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Around SBN: Spencer Hall's College Football Week 12 Alphabetical

Same Time, This Year


Pregame festivities at the Fiesta Bowl -- Photo by Al

GLENDALE, Arizona -- I'm spending part of the holidays in Arizona, and as last year, decided to take in the Fiesta Bowl.

I have a feeling the Oklahoma Sooners boosters are going to ask me not to go next year, if their school winds up invited back. For the second straight year, the Sooners went in as favorites, and for the second straight year, they went back to Norman with a loss, this time a 48-28 loss to an inspired West Virginia team that spent the evening showing why they felt they should have been in the BCS championship game vs. Ohio State (and likely would have, had they not been upset by a similarly-inspired Pitt team on December 1.

Without an unbeaten team like last year's Boise State Broncos, and with many tickets returned (as many as 7,500 from West Virginia, according to some reports), the crowd didn't seem as excited or interested as last year's; in fact, the announced crowd of 70,016 was almost 3,000 below capacity, and I'm guessing the many scalpers I saw waving tickets on the streets near the stadium wound up eating some of them, because there seemed to be more than that number of empty seats, particularly in the upper levels, and according to the dead-tree edition of the Arizona Republic this morning (can't find any online link), tickets could be had on the street for as little as $10. Even so, traffic headed to the stadium on highway 101 was really slow, even two hours to kickoff; at one point, several police motorcycles blasted through traffic -- only to reveal that they were escorting four large buses, rather than going to any accident; these were likely the school bands.

The usual chants of "Boomer! Sooner!" filled the stadium before the game; the Sooner fans seemed to outnumber the Mountaineers fans almost 2-1, but once the game started, the yellow-and-blue-clad West Virginia fans were much, much louder. Oklahoma was only briefly in this penalty-filled game, getting the score to within a touchdown at 13-6 late in the second quarter (before allowing a 21-yard touchdown pass making it 20-6 and blocking a WV field-goal attempt at the end of the half), and then briefly making it a 6-point game at 20-15 (and failing to convert a two-point attempt which would have made it 20-17). They were outplayed by the combination of Mountaineer QB Patrick White, and freshman running back Noel Devine (who came into the game only when starting RB Steve Slaton left the game in the first quarter with an injury. That, combined with the swarming defense led by linebacker Reed Williams, bottled up Sooner QB Sam Bradford all game. Though Bradford did complete 21 of 33 passes for 242 yards, he was sacked three times and threw an interception (in the end zone, when Oklahoma was driving to what would have been a leading touchdown).

By the time White threw to Tito Gonzalez on what wasn't designed to be a long play but wound up as a 79-yard touchdown completion to make the score 41-21, many of the Oklahoma faithful in the crowd had headed for the huge parking lots surrounding the "flying saucer in the desert". Though it wasn't as spectacular a game as last year's thrilling overtime win by Boise State, attending a football bowl game, seeing fans in their crimson and blue wigs and other outlandish getups, hearing the marching bands (I have to say, I'm always impressed by those, because not only do you have to play well, you also have to memorize the complicated choreography while marching on a football field), and soaking in the pageantry of a national event (Cub connection: Mark Grace, who was grand marshal of the Fiesta Bowl parade, also was asked to flip the coin at midfield before the game) is always fun.

Note to the Fiesta Bowl Committee: next time, have someone proofread your program material before you send it to the printer. The glossy, $10 magazine is very attractive. But I was flipping through the rosters because, not being familiar with either one of the teams, I wanted to match numbers with names -- and looking at page 115, I couldn't figure out why some of the numbers didn't match, especially when I was trying to figure out who West Virginia's #92 was (at one point, he was briefly down on the field injured). It was then I saw West Virginia's #5 listed as... Jared Zabransky. And looking down the rest of what was supposed to be the WV roster on that page, I realized that they had reprinted the Boise State roster from a year ago.

Nice glossy magazine, though. Maybe I'll come back next year to see if they've got the West Virginia roster printed. (And Oklahoma fans, I'm taking bids from you if you don't want me to go, if your team makes it back in 2009.)

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The BCS
These bowls are becoming a complete joke. These bowls, which are supposed to be the cream of the crop are not at all about creating the best match-ups. 3 BCS games, 3 blow-outs. Illinois had no business being in the Rose Bowl and had the Rose Bowl folks wanted to do the right thing, which would be to create the best game possible, they would have put Georgia up against USC.

Certain conferences are slotted into particular bowl games. Perhaps its time to start using a conference factor as its clear that the Big 12 has been overrated for years and it likely should not surprise anyone that Oklahoma didn't do well.

I'm not even favoring a playoff system as I think its inane to try to determine "the best college football team" when there are so many teams who play different styles of football. They play totally different schedules against a wide level of talent. But the money if flowing in so I imagine nothing will change.

DmL

by dmlichte on Jan 3, 2008 10:21 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Given the fact...
... that the game, though officially "sold-out", had a ton of tickets returned from West Virginia (at a cost to the school of approximately $1 million), maybe the money is NOT going to flow like it has before.

Would you say the same about the national college basketball playoff? Those teams play widely varying styles against different levels of talent, too. Should they not have a playoff for that reason?

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 3, 2008 10:33 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Basketball
To be honest I can't say that the same thing doesn't apply to basketball. And I certainly do not believe that the team that ultimately wins the NCAA tourney (just like any other sport) is the best team. What makes basketball different is a few things.

First is the schedule. Basketball teams are playing close to 30 games (more if they go far in conference tournaments). They play more non-conference games and power teams tend to play more games against power teams. So while I can look at the University of Wisconsin, my alma mater, their non-conference football schedule was pretty mediocre yet their non-conference basketball schedule saw them play Duke, Texas and Marquette. So the basketball teams that are going to be in the running for the NCAA tourney top seeds will have played other great teams while a football team like Oklahoma didn't play anyone good out of conference and then played in a conference that may be quite overrated. Same thing could easily be the case for Ohio State.

Secondly, basketball is much easier to attempt to determine a champion because its easier to play more games and have more teams involved in a tourney. 64 teams is done easily because you can play 2 games in 3 days. You also have the basketball season schedule back-up right to the tourney while bowls are typically 6 weeks after conference plays end and you likely would not be able to have a real tourney with more than 8 teams. 16 would really be pushing it.

But that aside, I don't disagree with the premise behind your statement/question. Its just that the factors involved in basketball give you a better grasp for the talent levels of teams. With that, you're able to have a more comprehensive tourney.

DmL

by dmlichte on Jan 3, 2008 10:43 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

a tourney.....
I disagree with the premise that a playoff is not possible. All you have to do is look at every other level of college football to see that not only is it possible, works rather well!
However, it will never happen because the bowls generate to much money for the schools and conferences involved....
You gotta believe!!!

by bolson1076 on Jan 3, 2008 11:17 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I dont remember who it was.....
....but I heard while listening to the radio about a gentleman who sat on a committee to determine is a playoff scenario was possible.  Although it is obvisouly possible when weighing the aspect of money there was no possible way the playoff schedule netted even close to the amount of money the bowls do.

Now, I dont have a link or a name I just remember hearing that on the air.

"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry "I strongly dislike Steve Stone." ---Hammer

by Hammer on Jan 3, 2008 11:23 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

A few things
First, we have to remember that these are student athletes who have finals and what not. A playoff system would take up much of the month of December unless, of course, the playoffs were pushed until January or over school's winter breaks. Realize, however, that some schools like Michigan and Ohio State are already back in classes (or will be within the next few days) while others have a few more weeks of vacation time.

But a bigger deal to me is that the system currently in place really is placing too much credit on artificial polling. Initial polls are done before a game has even been played giving a distinct advantage to teams who start the season high in the polls without even playing a game. This artificial polling is further reinforced by teams playing weak schedules and in overrated conferences. Its not so much the playoffs I don't like, its the factors that would be used to get teams into said playoffs.

DmL

by dmlichte on Jan 3, 2008 12:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Student athletes?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA......

Oh, you were serious?

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 3, 2008 12:08 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Perhaps not
the star players on most teams. And perhaps not most players on big time teams, but there are a ton of players on most Division I squads and most of them aren't going to the NFL. So I'd imagine that there are a fair amount of players on most teams who actually go to classes.

DmL

by dmlichte on Jan 3, 2008 12:30 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'd have to agree
During the season, football players don't miss that much class anyway.  Baseball is the toughest sport (in regards to missing class) by far.  We played 65-70 games in a 2 1/2 to 3 month span, and you were lucky to make it to class 2-3 days a week.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Jan 3, 2008 3:23 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Regardless of a playoff or not
the thing that drives me nuts is the delay between the season and the bowl.  With the money-grubbing stretching of the bowl season until mid-January, you have teams like Ohio State waiting 6 weeks or so between games.  What sport has a gap like that other than the hypocritical NCAA?  Yeah, you can sense my feeling on them.  After Bud Selig, the NCAA might be about my least favorite thing in sports.  

by rlpete on Jan 3, 2008 12:47 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree
but I don't feel bad for Ohio State.  Conferences like the Big 10 and Pac 10 have a distinct advantage because they don't have to play a championship game like the Big 12 and Pac 10.

You think Missouri is happy that Ohio State didn't have to play #2 in the Big 10 to win the championship?  Without the Big 12 Championship game, Mizzou plays Ohio State for the title.  There should be some sort of standard for the major conferences.

MURTON!!!

by tal1286 on Jan 3, 2008 1:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Or...
... without that last game vs. Pitt, maybe West Virginia plays Ohio State.

They sure played like champions last night.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 3, 2008 1:40 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

yeah but
unless I'm mistaken, that was part of their regular season.
MURTON!!!

by tal1286 on Jan 3, 2008 1:58 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

It was...
... but WV didn't have to play a conference title game.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 3, 2008 2:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't feel sorry for any of them either
I think the whole NCAA/BCS thing is a big money making joke.  I actually like it that so many games are blowouts.  I would be happy if Ohio State or LSU got crushed just so the viewership goes down.    

Don't get me started on NCAA basketball either.  I used to love it and went to first round tournament games for many years.  Now I barely watch it on TV any more.    

by rlpete on Jan 3, 2008 2:22 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

That is the Big 12's problem...
It's not like these conference championships are old tradition. This was a money grab by a few conferences who wanted to add more teams and have one more game for one reason only. This isn't as much an advantage for the Pac-10 and Big-10 as it is a decision those other conferences have made in the face of money. Besides, those championship games do offer some teams a chance to strengthen their resume too. It works both ways.
"You know what? You want a job? Go out and earn one." Sweet Lou

by Kyle Turney on Jan 3, 2008 4:29 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Not sure...
... what the other options are, though. Bowl games are also there for people to attend and far more people are able to travel to games during the last two weeks of December and first few days of January than during the beginning of December. Further schools do have final exams, whether or not the players actually take them.

The Big Ten is inserting a bye week starting next year and some Big Ten teams are already working on restructuring their conference schedule in order to have a later game as well as a bye week. Don't expect to see the Big Ten add a 12th team any time soon, and absent that 12th team, the Big Ten cannot have a conference championship.

DmL

by dmlichte on Jan 3, 2008 1:52 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Well at a minimum
They could go back to having bowl games on 1/1.  That would cut off a week.  

I know they won't due to the money.    

by rlpete on Jan 3, 2008 2:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You're a Badger, DmL?
ON WISCONSIN!  Class of 2005.

Dan

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Jan 3, 2008 12:49 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Yup
Class of '98. Football season ticket holder for the past three seasons as well (and next year, too, despite the fact that Bret Bielema and staff had one of the poorest coaching performances I've seen in a while this past Monday against the Vols).

DmL

by dmlichte on Jan 3, 2008 1:47 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

boy, did they ever
The pitch play on 3rd down during the drive that resulted in a FG, not kicking on 4th and 2 with nearly 1/2 the 4th quarter left, and why aren't players ready to line up correctly in game #13?

A game Bucky could have one, not necessarily should have.  Next year could be rough, especially if Ike goes pro (or if he stays and is just as focused as he was this season).

by Shanghai Badger on Jan 3, 2008 3:51 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

4th and 2
I have no problem with the decision to go for it on 4th and 2. Tenn would have had to march down the field, which they didn't. The play that was called, however, was inane. Tenn showed little ability to stop PJ Hill and Zach Brown. Run the damn ball up the middle. Apparently Travis Beckum was wide open, too, but our gutsy QB has no ability to go focus on more than one passing option. The blitzing on 3rd down on a QB who had been sacked 4 times all season made little sense. And when the Badgers had so much success on the ground I do no understand why they went in the air as much as they did.

I actually an somewhat optimistic about next season. They lose very few key parts and while I'd like Ike back, I think the defense will get better. Allen Langford killed the Badgers all season as teams passed against him at will. The QB situation is the big question, of course, but I think that Tyler Donovan was a big part of losses to Illinois and Tennessee.

DmL

by dmlichte on Jan 3, 2008 6:01 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

4th down/Donovan/2008
Yep, the actual play call was mind boggling . . . I didn't like it before the play failed because a FG puts them in a position to win on a field goal.  Who knows what happens after if they do kick, but if everything else stays the same, there's a decent chance.  Agreed that Donovan zeros in on one target -- was Swan before the injury.

I was at the Illinois game (then was home in time to see game 3 of the NLDS . . . knew the Bears would beat GB then next day).  Donovan threw two key picks late, but the defense was just awful the first half.  That wasn't Tyler's fault.  The O-line and missed tackles were a bigger part of the bowl game -- plus a couple of drops and a couple of missed pick opportunities.

I hope you're right about 2008, but they do lose both kickers (remember the lean years in the late 90's early 00's in that department) and Aaron Henry's got a torn ACL.

by Shanghai Badger on Jan 3, 2008 9:31 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Great game to watch
from the comfort of my couch, though I might have enjoyed the warm Arizona weather more.

I'm not too excited about tonight's game (Va Tech vs Kansas) but hopefully Monday's game (Ohio St vs LSU) will be worth the hype.  Too bad there isn't more flexibility in the matchups - would have loved to see USC vs Georgia, West Va vs Missouri.

btw Al, please pass along my congratulations to Mike for another award-winning BCB logo design.  I get chills just looking at it...  ;-)

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jan 3, 2008 10:21 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Bad luck for OU
Can we Missouri fans on the site get you to go to the next OU-Mizzou game, Al? We could use the help.

Maybe if they both go to the Big 12 championship in San Antonio again ... that's better than Phoenix, right?

Et tu, Augie, et tu?

by mlf on Jan 3, 2008 10:38 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

San Antonio better than Phoenix?
Hmmm. Dunno about that. But if you're paying the way...

;)

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 3, 2008 11:04 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks for the Band shout out!
As a four year veteran of a high school marching band (many years ago) it nice to hear someone appreciates seeing the performance.

One of the coolest things I ever got to do was becasue of band.  The Bands of America national competition used to be held in the Pontiac Silverdome and our band performed on that field twice.

That was the only time I've walked on a (semi)-pro football field and I must say the artifical turf was suprisingly springy.

Anyway, band geeks work pretty hard to put on a good show, thanks for watching Al!

"There are no curses here...Games are won and lost on the baseball field" - Lou Piniella

by El Borto on Jan 3, 2008 10:53 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

That's really cool...
... that you got to play in a stadium like that in a national competition.

The son of one of my co-workers is in the Michigan marching band so I have heard quite a bit about this in the last year or so; this plus seeing things like last night gives me a greater appreciation of how hard marching band members work.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 3, 2008 11:03 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If you're into marching bands
Check out Drum Corps.  It's like the Pro Circuit of marching bands except it's with kids who are all 21 and under.  They age out then.  And they don't get paid.  But it's still amazing.

http://www.dci.org/

The Cavaliers are consistently among the best and they are from Rosemont, IL.

http://www.cavaliers.org/

There are shows all over during the summer.  Honestly, if you enjoy the marching bands, I'd really recommend making the time to go one night to see the bands play.

The World Championships will be held in Indianapolis from August 7-9 this summer.

Other good shows in the Chicago Area include

One in Rockford on June 21st.
One in Naperville on June 29th.

You can find the full summer schedule here:
http://www.dci.org/schedule/?week=Week1

Hope you find this interesting.

MURTON!!!

by tal1286 on Jan 3, 2008 1:45 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Indeed
I've seen some DCI corps compete in the past and the championship competition usually gets broadcast. The coreography alone is amazingly complex and the music is just as good.

It's funny the people who are really into HS marching bands look at DCI like minors leaguers look at the majors.  Everyear the seniors in my HS band would get all worked up over tryouts and which band was the best band they could get into.

"There are no curses here...Games are won and lost on the baseball field" - Lou Piniella

by El Borto on Jan 3, 2008 2:23 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

In praise of the bowl system
From a fan's perspective, I wish there was a playoff in D1 football because it would be fun to watch and it would give me a chance to watch more football during the month of December when most teams are off preparing for the bowls.  On the other hand, watching this game yesterday gave me a new appreciation for the bowl system.  Here's why:

The WVU coaches, players, and fans all ended yesterday's game feeling that they accomplished something great.  The same could be said for USC, Michigan, and whoever wins on Monday night.  Under a playoff, only one team could end the season feeling triumphant.  

Again, I wish there was a playoff, but I also recognize that the Lloyd Carr or WVU stories wouldn't be quite as good if they each had lost in the early to middle rounds of a playoff.

"Look, what's important is to be in first place on the last day of the season." -Lou 8/1/07

by 26.2cubfan on Jan 3, 2008 11:36 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Al
If you're the reason ou keeps getting embarrassed in the national spotlight, I can probably find a bunch of my fellow OSU alums who will pay for you to go watch the sooners next year.

by JDay on Jan 3, 2008 11:59 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

I changed my mind about this yesterday...
....I no longer am in favor of a playoff. I agree with everyone that they are fun to watch. But the bowls are fun to watch too and the argument that a playoff would be more entertaining isn't really all that powerful.

The other side of this is that playoffs in any sport almost never do what they intend. They are supposed to determine the best team for that season. But in reality they can only determine the best team on that day (or series). While for the sports that have playoffs, I wouldn't mess with tradition. But really, having a group of impartial people narrow it down to 2 teams and let them play it out really is the best system. The only problem comes when there is disagreement about which 2 teams should make it. This year I think intelligent arguments could be made for 11 or 12 teams to get a shot meaning 9-10 teams that might have deserved a shot wouldn't have gotten it. But once the bowls are over only about 6 teams total will have a legitimate claim (counting the actual winner of the BCS). So the 6 that I have would be OSU-LSU winner, Georgia, USC, Missouri, VT-KU winner and WVU.

So here is my plan...scrap the national title game. #1 and #2 could still play. But then, once the season is over, run the numbers again. If a USC or WVU is impressive enough, then let the voters push them over the top. To make this plan work, everyone needs to get a quality opponent. I think OU was good enough. But there is no way Illinois belonged in the Rose Bowl and Missouri definitely should have been. In any event, my plan should sound familiar, it is pretty much what we had before the whole BCS thing came about. I say, take a step back and let's let the voters decide. Remember, I am supposing the national championship is about determining the best team of the season, and there is no way that can come down to a single game/series. (Just ask the 2001 Seattle Mariners)

"You know what? You want a job? Go out and earn one." Sweet Lou

by Kyle Turney on Jan 3, 2008 12:03 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Who you callin' a liar?
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3178698

Brian McNamee, via his lawyer, has come out and said that if Roger Clemens calls him a liar in the 60 Minutes interview, McNamee will sue Clemens.

I know who I believe in this whole situation.

DmL

by dmlichte on Jan 3, 2008 12:07 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Yep.
And I agree with you.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 3, 2008 12:30 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Kudos to the OU band...
For not going crazy playing that same song over and over and over again.  It got so annoying I had to finally turn the game off.  First of all, why do they need to do this after every single play, even average ones, and even when they're losing?  And for such a short song can't they learn about 10 of them?  Was this as annoying in person?  It was unbearable on tv.

by paulsbeard on Jan 3, 2008 12:14 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

That part...
... I can say, I didn't hear much of -- as you can see by the photo, my seat was in the north end zone. The bands were seated all the way across the field, in the south end zone, so I couldn't hear much of them except during the halftime shows.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 3, 2008 12:29 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Hey Al, just FYI
It is the Boise State Broncos, the not the Cowboys.

by whatiswrongwithlarussa on Jan 3, 2008 12:31 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Yep.
You're right. Sorry for the error, I'll fix it.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 3, 2008 12:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

For you trivia buffs
...pictured is the 'San Diego Super Flag.' This baby, which covers an entire football field -- makes the rounds every year, from regular season Chargers games to the 2 Bowl games here -- to anybody that wants it for a spectacle. I believe the flag was at Soldier Field last year, and it's hit a more than a few Super Bowls.

I wonder where it is stored in this area? I need to find out.....perhaps in an airplane hangar....
...just kidding....

But there's only ONE of these, and...now you know...the rest of the story.

(apologies to P. H.)

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jan 3, 2008 9:45 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Yes, it was at Soldier Field.
I was at the game, we have season tix.
PIE!!!

by LilLPLancer23 on Jan 3, 2008 11:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Coming from a Sooner fan,
I dont think its you Al.  Go to any bowl game you want lol.
Bob Stoops is the problem.  Dont get me wrong, I like the guy.  But since his BCS Bowl Win against the Buckeyes, he hasnt won a BCS Bowl.  Lately he's been a winner, but not a champion...
PIE!!!

by LilLPLancer23 on Jan 3, 2008 10:59 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

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