a person's body is not manufacturing the normal amount of this substance on their own. And those cases are few and far between.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 11, 2007 12:15 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

That's the statement

of someone who has a closed mind, and a closed mind is no good to anyone.

Both points are valid, and you should acknowledge it. Your point that HGH has few if any legitimate uses for a healthy adult is true. But study after study has shown that it does not increase strength or athletic performance, and you are just showing your own ignorance by dismissing that by saying studies can show anything. A statement like that says "I don't care what you say. I'm right and nyah, nyah, nyah!"

People would love to have a discussion with you. You should try it rather than simply pontificating, which nobody wants to hear.

HGH does not increase strength or athletic performance. This isn't even controversial. That doesn't mean that athletes don't believe that it does and take it for unethical reasons.

The artist formerly known as JoshinLA

by Josh77 on Sep 11, 2007 3:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Point taken

I'll admit, the scientific evidence of HGH's effectiveness with health athletes is limited at this time, but that does not mean it does not enhance performance.

Dick Pound and the IOC worked long and hard (and spent a lot of money) to come up with a test for HGH for the Olympic Games. If there was not strong belief in the scientific community that it enhanced performance, I don't think they would have gone to all the trouble in finding a test to dectect it.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 11, 2007 8:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

It would be ignorant to think any athlete takes...

HGH on its own. Thus any great scientific study saying it does nothing for athletes ON ITS OWN is non-applicable in this case. So nyah, nyah, etc...back at the guy with his study to wave about. These guys take HGH to help them grow and steroids to help them get stronger. Read about it in Game of Shadows at your local library.

by Jerry Mumphrey on Sep 11, 2007 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Excellent point

If I'm not mistaken, HGH is usually taken with a blend of other enhancing drugs to get the overall desired effect. This is one reason the IOC has worked so hard to come up with a dependable test for HGH.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 11, 2007 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

A few notes about the game today

-I was suprised at how many cardinal fans were at the game, they must be locals (who's gonna drive five hours to see one game)
-Ankiel had the big Golden Sombrero today and looked bad doing it. The right field bleachers were pretty hard on him, chanting "H G H" and I heard one not so nice person yell, "Hey Ankiel, your mother is very disappointed in you!"
-Ted Lilly did not have his first inning troubles today, he looked real strong on the mound.
-I haven't seen a replay but it sure seemed like DeRosa was hit intentionally, I hate that about La Russa. I think Lilly gave Taguchi a pay back, to bad he cranked a homer on the next pitch.
-I really think this loss is going to send the Cardinals over the edge and out of contention, they lost three in Arizona, flew to Chicago and got crushed, now they have to get on another plane to play a game tomorrow. It is going to be real tough for them to hold.

"Harlem Furniture......You'll like our style!"

by Imtrejo on Sep 10, 2007 11:21 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

How about how long it took

Taguchi to get back in the box after the knockdown pitch.

You're killin me smalls -'Ham' Porter

by TheRamZamDLEE on Sep 11, 2007 12:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The umpire told him to get back into the box

n/t

"Harlem Furniture......You'll like our style!"

by Imtrejo on Sep 11, 2007 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Karma

I believe that the game that this was a makeup for was going to end the Cards season. Zambrano had no-hitter stuff through 3 before the rain came.

Had the Cubs won that one, I think it would have sent them on a 4 game sweep, instead of the 2-1 series win. Cards would have had a hard time coming back from that.

But, maybe this is better. Cards use a bunch of pitchers and have no off days remaining.

Cubs fan since forever Live Cubs Chat with no refresh required

by roscoevillage on Sep 11, 2007 12:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I liked how

Ted just cool and easy took the ball back to the mound like he didn't even see Taguchi flat on the ground. I had to chuckle. I get the feeling that Ted has a very dry, but what I would find insanely funny, sense of humor. Especially after reading the "I'm batting 9th" comments.

fly your W flag Cubs fans!

by love the ivy on Sep 11, 2007 12:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

What will undo the Cards

is not enough pitching to get them through the absurd number of games they play on consecutive days through the end of the season. All this stuff I'm reading about momentum (Cubs, Cards and Brewers) is bullshit. Good pitching trumps all. If the Cubs faced Lefty Grove or Walter Johnson tomorrow it wouldn't matter how good they looked today. if the Cards had faced Steve Renko or Bill Bonham after losing the first two in the August series they would have won.

Momentum is good teams playing well. it's not some magical force that can turn garbage into gold.

by TR on Sep 11, 2007 12:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Momentum Is the Name of Today's Starting Pitcher

"Good pitching trumps all" -- you betcha. Whichever team's rotation pitches best these last 3 weeks will be the division winner. The reason our Cubs haven't built a big lead is our starters and team ERA ballooned during August. If our pitching is as good as it was May-July for the rest of September things will work out fine.

by wrigley1 on Sep 11, 2007 8:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

What an exciting day!

Good to see the offense finally break through! Here's hoping that the Brewers lose the next couple to the Bucs, and the Cubs go into Houston with some positive momentum!

by jjmarie30 on Sep 11, 2007 5:21 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I expect some nastiness this weekend.

After yesterday's plunk of DeRosa, Lilly brushing back Iguchi in apparent retaliation, Lou saying he is "aware" of LaRussa's strategy of intentionally plunking our guys, and with the probable frustration the Cardinals are going to be feeling, I expect a HBP war. I just hope none of our players is injured.

by Fraggin Judge on Sep 11, 2007 9:07 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

We expect it...

...and so will the umps. With LaRussa in one of the dugouts and what transpired yesterday, it'll be closely monitored.

Let's hope the umps don't blow it this weekend like they did in Atl in June with Lilly getting tossed early.

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 9:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

LaRussa...

Has gotten away with this garbage for years.

Whatever else stupid Dusty did and said, he didn't let LaRussa's nonsense go unanswered.

Pinella doesn't seem like the type to let him do it either. I hope I'm right.

The Cardinals could very quickly have nothing to lose. Their manager has the ethics of an alley cat. That's a dangerous combination for our guys.

So, to paraphrase Sean Connery from "The Untouchables."

They hit one of our guys. We hit two.

If one of our guys has to leave the game, two of their guys have to leave the game.

Only when the retaliation is disproportionate will LaRussa stop. He couldn't care less if Taguchi gets hit. Taguchi is less than nothing to him.

by lancaster99 on Sep 11, 2007 9:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

No, No, No, NO !!!!

Escalating things into a beanball war just plays right into LaRussa's hands. We'll end up with one or more pitchers suspended and players hurt at the time the Cubs can least afford it. If Tony can't win the division he'd certainly LOVE to give Cards fans the huge consolation prize of knocking us out of the playoffs -- let's not help him do it.

Generally, being an old school traditionalist, I believe some retaliation has a place in the game. Fortunately for us, Lou knows how and when to pick his spots far better than we do.

So let's get the better of our arch rivals by just plain and simple giving them a BEATING on the field, like we did yesterday !!

by wrigley1 on Sep 11, 2007 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's very simple

Ohman or Pignatello or even Wood could handle the duty. What's the most that will happen? A 5-game suspension? 10 games?

The player who is arguably our MVP, and certainly one of the best position player signings in all of baseball, has a swelled elbow and will miss Tuesday and maybe more.

That demands payback.

by lancaster99 on Sep 11, 2007 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Bad Plan

Sure, let a guy like Ohman do it.

Then when a bench clearing brawl ensues, which key Cubs will the Cards be taking swings at and luring into potential injury and suspension?

The price is too high. This gets our guys away from what should be their EXCLUSIVE focus and concentration on the matter at hand -- winning these games down the stretch.

The best payback for LaRussa's infantile head games is WINNING THE DIVISION. The Cards have finished ahead of the Cubs in 45 of the 61 years since we last won the pennant -- so let's not stupidly make it 46.

by wrigley1 on Sep 11, 2007 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Lou has been around the block

and I think he will have the team prepared to handle this ahead of time.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 11, 2007 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

So...

We're so petrified that someone MIGHT get hurt that we just let the Cards pitchers use the Cubs for target practice?

That's what is happening right now. I want it stopped and baseball won't do anything about it.

by lancaster99 on Sep 11, 2007 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I want the Cubs

to win the division. Payback and other types of distractions can wait until next season.

by cubsbak on Sep 11, 2007 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

retaliation...

...when warranted and done with the intent not to injure is as much a part of baseball as any other facet of the game.

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The only

"facet" of the game I'm interested in is winning baseball games.

by cubsbak on Sep 11, 2007 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

same here...

...but that doesn't mean that a team should depart from protecting its own for fear of the repercussions. as intimated, retaliating, when warranted, is part of winning baseball games. what's next, not going in to 2b hard to break up a double play for fear of a suspension?

we all know that baseball is a tough, gutty and gritty game and the cubs should play it accordingly!

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Intent to injure?

My hyperbolic, angry comments aside, I have no wish for a Cardinal to be seriously injured. Perhaps being made to leave the game, but nothing more.

But the problem is, once you let loose a pitched baseball at someone, you really have no control if the person is injured or not.

So, I do not wish a Cardinal to suffer serious injury, but I'm not going to cry if one is. LaRussa escalated this. Let him deal with the consequences.

by lancaster99 on Sep 11, 2007 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i posted...

..."with the intent not to injure!"

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

absolutely!

the cubs cannot refrain from retaliation.

if that dirtbag larussa calls for another hbp, then a cardinal better get drilled, preferably pujols!

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Happy Having Lou at the Helm

Good thing Lou is captain of our ship. He'll handle this in a very calm, collected way -- and remember revenge is a dish best served cold.

by wrigley1 on Sep 11, 2007 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Lou can call up

some arm/thug from AA (Samardzija?, too bad he is not on the 40 man roster) to fill out the roster. A special purpose call up for the weekend.

Hopefully he can hit Poo-holes right in his hip and then give him a nice Farnsworth tackle (still the best play the guy ever made as a Cub!) Wouldn't it be fun to see Poo-holes and Samardzija have at it?

Just dreaming...

Prince Fielder...he is neither.

by LAcarl519 on Sep 11, 2007 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

or suspended

by philadelphiacub on Sep 11, 2007 9:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Interesting...except the numbers don't add up

Batters hit by pitches this season
Milwaukee 63
St. Louis 50
Cubs 35

Opposition batters hit by pitches
St. Louis 63
Cubs 54
Milwaukee 46

St. Louis clearly has a history of throwing at batters.

But Cubs' batters have been only hit 35 times this season so far...while dishing out 54 HBPs? Pretty flakey reason to go to war this weekend just because DeRosa got bonked yesterday.

I say forget about bean balls, just sweep them at home and laugh as they cry in their Budweisers.

by JFCubFan on Sep 11, 2007 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

So are we all done talknig about -

let alone worrying about - the Brewers? I don't think I saw them mentioned once in this entire thread.

"I got mad hits like I was Rod Carew!"

by lostinthevines on Sep 11, 2007 10:28 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Great Point

Exactly. All this DISTRACTION about beanball garbage gets away from focus on WINNING the division -- and the Brewers are a lot more of a problem for the Cubs than any other team.

by wrigley1 on Sep 11, 2007 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i understand your...

...collective point, but what do you suggest the cubs do if larussa orders another hit batsman?

turn the other cheek?

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Guarantee

The one and only way to make absolutely CERTAIN -- indeed GUARANTEE -- that LaRussa will do it again this weekend -- is for the Cubs to go down there and retaliate.

by wrigley1 on Sep 11, 2007 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Perhaps Pinella

Should just bend over and hand LaRussa a paddle and say, "Thank you sir, may I have another?"

I'm tired of the sniveling. "We might get hurt. We might get suspended. We might trip and fall on the way to the on-deck circle!"

News flash. DeRosa isn't playing today. We're already hurt by this.

Time to inflict some back.

by lancaster99 on Sep 11, 2007 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Over the Top

Let's save the over the top frat boy rhetoric for the tavern.

You're tired of sniveling, buddy?? Most of us are tired of a 100 years of mostly awful baseball. Our Cubs get chances few and far between for winning the division and going to the postseason.

Advocating a formula for potentially throwing away our chances -- LOSING OUR HEADS BY THROWING AT THEIRS just isn't logical. Just what ol' Tony is hoping for us to do .....

by wrigley1 on Sep 11, 2007 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly.

Play winning baseball. That's the best revenge.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 11, 2007 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yep

Shawn Johnson, Des Moines, IA, worlds greatest gymnast. 2007 All Around World Champ. GO SHAWN!!!!

by sue369 on Sep 11, 2007 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

This is just what we need

A beanball contest and having any one of D-Lee, A-Ram or Fonzie out for the season.

I steal this quote from one of the classiest guys ever to wear a Cubs' uniform - all of MLB for that matter:

There was Gary Matthews, the Sarge. He wouldn't let me down. He was always in the on-deck circle when I was batting and if there was a pitch that almost hit me or knocked me down, Sarge would be halfway to the mound coming at the pitcher, "Get the ball over the plate or face the consequences." I saw a lot of fast balls down the middle because of Sarge and I had too much respect for how hard he played to give it any less than he did.

Key words? "Get the ball over the plate".

First things first, let's see a Cubs win tonight!

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You guys

Act like you can't do both.

Four out of five in 2003. It came, in part, because Prior and Wood and Baker refused to take it from Matt Morris and LaRussa.

Baker intimidated LaRussa that series.

You CAN do both. In fact, I'd argue that taking control, and showing that you will not back down from a drunkard bully like LaRussa is key.

I don't want it done recklessly. I don't want it done without regard for safety or suspension.

I want it done coldly and professionally.

You guys are upset because someone might get hurt. Someone IS hurt, and that's DeRosa.

I want the Cubs to try to prevent more people from getting hurt. And you do that by striking first.

by lancaster99 on Sep 11, 2007 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

im with you

hit one guy and be done with it. if you throw the first blow, you show that you're protecting your players, then the benches get warned, and then if la russa wants to retaliate itll be his boys getting suspended and not ours.

Matt Murton career in September: .321/.401/.576, 10 jacks (165 ab). Make sure Matt the Bat gets in the lineup this month Lou!

by kylejo on Sep 11, 2007 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agree to Disagree

Guess we'll just have to respectfully agree to disagree on this one. Not backing down from the drunken bully is exactly how bar fights start -- hate to see one in St. Louis.

by wrigley1 on Sep 11, 2007 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly.

The Cubs didn't win that series in 2003 because they retaliated for hit batters.

They won it because they played better baseball. Do that and the bully will slink away in silence.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 11, 2007 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

actually, al...

...there were 3 cardinals who were hit-by-a-pitch in that series all of which were retaliatory.

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

From when?

n/t

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 11, 2007 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Play ball

If the Cubs hit one of the Birds first and the benches are immediately warned, that still won't prevent the Birds from throwing at a Cub. And it may be more likely now that we're past Sep 1 with the rosters expanded.

Yes, it will incur a suspension but what good does that do the Cubs if that hit batter happens to be a D-Lee, A-Ram or Fonzie if it breaks his hand?

If you think they're gonna throw at a rookie, think again; it'll be a bigger name player.

Baseball doesn't need a real-life version of slapshot (the ultimate insult of my 1st sport).

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i can't believe...

...some of the comments regarding retaliatory beanballs.

baseball is not badminton, it's not billiards, it's not backgammon, it's baseball. to suggest that retaliating is a departure from the norm is ludicrous.

the desire, by some of you, for the cubs to be aspiring dalai lamas is the departure from the norm.

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ridiculous

Now is not the time to get into that nonsense. The Cubs have a division to win. Throwing at a Cardinal player isn't going to accomplish anything except it'll get a Cubs pitcher and probably Sweet Lou suspended for critical games down the stretch. The Cubs focus right now needs to be solely on winning baseball games not on settling scores. There'll be plenty of opportunities for that next season.

by cubsbak on Sep 11, 2007 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I know what baseball is

But making a priority out of goading LaRussa into a beanball affair (which won't take much to do), loses sight of the objective of the Cubs and that is to make the playoffs.

It would be so Cub that the guys start throwing at the RedBirds and at the end of Sunday's game at Busch, it's big time Cubs player that is on the DL.

Lost in all of this is the umpires. They just may warn both teams before a single pitch is thrown.

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 2:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

LaRussa has a quick

trigger when it comes to throwing at guys and this has been proven time and time again. With that said, he and Piniella have a good deal of respect for each other and I don't see anything getting out of hand in this upcoming series.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Sep 11, 2007 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

With all respect, Al

Cubs played one of their better games yesterday, and two guys got drilled. One of them might not play today.

Turning the other cheeck and just playing hard and well only gets you so far. At some point, you have to protect yourself.

by lancaster99 on Sep 11, 2007 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Great.

Let's get some of our guys ejected and/or suspended. That'll do us a lot of good.

Play hard and play RIGHT, and that's how the games will be won.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 11, 2007 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ejected, suspended

Both are really bad. What's even worse? A season-ending injury; especially to a Cubs player.

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 2:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Which will

be more likely to happen if the Cubs escalate things. AND it'll result in certain players (and sweet lou) getting ejected and suspended for critical games. Don't you remember what happened in Atlanta? Not only did Lilly get ejected but Fontenot almost got beheaded. Now is not the time for that crap. It's just stupid macho bullshit.

by cubsbak on Sep 11, 2007 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

agree to disagree.

It's just stupid macho bullshit.

no, it most definitely is not.

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, it is, in my opinion.

n/t

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 11, 2007 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed

Shawn Johnson, Des Moines, IA, worlds greatest gymnast. 2007 All Around World Champ. GO SHAWN!!!!

by sue369 on Sep 11, 2007 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

oh, i see...

Play hard and play RIGHT, and that's how the games will be won.

how did it come to be that you have decided that not retaliating is playing the game properly when decades of history, as well as the belief by probably every mlb player, indicates otherwise?

are you advocating that the cubs field a team of nancy's?

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 2:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh, please.

What, you want them to just start throwing at someone's head?

Or start fistfights a la Barrett?

That's the quickest way to put this potentially wonderful season down the tubes. No thanks.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 11, 2007 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

EXACTLY

Wait for next year. Guys memories are long on this thing.

Remember seeing an article about Ed Farmer and a retaliation happening 3 years later.

Focus on the ball game.

Who knows maybe we'll have an umpire warning Friday when the lineup cards are handed in...

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

oh, please to you, al!

can we bring a cessation to the extreme comments.

yeah, i want the cubs to start a fistfight...in fact, i'd love for this weekend's series to be that of a one we'd see in some semi-pro beer league where several players go to the hospital.

give me a break!

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

What do you think they did yesterday?

They played hard and they played right.

And two guys, pretty key guys, got drilled. Umpires did nothing.

When you're playing a guy like LaRussa, you don't get to live in a perfect world where you don't have to lock your door at night and you shouldn't tense up when walking down the street at night.

And where all you have to do is play hard, eat your vitamins and say your prayers and you'll beat the Iron Shiek.

I'd rather get a guy suspended for five games than injured for five weeks.

by lancaster99 on Sep 11, 2007 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

whatever...

I just don't want beanball to be the objective and them lose sight of the real goal, winning games.

Getting a guy off his game is a tactic many managers/coaches do. And what the Cubs don't need is to be thinking about a beanball instead of just going up there and hitting and pitching.

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

listen...

...i certainly do want a beanball war to be paramount to the task at hand, which is to hand the cards their ass this weekend and ultimately win the division.

that being said, here's hoping the cubs hand the cards their ass this weekend absent any ugliness! however, if a drilling is in order, drill away!

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Again

Who says you can't do both? You guys have this notion that all I and others are advocating is throwing at batters until three runs come in on HBPs.

You put one in someone's ribs before they can do it to you.

I know we have some headcases in the rotation, but I think we can trust a guy like Lilly or a guy like Marquis to throw at some ribs once and then go back to his regular game plan.

(I'm not sure I'd trust Zambrano with this...)

It seems to be an either/or for you guys. Either the Cubs get revenge/protect themselves against future attacks or they win.

They can do both.

by lancaster99 on Sep 11, 2007 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

my sentiments exactly, lancaster!

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=kurkjian_tim&id=2458700&lpos=spotlight &lid=tab1pos2

"If you'da been thinkin you wouldn't 'a thought that." ~~ "Squints" Palledorous

by rm463 on Sep 11, 2007 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

good article

i really dont understand most of the sentiment here. this is part of baseball, and when its against your arch rivals in a pennat race, geez i just dont understand how you dont retaliate, and how most on this board are taking the easy cowardly view of just letting it go.

guys, our boys were purposely hit, by our arch rivals, that deserves retaliation, plain and simple.

Matt Murton career in September: .321/.401/.576, 10 jacks (165 ab). Make sure Matt the Bat gets in the lineup this month Lou!

by kylejo on Sep 11, 2007 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

So who got hit first yesterday?

And with a high level of confidence can the Cubs say it was a purpose pitch or overtly throwing at him?

I don't know I can answer that. My impulse reaction is to say De-Ro was thrown at 'cause its LaRussa managing; it has to be. That impulse may be wrong.

Leading off and playing short, TheRiot; batting 2nd and catching, Mr.OBP, Jason Kendall.....Do it Lou!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 11, 2007 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i first heard the derosa beaning

in the car on the way home from work, and though ronny emphatically said that it was not a purpose pitch, the situation seemed perfect for a bean ball. dero is great with runners on, second and third with one out, so you set up the double play and face a batter who is more inclined to the dp grounder to second base in jacque jones. jacque making them pay with a base hit was great. when you see him get hit though, it just didnt look like the pitcher had any intention of throwing a strike.

i can definitely see plenty of scenarios where us retaliating would be a bad idea, but if you get in the right situation in the game, i say let em have it.

Matt Murton career in September: .321/.401/.576, 10 jacks (165 ab). Make sure Matt the Bat gets in the lineup this month Lou!

by kylejo on Sep 11, 2007 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think it was a purpose pitch

But you know something, I don't care whether it was or not.

LaRussa has ordered guys to throw in retaliation even when everyone involved knows it was an accident.

His reasoning has been that seeing a teammate dusted will cause a pitcher to be more careful about accidents.

The fact that DeRosa was injured, even if it's just for one game, sealed it for me.

The results matter more than the intent for me.

by lancaster99 on Sep 11, 2007 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't want to see a

bean ball marathon this weekend.

But I agree with those who say that you have to retaliate to protect your team. Hopefully the weekend goes without incident.

My wish is that we win the first three against the RedBirds and when we have a big lead in game 4, our clean up pitcher in the 9th inning will hit the batter in the hip with two outs and that will be the end of it. :-)

That would be a nice way to end it. Let our play do the talking, but let there be one final exclamation point.

Prince Fielder...he is neither.

by LAcarl519 on Sep 11, 2007 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Timing Is Everything

Erroneous conclusion regarding retaliation. I don't think the general sentiment is "taking the cowardly view of just letting it go".

Rather it is a matter of choosing the appropriate place and time, which is NOT in our arch rivals ballpark, in front of all their fans, as we lead them in the standings at the very end of a pennant race !!

The most basic sandlot strategy is attempting to get your opponent's mind out of the game onto something else. We cannot allow LaRussa to do that to us.

JUST WIN -- our best revenge is the Cards sitting at home watching the Cubs in the playoffs. We can throw at them early next year, when the division is not hanging in the balance.

by wrigley1 on Sep 11, 2007 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Loud, sustained applause.

n/t

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 11, 2007 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You are correct.

I agree with you.

Shawn Johnson, Des Moines, IA, worlds greatest gymnast. 2007 All Around World Champ. GO SHAWN!!!!

by sue369 on Sep 11, 2007 4:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

No, not @ all -

I was saying that we need to focus on our real competition. We're not tied with the Cards, we're tied with the Brewers. I started way too early this year, but NOW'S the time to start scoreboard watching!

"I got mad hits like I was Rod Carew!"

by lostinthevines on Sep 11, 2007 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You're absolutely correct.

That's why I wrote earlier that I'm afraid a nasty weekend await the Cubs. If the Cardinals find themselves falling out of the division race by then (as I believe they will) nothing will give that drunkard in St. Louis more satisfaction than to bait our players into a beanball war to see which Cubs get injured and/or suspended in the thick of a division quest. I have confidence that Lou will address this with the players before then but once the beanballs land it can easily escalate out of control, even if the umpires intervene aggresively.

Any such incidents will not only distract the club from the pursuit of the division lead but will impact the race if one of our key players cannot play in key games down the stretch. LaRussa is devious enough to plan this.

by Fraggin Judge on Sep 11, 2007 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Absolutely correct

Captain self-righteous would like nothing more than to ruin our season with that kind of petty crap.

Hopefully we can resist the urge to retaliate, and can merely brush some of their hitters back. Pujols is all bark and no bite; hit him in the leg and let's see what happens.

by SouthsideCub on Sep 11, 2007 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

the best thing to do

if we have another hit batter is for that guy to score. if every time one of our batters is hit by a pitch he scores, then i think we would see less guys get hit. hopefully the cubs players will be smart enough to just worry about winning games and not get caught up in a pissing contest with a third place team.

by anormal on Sep 11, 2007 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

More of the same @ the "other" BCB

After that last post of mine I decided to go over to brewcrewball.com and see what they were talking about - our youngster aren't that young (nor are the Cards' kids), so the Baby Brewers have way more upside than us. Granted, they have a few good young position players, but without a decent starting rotation to keep them afloat until they gel, they're doomed.

"I got mad hits like I was Rod Carew!"

by lostinthevines on Sep 11, 2007 10:47 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I didn't go over there

to see what you're talking about, but the Brewers young players do, in fact, have more upside than ours do. But that's ridiculous right now. No one cares about upside at this point. The future is now and it's all going to come down who can put the best team on the field for the last 20 games.

The artist formerly known as JoshinLA

by Josh77 on Sep 11, 2007 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

My point exactly.

Those players most likely won't be there long enough for them to form a cohesive, dominant team. That's not the way things work in the era of free agency. It's a one-and-done game now - right, Florida Marlins? Right, Chicago White Sox?

"I got mad hits like I was Rod Carew!"

by lostinthevines on Sep 11, 2007 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't know the Brewers very well

btu if Sheets can stay healthy and they can get 2 more quality starting pitchers in free agency next year, I think they could be a big time force next year.

As for this year, whoever can get hot for the next 20 games takes the division. The Brewers have just as good a shot as the Cubs do.

by NO100 on Sep 11, 2007 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Unfortunately that's true.

Hopefully, in the next few seasons the Crew will either a) part with a couple of their young studs in trade for SPs, or b) fall into Lake Michigan and never be heard from again.

"I got mad hits like I was Rod Carew!"

by lostinthevines on Sep 11, 2007 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

And I say hopefully they trade

studs for SPs because dem kids is GOOD! TOO good!

"I got mad hits like I was Rod Carew!"

by lostinthevines on Sep 11, 2007 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Youngsters do have more upside

Hart, Hardy, Weeks, Fielder, Braun are scary good.

Even guys like Dillion, Gross, and Gel show some promise.

Meanwhile Hall and Estrada are good, decent veteran players.

Their offense could be great, but right now the Braves' lineup is insane:

2B Johnson
SS Renteria
3B Jones
1B Texieria
C McCann
RF Francouer
CF Jones
LF Diaz

and they linger out of the playoff hunt because their starting pitching can't get the job done and their ace, John Smoltz pitches every start, and Tim Hudson is a quality No. 2 pitcher this year.

Yovanni Gallardo is a stud and will be a great No. 1/2 pitcher, but Ben Sheets has done nothing to show that he isn't going to pitch more than half of a season in a year. He's always going to have health issues. Manny Parra has some upside, but so did Chris Capuano and Dave Bush... how the mighty have fallen. Plus they are going to have Jeff Suppan around for quite awhile and they can't invest too much money into free agent pitchers because they have to save for when the young hitters hit the free agent market.

For the Brewers to become a great team, Chris Capuano, Dave Bush, Manny Parra, or someone is going to have to step it up to be a quality No. 2/3 pitcher behind Sheets & Gallardo. The Brewers also have to plan around not counting on any production from Ben Sheets. It's just like with us and Prior/Wood. If Sheets contributes, awesome, but if he goes down (like he does 2-3 times a year), they have to be able to stay afloat.

What will be really interesting is if the Brewers will be able to produce youngsters without getting top draft picks anymore. When you finish half of the 21st century last place in the Central, you are going to get some quality picks.

by IllinoisCubs on Sep 11, 2007 3:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs